PLEASE MAKE POWERPLAY IN "OPEN ONLY"

Given that all it takes to get access to each Power's toys is three weeks pledged plus 750 merits, that's hardly challenging for a beginner.

The same can be said for engaging with the BGS, exploring, etc. - each player finds purpose in a particular game feature, or not as the case may be.

Players in Solo and Private Groups have access to the same toolset as players in Open - that players in Open can be impeded by other players is, ultimately, their chosen play-style.
The rewards are an incentive for people to join powerplay but it's an attempt to foster a sense of community for players that pledge for the same power. I've seen in amongst the Mahon players, where they're hauling for the prime minister and not bothered about the reward (Mostly because it's a bit rubbish).

Frontier set the challenge posed by NPCs - for all players in all modes. It has been proposed several times that the challenge posed by NPCs be significantly increased (up to the level of challenge posed by PvP players in some cases) - Frontier haven't acted on that proposal and, given the fallout from the bugged weaponry and enhanced AI in 2.1, it would seem that they are not prepared to make the game unplayable for a significant number of players to satisfy the desires of a subset of the playerbase.
I was referring to PowerPlay only for the AI increase. Heck, even an increase in solo/pvt interdiction would get rid of the Bots.
 
Frontier set the challenge posed by NPCs - for all players in all modes. It has been proposed several times that the challenge posed by NPCs be significantly increased (up to the level of challenge posed by PvP players in some cases) - Frontier haven't acted on that proposal and, given the fallout from the bugged weaponry and enhanced AI in 2.1, it would seem that they are not prepared to make the game unplayable for a significant number of players to satisfy the desires of a subset of the playerbase.
Which is illogical nonsense in a mode about conflict and opposition...one mode gives you that, while the other two don't? If NPCs cannot oppose you, what is the point of them?
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
How long to learn to fly a ship? If you are in combat a fair amount since PP CZs are harsh on beginners who don't know how combat works- and combat avoidance (i.e. Git Gud, which only really applies in Open).
Requiring some combat skill is not limited to engaging in Powerplay combat.

I'd expect that combat avoidance is one of the earliest skills that a player develops.
However stretching what we have over modes has made it unpopular.
Unpopular with those who want it to require PvP. I doubt that the pan-modal implementation is the reason why it is unpopular with those who don't engage in PvP.
Unless FD start from scratch thats not possible. The cleanest way is for current haul / shoot as Open, and solo pg for missions and bgs. Your weighted merits idea is good, but that does not solve the underpinning problems.
Whether the lack of required PvP in the feature is a problem or not remains a matter of opinion.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Which is illogical nonsense in a mode about conflict and opposition...one mode gives you that, while the other two don't? If NPCs cannot oppose you, what is the point of them?
PvP players only set the difficulty level when players encounter each other in Open - and playing in Open is not a requirement which means that hostile PvP is entirely optional.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
The rewards are an incentive for people to join powerplay but it's an attempt to foster a sense of community for players that pledge for the same power. I've seen in amongst the Mahon players, where they're hauling for the prime minister and not bothered about the reward (Mostly because it's a bit rubbish).
The rewards end up being an incentive to engage in Powerplay for three weeks and defect once the shiny is unlocked; rinse; repeat.
I was referring to PowerPlay only for the AI increase. Heck, even an increase in solo/pvt interdiction would get rid of the Bots.
Ah. In which case it could be scaled, in any mode, with respect to the Powerplay rank of the player (and possibly with respect to the capability of the ship the CMDR is flying, to an extent).
 
Requiring some combat skill is not limited to engaging in Powerplay combat.
But current PP CZs are old school and without the niceties of the new style. When I ran Utopias reddit one of the main questions was 'how do I live beyond one minute?'.

I'd expect that combat avoidance is one of the earliest skills that a player develops.
Unless you fly using no hands, its incredibly hard to lose to an NPC interdiction. Players are another matter- and then you need to be well drilled and not panic, something that takes time and practice.

Unpopular with those who want it to require PvP. I doubt that the pan-modal implementation is the reason why it is unpopular with those who don't engage in PvP.
Really? Have you sen the numbers? PPs current design has failed. FD will not rewrite the NPC behaviors for PP, hence why Open fills in the gaps cheaply.

Whether the lack of required PvP in the feature is a problem or not remains a matter of opinion.
The next time a wing of NPCs disables my drives with ion mines and tears my shields apart with reverb torps I'll let you know. Until then NPCs will be the non-entities that provide no challenge or dynamism in a feature that cries out for them.
 
PvP players only set the difficulty level when players encounter each other in Open - and playing in Open is not a requirement which means that hostile PvP is entirely optional.
But it has the potential for more difficulty- more weapons, more tactics and better ships. NPCs have none of that. This is why Powerplay has failed, because one mode has no opposition while another has potentially lethal players. Its inconsistent to the point of stupidity. If PP was split with jobs in Open only then at least the potential challenge is fair.
 
The rewards end up being an incentive to engage in Powerplay for three weeks and defect once the shiny is unlocked; rinse; repeat.
This is true for some powers, LYR and AD primarily. Thats why Sandro stated they would be tech broker unlocks which is a good idea.

Ah. In which case it could be scaled, in any mode, with respect to the Powerplay rank of the player (and possibly with respect to the capability of the ship the CMDR is flying, to an extent).
No- because it can be exploited due to alts (especially on consoles) having low ranks. And since PP activities don't increase rep you can have an inconsistency introduced.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
But current PP CZs are old school and without the niceties of the new style. When I ran Utopias reddit one of the main questions was 'how do I live beyond one minute?'.
Players managed with old-style CZs in all aspects of the game prior to the introduction of the new ones.
Unless you fly using no hands, its incredibly hard to lose to an NPC interdiction. Players are another matter- and then you need to be well drilled and not panic, something that takes time and practice.
Which comes back to the optional nature of hostile PvP and that Frontier set the difficulty level of NPCs for all players, not just those who prefer PvP.
Really? Have you sen the numbers? PPs current design has failed. FD will not rewrite the NPC behaviors for PP, hence why Open fills in the gaps cheaply.
One does not need numbers to suggest that PvP being optional is unlikely to be a reason for players who don't engage in PvP to dislike a game feature. Whether Open only would be "cheap" in all aspects remains an unknown - it might be cheap in terms of development time but costly in terms of consequences among the player-base.
The next time a wing of NPCs disables my drives with ion mines and tears my shields apart with reverb torps I'll let you know. Until then NPCs will be the non-entities that provide no challenge or dynamism in a feature that cries out for them.
Less than half of base game copies sold have a corresponding copy of Horizons - so it's unlikely, in my opinion, that Frontier will discourage those who only own the base game from playing by increasing the scope of Engineered modifications applied to NPC ships. Frontier also know how much Engineering has been done by players who do own Horizons - and I expect that that also figures in their decision making regarding NPC difficulty.
 
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Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
This is true for some powers, LYR and AD primarily. Thats why Sandro stated they would be tech broker unlocks which is a good idea.
It's probably why those modules are retained after defection - if they were lost then players might gravitate to the Power(s) with the "must have" module to the detriment of the rest.
No- because it can be exploited due to alts (especially on consoles) having low ranks. And since PP activities don't increase rep you can have an inconsistency introduced.
Possibly. However players in highly Engineered ships complain of no credible NPC threat.
 
Players managed with old-style CZs in all aspects of the game prior to the introduction of the new ones.
While on the Reddit the new players always struggled while they learnt.

Which comes back to the optional nature of hostile PvP and that Frontier set the difficulty level of NPCs for all players, not just those who prefer PvP.
But if no-one is opposing you at all, NPC or player, then PP becomes a blind grind race.

One does not need numbers to suggest that PvP being optional is unlikely to be a reason for players who don't engage in PvP to dislike a game feature.
Its because PP is flat and lifeless, and that NPCs are flat and lifeless stuck in disconnected and abstracted layers. Players want surprise and dynamism.

Less than half of base game copies sold have a corresponding copy of Horizons - so it's unlikely, in my opinion, that Frontier will discourage those who only own the base game from playing by increasing the scope of Engineered modifications applied to NPC ships. Frontier also know how much Engineering has been done by players who do own Horizons - and I expect that that also figures in their decision making regarding NPC difficulty.
Which just condemns PP even more. They provide no opposition, and are simply toothless farm animals that occasionally shout at you- so it just becomes who can grind the most rather than actually push back intelligently.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
While on the Reddit the new players always struggled while they learnt.
.... and what proportion of players find the reddit community?
But if no-one is opposing you at all, NPC or player, then PP becomes a blind grind race.
Indirect PvP does seem to be characterised as that by some PvP proponents.
Its because PP is flat and lifeless, and that NPCs are flat and lifeless stuck in disconnected and abstracted layers. Players want surprise and dynamism.
While some players might want surprise and dynamism, not all players play the game for the "rush", nor do all players play the game to engage in PvP.
Which just condemns PP even more. They provide no opposition, and are simply toothless farm animals that occasionally shout at you- so it just becomes who can grind the most rather than actually push back intelligently.
It holds for the whole game, not just Powerplay.
 
It's probably why those modules are retained after defection - if they were lost then players might gravitate to the Power(s) with the "must have" module to the detriment of the rest.
Possibly, but the aim is to have players properly engaged in Powerplay at a non superficial level- having a hundred pledged for the modules is not useful.

Possibly. However players in highly Engineered ships complain of no credible NPC threat.
Which is why either PP is built from the ground up using BGS rules, or players become the offical opposition.
 
.... and what proportion of players find the reddit community?
In the beginning (before the forums here had PP subs) Reddit was the sole platform for PP players. Every power had one and nearly all players went to them.

Indirect PvP does seem to be characterised as that by some PvP proponents.
The only organized opposition you'll face as you fly will be in Open. In Solo or PG it won't exist, and is the same in Open (i.e. same ineffectual NPCs)

While some players might want surprise and dynamism, not all players play the game for the "rush", nor do all players play the game to engage in PvP.
So in a feature about directly challenging other powers you don't want conflict? Why pledge then?

It holds for the whole game, not just Powerplay.
True. But for PP more so since thats all it has currently.
 
Unless PP NPCs can do what players do, then it is cheap. I have never seen an NPC chase me all over, ambush me or push me to my limits.
I was referring to troubles in maintaining a competitive multiplayer environment in this game. It might just be easier and cheaper to focus on personal narratives and single player experiences, with occasional co-op, cockpit cats, nice pictures.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
In the beginning (before the forums here had PP subs) Reddit was the sole platform for PP players. Every power had one and nearly all players went to them.
Without numbers of Powerplay participants and numbers of players who found each Power's reddit to compare the contention that "nearly all" players found the reddits would seem to be an assumption.
The only organized opposition you'll face as you fly will be in Open. In Solo or PG it won't exist, and is the same in Open (i.e. same ineffectual NPCs)
That's a consequence of no hostile PvP requirement.
So in a feature about directly challenging other powers you don't want conflict? Why pledge then?
Conflict is not only PvP.
True. But for PP more so since thats all it has currently.
The whole game would seem to revolve around PvE (and/or indirect PvP) - which, given the lack of requirement to engage in hostile PvP, will be characterised as a grind by some of those who prefer hostile PvP.
 
I was referring to troubles in maintaining a competitive multiplayer environment in this game. It might just be easier and cheaper to focus on personal narratives and single player experiences, with occasional co-op, cockpit cats, nice pictures.
None of which is Powerplay- if that was FDs ultimate aim for ED PP would never fit and should be removed in that case.
 
Without numbers of Powerplay participants and numbers of players who found each Power's reddit to compare the contention that "nearly all" players found the reddits would seem to be an assumption.
How is it then for a number of years the plans that these reddits (mine included) played out exactly as they were planned, with no shadow group fighting for control? The only outliers are 5C, and even then they are transparent in aims and are not actually having parallel plans for Powers.

Having been one of the leaders of Utopia for a number of years I have never seen any other group of the same size come along and attempt any other plans.

That's a consequence of no hostile PvP requirement.
So you then have two modes with no direct structured opposition at all - the only pan modal opposition that can be done is outgrinding each other, which is like eating cardboard and why PP is seen as it is.

Conflict is not only PvP.
PvP is not only conflict. Its running away, supporting your team, as well as shooting.

The whole game would seem to revolve around PvE (and/or indirect PvP) - which, given the lack of requirement to engage in hostile PvP, will be characterised as a grind by some of those who prefer hostile PvP.
If the whole game revolves around PvE, why have a mode that duplicates what already exists? If everything tastes of vanilla no-one is really going to care. Powerplay is about intelligent opposition, which is stuck in one gear (grind here or grind there). At least with Open PP the chance exists to make that much more dynamic.
 
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