Is there no satellite link? I'm shocked.
No Single Player Offline Mode then? [Part 2]
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Is there no satellite link? I'm shocked.
He he, thanks for the support, but I didn't actually get my conflicting feeling from baiters and trolls. That was my personal, honest reaction to my emotional reactions to the news before I even came back here to see if I was alone in my feelings.
The moment I saw the redaction of Offline and read the first comments on online articles about it, I felt tired. I felt a little bit betrayed, I felt disappointed and then I felt annoyed and tired and sad and silly because I felt sad over something so insignificant, over being so "entitled" that I wanted my own vision of Elite rather than Braben's. It's been an emotional roller-coaster and I want (hehe, WANT!) it to end in one of the following:
1. Either I accept the fact that online single player won't be so bad after all, with the (subjective) drawbacks it will have to have.
2. Or Braben eventually accepts that since some people DO want the static gameplay model, they can have it and just download new missions I dunno, once a month or so.
In fact, I think the "archived game server" idea launched for future-proofing the game if FD drop dead is a swell model for an offline game.
No it doesn't.
There hasn't been a single solo mode game that hasn't stuttered to death, breaking the enjoyment and immersion. It happens frequently and repeatedly for 2 to 5 seconds at a time.
Also, with offline it could be modified to remove the frequent idiotic interdictions. A single interdiction on my way to a station is an annoyance, three interdictions on my way to a station is freaking ridiculous. That should be something configurable in Solo mode if offline isn't coming.
If that's the kind of game you like then great, I'm happy you're getting what you paid for.
If they would just give refunds to those of us who find this game no longer fits our "vision" of fun most of us would be done posting here. I know I would as I've got better things to do. But when a company takes my money and then removes a major feature that I paid them for then there's problems.
This is a good point. I came up with it first though. I had this idea yesterday already, so nyaah.
Yep, so that hope was dashed... but I still love the actual game.
when it comes down to it, being disappointed about not having offline mode (I'm one of them) is a far cry from demanding a refund due to it.
If your debating whether or not the amount of people so disappointed with this decision, disappointed and angry enough to demand refunds are a minority or not, then all we have are the polls on this forum. Every single one of them shows them to be a minority.
That is all I'm saying and I object to people implying that every KS backer is one of them. I'm not one of them. I'm sure many others are not. The available data backs me up far more than those in any opposite view.
Denying this just adds to the impression of how desperate those who wish to have a refund are with the reality.
The reasons some of them wish to have a refund is legitimate (in my opinion) and should be upheld.
Some are not legitimate reasons for me and are simply trying to get money back in the run up to Xmas.
Anything other than that is just more round and round of the same old standpoints.
or how many people upped their pledge after that promise was made either?
put me down as a +, how many more like me? I really don't know, so I shan't be offering dubious analysis based upon inconclusive data
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Going Forward and an apology
Beware incoming brain dump 3...2....1....
First the apology, today has been a rough day, I came on the boards this morning determined to strike a positive tone. I started a thread intended to be for discussing a theoretical offline server created post release by Frontier or perhaps by the community. It was promptly shutdown, this got to me I'll freely admit it. I understand moderating these forums must be hard job at the moment but I felt the intended subject matter of the thread was sufficiently different from the threadnought that it deserved its shot. Anyway it was shut down I've also managed to wrack up a warning or two and an infraction (for reporting Michael for closing the petition thread... obviously out of order I accept, though totally worth it at the time). So things have been getting pretty heated and I've made a few remarks that in the context of these forums are pretty mild but I still regret them and I've been guilty of looking for opportunities to make a fuss in other threads which is plain wrong. I guess I just wanted to be heard as piling everyone into one thread has just been horrendous as anyone who has tried to discuss anything in there will know, but what ever the reason it was wrong and I'm sorry. I let my frustrations get the better of me and I should not have.
Going forward, I've thought a lot about requesting a refund, today's announcement was a good step forward and had it been the policy from the beginning I and many others I think would of been less riled up, anyway I've played a bit of beta but not enough that I think there would be a problem getting my money back. However at the end of the day I don't want my money back, I want an offline Elite and I'm not ready to give up on that dream just yet, I've held onto it for a couple of decades so to abandon it so lightly doesn't seem right somehow. So yes I'm going to keep on campaigning in favor of an offline mode or local server being added by Frontier as soon as they can. But I'm going to do it in a positive way. I'm going to present my dream and hope that it is inspiring and engaging enough to move others and perhaps eventually the developers to lend their support.
You see I believe an offline Elite Dangerous can be magnificent! Far from being the poor cousin to the online version I think it can stand shoulder to shoulder with it. Each different but equal, each being a mode I want to play, offline when I feel like being in a universe built around me and catering specifically to my needs and online when I want to engage with others, be just another space pilot tooling around the spaceways watching the grand opera unfold. I believe that this vision of the game is only an enhancement to David and teams, not a either or, not a loss something here to gain it there.
So my message is this, please by all means get the launch out the way, refund those who want it, but don't abandon the offline question, don't just call it done. Go ahead with the review and when you do lets all be a part of it. Lets all state what we would like to see in an offline Elite Dangerous. Use the community it is your greatest asset! I promise you, If you give us the tools we will make sure that offline world is so full of content, richness, dynamism and customization that it'll keep the game going from strength to strength for years to come. I know I may be asking for miracles, but it is the time of year for it.
Thanks for listening.
Beware incoming brain dump 3...2....1....
First the apology, today has been a rough day, I came on the boards this morning determined to strike a positive tone. I started a thread intended to be for discussing a theoretical offline server created post release by Frontier or perhaps by the community. It was promptly shutdown, this got to me I'll freely admit it. I understand moderating these forums must be hard job at the moment but I felt the intended subject matter of the thread was sufficiently different from the threadnought that it deserved its shot. Anyway it was shut down I've also managed to wrack up a warning or two and an infraction (for reporting Michael for closing the petition thread... obviously out of order I accept, though totally worth it at the time). So things have been getting pretty heated and I've made a few remarks that in the context of these forums are pretty mild but I still regret them and I've been guilty of looking for opportunities to make a fuss in other threads which is plain wrong. I guess I just wanted to be heard as piling everyone into one thread has just been horrendous as anyone who has tried to discuss anything in there will know, but what ever the reason it was wrong and I'm sorry. I let my frustrations get the better of me and I should not have.
Going forward, I've thought a lot about requesting a refund, today's announcement was a good step forward and had it been the policy from the beginning I and many others I think would of been less riled up, anyway I've played a bit of beta but not enough that I think there would be a problem getting my money back. However at the end of the day I don't want my money back, I want an offline Elite and I'm not ready to give up on that dream just yet, I've held onto it for a couple of decades so to abandon it so lightly doesn't seem right somehow. So yes I'm going to keep on campaigning in favor of an offline mode or local server being added by Frontier as soon as they can. But I'm going to do it in a positive way. I'm going to present my dream and hope that it is inspiring and engaging enough to move others and perhaps eventually the developers to lend their support.
You see I believe an offline Elite Dangerous can be magnificent! Far from being the poor cousin to the online version I think it can stand shoulder to shoulder with it. Each different but equal, each being a mode I want to play, offline when I feel like being in a universe built around me and catering specifically to my needs and online when I want to engage with others, be just another space pilot tooling around the spaceways watching the grand opera unfold. I believe that this vision of the game is only an enhancement to David and teams, not a either or, not a loss something here to gain it there.
So my message is this, please by all means get the launch out the way, refund those who want it, but don't abandon the offline question, don't just call it done. Go ahead with the review and when you do lets all be a part of it. Lets all state what we would like to see in an offline Elite Dangerous. Use the community it is your greatest asset! I promise you, If you give us the tools we will make sure that offline world is so full of content, richness, dynamism and customization that it'll keep the game going from strength to strength for years to come. I know I may be asking for miracles, but it is the time of year for it.
Thanks for listening.
That'd be quite unlucky given the number of biomes available...
400 000 000 000 biomes / 100 000 players remember?
Also further to my earlier interest in backers and cash:
15,894 / 25645 backers were already onboard before the offline mode was announced (60%)
£769,263 was in the kitty at the same stage (50%)
How the remaining backer count and cash raised would be split is anyone's guess, not even sure if that website was counting repeat backers as additional ones or not.
HOLY COW Brother... I wish I lived in your world. This post should answer some of your questions.
And for the record I am not angry but annoyed. Big difference!
Cheers,
David Hostetler posted about 23 hours ago
_______________
Well, there you have if folks. Newsletter #50 makes it painfully clear: "This whole issue comes down to what the vision is of the game we are making..."
Like I said: we entered into this with mutually incompatible visions of the game, we just didn't know it.
And: "Is offline mode an impossible problem, or just unfeasible?
It is a creative decision, not wanting to produce an empty game."
This was a choice, not an unavoidable consequence of technical or even budgetary constraints. Braben/FD *CHOSE* not to develop a game that matched the things they originally said which convinced us to give them our money.
Sure, they can mince words about it if they want, to shirk the moral obligation to provide refunds or any kind of recompense to those of us that didn't read between the lines and understand that they were making an online-only, multiplayer-only, DRM-laden game.
Vision can be communicated clearly, early, and unambiguously, and they didn't do that. Many of us have said unequivocally that if this had all started with the tagline, "Elite: MMO", we would've run the other way.
How many of us would've opened our wallets if Braben had stated originally that "an offline game is an empty game" and "cloud processing and always-online entertainment benefits everyone"?
They never really committed to or believed in the value of an offline Elite, and it's clear now that at every step it was the runt of the litter for their efforts, if even that.
"Do you now consider Elite: Dangerous to be an MMO?
Technically, it has always been."
They were disingenuous about the project from the beginning, and gave lip service to several things in order to secure a higher level of backing than if they'd come clean on their real motives at the onset.
This is so much worse than if they'd really just had to scale the project or postpone some features until a later release. People understand that aspect of game development.
I'm a 15yr veteran software developer (native platform, web, and server) and you don't suddenly discover that you've got a product that can't manifest without significant centralized rack resources and a persistent network connection. They knew with each day they developed that they were entrenching that into the game, and they did so purposefully and without transparency to us regarding the sacrificial consequences it was creating for other promised features.
And for the record I am not angry but annoyed. Big difference!
Cheers,
David Hostetler posted about 23 hours ago
_______________
Well, there you have if folks. Newsletter #50 makes it painfully clear: "This whole issue comes down to what the vision is of the game we are making..."
Like I said: we entered into this with mutually incompatible visions of the game, we just didn't know it.
And: "Is offline mode an impossible problem, or just unfeasible?
It is a creative decision, not wanting to produce an empty game."
This was a choice, not an unavoidable consequence of technical or even budgetary constraints. Braben/FD *CHOSE* not to develop a game that matched the things they originally said which convinced us to give them our money.
Sure, they can mince words about it if they want, to shirk the moral obligation to provide refunds or any kind of recompense to those of us that didn't read between the lines and understand that they were making an online-only, multiplayer-only, DRM-laden game.
Vision can be communicated clearly, early, and unambiguously, and they didn't do that. Many of us have said unequivocally that if this had all started with the tagline, "Elite: MMO", we would've run the other way.
How many of us would've opened our wallets if Braben had stated originally that "an offline game is an empty game" and "cloud processing and always-online entertainment benefits everyone"?
They never really committed to or believed in the value of an offline Elite, and it's clear now that at every step it was the runt of the litter for their efforts, if even that.
"Do you now consider Elite: Dangerous to be an MMO?
Technically, it has always been."
They were disingenuous about the project from the beginning, and gave lip service to several things in order to secure a higher level of backing than if they'd come clean on their real motives at the onset.
This is so much worse than if they'd really just had to scale the project or postpone some features until a later release. People understand that aspect of game development.
I'm a 15yr veteran software developer (native platform, web, and server) and you don't suddenly discover that you've got a product that can't manifest without significant centralized rack resources and a persistent network connection. They knew with each day they developed that they were entrenching that into the game, and they did so purposefully and without transparency to us regarding the sacrificial consequences it was creating for other promised features.
[Redacted]
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I know that personally.
I was asking for numbers from any one of you. Reliable numbers, like a census or something, because I'd like to actually know for one thing how many were affected by the offline mode getting yanked, and for two, how to actually accurately compare people who like being around people online, with people who don't, online. Because there's a bit of a bias online towards people who are online.
That is all I'm saying and I object to people implying that every KS backer is one of them. I'm not one of them. I'm sure many others are not. The available data backs me up far more than those in any opposite view.[/QUOTE]Sorry - losing track of which "them" is which here. Use fewer pronouns so I can keep track, or not, it wasn't that important.
Uh,.. I really don't think anyone wants to drop out of Elite just to get money back for christmas shopping. Xmas comes around every freaking year - Elite comes around once every twenty. No, I don't believe that hypothesis in the least.
For the interesting ones I give them my address
Michael
You can give them mine to Michael tho doubt very much they would turn up .
Heck its only a game and a few quid and a lot more serious stuff going down around the world
Per Ardua
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TBH if I won a few mill on the lottery on Saturday I would ask DB to send their demands to me and pay them, so they could all go to somewhere where they could be happy. Because whoever is at fault here this subject is so far past its sell by date it has gone totally putrid.
That's what the ignore feature is for. I added just two or three and I see between 1 and 3 posts are blanked out red on each page. I still see quite some (usually rather civil) discussion, and that's perfectly fine of course - it's what the forum is for.
I have put in a request to withdraw from asking for a refund.
I am withdrawing from asking for a refund only due to DB promising to open up the server code one day when they shut the servers down.
I just hope my streched trust is a good thing in this.
Edit: And my case was opened for futher investigation but I will close it now and hope things will be good going forward.
I am withdrawing from asking for a refund only due to DB promising to open up the server code one day when they shut the servers down.
I just hope my streched trust is a good thing in this.
Edit: And my case was opened for futher investigation but I will close it now and hope things will be good going forward.
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+1 to that - I kinda wish it wasn't so red though since it does draw the eye's attention.
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