Speaking of, this thread is STILL going?
Allow use of pre 3.3 Advanced Discovery Scanner
- Thread starter ThatSmileyGuy
- Start date
I think of the FSS as being like a telescope for investigating things from a distance, and I think this is just another way to explore, neither better or worse than any other method. What I don't see is a reason why this change needed to be at the expense of the existing mechanism.
The time taken to discover all the things the player wants to (whether that be one thing or everything) is insignificant compared to the time to get to the system. It doesn't matter how the player chooses to discover what's in a given system, there are billions of them and the vast majority of those that have never previously been visited will probably never be visited again either.
FDev wanted players to be able to find the things that were out there to find, it was too hard before and the FSS speeds up & makes easier the process of finding jewel planets, mapping makes finding persistent POIs trivial compared to searching by eye.
But this ethic of making things easier to find is at odds with removing the old process, quite simply there was no need to remove the old modules, and the obvious answer is not to change the way systems are discovered but simply to add the new tools to the existing (pre 3.3) tools just as is done in the bubble.
The time taken to discover all the things the player wants to (whether that be one thing or everything) is insignificant compared to the time to get to the system. It doesn't matter how the player chooses to discover what's in a given system, there are billions of them and the vast majority of those that have never previously been visited will probably never be visited again either.
FDev wanted players to be able to find the things that were out there to find, it was too hard before and the FSS speeds up & makes easier the process of finding jewel planets, mapping makes finding persistent POIs trivial compared to searching by eye.
But this ethic of making things easier to find is at odds with removing the old process, quite simply there was no need to remove the old modules, and the obvious answer is not to change the way systems are discovered but simply to add the new tools to the existing (pre 3.3) tools just as is done in the bubble.
Exploration is the new modes.
Another point that has already been covered. This discussion is between those that support a proposal with no downsides, vs those that want others to go without, but not themselves. It is easily solved. The modes discussion has pros & cons in either direction.
So we're not missing the point.
"Scanning alone is not exploring no matter what people say."
Only Max Factor knows what exploration is.
Nope the similarity is in that people will moan on about it for years without getting anywhere.
Will it take that long for you to recognise that this won't affect your game at all?
Have you seen the arguments being made in the April update trying to justify why the new automated features shouldn't be added to the game? Play your own way, let them play theirs. Removing the old exploration modules was an anomaly, inconsistent with the way all other updates were applied and continue to be applied. That inconsistency should be corrected, and it is an easier fix compared to most suggestions.
For me exploration is (or was) honking a system, flying to the planets and scanning them. There was never anything to actually discover though - no aliens, no ruins, no worlds lush with life to explore. Just moon after moon after moon after moon.
In the first few days of playing this game in 2014 I would literally fly around looking for pixels on my screen that moved. Took forever to "explore" that way. At the time it was exciting though because I didn't know if I'd discover some alien race or ruins, or maybe a pirate base where NPC pirates spawn, or some other amazing discovery. How naive I was...
In the first few days of playing this game in 2014 I would literally fly around looking for pixels on my screen that moved. Took forever to "explore" that way. At the time it was exciting though because I didn't know if I'd discover some alien race or ruins, or maybe a pirate base where NPC pirates spawn, or some other amazing discovery. How naive I was...
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Will it take that long for you to recognise that this won't affect your game at all?
Have you seen the arguments being made in the April update trying to justify why the new automated features shouldn't be added to the game? Play your own way, let them play theirs. Removing the old exploration modules was an anomaly, inconsistent with the way all other updates were applied and continue to be applied. That inconsistency should be corrected, and it is an easier fix compared to most suggestions.
It was an upgrade and a popular one. Get used to it, its unlikely to change.
Lol. Oh my word. This is nothing to do with me. I suggest you find out what exploration is instead of making up your own definition.
For you.
Will it take that long for you to recognise that this won't affect your game at all?
Affecting my game or not is not the true question. Just as I don't want newbs to be given a billion credits (this wouldn't affect my game either) or anyone to be just given the location of Raxxla, I don't want you to be given the picture of the system for free. I want you to be subjected to the same rules I am and I find the new rules better.
This is all there is to it. Can we now please stop beating a dead horse? I'm sure FD noticed the demands for the old system and will decide however they wish. These debates are not convincing anyone to change their view.
Much as I agree, the people who want this have every right to suggest it. The people keeping this going are the ones arguing with them. Otherwise this thread would be three posts from the supporters, and hence look a lot less convincing.
But hey, we know how these threads continue, so everyone carry on
Much as I agree, the people who want this have every right to suggest it. The people keeping this going are the ones arguing with them. Otherwise this thread would be three posts from the supporters, and hence look a lot less convincing.
But hey, we know how these threads continue, so everyone carry on
Its for much the same reason you correct the people claiming the games in maintenance mode I'd expect.
I understand your argument, but it is negated by the rest of my post, which you snipped.
Maybe that is why so many people liked the previous system so much. Allowing them to actually travel to the body to get a better view of it. (And yes, i know it's still a -slightly less so- viable option).
There are multiple reasons we would like to see system map re-introduced.
Also taking into account that it used to do just that. We already have more complicated systems such as docking computers which seem to be more complicated than a scanner. Although, again, some people do like the FSS.
Fair point. While FSS feels like a proper scanner there is just something missing. I can see why it is the way it is, imagine having to exit FSS each time a body was outside of reach(as with turreted lasers for example) to rotate the ship and pop back in.
There always is a room for improvement
We are not. Through all the threads i have visited not one of them had been replied to by any of the members of the staff.
And from what i've heard throughout my "career" as a CMDR FDev are not too good at listening.
Some people outright claim that FD don't care unless people raise multiple complaints(See Eravate newbie sniping or operation Healies for Feelies, I've heard that healing beams are still overpowered).
We could also raise multiple other questionable decisions such as why do stealth ship appear in night vision rendering stealth builds nearly useless once spotted.
Please take note that proposed changes take into consideration balancing issues. Such as disallowing use of FSS while using the system reveal module, incresed costs, not revealing key data etc.
I have highlighted that in post #1 in this thread. We are not asking for the map be revealed 'for free'.
A more appropriate comparison for explorers might be beigegate, one that didn't affect gameplay at all. Or the orrery, which is nice but does not replace the system map and the game can be played without it.
In the case of engineered weapon imbalance I agree there are issues which should be acknowledged, which do not effect the majority of players.
The game design isn't (usually) shaped by a show of hands. If the community has any effect it's usually through well expressed ideas and challenging preconceptions.
Some people still moan about beige now even though it was fixed, its important to sift the wheat from the chaff and there's an awful lot of chaff.
Is that what you think you are doing? Have you heard of positive reinforcement?