General Multicrew is an unfinished mechanic that needs to be reworked!

[TheDragon2001]

Who am I?​

Just a usual cmdr. I'm a big sci-fi fan and Elite Dangerous is one of my favorite games. There are several reasons: there is no colorful space of No Man’s Sky, the design of the ships is believable, the battles are deadly, and control requires skill, but allows you to finely control the movements of the spacecraft. It lacks the ability to get out of the chair, but it doesn't really impact the gaming experience.

What's wrong?​

I recently invited my best friend to play my favorite space simulator. Since the game has the ability to control one ship, I bought Python and we started flying. After two hours of playing, I was completely disappointed with Multicrew.

View attachment 210644

Pay attention to the co-pilot's interface: the gunner does not know which target is selected and where the ship is flying. The HUD on the cockpit glass is completely absent. In addition, there is no radar and clear indication of shields.​

The role of the co-pilot has been curtailed so much that there is no room for role-playing. In fact, the only thing the co-pilot can be responsible for is turrets and external equipment. The rest of the time he misses. Here is a list of what the co-pilot cannot do, but logically he should do:

1. See the ship commander interface
2. See the target of the commander when selected
3. Manage ship energy and fully distribute it between subsystems
4. Enable and disable ship modules
5. Enable silent running
6. Open the cargo scoop
7. Request docking permission
8. Drive SRV
9. Mark targets
10. Make notes on the galactic map
11. Take control as needed

View attachment 210645
This is what the gunner's interface looks like when controlling turrets. The gunner does not see the target of the ship commander, and the ship commander does not see the target of the gunner. As a result: shooting at different targets.

Why is that bad?​

The correct distribution of functions between the commander and the co-pilot is a separate meta-game that would contribute to better player cooperation and more enjoyment of the game. The absence of these elements makes Multicrew mode useless and boring, although the very idea of joint control of the ship is intriguing. I haven't talked about the numerous Multicrew bugs here yet, but they are not important if the mechanics themselves are broken.

I really hope that Frontiers will pay attention to this issue in the future, because apart from Elite Dangerous, no game can offer such an immersive experience of space adventures. Perhaps this is not a problem at all, and I am making mountains out of molehills. Multicrew is useful for farming credits in wing missions, but is that really the only thing players want from that mechanic?

---

P.S.​

Sorry for mistakes. English is not my native language.
Thank you for reading this!

Reddit discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj/multicrew_is_an_unfinished_mechanic_that_needs_to/

I agree that multi-crew needs some major improvement, and I agree with some though not all of the points.
For instance, if my brother joins me on board my Cutter, I would be completely fine with him being a co-pilot (as outlined) or even taking the ship while I take a spin in a SLF. If I pick up some random cmdr to join me on my travels, no way do I want him messing with my systems or, heaven forbid, flying my ship.
What I would suggest is adding two sub-functions to multicrew.

Sub-function 1: Crew. The crew would be about like multicrew is now, though with better readouts and SRV capability.
Sub-function 2: Co-pilot. Co-pilot(s) would be crew specifically designated by the ship owner. Co-pilots would have capabilities about like you have detailed. A cmdr would not have to have co-pilots or they could have multiple co-pilots.

 

[TheDragon2001]

I am willing to risk handwavium gravitational force protection for the benefit of crawlspace action. They can simulate the fight by massive shaking of the ship. Like in Star Trek.

When far enough from a significant mass, you can accelerate from 0 m/s to 200 c in a matter of seconds. Those Gs would rip anything apart regardless of tech or composition, so it seems that the game just ignores G-forces. Because of this (and I do like that it ignores Gs) it seems like it should just keep ignoring Gs entirely.

 

[JTFireblaze]

When far enough from a significant mass, you can accelerate from 0 m/s to 200 c in a matter of seconds. Those Gs would rip anything apart regardless of tech or composition, so it seems that the game just ignores G-forces. Because of this (and I do like that it ignores Gs) it seems like it should just keep ignoring Gs entirely.

To be fair supercruise acceleration is different to normal space acceleration. It's more like you're bending space around the ship (I think), so your actual ship doesn't really "move". Which... well I guess means that you could be able to move around the ship when in cruise?

In normal space there would be real Gs and stuff, so it would be more dangerous for someone to wander the corridors then.

Makes you wonder what the inside of a passenger cabin really is... they probably all have the same chairs we do and can't actually wander the ship unless in cruise or it's travelling in a straight line. Oh man, imagine failing a passenger mission because you turned too hard and killed them all...

 

[Kissamies]

I agree that multi-crew needs some major improvement, and I agree with some though not all of the points.
For instance, if my brother joins me on board my Cutter, I would be completely fine with him being a co-pilot (as outlined) or even taking the ship while I take a spin in a SLF. If I pick up some random cmdr to join me on my travels, no way do I want him messing with my systems or, heaven forbid, flying my ship.
What I would suggest is adding two sub-functions to multicrew.

Sub-function 1: Crew. The crew would be about like multicrew is now, though with better readouts and SRV capability.
Sub-function 2: Co-pilot. Co-pilot(s) would be crew specifically designated by the ship owner. Co-pilots would have capabilities about like you have detailed. A cmdr would not have to have co-pilots or they could have multiple co-pilots.

The bare bones version of this feature already exists in the form of setting the crew permissions to keep them from controlling your shield cell banks and such. Rather clunkily it's only accessible when you have multicrew on, though. I agree that the more complete feature suggested above would be nice. Permissions to do more things and ability to set them per player.

 

[Vi7ER]

My sentiments EXACLY!

How great a social experience would it be if MC was fully developed. If you didn't fancy flying alone in the black you jump on someone else's ship and take up a key role. I would take it is as far as allowing the ship commander to distribute functionality to each crew member. Set who of all the crew on board does the following:

• Pilots the ship (yes others should be able to too, if you let them)
• Navigate - use the system and galaxy maps to mark nav targets and plot routes
• Power Management - distribute pips (as per communication between crew mates)
• Manage utilities - countermeasures and other tools
• Pilot SRV as well as fighter so ground missions can allow for scouting and supporting
• Introduce Ship Launched Shuttles - for use in suplementary roles like assisting with mining, exploration and smuggling
• Allow the commander to set profit sharing with each crew member (fun negotiating that out)

All this on top of what the OP described would I think, turn this into a winning mechanic! The advantage all the above would give you in different scenarios would make it actually worth considering as an alternative style of play to piloting your own ship.

Essentially players could "share" a ship!

Also, let an NPC sit in for a player - YES - merge the two mechanics. Why are they even separate??

Finally make it work along side wings. Sure set a limit on the number of players in the combined team but let it all work together.

And that's all I want - yeah not so much to ask is it?

As I mention here. Permissions are crucial I think. With them we can tailor the experience to fit whoever is in our ship. Whether NPC or other player.

 

[Vi7ER]

Check out what is written here: https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/...00000000000054072&replyId=4400000000000147997

Some great ideas here too.

 

[JTFireblaze]

Check out what is written here: https://elite-dangerous.fandom.com/...00000000000054072&replyId=4400000000000147997

Some great ideas here too.

That's a lot of stuff. A lot of new stuff. As much as people would love a new class of ship that has huge mannable turrets and deployable ships, multicrew in it's current form should be fixed up before adding another isolated feature and leaving this one to rot, in my opinion.


Combat:

• SLF pilot works well, minus the network lag. Fix that and it's in a great place
• Turrets and gunner role is ok. They could do with better targeting (sub modules) and maybe a small damage buff due to them being human controlled (although this is purely my opinion and I know others disagree, since the turning speeds and avoiding chaff effects is a big buff)
• Extra pips, yeah they're fine. It's a bit difficult for a SLF pilot to manage their extra pip without jumping back and forth from the ship. Maybe the helm could just override this?
• Gunner role should take on a more tactical overview, and be able to set targets for other players.

Mining:

• Can a gunner fire limpets in any direction? Prospecting in 360 could be huge.
• Can a gunner use Pulse wave? Same benefits as 360 limpet control
• Turret mining lasers are pretty decent I suppose. Maybe if there was a second gunner role available prospecting and mining duties could be split?
• Ship Launched Miner.

Exploring:

• FSS for crew when supercruising. Having to drop to 30km/s is fine solo, but having to actively stop flying when you have a crew mate that can do the job is baffling.
• Can crew use the probes?
• Ship launched explorer for crew? Cruise capable but not jump capable. Divide and conquer in a system?

Trading:

• Yeah, i dunno. trading is pretty much a solo thing.
• Gunners and fighter can defend against pirates and that's about it
• Maybe crew can look at market data and find best sell prices.

Overall:

• Networking and disconnects. I know P2P networking is a massive hurdle, but people want to be able to play together without fear of losing the session.
• Ability to party up better. The "Connect to a random ship" options are MVP, create a lobby system where commanders can host their ships on a board so players can pick.
• Allow the helm to swap into the other roles - if they trust their crew I don't see why you wouldn't let them pilot for a while. My SLF pilot can already take over the ship when I'm in a fighter too, let them take the helm so me and the crew can do the pewpew.

 

[Vi7ER]

Very true

That's a lot of stuff. A lot of new stuff. As much as people would love a new class of ship that has huge mannable turrets and deployable ships, multicrew in it's current form should be fixed up before adding another isolated feature and leaving this one to rot, in my opinion.


Combat:

• SLF pilot works well, minus the network lag. Fix that and it's in a great place
• Turrets and gunner role is ok. They could do with better targeting (sub modules) and maybe a small damage buff due to them being human controlled (although this is purely my opinion and I know others disagree, since the turning speeds and avoiding chaff effects is a big buff)
• Extra pips, yeah they're fine. It's a bit difficult for a SLF pilot to manage their extra pip without jumping back and forth from the ship. Maybe the helm could just override this?
• Gunner role should take on a more tactical overview, and be able to set targets for other players.

Mining:

• Can a gunner fire limpets in any direction? Prospecting in 360 could be huge.
• Can a gunner use Pulse wave? Same benefits as 360 limpet control
• Turret mining lasers are pretty decent I suppose. Maybe if there was a second gunner role available prospecting and mining duties could be split?
• Ship Launched Miner.

Exploring:

• FSS for crew when supercruising. Having to drop to 30km/s is fine solo, but having to actively stop flying when you have a crew mate that can do the job is baffling.
• Can crew use the probes?
• Ship launched explorer for crew? Cruise capable but not jump capable. Divide and conquer in a system?

Trading:

• Yeah, i dunno. trading is pretty much a solo thing.
• Gunners and fighter can defend against pirates and that's about it
• Maybe crew can look at market data and find best sell prices.

Overall:

• Networking and disconnects. I know P2P networking is a massive hurdle, but people want to be able to play together without fear of losing the session.
• Ability to party up better. The "Connect to a random ship" options are MVP, create a lobby system where commanders can host their ships on a board so players can pick.
• Allow the helm to swap into the other roles - if they trust their crew I don't see why you wouldn't let them pilot for a while. My SLF pilot can already take over the ship when I'm in a fighter too, let them take the helm so me and the crew can do the pewpew.

Very true! I guess that person is aiming for the sky. I agree that the basics should be sorted before going much further and to be honest that's what my list was about. Just a solid experience.

I think one of the worst immersion breakers for me are the empty seats next to us in larger ships. I.e. Corvette. One person piloting a ship that large at no obvious disadvantage alone? That doesn't seem right at all.

Ships above a certain size should not function fully without multi-crew. I.e. if attempting to pilot alone you can't do everything at once, you have to switch seats to manage power or plot routes. The disadvantage this would bring in most situations would make multi-crew a proper requirement to use a large ship to its full potential.

Perhaps the trade off could be a more indepth version of each task. i.e. when plotting routes you can manually adjust them, when assigning pips you can preset configurations, when managing turrets you can reload and manage heat and power specifically for that turret.

Basically there is so much untapped potential here!

Bring in ship interiors and its a transformative affect on the game.

I'm going to say something probably a bit contravercial but I think FPS combat is a total mistake. Odyssey should have focussed on improving what you can do in a ship. That's where this game shines. FDev could have turned ED into a comprehensive spaceship experience with Odyssey. Instead they chose to overreach into territory that waters down the core experience further. I see this as a real shame.

I do welcome spacelegs. Hell yes I do. But I'm a pilot, not a marine! I want to explore my ship, a planet, a harbour, heck float out in space. But I want to fight in my ship where its warm and safe and I have tons of metal around me.

If I wanted FPS fights I'd just go back to Destiny or COD or any number of a thousand and 1 guaranteed better experiences.

Sigh...

 

[JTFireblaze]

Ships above a certain size should not function fully without multi-crew

While I tend to agree with this in some ways, it would absolutely ruin certain playstyles for solo commanders unless there was an NPC crew system so that solo commanders can still use larger ships. And we have been able to pilot everything from the main chair already, removing that ability would cause an uproar!

If they could patch up some of the obvious issues in the current system, then look to flesh out an NPC crew system, then make it so you need crew to support the larger ships. Hell yeah!

 

[badfellowman]

There are so many good topics on this forum, but FD do not even think to answer...

 

[JTFireblaze]

There are so many good topics on this forum, but FD do not even think to answer...

We're in the suggestions forum. They don't often visit these places

 

[badfellowman]

Update! More people have to see this before the Odyssey startup.

 

[JTFireblaze]

Update! More people have to see this before the Odyssey startup.

I doubt FDev are going to have made any changes to it in time for Odyssey launch unfortunately.

Hopefully once launch settles, and the bugfixes are progressing, then they can start to look at improving their multicrew experience, given that physical multicrew is one of their new features

 

[Vi7ER]

I sure hope they will get to work on that as soon as they can because that excites me far more than FPS combat.

I don't know about you but I play ED to be a pilot in awesome spaceships and do piloty things! That's where ED excels. So this whole FPS combat element doesn't appeal to me in the slightest. If I want to play FPS combat games there are so many better options out there.

Don't get me wrong I totally welcome spacelegs! But why not limit it to pilot tasks only? Allow us to explore our ships, inside and out, walk around star ports, trade, explore planet surfaces and even assist in "spacemarine" operations by for example dropping and collecting troops from battle or providing covering fire.

But this whole combat and espionage stuff just jars with me as it's no longer about the ships. It's basically another game entirely where our ships become taxis. I just think it's a bad move personally. But it's probably just me lol!

Anyway, I do hope they go back to dramatically improving core things like multi-crew, NPC crew and wings and how they all interplay with one another.

o7

 

[Lone_star]

Total guess on my part.... but I'd guess only a tiny portion of the player base has even ever attempted to use Multi-crew.... which is why it's received little attention

 

[Greasetrap42]

Total guess on my part.... but I'd guess only a tiny portion of the player base has even ever attempted to use Multi-crew.... which is why it's received little attention

I'm a statistic of one(1). It was among the first things I tried when I first upgraded from sidewinder to AspX. Multicrew was a significant advertised feature that drew me to ED. I was so excited... and so was a friend. Then hugely disappointed. I spent quite a bit of time then researching multicrew on the internet. I figured I must be doing something wrong. It just didn't make any sense that all my friend could do was look out the window. What the heck?

Very disappointed.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Multicrew is a sadly underdeveloped feature. There is so much low hanging fruit there, it's a shame FD won't spend even a hint of Dev time on it.

 

[JTFireblaze]

Total guess on my part.... but I'd guess only a tiny portion of the player base has even ever attempted to use Multi-crew.... which is why it's received little attention

Catch 22.

Low usage probably due to how restrictive it is (low rewards, half of your game functionality is locked out when multicrew is active, wings pays better in every situation) and how buggy it can be (connection issues, UI not functioning, I even had a glitch where I ended up in the pilot seat the other day). And that low usage means FDev don't want to put resources on it.

Which is a damn shame. Because when it does work, it's really great. If they buffed the multicrew rewards and prioritised some of the more pressing bugs, I can almost guarantee there would be an influx of new multicrew players.

 

[tanner1ie]

Ex

Who am I?​

Just a usual cmdr. I'm a big sci-fi fan and Elite Dangerous is one of my favorite games. There are several reasons: there is no colorful space of No Man’s Sky, the design of the ships is believable, the battles are deadly, and control requires skill, but allows you to finely control the movements of the spacecraft. It lacks the ability to get out of the chair, but it doesn't really impact the gaming experience.

What's wrong?​

I recently invited my best friend to play my favorite space simulator. Since the game has the ability to control one ship, I bought Python and we started flying. After two hours of playing, I was completely disappointed with Multicrew.

View attachment 210644

Pay attention to the co-pilot's interface: the gunner does not know which target is selected and where the ship is flying. The HUD on the cockpit glass is completely absent. In addition, there is no radar and clear indication of shields.​

The role of the co-pilot has been curtailed so much that there is no room for role-playing. In fact, the only thing the co-pilot can be responsible for is turrets and external equipment. The rest of the time he misses. Here is a list of what the co-pilot cannot do, but logically he should do:

1. See the ship commander interface
2. See the target of the commander when selected
3. Manage ship energy and fully distribute it between subsystems
4. Enable and disable ship modules
5. Enable silent running
6. Open the cargo scoop
7. Request docking permission
8. Drive SRV
9. Mark targets
10. Make notes on the galactic map
11. Take control as needed

View attachment 210645
This is what the gunner's interface looks like when controlling turrets. The gunner does not see the target of the ship commander, and the ship commander does not see the target of the gunner. As a result: shooting at different targets.

Why is that bad?​

The correct distribution of functions between the commander and the co-pilot is a separate meta-game that would contribute to better player cooperation and more enjoyment of the game. The absence of these elements makes Multicrew mode useless and boring, although the very idea of joint control of the ship is intriguing. I haven't talked about the numerous Multicrew bugs here yet, but they are not important if the mechanics themselves are broken.

I really hope that Frontiers will pay attention to this issue in the future, because apart from Elite Dangerous, no game can offer such an immersive experience of space adventures. Perhaps this is not a problem at all, and I am making mountains out of molehills. Multicrew is useful for farming credits in wing missions, but is that really the only thing players want from that mechanic?

---

P.S.​

Sorry for mistakes. English is not my native language.
Thank you for reading this!

Reddit discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj/multicrew_is_an_unfinished_mechanic_that_needs_to/

Who am I?​

Just a usual cmdr. I'm a big sci-fi fan and Elite Dangerous is one of my favorite games. There are several reasons: there is no colorful space of No Man’s Sky, the design of the ships is believable, the battles are deadly, and control requires skill, but allows you to finely control the movements of the spacecraft. It lacks the ability to get out of the chair, but it doesn't really impact the gaming experience.

What's wrong?​

I recently invited my best friend to play my favorite space simulator. Since the game has the ability to control one ship, I bought Python and we started flying. After two hours of playing, I was completely disappointed with Multicrew.

View attachment 210644

Pay attention to the co-pilot's interface: the gunner does not know which target is selected and where the ship is flying. The HUD on the cockpit glass is completely absent. In addition, there is no radar and clear indication of shields.​

The role of the co-pilot has been curtailed so much that there is no room for role-playing. In fact, the only thing the co-pilot can be responsible for is turrets and external equipment. The rest of the time he misses. Here is a list of what the co-pilot cannot do, but logically he should do:

1. See the ship commander interface
2. See the target of the commander when selected
3. Manage ship energy and fully distribute it between subsystems
4. Enable and disable ship modules
5. Enable silent running
6. Open the cargo scoop
7. Request docking permission
8. Drive SRV
9. Mark targets
10. Make notes on the galactic map
11. Take control as needed

View attachment 210645
This is what the gunner's interface looks like when controlling turrets. The gunner does not see the target of the ship commander, and the ship commander does not see the target of the gunner. As a result: shooting at different targets.

Why is that bad?​

The correct distribution of functions between the commander and the co-pilot is a separate meta-game that would contribute to better player cooperation and more enjoyment of the game. The absence of these elements makes Multicrew mode useless and boring, although the very idea of joint control of the ship is intriguing. I haven't talked about the numerous Multicrew bugs here yet, but they are not important if the mechanics themselves are broken.

I really hope that Frontiers will pay attention to this issue in the future, because apart from Elite Dangerous, no game can offer such an immersive experience of space adventures. Perhaps this is not a problem at all, and I am making mountains out of molehills. Multicrew is useful for farming credits in wing missions, but is that really the only thing players want from that mechanic?

---

P.S.​

Sorry for mistakes. English is not my native language.
Thank you for reading this!

Reddit discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj Source: https://www.reddit.com/r/EliteDangerous/comments/ludrbj/multicrew_is_an_unfinished_mechanic_that_needs_to/

Indeed excellent post, multicrew right now is nearly useless.

Hopefully when Frontier finish cleaning up Odeesey and release it on consoles, they turn their attention to fleshing out the rest of the game, in particular in multicrew and squadrons .

 

[[PS4] Filthymick420]

Tbh the forum just needs a specific subsection for all of its half finished stuff. Anyone ever finish the Ram Tah missions?