Development Update 2 - July
- Thread starter Arthur Tolmie
- Start date
I actually agree with you, and I'm just as likely to ignore a mayonnaise hater as I am a mayonnaise cultist. Just understand that there are people who love mayonnaise but hate the fact that the latest batch is full of mold, so they point out the mold to others in hopes that word will get back to the mayo factory and they'll fix the issues.
What I don't understand is when people say, "There is no mold!" when clearly there is. Don't these people want the mold issue fixed? Sure, they can scrape off the mold and enjoy the mayo underneath, that's fine. Heck, eat the mold, I don't care. But don't deny the existence of the mold, because then nobody wins.
this^ I would be able to have as much fun in here as a do if the die hards (aka defend FDev at all cost or FDev must die) would just culm down when a player has a concern about the game or FDev its self. If you all stop making this so much fun for me then i would go back to SC.
Edited to keep up with Old duck. you respond to fast.
Yep, agreed 100% - but I'll be honest Duckers, I see way more people pointing to their spoilt jars of mayonnaise claiming that its actually laced with 5G chips and rat poison, or that mayonnaise should actually be mustard instead. (This metaphor's going off a cliff fast!)
The vast majority of positive posts I see are more tentative ones where people admit almost sheepishly that they're actually enjoying it.
I try not to rain on someone's genuine positive thread, though if it reads like a sappy Hallmark card, I might have cracked a joke in the past. There was a positive thread recently where my gut reaction was, "Are you kidding me?" and I almost posted in it, but then I realized that I am somewhat jaded, and it's really not fair be annoyed (or worse, express that annoyance) just because someone is enjoying the game that I'm currently a bit miffed at.
But I see this happening in both directions - someone posts something positive, and all the negative Nelly's come in and derail the thread. On the flip-side, someone posts a critique and all the positive patriots come in and make excuses or outright deny the problem (often while mocking the person who posted the critique). I sometimes get sucked into this mockery myself, which is why the last time I pointed out an issue with planets, I just used an image without any words, as the image spoke for itself. And yet, here we are debating if real-life Mars uses duplicate terrain assets or not.
because we all are in a simulationI try not to rain on someone's genuine positive thread, though if it reads like a sappy Hallmark card, I might have cracked a joke in the past. There was a positive thread recently where my gut reaction was, "Are you kidding me?" and I almost posted in it, but then I realized that I am somewhat jaded, and it's really not fair be annoyed (or worse, express that annoyance) just because someone is enjoying the game that I'm currently a bit miffed at.
But I see this happening in both directions - someone posts something positive, and all the negative Nelly's come in and derail the thread. On the flip-side, someone posts a critique and all the positive patriots come in and make excuses or outright deny the problem (often while mocking the person who posted the critique). I sometimes get sucked into this mockery myself, which is why the last time I pointed out an issue with planets, I just used an image without any words, as the image spoke for itself. And yet, here we are debating if real-life Mars uses duplicate terrain assets or not.
Tiling in terrain generation is unavoidable. I'm not a developer, but I use similar in graphic design where I'll tile a background of something in Photoshop because the alternative is extremely long hours, and I have other things on a to-do list that need addressing, and the thought is "well, to be honest I don't really think anyone will notice." The problem there is that once you see it, you can't unsee it. (And Odyssey's tiling is deffo below par and needs addressing.)
For me though, the issue of terrain repeating isn't something that I'd lose sleep over. It's lazy, and its a minor annoyance, but at this moment in time there are other things I'd rather Frontier take care of in the game.
Massively applaud your delivery in that though, and you're 100% right in that the image speaks entirely for itself. To me that carries far more weight than a similar image highlighting the tiling, coupled with the caption of "See!?!?! This is why Frontier is evil, this is why Odyssey is awful, this is why I'm never playing it, this is why content creators are committing hari-kari, this is why we're sending threats and whatnot to devs and community managers, this is why the programmers are idiots, etc. etc."
And that's the original point we started debating - the vast majority of people ARE miffed that the game is in the state that its in, ARE upset that it was released too soon in an unfinished state, AGREE that the issues posted and discussed NEED to be sorted, and WANT the game to get better. But its the shouty minority that cause a sensible discussion to descend into mud slinging. Posts like yours will cause people to say "yep, I agree with that, I hope FDev sort that out." whereas posts along the lines of "FDev is evil and are scamming us with this @#$@#" will more likely elicit a "Oh here we go again, will this idiot EVER shut UP?"
For me though, the issue of terrain repeating isn't something that I'd lose sleep over. It's lazy, and its a minor annoyance, but at this moment in time there are other things I'd rather Frontier take care of in the game.
Massively applaud your delivery in that though, and you're 100% right in that the image speaks entirely for itself. To me that carries far more weight than a similar image highlighting the tiling, coupled with the caption of "See!?!?! This is why Frontier is evil, this is why Odyssey is awful, this is why I'm never playing it, this is why content creators are committing hari-kari, this is why we're sending threats and whatnot to devs and community managers, this is why the programmers are idiots, etc. etc."
And that's the original point we started debating - the vast majority of people ARE miffed that the game is in the state that its in, ARE upset that it was released too soon in an unfinished state, AGREE that the issues posted and discussed NEED to be sorted, and WANT the game to get better. But its the shouty minority that cause a sensible discussion to descend into mud slinging. Posts like yours will cause people to say "yep, I agree with that, I hope FDev sort that out." whereas posts along the lines of "FDev is evil and are scamming us with this @#$@#" will more likely elicit a "Oh here we go again, will this idiot EVER shut UP?"
Fun fact, someone flat out told me to prove the following image was "unnatural" and unrealistic :I try not to rain on someone's genuine positive thread, though if it reads like a sappy Hallmark card, I might have cracked a joke in the past. There was a positive thread recently where my gut reaction was, "Are you kidding me?" and I almost posted in it, but then I realized that I am somewhat jaded, and it's really not fair be annoyed (or worse, express that annoyance) just because someone is enjoying the game that I'm currently a bit miffed at.
But I see this happening in both directions - someone posts something positive, and all the negative Nelly's come in and derail the thread. On the flip-side, someone posts a critique and all the positive patriots come in and make excuses or outright deny the problem (often while mocking the person who posted the critique). I sometimes get sucked into this mockery myself, which is why the last time I pointed out an issue with planets, I just used an image without any words, as the image spoke for itself. And yet, here we are debating if real-life Mars uses duplicate terrain assets or not.
He was not joking. I mean, you can't discuss with someone who think an entire planet plastered with a Qing dynasty Dragons pattern is "natural" looking.
To be fair thats my mum gift wrapping a bowling ball. Hopefully tomorrow / when it drops planets will get better.
Maybe we should open the wrapping and the nice planet is inside ?
Hopefully, and its not some horrific lampshade.
I can't believe you expect Frontier to send someone to your house to dust off your router.
Not true.
It can be avoided by using maths to generate the terrain instead of pre made pieces.
It's a hell of a lot harder and even harder than that to make it look anywhere near as good as pre made assets, but to say it's unavoidable is a false statement.
(You could also in theory use enough assets that they would never repeat, but with 400 billion systems, that's not practical)
(You can also use maths to modify the assets to the point they are near unrecognisable as the original assets, again, crazy hard)
Er, you missed the rest of my post where I basically agree with what you're saying:
I'm not a developer, but I use similar in graphic design where I'll tile a background of something in Photoshop because the alternative is extremely long hours, and I have other things on a to-do list that need addressing, and the thought is "well, to be honest I don't really think anyone will notice." The problem there is that once you see it, you can't unsee it. (And Odyssey's tiling is deffo below par and needs addressing.)
Well, I'm not going to quote anybody, but feel that some of this mayonnaise talk involves me or the pic I posted with very little context initially.. and I just want to say three things.
#1 The tiling .. I hate it, its a massive step backwards from in-space POV and hope it gets rectified, continent sized tiling is easily avoided, just use large tiles once per planet, imo. Yes, I'm beating a horse.. and It's not dead just yet, so I'll beat it some more.
#2 I enjoy playing Odyssey, even though I really dislike above. I have played many hours recently and had lots of fun and seen some amazing sites. I wish no doom, I predict no death and I hope for success, huge success.
#3 07 CMDR's
#1 The tiling .. I hate it, its a massive step backwards from in-space POV and hope it gets rectified, continent sized tiling is easily avoided, just use large tiles once per planet, imo. Yes, I'm beating a horse.. and It's not dead just yet, so I'll beat it some more.
#2 I enjoy playing Odyssey, even though I really dislike above. I have played many hours recently and had lots of fun and seen some amazing sites. I wish no doom, I predict no death and I hope for success, huge success.
#3 07 CMDR's
As bad as that image looks, like I said in another thread, whomever took it to use it as evidence may not have been entirely truthful or at least, cherry picking (not been there, so can't say for sure), unless they also included the actual surface image without the DSS. The DSS picks it up, sure, but its not always clean cut. There's obvious tiling as I have outlined a few times.. and then there's tiling that's a non-issue, picked up mainly by the DSS
See Post #32 for an example of what I mean: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/question-for-future-planet-tech-upgrades.586727/post-9432676
Nope, not at all - I absolutely, completely, and unequivocally was not singling any one person out. The only reason I mentioned the tiling issue in the first place was that Old Duck brought it up. Apologies if you felt personally gone after. (Ironically, you're not the first person today who's felt I was personally having a go/trolling them for their opinions, so does seem I need to wind myself in a bit.)
And agree 100% that I hope it gets sorted. Like I mentioned in the first post today about it, I personally don't find it game breaking, but one you see it you can't unsee it.