Make Elite an MMO again !!

[GloatingSwine]

The only way they can truly stop it is to come up with better ideas that organically pull people into open, or leave those in open feeling less bad about it and/or having a better chance of meeting players organically. And have it implemented by FDev. Totally doable...............

There would need to be meaningful ways for the presence of another human being to make your game better.

Right now, unless you're interested in PvP, they basically can't.

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

Well, FDev have already done that on numerous occasions. It makes not the slightest bit of difference to the arguments.

Over half of all player activity is in PC Open. That's been true for ages and hasn't changed. The total amount of player activity has much more than doubled since suggestions about making more attractive started coming through - the busiest systems now are about five times busier than they were in 1.0, the quieter systems are two-to-three times busier ... and that's not counting the big spike in activity from all the Epic free accounts (which has approximately doubled activity compared with six months ago).

So, if in 1.0 Frontier had only had Open, there would have been about 50% more players in Open [1]. Now, there are >200% more players in Open than back then. I see players in Open daily unless I'm poking around really obscure systems, while when I started flying around in version 1.1 I could go for weeks without seeing anyone.

Has this massive increase in the number of players in Open made any difference to these arguments over the last six years? Not in the slightest.

Would encouraging another few percent of players into Open make any difference? Well, since activity is ~30% higher at weekends compared with weekdays, and we're not at the stage where people are saying "Open is great at weekends, but we really need an incentive for people to play in Open during the week too", obviously not.

When Odyssey launches, assuming that it's not a total disaster, there'll be at least a temporary boost in player activity as everyone checks out the new stuff. Almost certainly, this will mean that the number of people in Open post-launch is greater than the total number of people in all modes right now. Will this stop threads like these? Of course not.

The only way they could actually make Open feel inhabited would be to significantly shrink the size of the bubble, to concentrate the same number of players into a much smaller number of systems - have the Thargoids set 90% of the bubble on fire and completely destroy it, then what's left would feel quite busy. But there are other good reasons not to do that.

[1] Falsely assuming here that everyone continued to play under those terms, of course, so this is a theoretical best case.

Sounds like the trend is in the right direction - I'm encouraged!

 

[[VR] Bulbulunufus]

There would need to be meaningful ways for the presence of another human being to make your game better.

Right now, unless you're interested in PvP, they basically can't.

Exactly (although it's certainly not that black and white)

 

[khalismur]

If player X gets twice as many points for doing something in open as player Y does for doing it in solo you cannot tell which one is being punished and which rewarded without more information, functionally identical.

Right. When your neighbor earns more than you, that means you're being punished. All hail Marx!

 

[aRJay]

There would need to be meaningful ways for the presence of another human being to make your game better.

Right now, unless you're interested in PvP, they basically can't.

To quibble I can think of some but none of them require open they can also be done in a PG.

 

[[PS4] Filthymick420]

Paying me more to do a CG in open is functionally no different from reducing how much I get paid for doing it in any other mode. It just sounds slightly nicer.

I agree with this. Consider if there were 2 shifts available at your place of employment, morning and afternoon. Now suppose for whatever reason you are specifically restricted to only working one of those shifts with no ability to work the other. Now suppose the employees on the shift you are not working suddenly got double pay for doing the exact same job.

All of a sudden you are not a very happy employee, are you?

 

[aRJay]

Right. When your neighbor earns more than you, that means you're being punished. All hail Marx!

How am I not being punished when I am doing the same activity in PG produces less progress in the CG than if I switched to Open?
The idea of increasing the rewards for activities in open is not only to make that more attractive but to make the alternatives less attractive.
@Filthymick420 has just put much better than I could.

Perhaps doing something to reduce whatever it is that makes open unattractive to players that have access to it but don’t use it would be a better approach than bribing them.

 

[Arioch]

Perhaps doing something to reduce whatever it is that makes open unattractive to players that have access to it but don’t use it would be a better approach than bribing them.

Allowing me to switch off other player’s coloured engine trails would be a start

 

[Robert Maynard]

They could do solo or pg we wouldn't want it any other way... keep saying it were not asking for anything that alters solo or pg.
Cgs would simply be more lucrative in open only. Devil is in the detail.

More lucrative in Open = Less lucrative in Solo and PG; therefore it's an alteration to the relative influence / earnings between one mode and the others - whether that's a bonus to one mode or a penalty to the other two modes depends on the spin it is given.

 

[Mormo]

Most of the arguments are not for "open only", but rather some changes to how open works, as to have a more interesting galaxy. <…> solo/PG players would not be punished in any way.

Buffing rewards will make 'more interesting galaxy' for gankers only and punish those who can play solo only. If you want more people to play in open then bring more new players to the game so some of them may be will stay and play the way you are interested in.

 

[Robert Maynard]

So using the "oh open only means mega gank time", argument ain't valid. You'll not meet anyone except perhaps pp corridoors bgs areas etc.
And you'll likely see haulers and miners as well as a hobo.

It's the same now - "don't go do interesting places in Open and you'll (probably) not get ganked)." - except going to those interesting places, regardless of game mode, currently has no difference on the effect that each player has on any game feature. Open only would effectively PvP-gate those interesting places if the player wanted to have any effect on the game.

 

[ADAMtheWELSHMANz]

@Dragsham You ever done a CG in Open where it's an outpost or a megaship with very limited landing pads?

 

[skananote]

I understand you can be afraid of gankers, I saw it in many games.. but man, its a game, sometimes you need to lose as in all games...

Also the price of ships compared to the money you easily win in this game... Why that fear? I just cant understand...

I don't want to lose. My reason for playing ED are very different. It is not a competition. I play because it is relaxing. I am not interested in any interactions with other players...

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

Right. When your neighbor earns more than you, that means you're being punished. All hail Marx!

The part of the game which is competitive and MP no matter whether you like it or not is the BGS and CGs so not sure what Marx has to do with it.

 

[varonica]

I agree with this. Consider if there were 2 shifts available at your place of employment, morning and afternoon. Now suppose for whatever reason you are specifically restricted to only working one of those shifts with no ability to work the other. Now suppose the employees on the shift you are not working suddenly got double pay for doing the exact same job.

All of a sudden you are not a very happy employee, are you?

I might, in fact, be an ex-employee!

 

[khalismur]

I don't want to lose. My reason for playing ED are very different. It is not a competition. I play because it is relaxing. I am not interested in any interactions with other players...

I suggesting reading other posts in this thread. Most of us agree "open only" isn't good, and many other alternatives were proposed.

The part of the game which is competitive and MP no matter whether you like it or not is the BGS and CGs so not sure what Marx has to do with it.

Common Mike, I'm sure you can understand the meaning of what I wrote and its context if you read a bit more of this thread. I believe in you

 

[Dragsham]

Cgs in open yes I have and its very annoying having pvp and blocked or queued pads I get it.
So l switch to solo where uninterrupted ill supercede any open only bonus by virtue of the fact I'm not being pvped.

 

[Robert Maynard]

The point is that it's a repeated theme, meaning a substantial number of people spontaneously come to the same view. If it's enough people then it becomes a motivation for change. There clearly is something that grates with a lot of people.

It's a repeated theme because some players don't accept that this game does not require any other player to play with them to affect the game - yet that's the game we all acquired.

That there are repeated calls for Open only / bonus for existing game content is unsurprising - as the discussion on the merits, or lack thereof, of pan-modal game features has been ongoing since the game design was published (over eight years ago) and new players join the discussion all the time.

While there are certainly some players who seek to change the status quo, there are also others who seek to retain it.

 

[[PS4] Filthymick420]

Cgs in open yes I have and its very annoying having pvp and blocked or queued pads I get it.
So l switch to solo where uninterrupted ill supercede any open only bonus by virtue of the fact I'm not being pvped.

This seems like it could be easily worked around.

Do most of travel in open. Log out before reaching destination and relog in solo/pg, dock and log out. Relog in open while docked and finish what you were doing.

I broke it before it ever had a chance of happening. Now consider there are way sneakier players than myself.

 

[Nadreck]

I also never suggested ending solo/PG, but rather a review of how the different modes interact with BGS. There must be a downside to being able to influence the BGS while playing in a safe mode. I didn't duggest any punishment for solo/PG players, but rather a buff to Open players, by making Inf changes count more. That's not an absurd change, that's not punishment. Just a way to make the galaxy more alive in Open and the rivalries between PMF more interesting.

Again, console players, solo/PG players would not be punished in any way.

You are contradicting yourself there. If a player in Solo/PG is attempting to influence the BGS, and is being opposed by an Open player with an unfair bonus to INF, then he is being punished.

No, there must NOT be a downside to influencing the BGS in Solo/PG.

If I lose a BGS contest in Solo, it means that I was up against a superior force: either superior numbers, or a player who was putting in more effort than me. And I would accept that as a fair loss. But I would NOT be happy about losing to a player putting in less effort than me, but getting an unfair and unjustifiable bonus.

Again: the BGS is NOT supposed to be a pew-pew contest! (except in CZ's). To recycle my earlier analogy: if a Pepsi trucker uses a bazooka to prevent a Coke delivery, he is CHEATING. He is not following the generally-accepted rules of corporate competition. If I choose to follow those rules and compete fairly, why should I be penalised by a bonus unfairly awarded to my undeserving opponent?

And the "...but he's taking a greater risk..." argument doesn't hold up. He is at no greater risk from ME, because I am in Solo. If there's some other guy supporting my faction by hunting him in Open, then I wish he'd stop faffing about "on patrol" and help me with the INF missions, he'd be a lot more useful doing that!