'Attack of the AI' III

[777Driver]

since corkscrew didnt seem to work and they can match speed, next time i will try just boosting straight.

Forget corkscrewing and boosting straight, people are misunderstanding the advice on the forum. That method will only work if you have a massive speed advantage over your attacker. Your best option is to boost towards the attacker, as soon as you pass him, flip round and boost towards him again, use lateral and vertical thrust during the boost. The aim is to keep the NPC maneuvering to get a clean shot on you.

Keep the FSD charging whilst you do this, as soon as the FSD is ready, line up and boost towards the high wake target and jump.

Straight line or corkscrewing just makes you an easy target for any ship that can stay within weapons range.

 

[kofeyh]

tried corkscrew as advised but hey its an asp explorer. i dumped 4 pips in eng when the shields died at 8 seconds. and the FAS was still keeping up with me. and it NEVER missed.

If you run in the same direction you are facing, with AI behind you it can fire all guns unobstructed. It will also mass lock.

Please try pitching and facing the attacker and boost past it. You cannot outrun FAS in an asp; you can however out smart it.

next time i will try just boosting straight.

Please, no. Again. Come about. Face the attacker. Boost towards and pass them. If it is a medium or large combat ship it can mass lock you and run you down. Come about. Face bad guy. Boost towards and past. If you need more time, again face attacker and boost again. If they cannot face you, they cannot shoot you.

High-wake out. That's 15 seconds and the AI cannot stop you.

Try this. Just as 777Driver, myself and and others have suggested. I can assure you, it works.

 

[yodajedifishmaster]

ok just to be sure, i turn and face while hes still waiting for cargo and boost past and turn using thruster and do it again until i can jump. i will try this and bill you guys for the credits of rebuy if it fails [big grin]

on a serious note, is this still valid for those nutters who dont appear on radar but taunt you then appear and insta interdict - after interdiction just firing, saying hahahaha or something less witty?

 

[Ozzie F Isaacs]

Yoda, that sounds like the mission generated ones you are describing, that tactic will only buy you time against them, they wont stop coming until they are dead or the mission is completed.

 

[CMDR_TheBS]

Forget corkscrewing and boosting straight, people are misunderstanding the advice on the forum. That method will only work if you have a massive speed advantage over your attacker ... Straight line or corkscrewing just makes you an easy target for any ship that can stay within weapons range.

Which is what many of us are taking issue with. People aren't being specific on these matters. That's why I said ... boosting away from the guy and keeping him outside of 2km just won't work.

That said ... I've boosted past a guy, FA off, turn and hit him hard, then when he gets a bead on me, I boost again past him, etc... until I get my charge built up. Unfortunately, some of these guys just have some serious weapons, so it takes less than 5 seconds for them to bring down everything. So if you time it wrong, you're toast ... and now you're up close'n personal for him to do it.

But yes, pure running has long been an issue. That's why I get tired of people say just run and use lateral thrusters. As you said, it's not often going to work, especially if they can outrun you. I've tried with mines to no avail as well, although they will take out the "smaller fry." That's the only thing I've changed since 2.1, adding mines.

 

[Ochiniwa]

Yep. All he needs to do is learn how to properly run away. Along with a good 70% of the player base.

How is this fun again?

That is exactly the point. I have been reading forums and found out that I no longer can do my deliver missions and kill the one ship that intercepts me. Been playing 3 hours to get 5 millions together and lost it within 30 secs again because an Ananconda intercepted me.

 

[Bomba Luigi]

That is exactly the point. I have been reading forums and found out that I no longer can do my deliver missions and kill the one ship that intercepts me. Been playing 3 hours to get 5 millions together and lost it within 30 secs again because an Ananconda intercepted me.

You can, but you of course need the right ship for the job. If you want to engange in combat you of course will need a ship that can handle that, not every ship is supposed to be great in everything.

 

[Nugstar]

I've not died yet in 2.1, flying an FDL. I dare not fly my Conda, and it's 500million credits worth of hardpoints, scbs and hrps.

The only reason I don't fly it is because I don't have the rebuy just yet.

But I think I'll be Ok.

 

[CMDR_TheBS]

You can, but you of course need the right ship for the job. If you want to engange in combat you of course will need a ship that can handle that, not every ship is supposed to be great in everything.

Which utterly defeats the purpose of even arming a ship and trying to have a "well round ship" to do mining and trading ... let alone exploring. I mean, if we cannot even do combat, and all we are doing is running ... what's the purpose of dealing with intercept after intercept of dangerous/deadly/elite NPCs after us, many times us barely getting out, only to be intercept again, and killed the second time? Seriously?!

I never saw that before 2.1, could focus on mining and trading, and get intercepted with far less frequency. Many times it was someone my level or lower, and I could either run or dispatch. Other times they were higher, and I could escape, as I had enough shielding. If I got a second intercept, I usually wasn't in critical shape. Now? A crapload of dangerous/deadly/elite every time, so Vipers are tough, and FAS/FDL/FGS (or better), shields down in under 5, dead in 10 ... unless I keep distance, then it's 20 or so. Especially on the 2nd intercept when I'm already damaged.

I am always boosting and turning in my Python while kicking off chaff, but they will time it right once, and get that run that takes out my shields, or if not, on the next pass, before I jump out. Then my FSD is hit, and it's over. Or at least on the 2nd interdiction. Great for guys doing combat, great challenge. Utterly sucks for those of us running with 160-224t of materials in a Python or similar, even if A-spec.

That's why a lot of us turned it off. The Dangerous/Deadly/Elite NPCs are constant, rarely any variance, and they get us time and time again. The game isn't for us any more.

 

[Nugstar]

Which utterly defeats the purpose of even arming a ship and trying to have a "well round ship" to do mining and trading ... let alone exploring. I mean, if we cannot even do combat, and all we are doing is running ... what's the purpose of dealing with intercept after intercept of dangerous/deadly/elite NPCs after us, many times us barely getting out, only to be intercept again, and killed the second time? Seriously?!

I never saw that before 2.1, could focus on mining and trading, and get intercepted with far less frequency. Many times it was someone my level or lower, and I could either run or dispatch. Other times they were higher, and I could escape, as I had enough shielding. If I got a second intercept, I usually wasn't in critical shape. Now? A crapload of dangerous/deadly/elite every time, so Vipers are tough, and FAS/FDL/FGS (or better), shields down in under 5, dead in 10 ... unless I keep distance, then it's 20 or so. Especially on the 2nd intercept when I'm already damaged.

I am always boosting and turning in my Python while kicking off chaff, but they will time it right once, and get that run that takes out my shields, or if not, on the next pass, before I jump out. Then my FSD is hit, and it's over. Or at least on the 2nd interdiction. Great for guys doing combat, great challenge. Utterly sucks for those of us running with 160-224t of materials in a Python or similar, even if A-spec.

That's why a lot of us turned it off. The Dangerous/Deadly/Elite NPCs are constant, rarely any variance, and they get us time and time again. The game isn't for us any more.

4 pips to system. High-wake out. Done.

 

[CATPAIN KIRK]

Way too easy. Make it harder!

Pretty much this - I only started playing again after reading lots of whining about the AI being too hard. Doing delivery missions in my Python? Hardly get interdicted at all and if I do it's a tip because if I get interdicted it's still pitiful. Went to a haz RES in my racing paper Courier and only had to extract after a collision (Entirely my fault - I was drunk).

Harder please.

 

[Faybs]

Which utterly defeats the purpose of even arming a ship and trying to have a "well round ship" to do mining and trading ... let alone exploring. I mean, if we cannot even do combat, and all we are doing is running ... what's the purpose of dealing with intercept after intercept of dangerous/deadly/elite NPCs after us, many times us barely getting out, only to be intercept again, and killed the second time? Seriously?!

If I'm walking in the forest and a squirrel for some reason attacks me, I'll kick the stuffing out of it. If I see a bear looking at me funny, I'll deserve what I get if I try to do the same. The whole point of having different grades of AI is not how many goodies you get when you pop the piñata, it's having fights that are easy and fights that are hard. Some fights will be unwinnable (like when you're doing a taxi run in a hauler and a conda shows an interest in you) so a good pilot will know how to evade.

 

[kofeyh]

That is exactly the point. I have been reading forums and found out that I no longer can do my deliver missions and kill the one ship that intercepts me. Been playing 3 hours to get 5 millions together and lost it within 30 secs again because an Ananconda intercepted me.

4 pips to SYS, target another system, leave. Waking to another system (high wake) is 15 seconds. Mass lock from another ship can't stop you.

I believe a lot of people are still trying to escape to supercruise, believing this is always faster; if you are mass locked, it almost always is slower to try and run from mass lock.

If one is mass locked, stop jumping, target a system, start jumping. 4 pips to sys roughly halves incoming damage and you can turn to face attacker and boost past to break their weapons lock.

15 seconds. That's all it takes to garuntee escape. 4 pips to sys, boost around and past the attacker. Rebuy screen should become a thing of the past. Also if one is not specifically engaged in knocking AI heads together; leave. Staying to punish an attacker puts your entire cargo and ship's rebuy on the line.

Note: the above is nothing new, it's just now somewhat more effective.

 

[Mohenjo]

4 pips to SYS, target another system, leave. Waking to another system (high wake) is 15 seconds. Mass lock from another ship can't stop you.

I believe a lot of people are still trying to escape to supercruise, believing this is always faster; if you are mass locked, it almost always is slower to try and run from mass lock.

If one is mass locked, stop jumping, target a system, start jumping. 4 pips to sys roughly halves incoming damage and you can turn to face attacker and boost past to break their weapons lock.

15 seconds. That's all it takes to garuntee escape. 4 pips to sys, boost around and past the attacker. Rebuy screen should become a thing of the past. Also if one is not specifically engaged in knocking AI heads together; leave. Staying to punish an attacker puts your entire cargo and ship's rebuy on the line.

Note: the above is nothing new, it's just now somewhat more effective.

15 seconds is forever when enemies are able to destroy you in 10 seconds.

 

[CMDR Derrida]

It's ok for someone with 10 weeks of game play and stupidly hard for a beginner to get a foothold in the game.

 

[777Driver]

15 seconds is forever when enemies are able to destroy you in 10 seconds.

As long as you follow the advice given, you won't be destroyed in 10 seconds. The important part is what you do during those 15 seconds of FSD charging.

 

[kofeyh]

15 seconds is forever when enemies are able to destroy you in 10 seconds.

So is 30+ due to mass lock.

If you fly in a straight line desperate to get to supercruise, the AI has the perfect firing position and can use all weapons. Try mines; unfortunately in their haste to run you down, AI will happily plough through mines with great abandon (this can be remarkably effective, but I am sure AI will be adapted to 'learn' this trick).

4 pips to sys will roughly halve incoming damage; so that 10 seconds becomes closer to 20, massively increasing survival time. Come about (pitch 180 deg) and boost towards and past the attacker; most AI use fixed weapons, they have a narrow firing arc and cannot lock when you are no longer in front of them, forcing the AI to come about.

I am not for a moment suggesting the AI is perfect; it needs work. But there are things commanders can do to considerably increase the odds of survival, from reducing incoming damage, to simply changing course to boost past AI, breaking weapons lock.

edit: 777driver on point, as always.

 

[Marc_Hicks]

It's ok for someone with 10 weeks of game play and stupidly hard for a beginner to get a foothold in the game.

No it isn't, because the NPC difficulty in random encounters is scaled to your combat rank. As I confirmed when I deleted my commander save.

 

[CMDR Derrida]

No it isn't, because the NPC difficulty in random encounters is scaled to your combat rank. As I confirmed when I deleted my commander save.

Ah, I didn't realise that. I know that makes sense, but for some reason thought I'd read it didn't match ranks in encounters.

 

[Robert Maynard]

No it isn't, because the NPC difficulty in random encounters is scaled to your combat rank. As I confirmed when I deleted my commander save.

Can that alone be considered conclusive proof? Much more is reset than just Combat Rank when a commander is reset....