Would the autopilot also honk the entire system and tell me when there is an earth like planet or a black hole?
2.2's Instant Ship and Module Transport - Yay or Nay?
- Thread starter Kintch
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you may wanna read at least some of the thread........
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[video=youtube;kGpsXuMvApo]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kGpsXuMvApo[/video]
Again: instantanous is for the lame weekend commanders with their puny 5 hour weekly playtime. Shame on them for ruining our game!
They can not plan, they cannot travel (yea, technically they're the better customers for FD, since they pay the same for the game but use a fraction of server ressources, but still BOOOO!)
Again: those poor souls who can't play as much as some Hardcore gamers would still be in a much better position with time-consuming ship transfer than they are now, with no ship transfer at all.
What is needed is the option to initiate a transfer between two stations from a third place. That way people could plan ahead, get their needed ship from station A to station B, while they themselves start from location C. When they arrive, their requested ship has probably already arrived.
That's the strategic element I am referring to, that would make time-consuming ship transport not just more realistic, but also interesting to use and still much more convenient than no ship transfer at all.
This is probably the most eloquent presentation of the problem with this mechanic that I have read and I would love to hear a proper response.
Unfortunately, it'll just be trolling remarks from Kanja Club.
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Well I had this all typed out in the 4th wall thread, but it got closed before I could post pointing to this thread and while it doesn't really belong here I figured I post it anyway because... meh.
Well if we're going to discuss the 4th wall then let's discuss the whole subject and not just rehash the ship transfer arguments. The 4th wall is a tricky beast in a persistent online game the very nature of the game tends to undermine believable self consistent worlds,
- Dealing with logging in and logging off, player death and respawn (a biggie that ED makes almost no attempt to explain).
- The passage of time even when you're not playing.
- Instant loading and unloading/repair/skipping over the time anything "boring" would take and/or compressing time in general.
- Other players being... well other players, rather than believable roleplayed characters in the world.
- Speaking of characters, the complete lack of the ability to communicate with or question NPCs in the game.
- Combat Zones (in their entirety).
- Community goals, which have always struck me as being a hideous OOC feature welded into the ingame world.
- CQC... Pretty sure they said ftl communication didn't exist.
- Lack of commodity data on other systems. Even if FTL communication still does't exist (and that's not clear as FD seem to have been pretty fast and loose with the lore) given how easy ftl travel is there would be a network of com probes jumping around gathering and distributing news, commodity data, etc.
I could probably go on, but that should be enough to get getting on with I suppose my point, if I have one, is that ED does not seem to me to be that sort of game. It's WoW in space, it's what happens when you try to build an online game. The "game" becomes a virtual environment for us (the real us) to meet up and play in, so the 4th wall is fatally compromised from the get go. Now I'll grant you it doesn't need to be that way. But then if it were built differently you get to a point were you have to ask if it's worth making it an online game at all.
Well if we're going to discuss the 4th wall then let's discuss the whole subject and not just rehash the ship transfer arguments. The 4th wall is a tricky beast in a persistent online game the very nature of the game tends to undermine believable self consistent worlds,
- Dealing with logging in and logging off, player death and respawn (a biggie that ED makes almost no attempt to explain).
- The passage of time even when you're not playing.
- Instant loading and unloading/repair/skipping over the time anything "boring" would take and/or compressing time in general.
- Other players being... well other players, rather than believable roleplayed characters in the world.
- Speaking of characters, the complete lack of the ability to communicate with or question NPCs in the game.
- Combat Zones (in their entirety).
- Community goals, which have always struck me as being a hideous OOC feature welded into the ingame world.
- CQC... Pretty sure they said ftl communication didn't exist.
- Lack of commodity data on other systems. Even if FTL communication still does't exist (and that's not clear as FD seem to have been pretty fast and loose with the lore) given how easy ftl travel is there would be a network of com probes jumping around gathering and distributing news, commodity data, etc.
I could probably go on, but that should be enough to get getting on with
I suppose my point, if I have one, is that ED does not seem to me to be that sort of game. It's WoW in space, it's what happens when you try to build an online game. The "game" becomes a virtual environment for us (the real us) to meet up and play in, so the 4th wall is fatally compromised from the get go. Now I'll grant you it doesn't need to be that way. But then if it were built differently you get to a point were you have to ask if it's worth making it an online game at all.
Of course they matter. Just the same as all players matter. But backers are no longer the only focus. Backers got to help guide version 1.0, because they were the only investors. Now we have a whole range of people who have further funded the game, so FD have a wider audience to listen to.
Kickstarters still get to keep their special area of the forums though, where FD will discuss things with them they don't want to discuss with us proles
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No you would have to do that by yourself, it only fly the ship from point A ---- B.
An interesting alternative would be to allow a ship to be broken down and placed into storage as cargo on another ship. It would end up weighing some portion of the normal weight of the ship and could be carried to another station. A large cargo ship could potentially carry multiple ships this way. These could either be fulfilled by the player moving the ship or by another player as a mission. This could be an interesting player to player interaction if players could set the value of the mission to attract players to do the mission for them. Since the system would control who the mission was given to, it wouldn't really open the door to reliable credit transfers.
Yup, this is it. Really, i could acutally wait in game time for cargo loading, refuelling and repairs...
People who don't want a delay to ship transfer can take on a mission, fly to an asteroid belt and mine, land on a planet, scan some wakes, do a trading run, cash in some bounties, sell exploration data, destroy some skimmers, oh I could go on....
My version seems to offer a lot more to do to players. Do I win?
A lot of things are simplified due to the mechanics not been developed to date and it can be accepted, a lot of these are placeholder features. What cannot be accepted is mechanic that fundamentally devalues the 1:1 scale of the universe and destroys the credulity of the game itself.
That's a very strategic game-design decision.
Would you rather focus providing players with more interesting things to do while they're logged in (wheter it be 3 or 90 hours a week), or better automation to skip over the not-so exciting parts?
Would you rather have the same coder write some "waitstates" and "counters" for a delay in ship transportation, or add some new fields and routines that you can fill with exploration data?
Because if you "plan strategically", placing the "action" away from those points where ship transfer is possible, is the next logical step. You might be able to move your fleet to Obsidian Orbital for a few million credits .. but the next 200-300 ly to the Thargoids, you're on your own .. good luck with that 2D friendship drive.
Sadly no, you don't win. As his suggestion allows people to wait if they want to and not if they don't. Where as yours is just restating that people don't have to sit on their hands while waiting. But that's not their problem, their problem is that they want instant transfer to do something then and there. Right or wrong you can't give them what they want by your method. But folks taking the game rules into their own hands and RPing a wait for delivery works just fine. So, I'm afraid, in this context he wins.
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![[VR] Frank_G](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/59/59394.jpg?1553527111){kind=avatar}
Right. Cargo loading and repair time could be added, when we are able to leave our seats. It then becomes a decision to repair now, take that extra cargo, or risk continuing in a damaged ship and not missing the delivery deadline of the primary cargo. But if added or not, there must not be any me hanic, that kills the scale and the believability.
a) it's the galaxy, not the universe
b) this is the 1:1 scale galaxy - a fraction of that teal ring you see there is the "Bubble" .. a fraction of that bubble even has the opportunity for ship transfer. "Fundamentally devalues" .. .cut down the sillyness please.
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Gotta say you are posting much faster than i can rep you.
That's a very strategic game-design decision.
Would you rather focus providing players with more interesting things to do while they're logged in (wheter it be 3 or 90 hours a week), or better automation to skip over the not-so exciting parts?
Would you rather have the same coder write some "waitstates" and "counters" for a delay in ship transportation, or add some new fields and routines that you can fill with exploration data?
Because if you "plan strategically", placing the "action" away from those points where ship transfer is possible, is the next logical step. You might be able to move your fleet to Obsidian Orbital for a few million credits .. but the next 200-300 ly to the Thargoids, you're on your own .. good luck with that 2D friendship drive.
The autoPilot as suggested in the DDF didn't bring anything new to the table, to code it, I'm not a programmer, so please correct me if wrong, would not be a huge task, there are already hacks you can apply in ED that will do just that and more.
What I ask is a simple automation of the rotate press (J) before you warp to the next star. Anything the interrupts the NAV computer will disengage it and you're on you own. if we can have instant ship transfer, I can't see why we can't have the AP, and even if we can't have the IST, I can't see any logical reason not to have the simple AP.
it could be a crewman you need to hire and pay a salary to keep, just like the fighter pilot.
You went to a lot of effort there just to say nothing of consequence.
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