DLC20 Discussion (maybe, but why not?)

Aramar

Aramar
CaprinemasterAT said:
Why is a generic Asia Pack more likely than an India Pack in your opinion? Just asking, because the honey badger to me sreams more Indian then generic Asian. same with the Lion tailed Macaque. Not saying you are false tho, everything is possible.
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I'm answering this too. In my opinion, the trend has been moving from more specific to broader themes:

Europe -> Eurasia
Australia -> Oceania
South and North America -> Americas
South East Asia -> India or Asia ?

However Asia is the only continent as a whole to not have its own DLC. So far, we have never got a DLC focused on a single country. So for me, it's more likely that Frontier will continue the trend to launch more general packs than focusing on specific smaller regions/countries.
 

Marvinb

Marvinb
SanRazo said:
I could see the langur as well being here, after all we already got the proboscis rig.
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I could see that aswell, but personally i dont have super high hopes.
But who knows, the langur is for sure the more iconic for india of the two, especially due to them often living in cities and stuff
 

TheYeti

TheYeti
CaprinemasterAT said:
Why is a generic Asia Pack more likely than an India Pack in your opinion? Just asking, because the honey badger to me sreams more Indian then generic Asian. same with the Lion tailed Macaque. Not saying you are false tho, everything is possible.
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The colours, decor and all doesn't appear much Indian, except for maybe the pilar in the right side of the image. The backdrop shows a river, umbrellas (?), something that looks like a safari lodge (?) and something that looks like a water tower. Nothing really giving away a regional theme.

Honestly even Asia doesn't make much sense to me, nor does any biome theme. The honey badger isn't really characteristic of any specific region or biome, and would most hint at an 'Old World' theme if anything.
 
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SuzieSky

SuzieSky
TremendousTimAllen said:
Hot take: While this forum is certainly a factor, I think a lot of us overestimate its importance to the overall decisions made with regards to DLC species. Just because the coati (for example) is high on wishlists on this forum doesn't mean that the average player wants it or even knows about it. Now of course, that doesn't mean it would never be added (I don't think anyone knew about the Lechwe), but I think some of the takes I've seen are a little over the top. I understand being disappointed (I was super hopeful for the golden lion tamarin personally) but some of the anger I've seen feels a bit misguided
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We've long since established that Frontier doesn't go straight down the list, but for the most part, packs have included ~2-3 animals from the top ten of the wishlist, especially given what is appropriate for the theme. Favorites do get skipped sometimes, and it's hard to watch your favorite animal finally make it to the top of the list to be passed over for something much less requested. This time, they skipped the entire top ten. Manatees, howler monkeys, tamarins (I was/am really sad about that one, too), and the South American coati were all top 10 animals. Only the rhea and ocelot were in the top 20, as were the mara and spider monkey, which were skipped. For the North American species, the black bear was the most requested, and the wapiti wasn't far behind. The coati also had the special case of votes being split between two species; when you combine them, coatis are even more popular than secretary birds. Tamarins and marmosets have even higher combined votes.

I get that this community can be biased and influenced by species campaigns, but often we try to focus on animals that are exciting, unique in some way, and common in zoos. Generally, I think we've 'selected' some pretty good species, and there isn't much reason to deviate too far from what people want. From a pure popularity standpoint, I think a coati, secretary bird, tree kangaroo, at least one tamarin, and at least one howler/spider monkey ought to make it into the game, and the walrus, muskox, blackbuck, and grey-crowned crane should be strongly considered.

The coati is not an ABC animal. Like the binturong, I didn't really know what a coati was and did not know why it was popular. When I Googled it, I found a cute animal that I somewhat recognized. After paying attention during my zoo visits, I found that binturongs and coatis are actually very common in zoos. I learned more about both animals from PZ and the community. In my opinion, the coati is similar to the binturong in that it is not an ABC animal, but it is a cute and interesting small mammal that many people would love and enjoy learning about.
 

Swjosdotschka

Swjosdotschka
CharlieXGaming said:
View attachment 431027This was my predicted roster from my South Asia Pack concept video a month ago, and it does to me atleast look decently realistic.
  • Honey Badger ✅
  • Lion Tailed Macaque ✅
  • Indian Muntjac
  • Gaur
  • Blackbuck (strong chances)
  • Fishing Cat
  • Sarus Crane
While I’m not ecstatic about any of these animals (not because they’re not interesting, because I haven’t started building anything Asia yet), it’s exciting on its own that this could be the closest I have ever been in 20 DLCs to guessing a pack right 😮
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I mean... I'd be on board with that, actually. I would miss the Asiatic Lion, but... I feel the likelyhood of an aniversary animal is there again, so there is that.
Aramar said:
I'm answering this too. In my opinion, the trend has been moving from more specific to broader themes:

Europe -> Eurasia
Australia -> Oceania
South and North America -> Americas
South East Asia -> India or Asia ?

However Asia is the only continent as a whole to not have its own DLC. So far, we have never got a DLC focused on a single country. So for me, it's more likely that Frontier will continue the trend to launch more general packs than focusing on specific smaller regions/countries.
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That is also a fair point. Just the artwork is screaming so much India...
Can I have my raccoon dog when it is general asia, please?
 

TremendousTimAllen

TremendousTimAllen
SuzieSky said:
We've long since established that Frontier doesn't go straight down the list, but for the most part, packs have included ~2-3 animals from the top ten of the wishlist, especially given what is appropriate for the theme. Favorites do get skipped sometimes, and it's hard to watch your favorite animal finally make it to the top of the list to be passed over for something much less requested. This time, they skipped the entire top ten. Manatees, howler monkeys, tamarins (I was/am really sad about that one, too), and the South American coati were all top 10 animals. Only the rhea and ocelot were in the top 20, as were the mara and spider monkey, which were skipped. For the North American species, the black bear was the most requested, and the wapiti wasn't far behind. The coati also had the special case of votes being split between two species; when you combine them, coatis are even more popular than secretary birds. Tamarins and marmosets have even higher combined votes.

I get that this community can be biased and influenced by species campaigns, but often we try to focus on animals that are exciting, unique in some way, and common in zoos. Generally, I think we've 'selected' some pretty good species, and there isn't much reason to deviate too far from what people want. From a pure popularity standpoint, I think a coati, secretary bird, tree kangaroo, at least one tamarin, and at least one howler/spider monkey ought to make it into the game, and the walrus, muskox, blackbuck, and grey-crowned crane should be strongly considered.

The coati is not an ABC animal. Like the binturong, I didn't really know what a coati was and did not know why it was popular. When I Googled it, I found a cute animal that I somewhat recognized. After paying attention during my zoo visits, I found that binturongs and coatis are actually very common in zoos. I learned more about both animals from PZ and the community. In my opinion, the coati is similar to the binturong in that it is not an ABC animal, but it is a cute and interesting small mammal that many people would love and enjoy learning about.
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To be clear, I'm not saying that it's wrong to be disappointed. I would have much preferred the Coati and/or Mara over the Flamingo and, to a lesser extent, the Coyote, Ocelot, and Bighorn. But I'm sure I'm not alone in having been fairly involved in other games where I've seen a lot of responses to content from certain members of the community that rubbed me the wrong way. There's being upset and voicing that, and then there's blowing a fuse and abusing the developers, which I hate to see. I'm also on here spending a lot of my free time reading other's opinions, posting my own thoughts and have contributed my own list to the meta wishlist, so I'm not trying to say it has no meaning, just that there is a lot more that goes into those decisions (which clearly you're aware of, this isn't directed solely at you!)

As for your list, I don't necessarily disagree. Assuming the upcoming pack includes several Indian animals, I think after that, the game would only be 'complete' to me if they added at least 2 more new world monkeys (Golden Lion Tamarin and Black Howler Monkey please!) and a pelican. After that, I would absolutely have Walrus, Muskox, Tree Kangaroo, Coati as the next must haves along with my ever present oddball pick of the Coconut Crab and a few others like the Echidna
 

Artemisya

Artemisya
TremendousTimAllen said:
Hot take: While this forum is certainly a factor, I think a lot of us overestimate its importance to the overall decisions made with regards to DLC species. Just because the coati (for example) is high on wishlists on this forum doesn't mean that the average player wants it or even knows about it. Now of course, that doesn't mean it would never be added (I don't think anyone knew about the Lechwe), but I think some of the takes I've seen are a little over the top. I understand being disappointed (I was super hopeful for the golden lion tamarin personally) but some of the anger I've seen feels a bit misguided
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Indeed, if we look at comments elsewhere about the Americas, a lot of people were actually happy with the coyote while here, it was heavily criticised. On the other hand, I saw many people complaining about the second “ostrich” and the flamingo, while the monkey got a neutral reaction even though all three were among the favourites in this community.
 

SuzieSky

SuzieSky
Artemisya said:
Indeed, if we look at comments elsewhere about the Americas, a lot of people were actually happy with the coyote while here, it was heavily criticised. On the other hand, I saw many people complaining about the second “ostrich” and the flamingo, while the monkey got a neutral reaction even though all three were among the favourites in this community.
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The saki was aggressively species-campaigned by a few loud voices; that is the only reason it was somewhat high on my list. On the OG list it was around #100 in terms of popularity. The only reason it got a neutral reaction is that we're so starved for new world monkeys.

The rhea would have gotten a higher response, but the model wasn't too good. Also, while it was important as a regional pick, it was also only around #20, and many people commented here about how a fifth ratite was less interesting than other bird options despite a heavy species campaign. The spoonbill and ibis were mid-requested, and the flamingo was only around #100. That might help explain the lukewarm response. The ocelot and coyote have been mid-somewhat highly requested for a long time; also, there are many NA players who wanted the coyote even though others objected loudly. This forum tends to bash cat/dog/bear carnivorans way more than people do irl, and NA animals have gotten a lot of hate.
 

NachoB

NachoB
SuzieSky said:
The saki was aggressively species-campaigned by a few loud voices; that is the only reason it was somewhat high on my list. On the OG list it was around #100 in terms of popularity. The only reason it got a neutral reaction is that we're so starved for new world monkeys.

The rhea would have gotten a higher response, but the model wasn't too good. Also, while it was important as a regional pick, it was also only around #20, and many people commented here about how a fifth ratite was less interesting than other bird options despite a heavy species campaign. The spoonbill and ibis were mid-requested, and the flamingo was only around #100. That might help explain the lukewarm response. The ocelot and coyote have been mid-somewhat highly requested for a long time; also, there are many NA players who wanted the coyote even though others objected loudly. This forum tends to bash cat/dog/bear carnivorans way more than people do irl, and NA animals have gotten a lot of hate.
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In summary all mid choices which makes the pack extremely mid.

I'm one of those ocelote and rhea all time supporters. They were always in my list of SA animals i wanted the most so i was happy to see them in the pack, but the rhea model really dissapointed me once i saw it ingame (majestic feather work, terrible and completly wrong wings rig and body shape). Saki are cute, i like then even though i would have prefered a howler for sure but that's more because of personal experience with them and because they are the larger monkey native to my country. But yeah... The rest of the picks were really boring to me. And tbh we needed a LATAM pack more, not a full on Américas pack. And even if full on Américas pack was the only choice coyote and Big horned sheep are probably the worst picks considering the other NA that were wished for, all of them might i add, were easy to make clones: ABB, wapiti, sea otter... And maybe a little bit more of work for a musk ox. Even coati could have counted for a NA animal since the white nosed species is basically a NA species. Same goes for the spider monkey but that one was probably a logístic nightmare so i was never really expecting them tbh.

And there were two other picks much more interesting and more requested than the flamingo: roseate spoonbill (which again, also North american) and Scarlet ibis... Both of which could be achieved with crane or flamingo modified rings. I think the new flamingo is useful only because it looks leagues better than the greater one and has a more aproppiate baby aged model. But just like is going to happen with the elephant they are just basically charging us a new skin and remaster as a new animal... Which technically is... But not worth a sloth in a DLC.
 

Barje

Barje
Asia makes more sense as I agree with Aramar's statement.
We already got tropical so i think rainforest is rather not the theme.
If it is asia animal pack, here are my picks:
  • Honey Badger
  • Lion Tailed Macaque
  • Nilgai
  • Blackbuck
  • Musk Ox (I don't think we'll ever get another pack I could fit it in, and it's essential big animal we still don't have)
  • Hanuman Langur
  • Greater Adjutant (in case we will never get marabou stork)
-Spectacled Cobra/King Cobra (Cobra engine game give us cobra animal)
 

NachoB

NachoB
For a general asia pack with these already locked down:

1. honey badger (confirmed)
2. Lion tailed macaque (confirmed)
3. Sri lanka / sumatran elephant (kind of confirmed i guess?)

so that leaves 4 picks of my choosing. Fortunally honey badger and lion tailed macaque do fit my wishes perfectly. For the rest i need

2 birds: probably golden pheasant and mandarin duck, but would gladly accept painted stork, damoiselle crane and himalayan monal, and even great argus pheasant if they are going into SEA again. Temmicks tragopan is also a very cool option people don't talk about enough. And reeve's pheasant is probably my favorite pheasant alongside with all the others i mentioned.

2 ungulates: blackbuck and muntjac being my prefered picks, with blackbuck being a must for me. Pere david deer and gaur, or even something like the lowland anoa would also be nice additions. And yes even the sumatran rhinoceros for me.

Since we are probably getting either 0 to 1 bird, i guess there is another spot for another carnivore: yellow throated marten would be the most unique one, but maybe also a civet. Fishing cat is another cat i would really like but only if they do come with come of enrichment to showcase their most popular behaviour, if not then i rather get an asiatic lion tbh. Or it could go to another ungulate.

And yes this time around we need a exhibit. For pieces just make the india set flexicolour and give us a couple of trees and maybe new enrichment objects frontier please.
 

Stygi

Stygi
If we are going to get a general Asia pack:

1. Honey Badger
2. Lion Tailed Macaque
3. Sri Lankan Elephant (Rather be pleasantly surprised with its absence)

Regardless of whether or not this is just an India pack or a broader Asian pack the Blackbuck and Himalayan Monal are my top choices filling the important gaps in the roster with an Indian antelope and a pheasant, I would also be ok although less happy with any kind of substitute whether it is the Nilgai or any of the numerous pheasants they could choose from.

The Mandarin Duck would be an absolute must for this theme as we simply need some kind of waterfowl, the last spot I am much less picky about and there is a large range of animals I would be happy to get.
Obviously any monkey is a good monkey at this point and Asia still has some useful species the Hanuman or Javan Langurs or even the dreaded Golden Snub Nosed Monkey are the stand out choices for me. Any other bird would also be a lovely inclusion although I would be shocked to see 3 in a pack, any kind of Pelican would by lovely but an Asian Crane like the Demoiselle or Sarus would also be neat. More realistically another ungulate would be nice. An Asian Deer is a clear gap that needs filling and I think it should be on the smaller side so it stands out more, either the Muntjac or Tufted Deer would be fine although I wouldn't mind if a larger deer took this slot such as the Pere David's or Axis.
 

Chris1983

C
The more I think about it the more I get the feeling it's not going to be an India Pack. The Honey Badger may be an animal that is distributed in India but in my opinion it is always much more associated with Africa.
So after we got the Americas Animal Pack which is actually a "New World Animal Pack" I could imagine we are getting the counter part, the "Old World Animal Pack here".
The Lion-Tailed Macaque still would make totally sense and the silhoutte of the elephant could hint towards it too, as the elephant is the biggest animal of the old world and is maybe one of the first animals that comes to mind when you think about Africaan and Asian wildlife.
The pillar we see in the Keyart is part of the Indian Building Set, but it could be representative for ancient architecture in general.
Frontier definetly did it before with Zookeeper's Animal Pack, that tricked us and made us suggest "Mountain animals pack". Also the keyart of ZKAP showed the Chinese laterns, which were just there for the "Party decoration vibe", while it made us suggest something "Himalayan-like".

A possible roster could be:

1. Honey Badger
2. Lion-tailed Macaque
3. Blackbuck
4. Serval
5. Banded Mongoose
6. Grey Crowned Crane
7. Alpine Marmot (to not forget Europe). If the stick with Africa/Asia it could be Muntjac or maybe Great White Pelican
 
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