The new commoditiy system is screwed.

[Hullreaver]

Lately, I have been stacking pirate wing assassination missions. I have well over $100M in missions stacked at one time and you have 6 days to complete them. Doing the math, with the average bounties, it works out to over $1M credits per ship destroyed, since some of the kills will count towards more than one mission and the missions are in the $20-30M credit range for around 40-50 ships. Point being that you can make credits in ways other than mining.

The Pirate Lord missions were ... interesting. They were all Elite level wing missions and when I went to the first one it was a wing of 4 with an FDL lord and 3 minions (2-vultures and an FAS). I started battling and then the other 2 pirate lords decided to drop in as well (1 Annie and another FDL), so I was suddenly battling 6 elite ships. I was in my Vette, so not too distressing, though by the end of it my shields were gone and my hull was down to 85%.

 

[Vetinari]

Point being that you can make credits in ways other than mining.

I find it hard not to make Credits. Almost everything I do results in a payout. If I stayed somewhere I had already explored and did nothing but PVP I could probably manage it but that seems a bit extreme.

 

[MickyG1982]

So your advice is sell the python...

OK let's say they have done a few low risk missions and have the rebuy, but it's stock, and they have only the rebuy and not a penny more...

What do they do?

Once they get swatted by a pirate, that lesson will have been taught and learned all by itself.

 

[MickyG1982]

Simple solution here...

Don't do the same thing as everyone else.

I should actually add...

Don't do it in the same place as everyone else.

 

[Ashnak]

I'd like all the fella's posting ' this is fine ' to say if they own a fleet carrier and whether they got THIER fortunes mining when it was nice & easy .

I didn't post "this is fine", but I'll do so now:

This is fine.​

And no, I don't have a fleet carrier. Maybe one day, when my alt comes back from his circumnavigation, I'll check out a friendly carrier owner for some money laundering and pool the resources from my three accounts.
As for making my fortunes - not really. Yes, I did some mining, but probably not more than a few hundred Million worth. My favourite mining ship still is a DBX. Account number 1 made his Billion on the way to Beagle Point (and is still somewhere out there), account number 2 just through regular missions and a little bit of everything, account number 3 through hard work as ³H hauler for one of the traders when this was still lucrative.

 

[Rat Catcher]

I'd like all the fella's posting ' this is fine ' to say if they own a fleet carrier and whether they got THIER fortunes mining when it was nice & easy .

I absolutely did not buy a FC with proceeds from mining... Although in the 3 years I've been playing I have earned over a billion from mining, most of that being in the days when VO's were 1.7 mill a pop and I was building my fleet...

 

[Northpin]

So they fixed Painite too, right? Not a single price over 400k and small demand anyway...
While the Core mining is still plagued by PWS being fitted backwards on our ships.

And this demand... is so freakin low.
Why have Cutters and Carriers when the demand is so slow and regenerates even slower when you have thousands of players hammering that small demand every day.

Well, glad that my accounts are sorted, but the newcomers will have a hard time clogging the systems with carriers anytime soon... which is not a bad thing per se
36bn on PC account and 32bn on XB account should be enough for quite some time - unless they introduce base building next year :/

 

[skananote]

And this demand... is so freakin low.
Why have Cutters and Carriers when the demand is so slow and regenerates even slower when you have thousands of players hammering that small demand every day.

Two stones with one bird... FDev way of fixing things, they killed mining and also the need for bigger ships in one move... Now pro-nerfs can stop crying that newbs shouldn't fly big ships...

 

[S~P]

You know, a T9 loaded with basic minerals will fetch a tidy profit, doesn't have to be Painite etc....I think cmdrs should stop stressing and chillout, it's not a race.

 

[Dillon Fallon]

I absolutely did not buy a FC with proceeds from mining... Although in the 3 years I've been playing I have earned over a billion from mining, most of that being in the days when VO's were 1.7 mill a pop and I was building my fleet...

Yep, This is mine:

This is also mine:

Besides, I know players who made 10 billion+ with mining in a few weeks, well before fleet carriers were even released. They'd have one by now regardless.

 

[Northpin]

This is my PC account (it has 40bn assets)

Mining happened before Carriers release.
Post carriers i earned cash by buying cheap and selling expensive (tritium, but LTD too)

 

[Razzerman]

redesigning the economy instead of just throwing random fixes at it

From the looks of it, they're all throwing dice to set the prices, and seeing what sticks. Probably under the influence as well.

 

[GraphiteGB]

Core mining is not going to last... unless they alter demand values
Every sale Lowers the Price and every sale lowers demand at the stations.
Even with Broken PWA it is going to break the 3 systems that are keeping cores Prices high...
Cores mined prices are not rising there falling just as Laser mining has, resupply on cores item demand is not high enough...
Without brand-new sale locations being rotated in by station states randomly changing as they did on the old stations Even the core mining will die...
Its all ready dropped the top core from 1.2 on first day to 1.09 mill today... With out new sale locations that rate is not going to last they will reach zero demand on the stations even with Broken PWA...

Its not just effecting the top core mining item every item in rocky rings IS being sold... so if they dont boost demand numbers it's not going to last...

They should just announce the new bulk sale tax trigger % of demand number and not force the community to guess the trigger point ether by making multi runs carrying 0 - 10% of cargo … as its not 25% any more.

 

[Maolagin]

I don't think ED has the same kind of engaging gameplay - because while WOT was a grind, it didn't feel like it

Indeed, at some level it's just different strokes for different folks. For my part, I feel the exact same way you do - if you reverse ED and WOT in that quote!

I'd like all the fella's posting ' this is fine ' to say if they own a fleet carrier and whether they got THIER fortunes mining when it was nice & easy .

Okay, sure, I'll play. I do own a carrier, bought it soon after carriers released. According to my logs, it looks like I mined the last billion or so the few months before they released during the first big core mining era. Before that most of my net worth came from exploration data, much of that during DW2. And back then there was talk about how cheesy it was that we were all going to come home billionaires due to the newly released planetary mapping mechanic. Only took me ... checking my notes ... about eight months of flying to do it!

Even with Broken PWA it is going to break the 3 systems that are keeping cores Prices high...
Cores mined prices are not rising there falling just as Laser mining has, resupply on cores item demand is not high enough...
Without brand-new sale locations being rotated in by station states randomly changing as they did on the old stations Even the core mining will die...

Why in the world would you think that the high-sale-price stations won't switch as BGS states change? State-driven price spikes is what has driven literally every mining boom since the new mining system released.

 

[Northpin]

Why in the world would you think that the high-sale-price stations won't switch as BGS states change? State-driven price spikes is what has driven literally every mining boom since the new mining system released.

yes, but if the regen is as slow as it currently is - those stations will offer low prices because their demand was met 1 week ago or one month ago
and if the demand is allowed to go into negatives, it will take even longer to recover.

Robigo anyone? before it gets "balanced" too?

 

[dudhit]

triggered!. I've worked in cataloging and logistics. materials ARE commodities. commodities can be materials. should be able to buy/sell at same spot. open the economy, stop lying about blazing our own trail by nerfing prices after players have taken the time to grind the intended way.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

There's always been exploits, sure, but nothing that could turn credits like mining / today's massacre stacking could.

• seeking luxuries? Would get you a whole ~1m credits per loop.
• stacking massacres pre- nerf? Massacres then only earned you about 1-2m, so 20 identical stacked missions would earn you what a single massacre or two would get you today.
• stacking power generator missions? Sure, whip 20 missions with a single missile, but again that'd only get you about 20m, and the stacking took time. Mission boards generated half as many missions as they do today.
• Robigo? Again, roughly 1m per mission, for around 20m per run, for what actually held risk of losing everything and copping big fines.
• rockforth? Those people actually got punished.

This is why people who were around for all these exploits are so bewildered by mining... FD took every measure to stamp out quick money spinners. They were slow to it, but they did. Then along came mining which spun significantly more than any exploit to-date, and that was peachy. It was a completely counter-intuitive move.

So whether or not rollbacks happened is irrelevant due to the enormity of impact mining/ massacre stacking has had on player wealth today.

Even with those exploits, an A rate Anaconda took months, not days, to earn.

Doze wear duh daze.

The by far biggest money earner I benefited from pre nu-mining were those PAX missions to Colonia, where the passenger would change their mind after you undocked and preferred to be hauled to a station just one jump away, yielding credit rewards in the low to medium 8 digits per mission (yes, they were stackable, via menu logging). Think I made about 200m through the course of a few hours, and it was fixed within a few days as it was an exploit. I did feel dirty using this because it massively boosted my Exploration rank. But those things were rare (for me at least - most exploits were fixed before I was even aware of them).

I can make the same money now (per hour!) completely legit stacking high value metal single hop delivery missions in certain systems, where those missions spawn quite reliably if the system state is right.

 

[Northpin]

btw - did mission server caught up with the new average prices?

 

[Jmanis]

btw - did mission server caught up with the new average prices?

Oh it's the Thursday tick hey? I'll have a look at some deliveries now.

EDIT: Oh my!

 

[Ian Doncaster]

yes, but if the regen is as slow as it currently is - those stations will offer low prices because their demand was met 1 week ago or one month ago
and if the demand is allowed to go into negatives, it will take even longer to recover.

Though there are around 16,000 - 28,000 stations importing core gems (depending exactly on which type), so even with a year's demand regeneration cycle that's still 50 stations a day.

And there's 12 different gems (counting Painite and LTDs) on different state-driven pricing patterns so that adds a bit of variety too.

It'll get harder to find the top prices, certainly. But I don't think there's any great danger of demand being met across the board - total bubble-wide Benitoite demand seems to be about 22 million tonnes, similar amounts for most of the other core gems, more like 12 million for Void Opals. So that's a couple of hundred million tonnes of demand, so maybe 500kT/day of demand for mined goods even on really slow regeneration.

That's probably manageable, and Platinum (354MT) and Osmium (2.6GT) are in even higher demand and still give pretty substantial prices.