It’s like... all of the things I’ve been saying for years, but said better, with bigger words.
Question for Open players who don't like PVP/ganking... help me understand
- Thread starter Danquememe
- Start date
This was a lovely post - thank you.
Prior to about 8 weeks ago, I had never even heard of the original Elite game from the 80s, nor any of its sequels. I was tangentially aware of Elite Dangerous, thanks to Steam suggesting it to me from time to time, but for whatever dumb reason, I thought it was some kind of arcade-ish shooter game. I was way up my own you-know-what with my hyper realistic combat flight sims - where there's no radar or icons or lock-ons or otherwise - and dismissed ED out of hand as something I wasn't interested in.
It's only much later that I've come to understand a little bit about the game's history, and the influence of the "84ers" on the current game.
I do still feel like very much the odd man out, since as mentioned, I am here for one thing, and it's PVP spaceship dogfighitng. The rest of it is truly incidental busywork that serves to gatekeep my access to what I actually purchased the game for. I am challenging myself to take things I'm learning in this thread and push myself to do more of the PVE stuff - since I'm not actually a one-dimensional murderhobo monster in real life (at least, I hope) - and I'm going to be sitting with this game for a while yet. Hopefully these other aspects will grow in import and interest for me over time. We'll see.
But for sure: the spaceship combat with other players is fantastic. Very challenging, very demanding, very difficult. Everything I look for in a video game.
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Another great post.
So yes, then - according to the logic outlined above, the BGS is responsible for my first gank (I was trying to sell LTDs at the highest-price port of the day), and therefore also the pleasant interaction I had with my ganker afterwards, and basically my character's whole origin story (i.e. where my new friend shuttled me across the galaxy, helping me unlock engineers, so I could build my own PVP ship, etc)
So the BGS made me a ganker? Is that where we've landed? LOL!
Completely true about the lack of direction and story, and completely intended by Fdev. This game would not be what it is if there was a 'story' and if the game were set in a restricted number of hand crafted systems (for example). I would suggest the vast majority of players who have thousands of hours in this game would not still be playing it after 6 years if that were the case.
You are playing it as a pvp combat game, which is fine.
What the game isn't is a seal-clubbing ganking sim, even if gankers try and excuse their actions by claiming "we can do it, so it must be ok". I could pull the legs of the spiders in my garden, or any other cruel childish behaviour, doesn't mean I should. Just because a ganker can ruin the game for a new player doesn't mean he should.
I still think you're trying to play game A using the software provided by the much larger and completely different game B. But that's fine. Just don't expect the game or others who play it to agree.
You seem to think all we gank are new players. This isn't remotely true. Sure a newer player is more likely to become another pretty pixel explosion running into a ganker, but you'd be shocked how often I pull people with higher combat ratings who are flying paper ships. Come ganking with us some day and broaden your horizons. You might actually like it.
That would make you a spanker.
This is an entirely fair point, and honestly - at the crux of the criticism of ganking, regardless of whether it's against new or experienced players.
There are plenty of people who expect that the morals and forms of everyday life will be carried forward into the gamespace.
And plenty of others for whom the gamespace is itself an escape from the strictures of everyday life.
Much of entertainment relies upon allowing the consumer to experience things outside the realm of daily existence. What if you were a powerful mobster? What if you were an elite soldier? What if you were a highly trained spy? What if you were a messianic character? Etc.
Again, I'm not here to say what's right or wrong, or what is or isn't intended by FDev. The extant text, as it were, is open to a lot of interpretations, and honestly, I'm not at all qualified to say which is "correct", if any.
There are those who believe anyone doing anything antisocial in-game must be identically antisocial out-of-game. That's a big assumption.
There are those who believe anyone following the conventional moral rules in-game must also be a good person out-of-game. Also a big assumption.
And there are those who completely divorce anything happening in-game from real life. "It's just a game" and so forth.
At the end, again, because of the relative lack of consequences for any of our decisions in-game, and our ability to avoid the worst of those consequences by playing in Solo or PG, or using the block feature, etc - it's hard to say what, if any, moral imperatives can be found within Elite. Beyond "do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law," to quote another famous British person.
Good thing it isn't - if it was, it would be an extremely crappy one at that, given how easy it is to totally evade or escape ganks using modes or just flying proper builds and gitting gud.
Oh but didn't you know, apparently it's selfish of us gankers to expect other players to learn the game. Apparently we just need to fly around and o7 everyone.
Ah... The Great Beast himself... Adjusted the spelling of his name to equal 666 in Quabbala count...
Tackled Abru-Mellim's Quabbala trial and didn't come out of it smelling of roses, took an extended trip with Lady Frieda (while she was still married, of course) around Europe spending most of their trip under the effect of alcohol or opium... Then of course published the Freemason's 'Secrets'...
The ideal role-model I always thought
(yes, Aleister Crowley was a fascinating man)
Honestly, I'd really like to know what, if any, interest Mr. Braben has in Mr. Crowley's work.
Because the biggest takeaway I have from this game is that it's literally a "Do as you wish" simulator above all else.
You do know that the new player area of the galaxy is locked off to the rest of the playerbase right? Do you really think someone unlocking Farseer is a "new" player or that the only players in Deciat are players unlocking Farseer for the first time?
For that matter, can someone help me parse what a "Mostly Harmless" CMDR flying an Anaconda actually is?
Like... the Anaconda is an endgame ship.
"Most Harmless" implies you're a beginner.
One of these things is not like the other.
When I was ganked for the first time, I had literally just become Novice rank. I was in a Cobra Mk III with paper shields. But I'd already made over 40M in credits from mining and I shortly thereafter purchased an Asp Explorer and then Type-9 to mine even more efficiently.
Was I a newbie? I'd been playing the game about a week at that time.
He's (very) likely to be a Freemason, I'd suggest
But, maybe DB actually hasn't an interest, the writings of Mr. Crowley could be considered the rantings of a lunatic... or enlightened... but if you can stay awake through some of his maunderings there are fascinating things to be read
The game, I'd guess each of us interprets how it is intended to be played, making us, rather than DBOBE, the Crowley followers, surely?
In this vein, I don't understand the typical ganker's MO, which is to fly "easy mode" ships and use these ships to kill "easy mode" CMDRs (traditionally the Harmless Sidewinder, though this probably has changed thanks to starter systems). I've done some of my own "unprovoked" PvP in the past, and it's always been in modest ships like an engineered Sidewinder or Dolphin. I get an extra sense of pride forcing a FDL or Anaconda pilot to wake out in fear of my Dread Sidewinder or Eagle, LOL. PvP piracy in my Dolphin was epic, and I never lost that ship even against highly engineered Corvettes. I found this PvP challenging and rewarding. Attacking noobs while flying a godship myself seems utterly pointless and cowardly, regardless of the roleplay. That makes YOU the noob IMO.
Anaconda an endgame ship? Even I'd bought (and sold 10 minutes later) one within a couple of months of play - I think I would have been 'Mostly Harmless' then...
Oddly, I remained low combat rank for almost 2 years of play only getting Dangerous ranking after around 25 months of play - but I do try to avoid the particularly boring and tedious bits of the game so was Exploration elite within 10 months of play and Trade after 21 months... Currently looks like Combat elite is going to hit 35 months or so...
Not only that - in games in which you can "die" usually you won't select the "very hard" mode / won't enter the level 100 dungeon etc. unless you feel ready (experienced enough / have the appropriate gear / sufficiently leveled up your character etc) for the task.
You can ofc try that difficulty level with a weakish character if you want to see how it looks like, but you accept that chances are that the level 100 monster inside is just going to eat you for breakfast.
ED is not fundamentally different in this regard, it's just that it has 3 modes of difficulty:
- Easy Mode
- A tiny bit (like a Planck length) more difficult mode
- Yet a little bit (like 1 millimeter) more difficult mode.
I mean, isn't it? It's one of the most expensive ships in the store, bar the two rank-restricted ones. Players since the game's launch talk about how it used to take literal months to save up to afford one, and the impression I get is that it was something of a status symbol at one point.
I dunno, I have one, I mostly hate it, but it's useful for clearing PVE massacre missions in the same way a toilet brush is useful for cleaning toilets, so I put up with it.
Regardless - is there another ship that's more emblematic of endgame status? What if it's a Cutter or Corvette flown by a Mostly Harmless player? I've seen that, too.
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The 'big 3' aren't 'endgame'. They're the best for some stuff, but they're also the worst at other stuff. They're just expensive or hassle to get, is all.
It'll entirely depend on what you want to do whether you want one. If you don't wanna do things that needs them, they're literally just a waste of time.
Even the concept of 'endgame' is pretty stupid in ED. There isn't one. It ends when you're bored and sick of it, and go play something else instead.