Elite Dangerous is the Largest Empty Sandbox Ever Made

[CMDR Carbo]

Just wanted to point out, that the original Reddit post is a bit different compared to the OP of this post.

The Reddit post is about what a disappointment update 2.4 is, how story telling works (or doesn't work) in the game, how boring the CGs are and the amount of bugs that are in the game.
I would agree to most of the complaints on the Reddit post in a heartbeat.

The OP of this post is more about a broken sandbox and how player owned X, Y and Z are the solution to everything.
Which, I'm not convinced is the solution.

 

[Bdragon4]

The game has a solid framework, but there's nothing to do in it except earn credits.

 

[Darkfyre99]

Defending your 'home' system is entirely optional. It matters not which faction is in charge. My home system flips regularly, my ships and modules are still there.

I was thinking the same thing. I'm never going to 'lose' my system unless you find a way of making the stations, outposts and ground installations vanish.

My home system has a rather large number of Imperial factions, including two visiting ones. Since its in my best interest to keep the two outsiders there, rather than let a non-Imperial faction, I tend to support them as much as my "home" faction. As a result, the minor factions tend to be embroiled in quite a few wars and civil wars.

The Pilots Federation: causing wars for fun and profit since 2805.

 

[Cosmo]

While Carriers will be coming when Squadrons are introduced, we don't know that they will be capital ships, i.e. whether they will have their own offensive / defensive armament - or, indeed, how they will traverse the galaxy.

They said it's a very large, dockable vessel that will act as a mobile base of operations for Squadrons. It requires significant space to carry a squadron. They didn't explicitly mention that it's a capital ship, but it's implied. If it's small ship, that would be a huge disappointment for me, probably the last nail in the coffin with this game for me.

Whether Squadrons offer a full suite of Guild features or just a membership list, hierarchy and communications remains to be seen.

Yes it remains to be seen how deep this feature will be. If it's another half-baked, superficial feature like Multicrew... that would be another massive disappointment.

Frontier don't seem keen on introducing executive control elements into the game, nor permit storage and accumulation of commodities (other than in one's current ship).

The current game designers have wasted a lot of potential of this game. This is a reason why so many people quit playing and the uproar on the subreddit. Braben did mention very early on executive controlled ships, those are part of the plan, but who knows when that's coming. I hope the Fleet Carrier is the first executive controlled capital ship.

NPC Crew were discussed in the DDF - we're waiting for their introduction, along with NPC Wingmen.

Yes I'm also waiting for atmospheric landings, walking in ships, boarding other ships.. the promises that were made during and soon after the kickstarter.

"We also want to add leaving the ships so you can explore space stations or board enemy vessels or even just to look around your own."

Whether the Squadron mechanic either initially or eventually includes Outpost / Station ownership remains to be seen.

In order to make a deep sandbox, the Squadrons need to be more than basic guild functionality.

A lot of things remain to be seen, and a lot of people stopped caring or waiting to see it unfortunately.

Just wanted to point out, that the original Reddit post is a bit different compared to the OP of this post.

I referenced the same comment as in the subreddit. The comment is not just about 2.4 it's about the game in general.

The issue here, is that what cosmo wants may not be what a lot of others who play the game want. It may be detrimental to their own in-game experience. I have seen Cosmos list and to me it looks like he wants X-series corporations that are controlled by player groups. Which will destroy the game for me and a lot of others.

So instead of just thinking about what you want, maybe try to think of stuff that will improve the game for everyone instead or stuff that wont cause issues for other players that don't want that kind of gameplay.

A lot of people want more of these kinds of sandbox features. Of course it should be optional to use those. It shouldn't cause issues because there's enough space in the galaxy to accommodate different play styles. Less than 0.01% is explored after 3 years.

 

[stefandefqon1]

Amen mate Its realy boring you cant even use mines outside the station but OFC all other weapons are allowed

 

[Marcus Tullius]

The point of the thread is primarily to remind the game designers that it's important to make the sandbox deep if Elite Dangerous is to last another 5 years. It needs features that give players agency to create and control things rather than add superficial content. It doesn't need to be a full-blown sandbox game, but it needs more sand and tools. Otherwise it will remain a shallow sandbox which many people complained about for the last 3 years.

What could make the sandbox deep

Some suggestions:

• Player owned capital ships - this is believed to be coming as the Fleet Carrier in Q4 2018. Should be (very) customizable and act as a mobile base for PVE and PVP gameplay. Also expand the type of player owned capital ships: battleships, bulk carriers etc.
• Proper in-game guild mechanics - believed to be coming as Squadrons in Q4 2018. For deep social interaction among players.
• Mining Extractors - player owned. It can be bought and placed on a planet. After a while the player would return to collect the mined minerals
• Storage Structure - player owned. This building is used to store the mined minerals.
• Processor Structure - player owned. This is used to process the mined minerals. Then players can produce goods such as modules and ships by themselves. It makes the economy more player driven and adds depth to mining.
• NPC Ship Crew Management - NPC crew in the cockpit and crew management options for the whole ship which can be managed by the player. This adds depth to NPC interactions onboard a ship.
• Player owned Outpost, Stations - for Squadrons who have enough credits and resources to build or buy an outpost or station.

Roughly 80% or more people who bought ED went away and stopped playing. I could be one of those 80% but I come here to give advice and feedback so Frontier can make Elite Dangerous great.

I’m sure that FDevs know what to do and how to do it, but they want to cash these features. That’s why we have to wait for space legs to have NPC crews, atmo landings for building mining sites etc. Meanwhile we will *enjoy* more PP, CQC, multipew and so on.

 

[GreyAreaUK]

The game has a solid framework, but there's nothing to do in it except earn credits.

You basically just described Skyrim. Once you've killed a dragon, learned a spell or two and got yourself a good sword...well, what's left?

 

[Sylveria]

You basically just described Skyrim. Once you've killed a dragon, learned a spell or two and got yourself a good sword...well, what's left?

Kill more dragons, earn more septims... lather, rinse, repeat

 

[jasonbarron]

We can't all be self important musicians on Lave Radios audio stream. Some of us have to have lives instead.

I can always count on you for good laugh! I'm on the mobile, so no rep I'm afraid.

 

[Lecitron]

Another way of looking at it is is that if the same feedback being made five years ago is being made today, and yet the game is not only successful but becoming even more so, the feedback was wrong then and is wrong now. Or, if not wrong, then not entirely relevant.

I can keep posting that I'd like it to be Eve without the subscription, but it doesn't matter how many times I post it, it's not going to happen.

And this is the real problem, i´m BORED of eve this, eve that. I hate eve

 

[playfuldreamer]

The issue here, is that what cosmo wants may not be what a lot of others who play the game want. It may be detrimental to their own in-game experience. I have seen Cosmos list and to me it looks like he wants X-series corporations that are controlled by player groups. Which will destroy the game for me and a lot of others.

So instead of just thinking about what you want, maybe try to think of stuff that will improve the game for everyone instead or stuff that wont cause issues for other players that don't want that kind of gameplay.

That's a circular argument.

If I have to consider what other people want, shouldn't they consider what I want? We'll get absolutely nowhere--which interestingly enough is exactly where we are.

 

[Goose4291]

I can always count on you for good laugh! I'm on the mobile, so no rep I'm afraid.

 

[babelfisch]

The current game designers have wasted a lot of potential of this game. This is a reason why so many people quit playing and the uproar on the subreddit. Braben did mention very early on executive controlled ships, those are part of the plan, but who knows when that's coming. I hope the Fleet Carrier is the first executive controlled capital ship.

The reddit post isn't related to your comments at all.

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

Thanks mate. It's a shame that these people can't see the glaring problems with this shallow sandbox.

It's a shame people keep suggesting things that would turn the game into not-Elite.

 

[AdriánGuth]

Hey God!! The Milky Way is the Largest Empty Sandbox Ever Made

 

[playfuldreamer]

Hey God!! The Milky Way is the Largest Empty Sandbox Ever Made

Silly. The real physical Milky Way contains an Earth I can explore.

 

[S3B4ST13N]

Mining suffers from lakcing basic enonomical reasoning. If ED would be a real universe no one would be mining in ice rings ever, it is way too underpaid or prices for ice mined only ressources would ba a lot higher makign minign there proficient.

I really wish we had Multicrew mining where one guy can fly a fighter mining vessel and scan the potatoes for good materials and mark them. And another guy can have turret mining laserschipping off parts from the potatoes, while the pilot may also do so on possibly another one. or cares about alignign the ship correctly over the chipped of parts.

But this requires better mining mechanics, better information on probed asteroids. (why does their data disappear after the probe is gone? we cna scan enitre ships up to their cargo, but not potatoes in space? :/)
And of course better payout for everyone, "increased rewards" thats what the multicrew join screen says yet it's a plain out lie, it's not increased.

Whilst I hate mentioning it because it's so over-mentioned, lol, Star Citizen's plans for mining (and multicrew mining) are at a level I expect from Frontier. I don't expect them to produce it to the same standard; they simply don't have the resources for it, but that doesn't mean they couldn't spend more than a small chat over a cup of tea and a crumpet to plan out their features (which is what it feels like at the moment).

SC mining has a Trade and Development Division, which is basically a market board for players to scan and see what is in demand; and determine what materials warrant the most attention to get the most attractive profit margin in that system. Player agency impacts supply and demand; this doesn't happen in ED and that's a shame - this feature alone will give hundreds of players who enjoy mining something to work on. Playing the market by mining the right materials. RP'ing a miner. Having an impact on the system, if not the galaxy.

They have freelance, or working as an employee.. I mean...WHAT.... Elite could have a mining guild which you work for. Get specific mining quests; get paid for it. Go prospecting, get paid for that. Start a player mining guild, or get hired into one - which takes X amount of % off the top of your profit margin.

Research and information gathering needs to be made before one just goes running off into an asteroid field. ED? *Open website* *find pristine* *jump jump jump* *mine* *repeat* .. blah

!!!!A dedicated mining ship!!!!!

Multicrew mining includes a pilot, a scan operator, a beam operator.

There are tools to ensure you are mining properly; a Exothermic Reaction Detector, a Laser Seismometer and a Analytical Materials Processor...

All this planned content.. vs ED's which boils down to "What should mining contain? I dunno.. a laser.. and a processor .. and stuff I guess?"



And for those that can't help themselves; SC still being in alpha, or being long off for a release, is irrelevant and doesn't change, or invalidate, my point in the slightest.

 

[krylite]

When I saw this thread title I thought ohno, Cosmo, not you too? But his threads are well thought out for concerned discussion and not really salty for the trolling sake of it like many others. So addressing the number of players. As Darkfyre posted the stats from steamspy for the last two weeks, ED is still comparable to EvE and 60k different players is still pretty hefty. I noticed that Aisling was successfully turmoiled last week despite her weekly massive fortification activity, and that took a heck of a lot of undermining even in solo by who knows how many hundreds of feds or otherwise allied opponent pledged cmdrs and ships. So there is still considerable competition and player activity among the powers and their players on any given week cycle of the year seemingly.

Anyone else notice small changes in terrain texturing (some green in valleys?) or little added details? Even multicrew has new advice messages when joining a ship. The advice message window was separate from the usual cockpit HuD and interestingly demonstrated that their ED cobra framework seemingly can display out-of-game message windows for the player at any time as a feature. It feels at least somebodies are polishing and addressing some rough edges whether it's some small core aspect of ED or any part of horizons.

And the issue about personal player assets. I would be for small player bases initially while more uncomfortable about player owned stations and capital ships. While the X-series games allowed you to own big assets it was a single player game in an overall limited 2D worldspace. For the massive galaxy worldspace of ED, it seems like a series of big challenges and while I don't think Frontier is actually capable of implementing persistent multiple player graphical assets at the present, I think the signs are there that they've been experimenting with ideas and trying to make progress. Take holo-me and multicrew. While your avatar design disappears when you log off, the design is saved and when online, appears to others in the same instance and the profile snapshot on the contacts tab window. So at least it's a new player asset besides the single player ship. Sometimes on scan missions, a special small base is "discovered" but it's temporary and vanishes like a mirage from the location after the mission is over or if the player session gets interrupted. Assuming 60k different players of the last two weeks wanted their own base, it seems to be a challenge to make them persistent and visible to others after the owner player has logged off, much less gameplay and things to do with the base or even in it /w spacelegs [yesnod] . So some good discussion for the future of ED. Personally I'd give Frontier two to five or even ten more years to realistically get a handle on filling out their massive world. Would ED have to move to a full centralized server farm and move away from p2p instancing to accomplish this?

The hundreds of billions of stars in the galaxy is a "small" sandbox, relatively smaller than a playground sandbox, but still heck of a lot of sand with each speck a unique system by itself. Nice that explorers current do get a persistent world asset of their name in text as the discoverer of a system and it's bodies.

The galaxy as a "chest of sand" box.

Spoiler

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zk2d0sQdEB4&feature=youtu.be&t=32m23s

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

The part where the moderator on the first page took everyone off-topic about tinfoil hats and continued to try to do so throughout the thread.

So one mod snubbed you one time on the content of your OP. I have many a mod do that to me as well. In fact, there was a thread where I complained about the thread being a troll thread (it's in PvP somewhere), and I had a feisty discussion with Jenner over allowing it to exist on the forum.

And I don't think you consider me a naysayer. Or do you?

So, if your comment had been, there is some mod trolling going on in these here forums. I'd not have peeped. Yes there is. But you specified it's towards naysayers. And that my dear fellow is ballcocks.

Here's the thread: https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...Corgi-gets-got-65k-LY-from-bubble-SDC-Special

 

[Genar-Hofoen]

The only thing which should be player-owned in this game is your ship(s), your modules, and your money.

To ask for player-owned stations/bases/territory, is asking for turning Elite into an executive control game. It's asking for a complete re-write of the game's back-end.

Elite is not an executive control game. If you want an executive control game, go and play an executive control game - that means some other game which is not Elite.