Griefers make open impossible, and how easy the solution is.

Good Whiskey

Good Whiskey
Stigbob said:
I did I read up on it here in the forum in late 2014.

Bonus info from David Braben himself in 2012 "What would I want from a game ?, I want to be able to play a great game without being griefed by teenagers. But having said that I do want a feeling of risk out there"

Seven minutes in for the quote.

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N9ENkIB0cic
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Yeah, because like me you do research. No one browsing Stream for a space shooter is ever going to see that chip.

Sylveria said:
As to your view of the game as a "space trucking sim" that's your choice to view it as such. Not everyone is carting groceries in the ED gameworld
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I don't think it's a space trucking sim, but that's what you're implying people should know it is. And the carting of groceries isn't the issue we're talking about... we're talking about winning wars by carting groceries with no opposition because this game's layers allow for that.

Ratkatcher said:
But that is exactly what happens in a vote... No-one meets anyone to tear their ballot paper forcefully from their grasp whilst shooting them in the groin with a zip-gun... Well, not in my country anyway...

Why the idiocy?
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Careful now. You can call me an idiot if you want, but if you can't understand my point, which is that the vote of the PG or Solo player trumps the vote of the Open player for how conflicts will play out, then that might need to be a self-directed insult.
 

Rubbernuke

Rubbernuke
Sylveria said:
Do you see everyone who votes differently from you? How do you know they voted as you did or not?

It has the BGS by design- it was always intended to have a background simulation (BGS)

PP was a feature which was added later- and I suppose you could say people moaned until they got it... or at least wanted some sort of optional political game to play with ED.

As to your view of the game as a "space trucking sim" that's your choice to view it as such. Not everyone is carting groceries in the ED gameworld- some play it for combat, others for hauling, others for space exploration, etc. If the message is "tangled" then perhaps try some different activities?
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Powerplay was not something that was telegraphed to the players- it was a big surprise. My guess is that it was an early attempt to augment the BGS- Dav has always said the BGS was not intended to be used like it was and I always thought Powerplay was the result of that thinking.
 

Sylveria

Sylveria
Good Whiskey said:
I don't think it's a space trucking sim, but that's what you're implying people should know it is. And the carting of groceries isn't the issue we're talking about... we're talking about winning wars by carting groceries with no opposition because this game's layers allow for that.

(snip) my point, which is that the vote of the PG or Solo player trumps the vote of the Open player for how conflicts will play out (snip)
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Again, how do you know those "carting groceries" aren't simply feeding their families and not "directly opposing" you?
 
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Stigbob

Stigbob
Good Whiskey said:
Yeah, because like me you do research. No one browsing Stream for a space shooter is ever going to see that chip.
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The clips irrelevant to modes as its about griefing.

If PVP is important to a player they should google how it is in any game they are considering buying, if they did that with ED I'm sure the salt would pour out of the monitor onto the desk so they'd know. For me opting out (if I want 90% open player) is more important so I googled that.

I hate 3rd person games, I avoid that ever being an issue by checking first.
 

Sylveria

Sylveria
Good Whiskey said:
Anyone who is actively winning a war by never having to fight a war. :sneaky:
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OK, I'll ask again- who is this "anyone" you're referring to?

You do see the dilemma here, I hope. That it's not so easy to pinpoint who your "opposition" is in a universe filled with many thousands of other players who may or may not be playing for the same reasons you are, right?
 

Rat Catcher

Rat Catcher
Good Whiskey said:
Yeah, because like me you do research. No one browsing Stream for a space shooter is ever going to see that chip.


I don't think it's a space trucking sim, but that's what you're implying people should know it is. And the carting of groceries isn't the issue we're talking about... we're talking about winning wars by carting groceries with no opposition because this game's layers allow for that.


Careful now. You can call me an idiot if you want, but if you can't understand my point, which is that the vote of the PG or Solo player trumps the vote of the Open player for how conflicts will play out, then that might need to be a self-directed insult.
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I wasn't calling you an idiot - unless you are particularly sensitive...
But the 'vote' of any player, in any mode, is exactly equal to that of any other - nothing trumps anything else... it would be the same in an election if one candidate has more supporters, do those supporters have a more powerful individual vote than any other?

No-one is important, or more powerful (in the game world) than any other... you, me, sylveria... we all influence the BGS equally, as individuals, certainly when large groups of individuals play BGS against smaller ones, the group that gathers most 'points' (which is all the BGS is) gains in influence...

Even you understand this principle... Even if you dislike not being able to 'see' those who might oppose you... so much like RL, really :)
 

Sylveria

Sylveria
Ratkatcher said:
No-one is important, or more powerful (in the game world) than any other... you, me, sylveria... we all influence the BGS equally, as individuals, certainly when large groups of individuals play BGS against smaller ones, the group that gathers most 'points' (which is all the BGS is) gains in influence...

Even you understand this principle... Even if you dislike not being able to 'see' those who might oppose you... so much like RL, really :)
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It's actually much better than RL in the sense that it doesn't have the same political corruption via monetary value, IMO.

In game, everyone's "vote" really does count for one- rather than someone being able to influence through currency or other means.
 

Rubbernuke

Rubbernuke
Good Whiskey said:
Anyone who is actively winning a war by never having to fight a war. :sneaky:
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This is one of the advantages of Powerplay in such an adversarial context- with the BGS its quite difficult due to its diffuse nature to really know the intentions of others, while in Powerplay you have outward pledges, one of two cargoes and explicitly marked territories.

It also means that with PPs separate C + P there are no rules to punishment beatings.

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BTW are you Daniel Day Lewis playing VR?
 

Good Whiskey

Good Whiskey
Sylveria said:
You do see the dilemma here, I hope. That it's not so easy to pinpoint who your "opposition" is in a universe filled with many thousands of other players who may or may not be playing for the same reasons you are, right?
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The only dilemma here is the one created by your intentional refusal to understand a simple truth of Elite, which is that two groups who are playing this game with the same objective are going about it in two different ways; one of which takes advantage of the modes in order to avoid armed conflict, and one that seeks armed conflict and is denied. This is a fairly straight-forward affair unless you continue to attempt to bend it.

Ratkatcher said:
No-one is important, or more powerful (in the game world) than any other
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I would argue that PG/Solo players have significantly more unopposed reign over this game than anyone in Open, because being in Open comes with risk and being in a PG or in Solo does not. This is at the root of the issue we're discussing.

Rubbernuke said:
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BTW are you Daniel Day Lewis playing VR?
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Yes. See those pants? I'm wearing them right now.
 

Rubbernuke

Rubbernuke
Its a bit like buying FIFA expecting to play a football match.

You build a team and then when you play someone else find each player uses their own rules, plays on different pitches and ultimately is a case of kicking as many goals into unguarded nets as fast as possible.

Yes its football, but not what you expected.
 
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