2.3 dev update feedback mega thread

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Windscreen Smudge

W
Robert Maynard said:
Mine's fine. If Frontier want to describe the method of getting players into ships to serve as crew as telepresence, who are we to argue?

For the record I have nothing against it as I fully expected Frontier to lower this barrier to gameplay (by not requiring players to co-locate to join as crew) - however the same cannot be said for all participants. :)
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A Description has nothing to do with how the game actually works. How the game works is what matters.

Telepresence is not important. Matchmaking is. Hopefully they have the Matchmaking worked out and it isn't as buggy as Wings, another mechanic in the game that relies on matchmaking.

Nothing relies on telepresence. Telepresence is not a thing. It only exists in people's imaginations. Matchmaking is real. Stick with what's real, because the things that are real are the things that are important.

Getting this yet?
 

Mephane

Mephane
Robert Maynard said:
Probably not a good idea - given that telepresence is a fundamental enabler to multi-crew - and this is the 2.3 feedback mega-thread, after all....
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Telepresence is not a fundamental enabler at all. Instant transfer yes, probably. Telepresence is just useless lore to explain what should better be left outside the scope of the lore in the first place. Just like SLF 3D printing, the technology to perform full-body instantaneous interstellar telepresence would automatically make a lot of things obsolete - most hips would be unmanned, remotely controlled from pilots sitting in telepresence booths in safe, comfortable locations. And then data transfer would be easy and limitless, meaning things like exploration data or bounty vouchers would not need the ship to return - in fact most exploration would happen with unmanned ships as well, never meant to return home at all, ever.
 

Winterwalker

Winterwalker
Windscreen Smudge said:
No. Matchmaking is an enabler for multi-crew.
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Deadspin said:
Personally, I believe people just need to suck it up.
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Or agree to disagree? Because yes, it's a match-making enabler and yes, people can suck it up. I can, easily, I'm over 21 but that's not the issue. The issue is wherever possible maintaining a level of integrity of the game and in it's world/galaxy/environment.

Reason; You might have noticed that much of the time ED is a slow pace game, not only a twitch shoot 'em up, it's also a slow burn with people making distant world trips, rescuing people with fuel and engaging with the galaxy "as if it were a real place". Believe me, the game as a whole benefits from having "wherever possible" as much consistency as possible. Nobody's proposing 'don't have the match-making enabler' but they are concerned that it should be recognisable as one .. and not be mistaken for magics, in a game where the CEO of the developing company (and many of it's fans, players, backers, contributors) value, if not scientific realism, but where necessary in the interests of a playable game, a consistent "plausibility". (ie. a science fiction .. not science fantasy). ED sells itself short if that gets forgotten, and people are definitely entitled to expect that it's not forgotten if they're invested in seeing ED last a long time into the future. If all it is an enabler, it shouldn't worry anyone that the transition to crew 'feels natural' to the theme (pilot in space, blaze your own trail) if possible. KK?
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Robert Maynard
Windscreen Smudge said:
Nothing relies on telepresence. Telepresence is not a thing. It only exists in people's imaginations. Matchmaking is real. Stick with what's real, because the things that are real are the things that are important.

Getting this yet?
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Reduce it to that level and the whole game could be described as imaginary in that case. It is still a game, not real, though.

How Frontier chooses to describe particular features is important to some, unimportant to others - those who wish to discuss it can do so, in my opinion.

Plus the fact that telepresence is also used to describe how SLFs are piloted - so it would rather seem to be a "thing" in the E: D galaxy.
 

Xender

Xender
Because traveling in Elite is really time sink, they could introduce beaming/telepoting technology - much better than telepresence ;P
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Robert Maynard
Mephane said:
Telepresence is not a fundamental enabler at all. Instant transfer yes, probably.
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If it was a transfer then, presumably, we would be able to disembark where the ship being crewed was docked - that is not going to be the case - when we leave the crew, we will reappear, with our ship, where we were just before we joined the crew.
 

[VR] Bac Ho

[VR] Bac Ho
I have not read all the comments here, but what I can see there are two camps entrenched, one for and other against the telepresence issue. I was thinking there must be some middle ground that would be acceptable to the both camps. I'm not sure if this has been suggested before, but please hear me out.

At the moment we have telepresence in the game with the SLF with a range of 30km as the mother-ship that transmitting the signal.

So why not for multi-crew use the stations across the bubble like a network that can boost the telepresence signal of a range (let's say 300ly) from any station in any direction. This would make telepresence throughout the bubble and with a area of 300ly around the bubble. This model can be use for Colonia and any other expansion future as long there is station present.

Any commander wanting to become a telepresence crew of another ship must first dock at ANY STATION to link to the network, via “telepresence crew lounge” which could be in the station services along with the npc crew lounge that we have already.

Yes this would limit the multi-crew feature to the bubble and a area of 300ly outside or anywhere there is a station present, but as multi-crew feature is only combat oriented I can't see a problem.

This system might help to try explain the telepresence issue in the game.

I'm not sure if what I have suggested would help, but anyway it's just an idea. :D
 

Winterwalker

Winterwalker
Robert Maynard said:
If it was a transfer then, presumably, we would be able to disembark where the ship being crewed was docked - that is not going to be the case - when we leave the crew, we will reappear, with our ship, where we were just before we joined the crew.
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It's speculation .. but could imagine in future there being a difference between a 'telepresence' crew and a 'real' crew player, who met you at the dock and walked onboard. A TP crewman might be limited to the guns, or to any particular role, but a physical crew might be able to swicth roles, possibly helm the ship and therefore gets a fuller experience? If at some stage space legs do come along, it would come to a head .. or otherwise "why" walk onboard with your new space legs, if you can do everything anyway by phoning it in? At that stage there would ideally be a distinction between the two, if TP is to stay as a permanent fixture?
 
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Deleted member 110222

D
Once more, I'm saying it. Don't care about telepresence. Just give the crew something to do!
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Robert Maynard
Winterwalker said:
It's speculation .. but could imagine in future there being a difference between a 'telepresence' crew and a 'real' crew player who met you at the dock and walked onboard. A TP crewman might be limited to the guns, or to any particular role, but a physical crew might be able to swicth roles, possibly helm the ship and therefore gets a fuller experience? If at some stage space legs do come along, it would come to a head .. or "why" walk onboard with your new space legs, if you can do everything anyway by phoning it in? At that stage there would ideally be a distinction between the two, if TP is to stay as a permanent fixture?
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That'd be interesting - especially if some form of damage control were to be introduced that would require crew to get out of their chair.... :)
 

Windscreen Smudge

W
Robert Maynard said:
Reduce it to that level and the whole game could be described as imaginary in that case. It is still a game, not real, though.

How Frontier chooses to describe particular features is important to some, unimportant to others - those who wish to discuss it can do so, in my opinion.

Plus the fact that telepresence is also used to describe how SLFs are piloted - so it would rather seem to be a "thing" in the E: D galaxy.
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No, actually it's not.

Matchmaking is netcode. Netcode is a real thing Rob. It makes the game work.

Telepresence is nothing. It doesn't make anything work. It doesn't exist.
 

Winterwalker

Winterwalker
Xae said:
JunkStatistics.txt

That is only true if the sample was randomly selected.

It wasn't.
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70/30? The instant ship-transfer poll was (I'd suggest) a representative poll (open to all Cmdr accounts worldwide) because it also spoke about plausable realism. That time it was about instant transfers of physical objects (ships) across distances.

This time, the physical object, is the pilot.

So, if the new question was, 'should your commander teleport instantly to a different ship to crew there .. OR .. should there be a form of remote control, if your ship is light years from the target ship, where you will perform crew tasks' I bet you'd get the same 70% looking for the less teleport-y, and less instant transfer-ish, of the two?

My bet is you'd find telepresence, remote control, 70/30 popular in a Community wide vote on that and here's my ton of Painite.
 
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Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Robert Maynard
Winterwalker said:
70/30? The instant ship-transfer poll was (I'd suggest) a representative poll (open to all Cmdr accounts worldwide) because it also spoke about plausable realism. That time it was about instant transfers of physical objects (ships).
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It was rather interesting that the forum poll that preceded the official poll, the official off-forum poll and the exit poll that ran on the forums as the official poll was running all gave the same result (within a few percent).....
 
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