My open letter to Fdev

[Mouse]

I love how the term "griefer" is thrown around by the bleaters, especially when the game is DESIGNED to pit players against each other players.. The mechanics are working as intended, crying about being killed by players is not only childish, its sad. The game has a huge PvP element, PvP is not griefing and I doubt that the ones throwing that term around actually KNOW what griefing is SO, please do a bit of research before unloading your butthurt on the PvPers, it makes you look even more foolish.

PVP is not griefing you are right.. yet invading PVE PGs in order to PVP their players IS griefing. PLus the game is designed so players can work against or with players and it doesn't have a huge PVP element.. the PVP element of the game is rather small as it is a PVE game with PVP enabled. So before telling people they are sad and childish and that they look more foolish maybe you should get your own facts straight....

 

[Roybe]

Mobius and solo aren't "personal RP", they are effectively separate servers with their own rules. It's not uncommon at all for MMOs to have PvE-only servers, and yes, those PvE-only servers have the same influence on those games' persistent worlds as the PvP servers. Arbitrarily dragging people out of solo and groups would defeat the purpose of having those modes in the first place.

Is it really so horrible that there are people enjoying the game, and you can't stop them from enjoying it?

It really isn't though...and this is where people lose sight of what the capabilities of the game are. They are actually playing in the same server as anyone else...and could theoretically be flying in a system (not the instance) with you at that same time...except they are flagged not to see anyone, except those flagged in the Mobius group. It is not close to being it's own server..it's just their choice as to who they play with at that time.

 

[Mouse]

No its NOT. Its rude and childish but its NOT griefing, a griefer is someone who hounds/pursues a player killing them multiple times, usually over a period of time. Now, what you describe is NOT "griefing", get over it or LTP

Actually it is griefing to follow players into other modes just to kill them. And LTP.. seriously? Do you think those of us who don't PVP do so because we don't know how to play the game? Just because you like PVP does NOT mean everyone does.. And I bet there are players that are strictly PVE that could wax your tail from here to Sag A, but they have no desire for that type of gameplay.

You are the one who "Needs to get over it".

 

[Dave1235]

Just get rid of single player and private groups. There are enough players unhappy already about the state of things. Doing this will put everyone on an even par. Just deal with it. It seems totally ridiculous to have 2 states of play where private groups can affect the same universe.

Maybe rp the death penalty and wipe all their accounts.

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Just get rid of single player and private groups. There are enough players unhappy already about the state of things. Doing this will put everyone on an even par. Just deal with it. It seems totally ridiculous to have 2 states of play where private groups can affect the same universe.

Maybe they wouldn't be upset if they did some research before buying.
So no sog all having the same effect on the single bgs has been advertised since ks. Fd never hid that from anyone who can read

 

[ROSS-128]

It really isn't though...and this is where people lose sight of what the capabilities of the game are. They are actually playing in the same server as anyone else...and could theoretically be flying in a system (not the instance) with you at that same time...except they are flagged not to see anyone, except those flagged in the Mobius group. It is not close to being it's own server..it's just their choice as to who they play with at that time.

That's why that word "effectively" is in there. Yes, the game runs peer-to-peer. But if nobody can join your peer-to-peer network without being on an authorized userlist, you have effectively created a virtual server out of that network. It has the same effect as a server, as far as the end-users are concerned. They're not flying around in open "RPing as PvE players". Joining a group like that under false pretenses in order to fly around ganking unprepared players is not OK at all.

The BGS is a third-party that keeps all those peer-to-peer networks in sync, and since there's only one BGS server then talking about cutting groups off from it is a whole other can of worms.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

tell me, do the polls have a full 1.7 million player count vote distributed ? or is it maybe 30k,50k or 100k at most

An interesting related aside. Back in the OT thread there was a vote for UK players to brexit not. There were so many potential holes in the poll. Nothing was stopping none UK people from posting, and gamers who play ED is hardly a balanced slice of the UK voting demographic and finally the number of voters there is even less of a valid percentage of the UK than in normal ED polls.. and yet the final result was almost an exact match to the final figures of the actual UK wide poll FAR more accurate than any of the official predictions.

So my point is ED polls on what the majority of the playerbase want may be more accurate than you think.

Even FD realise their primary playerbase tent to be pve gamers

DB has stated how the game is
MB has stated it
The KSer stated it
The FAQ states it
The forum polls show the majority of people here are happy with it
And a UK wide poll have shown that the numbers voting here can be a fair reflection of the playerbase.

Surely at some point people have to accept if it walks, squawks and flies like a duck..........

Anything else is willful ignorance imo

The only olive branch for change was Sandy's hand grenade but think about it... all that was was making players action for pp in open count more. No more pay no more influence to personal progression... nothing. The only difference this would make would be if Möbius was an organised entity choosing to go against everyone in open who were also organised against Möbius. They are not so the net effect will be Möbius players will cancel each other out.

 

[Spiridon]

1.7 million is a poll by itself. That many purchased the game with the 3 modes as advertised. People don't want pvp. People want to just play with friends without interference from anyone else. Others want single player experience like every other Elite game. The system is as advertised and it has sold well as advertised.

Exactly. That's why I bought the game, and at least 7-8 people I know personally. (a 100% majority) First wish was "single player experience like every other Elite game" and this other possibility kicked in nicely.

We've done our research.

So my open letter to the Devs is: thank you, we've got what we wanted and paid for. Disregard this very very vocal minority who's yet to learn to research a product, not to fall for the simplest marketing tricks as "Dangerous", "Blaze your trail" etc. DBOBE, keep up the good work.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

Bottomline: CG is at Tier 3. CG goes on.

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Exactly. That's why I bought the game, and at least 7-8 people I know personally. (a 100% majority) First wish was "single player experience like every other Elite game" and this other possibility kicked in nicely.

We've done our research.

So my open letter to the Devs is: thank you, we've got what we wanted and paid for. Disregard this very very vocal minority who's yet to learn to research a product, not to fall for the simplest marketing tricks as "Dangerous", "Blaze your trail" etc. DBOBE, keep up the good work.

Hear, hear.

Or here, here.

 

[AJW]

Exactly. That's why I bought the game, and at least 7-8 people I know personally. (a 100% majority) First wish was "single player experience like every other Elite game" and this other possibility kicked in nicely.

We've done our research.

So my open letter to the Devs is: thank you, we've got what we wanted and paid for. Disregard this very very vocal minority who's yet to learn to research a product, not to fall for the simplest marketing tricks as "Dangerous", "Blaze your trail" etc. DBOBE, keep up the good work.

Yup. I bought this game knowing that it allowed me to play along with others as I chose. Or nobody at all if I so desired. If the game was 'open' only I wouldn't have bought it. And it is self evident that many others did the same. Frontier are in no position to force 'open only' even if they wanted to (though as anyone who has bothered to read their multiple statements on the subject, they don't). Arbitrary removal of a core mechanic from the game for no better reason than to placate a minority of the player base would almost certainly constitute a breach of contract, and accordingly they would be faced with having to provide a full refund to a substantial proportion of their customers. Such a decision would, since Frontier is A PLC, constitute a breach of fiduciary duty to their shareholders, even if it didn't bankrupt them. It simply isn't going to happen. If people want an 'open only' game, they should look elsewhere. And do proper research this time.

 

[Roybe]

That's why that word "effectively" is in there. Yes, the game runs peer-to-peer. But if nobody can join your peer-to-peer network without being on an authorized userlist, you have effectively created a virtual server out of that network. It has the same effect as a server, as far as the end-users are concerned. They're not flying around in open "RPing as PvE players". Joining a group like that under false pretenses in order to fly around ganking unprepared players is not OK at all.

The BGS is a third-party that keeps all those peer-to-peer networks in sync, and since there's only one BGS server then talking about cutting groups off from it is a whole other can of worms.

You are correct..but most people look over the 'effectively' and believe that there are other servers involved..either private servers..or multiple public servers...was trying to politely use your point to explain one of the biggest reasons why the game cannot split the various 'modes' out....probably not the best way to explain this?!?

 

[Dave1235]

Simple way to fix this, make CG's available only in open, fixed

Simplest way to fix it is remove open and let people start groups like the pve'rs had to. Will remove all the false entitlement about open being "the right way to play" by people who bought the game without understanding what they were buying. A lot of people can only play solo due to inet etc. Why do they lose part of a game they bought as a solo game for that reason because others couldn't be bothered to do some research before buying?

 

[Dave1235]

To me, it seems like it could be implemented easily enough. There are now places in the current galaxy you can not enter without a permit. Stage some CG's in the same manner perhaps, in some far reach of space, so if it is a 'combat community goal', then you need a permit to join the battle in a restricted area. That permit requires you enter that area in open play only.

Those who do not want to participate, just don't ask for the permit. lol

Incentive for playing in an actual 'live' CG with real community players would be much higher reward, because it is higher risk.

The players who want exciting human interaction will get what they want and always craved and been looking for in a space game. Epic battles.

'If impossible' to implement because it just simply can't be done, maybe some other game developer's out there are reading this forum and some of the ideas here and those light bulbs are going off in their heads right now. One can only hope.

;-)

I think they did already. Its called eve valkrie unfortunately some people got confused and bought Elite by mistake and just can't get over it.

 

[Dave1235]

a minority of people voting or some polls on forum are not the majority of people playing the game and never posting on forums

So what did fd add to the ks when it looked like ED Wasn't gonna make the kickstarter?
Servers to increase instance size or stop combat logging. No, offline mode!, because they knew what backers and elite fans wanted. Guilds support? No they specifically said they don't want that and I bet it would tempt more pvpers to buy so why offline mode. Remember its always meant to be a coop pve game and it makes sense.
It's almost funny to read the people saying design decisions that were selling points "should have been fixed in beta"
I think a whole lot of people are going to get a lot angrier before they get it.
Never mind hopefully they will learn from it and enjoy valkrie

 

[Dave1235]

You still dont get it. This game is p2p. That will not change. Even if there only was Open, you still wont see people who like Solo, because you cannot connect to them via p2p unless they want you to. In other words, we can all be in 'Open', but never in the same instance. That cannot be changed.

Well explained. I still doubt many would get it. Why would someone design a game in such a stupid way? It hampers pvp. No company would be that crazy. No one would ever buy a game like that. Lol, its gonna be interesting on the forums when they finally realise.

 

[Ian Skippy]

Well explained. I still doubt many would get it. Why would someone design a game in such a stupid way? It hampers pvp. No company would be that crazy. No one would ever buy a game like that. Lol, its gonna be interesting on the forums when they finally realise.

Read up on how network infrastructure works before calling things "stupid".

"Lol".

 

[Dave1235]

Read up on how network infrastructure works before calling things "stupid".

"Lol".

Lol I did I remember when fd upped it from 16 to 32 and some of the network diagrams and explanations on how it all works. Iirc fd were quite proud of it back then.

 

[MarkAusten]

one of the major selling points of the game is player interaction with other players, it is advertised as a multiplayer/MMO game to this very day.
are you going to pay for the refunds of people that got baited in to buy the game now ? from 1.7 million copies sold(i know that some of you bought it multiple times to "support" Fdev) you have maybe 2500 players in game right now and it will peak at around 4000 again tonight(european time) are you going to pay refunds to around a million of players?

And another major selling point of the game was the Solo mode.

 

[Deathwatch]

And another major selling point of the game was the Solo mode.

They stated why they couldn't do offline mode, the Solo Mode came in once they realised with the BGS they couldn't do an offline mode so Solo (online) came into existence.

 

[TartanDragon]

They stated why they couldn't do offline mode, the Solo Mode came in once they realised with the BGS they couldn't do an offline mode so Solo (online) came into existence.

Nope. Solo was always in the KS. Offline was added and then removed when they realised it was too much effort.

 

[Deathwatch]

Nope. Solo was always in the KS. Offline was added and then removed when they realised it was too much effort.

I was always under the impression that they rolled their solo/offline into one in the KS, seeing as i was around then, It may have been my misinterpretation.

However I do think the Private Groups in this game got out of hand when you have huge groups complaining oooh someone broke our private rules not like i know the guy and hes just someone who asked to join and ive never interacted with him.....