Allow use of pre 3.3 Advanced Discovery Scanner

[Riverside]

Long standing game elements should not be removed on a whim at the expense of the playerbase. Having used both old & new systems extensively it is clear there would be no advantage to fitting the old ADS module (the most powerful of the three) to a current ship that justifies their removal for balancing reasons.

The ADS/IDS/BDS modules should be made available in outfitting for players to purchase again. The ADS would provide the functionality already present in explored systems, in unexplored and partially explored systems at the cost of having to fit the ADS module (power, mass & occupies a slot). The other modules would provide similar functionality but with reduced range (and cost) as before.

 

[ThatSmileyGuy]

The ADS/IDS/BDS modules should be made available in outfitting for players to purchase again.

Yes, that's what i mean. Encourage variety. If people do find FSS superior, and i'm sure most do, let them enjoy the FSS.
However do not take away from those that did enjoy the previous system, got used to it, as well as allow players to select their playstyle.
ED is a great game as it allows players to actively do what they want and, foremost, how they want to do it.
FSS would still be the leading exploration tool.
Allowing players to re-fit (should they decide to) previously used scanners would allow everyone to find their own style of exploring.

 

[Sylow]

Maybe I'm just seeing things here, but I returned to the dark and started looking at systems with FSS that were discovered by ADS and found many that were scanned under the older ADS system, with credit given for being honked, but when I remap the same planet or moon, I get the credit if the planet or moon using FSS.

Are you sure you use the FSS and not the probes? The old system only gave you "first discovered". The "first mapped" was introduced along with the scanner changes, which also introduced the ability to launch probes and map planetary bodies. So it's quite logical that you can find systems which previously were explored but have bodies which were not mapped yet. But to get the "first mapped" you have to use the Detailed Surface Scanner. If you indeed manage to get some "first mapped" entries without using this tool, you found a bug which should be reported.

 

[ThatSmileyGuy]

The FSS has cut my exploration time by more than half

I don't deny that. In many (if not most) cases, FSS cuts the exploration time of whole system drasticaly. Then again, it's not about having it removed. I can see You have joined forums just recently(Thanks to my previous flop i've learned how to check that). This thread is about exploring a possibility of expanding exploration aspect of the game for those who did seek different kind of results from it. looking back, before the 3.3 update one would see what was in the system as well. But in a different manner. The one that others found faster than it is now with FSS. System map returned different kind of information. So does FSS. Please understand, that different player groups did seek something different from exploring the galaxy.
Giving the players the choice to choose their method is key here.

 

[ThatSmileyGuy]

In nearly every way the FSS functions better than honk-look system

It's a subjective matter, really. What i want You to understand that exploration focused portion of the community had a viable mechanic taken away from them. Please do have a re-read of the thread to have a better understaing of the matter i'm trying to represent here. Whilst You might think that cherry picking is THE WAY of carrying out exploration it's not entirely true for the rest. You did mention the point i did explain previously, trying to justify FSS' presence in the game since it's faster for cherry-picking style of gameplay.
Then again, for those who seek views, vistas or otherwise extraordinary systems in vast expanses of entire galaxy it's a forced mechanic that slows the entire endeavour down.

 

[KellyR]

The new discovery scanner works just like the old Advanced Discovery Scanner. Once you've established an orbital plane, you can go to the system map and find any stations that are present as well as all planets. If you want to discover those planets and the what comprises the rings (where applicable), you have to use your FSS. You needed a Surface scanner to do this before and now you don't. Just your FSS. If you still want to map the, then you'll need a Surface Scanner (just like before). So, no. The way it is right now is fine concerning exploration. Mining, I can't say as I'm not a miner and therefore won't even address that.

 

[space voyager]

I'm pretty sick of these threads. I also think the first post describes pretty nicely exactly what I dislike about the ADS - jump, honk, glance, jump... This never should be called exploration.

Though to your defence,OP, at least you glanced, some didn't even do that.

 

[Burke]

I'm pretty sick of these threads. I also think the first post describes pretty nicely exactly what I dislike about the ADS - jump, honk, glance, jump... This never should be called exploration.

Though to your defence,OP, at least you glanced, some didn't even do that.

The jump honk that you dislike so much is still in the game and you get paid for it from what i have read on here, its just that you are denied the opportunity to "glance" The reason these threads keep popping up is that the FSS is a POS and i expect these threads will keep popping up unless fdev opens their ears to the feedback that they asked for. All the FSS acheived was ruining exploration for photo explorers. Its about as full on troll as it gets.

 

[space voyager]

OTOH you got the zoomed-in view of the worlds, an advanced "photo explorers" tool. Just a little extra work and you can be much more sure the trip to the planet will be worth it.

 

[Burke]

AsTheSmileyGuy has already explained...

Then again, for those who seek views, vistas or otherwise extraordinary systems in vast expanses of entire galaxy it's a forced mechanic that slows the entire endeavour down.

Its been said over and over again, the FSS is a barrier to seeking out such things. There is no way you can spin it into being something useful.

 

[space voyager]

AsTheSmileyGuy has already explained...

Its been said over and over again, the FSS is a barrier to seeking out such things. There is no way you can spin it into being something useful.

Yes, but you just don't get it that some of us LIKE the barrier. At least do something to get to know the system.

 

[[Diplomacy] Carnegie]

I'm pretty sick of these threads. I also think the first post describes pretty nicely exactly what I dislike about the ADS - jump, honk, glance, jump... This never should be called exploration.

Though to your defence,OP, at least you glanced, some didn't even do that.

You're sick of people asking for something that wouldn't affect your gameplay in any way?

Interesting outlook.

 

[Phoenix_Dfire]

This is what really frustrates me, I don't see the difference between what the op is describing and using this instead;-

It's no more complicated that looking through the old charts of planets that we used to consult before and they've even added an indicator in the lower left of the UI to tell you what type of planet the scanning line is on.

The only issue I have with the FSS is that there should be options to manage the volume of the signals and pulsing lights to help people who have reported migranes when using it.

 

[Burke]

Yes, but you just don't get it that some of us LIKE the barrier. At least do something to get to know the system.

Im not saying you shouldnt like it, im not saying to take it away from you. Im saying that everybody could be happy if the player was given the choice. Choice is the big issue here, the last update forced the FSS on people who do not like it. Does your enjoyment and my enjoyment have to be exclusive? I dont beleive it does.

Its the same issue as that awful colour saturation, subnautica gives the player three different filters that they can choose between, three! ED inflicts itself upon the player, are we meant to be grateful for this?

It's no more complicated that looking through the old charts of planets that we used to consult before and they've even added an indicator in the lower left of the UI to tell you what type of planet the scanning line is on.

Yes it is. Its a barrier to gameplay, i dont need to explain why cause its been explained in many posts. If you arnt getting it yet you never will. Anybody claiming its no different is just plain wrong.

 

[Phoenix_Dfire]

Yes it is. Its a barrier to gameplay, i dont need to explain why cause its been explained in many posts. If you arnt getting it yet you never will. Anybody claiming its no different is just plain wrong.

I'm afraid you would have to explain because (And pardon the pun), because I just don't see it. With the new system I can see if there are planets of interest without having to leave the game to look up a chart because it tells you in the bottom left hand corner, I can scan an entire system within a couple of minutes if I chose to. I don't sew why it's a barrier to gameplay when there wasn't really any gameplay in the old exploration mechanic anyway.

 

[Sylow]

Im not saying you shouldnt like it, im not saying to take it away from you. Im saying that everybody could be happy if the player was given the choice. Choice is the big issue here, the last update forced the FSS on people who do not like it. Does your enjoyment and my enjoyment have to be exclusive? I dont beleive it does.

The problem is that you want it -easy- to spot the vistas still. As it formerly was. I mean, it now isn't impossible to do what you want to do, either. But instead of the high challenge of pressing the honk button for a few seconds, you now have to use the FSS to scan the system first. Then you go to the system map and see what special vistas and formations are around.

I get it, what you want to do was easy before and now takes more work. It's one of many things which actually became more work. (Imagine: even missions got a bit harder. Before FSS when i ran an assassination mission i jumped into the system, honked and got the marking where i have to go. Now i have to scan USSes to find my target. I guess i should also complain about it all the time? )

All in all i see it like this: you are searching for diamonds. Formerly you had a magical diamond detector, now you have to do the work yourself. How valuable may the diamonds be, if they are only worth picking up if you have magic to do that for you?

Its the same issue as that awful colour saturation, subnautica gives the player three different filters that they can choose between, three! ED inflicts itself upon the player, are we meant to be grateful for this?

I also don't consider the FSS to be pretty. I also still wish there would be some radar available while in FSS. I just yesterday again was interdicted by an NPC while in the FSS. (Populated system, i was searching for the mission target. ) So indeed there's plenty of room for improvement. But i rather push for improving things than for undoing improvements to the game.

Yes it is. Its a barrier to gameplay, i dont need to explain why cause its been explained in many posts. If you arnt getting it yet you never will. Anybody claiming its no different is just plain wrong.

Of course things are different. A weak placeholder was replaced by actual mechanic. That all by itself of course means that gameplay has changed. Nobody says that nothing has changed, but we dare to point out everything is still possible to do. And yes, the new mechanic has a number of flaws and shortcomings, which should be fixed. Of course it is a minigame, which can get repetitive if you do it too often. Like any mechanic in a game. But it at least is not a completely-braindead minigame which i feared it to be. It's not hard to learn, but it requires at least some experience to get ahead quickly. So it has at least some learning curve, which definitely is more than "press button for a few seconds".

So really, all the "go back to the old", it will not happen. It would be foolish for FD, it would disappoint all the many people who see the advantage of the new FSS, it would eliminate gameplay, etc. It makes much more sense to make suggestions on how to improve what we have, without demanding to have the old placeholder available again.

 

[Riverside]

I'm afraid you would have to explain because (And pardon the pun), because I just don't see it. With the new system I can see if there are planets of interest without having to leave the game to look up a chart because it tells you in the bottom left hand corner, I can scan an entire system within a couple of minutes if I chose to. I don't sew why it's a barrier to gameplay when there wasn't really any gameplay in the old exploration mechanic anyway.

Would the option to add the ADS (that you would not need to equip) detract from your own play? I think there are people who would prefer not to have to enter the FSS Scanner Screen just as you (presumably) did not want to have to use the ADS before it was removed.

 

[Para Handy]

Its been said over and over again, the FSS is a barrier to seeking out such things. ....

... and people have replied over and over again NO IT ISN'T.

 

[Faded Glory]

I'm afraid you would have to explain because (And pardon the pun), because I just don't see it. With the new system I can see if there are planets of interest without having to leave the game to look up a chart because it tells you in the bottom left hand corner, I can scan an entire system within a couple of minutes if I chose to. I don't sew why it's a barrier to gameplay when there wasn't really any gameplay in the old exploration mechanic anyway.

You don't see it because it's a style of exploration you either haven't engaged in or are not interested in.

For identifying specific body types (it's the bottom right of the screen, at least in my FSS) and numbers of bodies in a system the FSS is great. For scanning systems the FSS is very quick and efficient.

But say you are looking for a glowing green gas giant... You can drop into a system, see at a glance that there are gas giants present. All good so far. But the FSS gives no indication that the gas giants present are glowing green, so you will have to scan them first. The problem now is that glowing green gas giants are rare, so you are going to have to scan many, many gas giants only to discover that none of them are glowing green. While it wasn't particularly difficult or time consuming, it wasn't really what you were after...

So, you are being obliged to engage in gameplay that isn't providing you with the results you are interested in.

Suppose you are taking a mission to blow up pirates, but there was no indication in the HUD that a ship was a mission target. So, you just have to keep blowing up ships in the vague hope that they are the ones you are actually after (and we can ignore the fact that in real life, those ships often don't turn up anyway). While blowing up ships may be fun, if your goal were to complete the mission, you'd probably get fed up pretty soon and wish there were a way of actually targeting the ships you want to engage with and blow up.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

You don't see it because it's a style of exploration you either haven't engaged in or are not interested in.

For identifying specific body types (it's the bottom right of the screen, at least in my FSS) and numbers of bodies in a system the FSS is great. For scanning systems the FSS is very quick and efficient.

But say you are looking for a glowing green gas giant... You can drop into a system, see at a glance that there are gas giants present. All good so far. But the FSS gives no indication that the gas giants present are glowing green, so you will have to scan them first. The problem now is that glowing green gas giants are rare, so you are going to have to scan many, many gas giants only to discover that none of them are glowing green. While it wasn't particularly difficult or time consuming, it wasn't really what you were after...

So, you are being obliged to engage in gameplay that isn't providing you with the results you are interested in.

Suppose you are taking a mission to blow up pirates, but there was no indication in the HUD that a ship was a mission target. So, you just have to keep blowing up ships in the vague hope that they are the ones you are actually after (and we can ignore the fact that in real life, those ships often don't turn up anyway). While blowing up ships may be fun, if your goal were to complete the mission, you'd probably get fed up pretty soon and wish there were a way of actually targeting the ships you want to engage with and blow up.

What would be better though is to have some gameplay that helps you find that pirate instead of a great big freaking marker saying shoot me know.