Here is the real reason we don't need players owning space and structures.
- Thread starter Commander Debic
- Start date
Pure emotional content ! Games are really powerful, and people wonder why EvE has been running for over 10 years.
Thanks for cooling it a little perhaps I should have put the word humour in brackets in the title.
I was writing this during thread closure.
That's fine it's their choice and all, but I would never consider guys shouting back & fourth at each other to have anything to do with discipline. You don't shout back at your Sgt.
The guy screaming incoherently at the end just makes it more comical to think they have any comms discipline.
I don't mind the "hard criticism" myself, though personally I'm more a "stick to hard facts, don't get blinded by emotions" when it comes to that.
For example: The ranting ones among the more competitive guys I've played with, I wish they would have stopped wasting everyone's time on a 10+ minute rant.
The worst thing is when they go on and on during an operation, blocking any important intel that remaining focused players have. This can even happen in 3 man teams.
(Yes I realize there is no context to the video - I don't know if they are in any more danger, or in a safe debriefing room - So I have to comment as if it can happen in all places)
NOTE: I have NOT played Eve, my experiences comes from 7 years of playing a combined arms FPS called Command & Conquer: Renegade.
That's fine it's their choice and all, but I would never consider guys shouting back & fourth at each other to have anything to do with discipline. You don't shout back at your Sgt.
The guy screaming incoherently at the end just makes it more comical to think they have any comms discipline.
I don't mind the "hard criticism" myself, though personally I'm more a "stick to hard facts, don't get blinded by emotions" when it comes to that.
For example: The ranting ones among the more competitive guys I've played with, I wish they would have stopped wasting everyone's time on a 10+ minute rant.
The worst thing is when they go on and on during an operation, blocking any important intel that remaining focused players have. This can even happen in 3 man teams.
(Yes I realize there is no context to the video - I don't know if they are in any more danger, or in a safe debriefing room - So I have to comment as if it can happen in all places)
NOTE: I have NOT played Eve, my experiences comes from 7 years of playing a combined arms FPS called Command & Conquer: Renegade.
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Deadline: a line drawn around a prison beyond which prisoners were liable to be shot.
Deadline: Management speak for 'I agreed this date without any reason and I have no plan for failure beyond this date'.
I agree there is no context to the video but having played there and in more than one Corp/Alliance, I can assure you what went on in that video is pretty much live play from my experience. Debriefing usually means kicking out all the "troublemakers" who didn't agree with the guys in charge.
Anyway no need to get serious about the thread, it was meant as a humorous look at an Eve Vid, that seemed particularly hilarious in my own opinion. I didn't mean to open an Eve discussion thread, I was trying to lighten the mood with all the raving that has been going on in ED since Horizons was announced.
That's funny, because in all the 6 years of WoW raiding from the most casual to the most hardcore, the most hardcore had the most amount of discipline without yelling and the casual ones were the most disorganized, often having officers yelling.
Just saying, but every time we first realmed something, it wasn't through yelling and the discipline was inspired through no messing around instead. If you screwed up a couple times in the same night, you were simply replaced for that night. No discussions, no yelling, no buts.
So I really don't care if some random half-mercenaries who join the army because they can't get a proper job and it pays well require yelling to get motivated. As far as MMO-games go, I've seen only the contrary to really work. Discipline through fear or abuse of power doesn't work in the internet, only through respect and diplomacy.
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Yeah the diversity of different groups is a key factor to group based gaming, it also brings people togeather to work things out, this video always makes me laugh.
[video=youtube;vDd9nNNjZTk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDd9nNNjZTk[/video]
Perhaps they NEED to be in a group because they can't handle the game on their own? Or perhaps they just like listening to weapons grade atismu for lulz
Nah, mostly because it weeds out the people they can't rely on. Most people join with the idea that they'll never be the one under the magnifying glass when things go wrong, and if they are the one that screws up, they accept their humble pie and try harder or they leave.
Games like Eve are mind numbingly complex, both from a mechanics and a sociopolitical perspective. There are so many different facets to it that you can never expect any one person to have a good grasp on everything. That'd require 4 years of college.
So you regularly get people who are fascinated about one aspect of the game, but if they're going to work as part of the group they're expected to understand several other aspects. You can't work well with your other members if you can't anticipate what it's like to play their role, nor can you play your role well if you typically like being a scout but tonight you're playing the logistics support because Harry didn't show up. If the scout is too busy daydreaming that he should be a scout right now instead of playing logistics, everyone dies.
As with any montage, this is the best of the best, selected out of who knows how many hours of gameplay. Moments like this are typically led by weeks of frustration and failure. Eve isn't an easy game. If someone is consistently screwing up, that's weeks of game time they've screwed up for the whole crew, and they accepted that responsibility when they joined the group. If they don't want that kind of responsibility they don't have to accept it. There are people who've been playing EvE for it's entire existence without belonging to a corp and are some of the most influential players in the game, and they did it solo. That was their choice also.
This is not every corporation in Eve. You only have a few of these hard-arses. They thrive because the people who want to be in that kind of environment flock to them, everyone else plays in one of the laid back corporations.
Yeah, and you don't even want to know what these guys think of WoW raiding. If you were to make a food chain out of the different MMO group activities based upon the coordination and skill they require, WoW would rank somewhere between plankton and molluscs.
10 million people and you can afford to throw people out like toilet paper if they don't do their job. Eve only has half a million. The amount of people capable of the higher level of play is about 10% of that. After that you have to spend weeks/months vetting and training individual players to mesh well with your corp structure, ensure they aren't a spy or thief, hope that their time schedule lines up with whatever activities are going on because you don't go to the raid, the raid often comes to you when it's ready, and then hope that they're on their A-game that day because they may have just been messaged on a Sunday morning and dragged out of bed because the scout finally caught the enemy with their pants down. On and on and on I could go.
Night and day. WoW is a game of patty cake compared to everything that is involved in getting in the upper tiers of Eve's Sov scene.
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Being in command is all very well,Screaming at your suborbinates when they screw is all very well,But rememeber your success and glory is only a reflection of there work,Without them your just a rather shouty selfimportant man.
You may call your self a king and have a Truly oppulent crown,But with no subject to do your bidding Your just a man in a very expensive hat
You may call your self a king and have a Truly oppulent crown,But with no subject to do your bidding Your just a man in a very expensive hat
Wow. I spent most of that video shaking my head in disbelief. But then the maniacal screaming at the end not only made me laugh out loud, it created a clash of memes in my head that just had to be exorcised.
[video=youtube_share;a37D8gSQfPc]http://youtu.be/a37D8gSQfPc[/video]
Oh thats the best southpark eps ever, nicely done, have some rep, lol
Apparently they understand that, because if they didn't ultimately get along these same people wouldn't get together in Reykjavik to meet, hang out and party for 3 days every year.
[video=youtube;kVtLStro_h4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kVtLStro_h4[/video]
The video is hilarious, but it seems that a huge majority of this forum has never played another game online except Elite.
Almost ALL of them are like this except if they are very niche and are played by like a 100 people.
Even flight sims and driving sims which attract a more serious crowd have people that act like this.
I haven't played Eve seriously, just tried it out and it was a bit too complex and I wasn't looking for something like that at that time, but it seems that most of the people here heard of some trolls on Eve and think that it's like the cesspool of humanity condensed in a space game. It's like my grandpa that had heard that some Honda's were recalled a couple of years ago that now thinks that all Honda's fall apart immediately when they leave the car dealer.
Please, play some other MMORPG for something like a week, and then come back and say that only EVE is like that.
Elite Dangerous in this iteration NEEDS a social aspect. This will definitely bring in more drama and trolls. But it's just how people are. The only players that I contact are on the forums, because the only CMDRs I encounter in Open are newbies that ask questions, most other CMDRs either see you as a nuisance or just ignore you because there is no proper way to communicate well with each other.
if you don't want any of the online stuff, petition to FD to make Solo separate from the online universe, so that the one doesn't influence the other. That way everyone will be happy.
Almost ALL of them are like this except if they are very niche and are played by like a 100 people.
Even flight sims and driving sims which attract a more serious crowd have people that act like this.
I haven't played Eve seriously, just tried it out and it was a bit too complex and I wasn't looking for something like that at that time, but it seems that most of the people here heard of some trolls on Eve and think that it's like the cesspool of humanity condensed in a space game. It's like my grandpa that had heard that some Honda's were recalled a couple of years ago that now thinks that all Honda's fall apart immediately when they leave the car dealer.
Please, play some other MMORPG for something like a week, and then come back and say that only EVE is like that.
Elite Dangerous in this iteration NEEDS a social aspect. This will definitely bring in more drama and trolls. But it's just how people are. The only players that I contact are on the forums, because the only CMDRs I encounter in Open are newbies that ask questions, most other CMDRs either see you as a nuisance or just ignore you because there is no proper way to communicate well with each other.
if you don't want any of the online stuff, petition to FD to make Solo separate from the online universe, so that the one doesn't influence the other. That way everyone will be happy.
That kind of behavior is the reason I stopped doing multiplayer many years ago.
I am not sure if it is an argument for not implementing players owning space and structures though.
Even without that we have unpleasant characters in ED too.
Most of these Eve players sound like teens. They take this stuff too serious anyway. Seeing things in perspective has not developed yet in most of them.
Having said that... players owning space/sectors/systems is not something I would like to see in ED.
I would not mind if players could have their own base on some planet or asteroid.
I believe that would be cool. I would love to have a customizable 'home' in the game.
I would also be happy with an apartment in a station
.This could be a great money sink if we would be allowed to upgrade such a base, add defenses, rooms, upgrade power reactors, living space, armories, hangars etc.
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Ah EVE.... *shakes head slowly*
It is now, no objections. But get off your high horse if think Eve is the pinnacle of management.
But keep telling that to yourself to justify a bunch of loonies trying to play General.
I'm fine if you want to support that, but please if you are going to make that happen in ED, may I request that you make a group where all the yelling and angsty players can have their fun "respecting their authoritah"?
I played EVE for roughly 10 years, and the linked video is pretty much why I only played with others for roughly the first year of that. But that's not EVE's fault, that's just coz until they prove themselves otherwise, people are dumb. EVE isn't immune to that, nor is Elite, or WoW, or GW2, or any other MMO.
EVE and Elite are both very different beasts, and honestly, I don't want player-run buildings not because of what's going on in that video, but because, well, it's just not Elite.
EVE and Elite are both very different beasts, and honestly, I don't want player-run buildings not because of what's going on in that video, but because, well, it's just not Elite.
