ou don't know who you are talking to then if you think we care about credits. ignorance is bliss. As is generalizing everyone you disagree with.
Y
Proposal: alternative to outright removal of ADS instascan & system map minigame for explorers
- Thread starter StuartGT
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- exploration suggestion
ou don't know who you are talking to then if you think we care about credits. ignorance is bliss. As is generalizing everyone you disagree with.
Y
Do you like the ideas presented in the OP? Do you think they'd be enough?
As you know, I support something like this, but it should come about as the result of putting the FSS data into a Science Module. Aside from the black spheres, I'd also have text underneath giving the probabilities of the stellar bodies being of a certain type (Icy, ELW, Class I Gas Giant, Brown Dwarf etc etc) & the most likely distance from the primary star.
Here was my suggestion:
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/447638-Q4-Suggestion-Science-Module
I believe it fits in neatly with your own proposal. I'd probably make it a quicker process than resolving each emission manually, but definitely not instant. Also, the rewards (Experience & Credits) for using this approach would be less than for doing it manually, & would deny you the "First Discovered By" tag.
Another option is that, if the FSS could reveal approximate locations of stellar objects via the HUD, then a player could choose to fly out towards them & attempt a secondary FSS scan to reveal the info you'd usually get from the Emissions resolution approach. Again, though, this would yield fewer rewards......but more than the Science Module approach.
For me, the philosophy should be "Multiple Paths to the Same Destination".
https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/447638-Q4-Suggestion-Science-Module
I believe it fits in neatly with your own proposal. I'd probably make it a quicker process than resolving each emission manually, but definitely not instant. Also, the rewards (Experience & Credits) for using this approach would be less than for doing it manually, & would deny you the "First Discovered By" tag.
Another option is that, if the FSS could reveal approximate locations of stellar objects via the HUD, then a player could choose to fly out towards them & attempt a secondary FSS scan to reveal the info you'd usually get from the Emissions resolution approach. Again, though, this would yield fewer rewards......but more than the Science Module approach.
For me, the philosophy should be "Multiple Paths to the Same Destination".
No, that isn't the DD way, we must interpret (or misinterpret), speculate, and flat out guess every aspect before we actually know what is going on. Sheesh if we were smart and just waiting to see what is actually developed 75% of the posters would have nothing to say.
Notice that in the screenshot we've been shown - in contrast to the galaxy or system map views - the HUD top windows are kept visible while operating the scanner. I presume that is exactly so that you can still see notices scrolling by. Especially since USSs will no longer be randomly spawning around you, it'll probably be a poor strategy to ignore that "1 new contact" message while scanning.
For the system to work, I definitely feel that the scan screen needs to be in the form of an overlay, so that a player can fly & analyse at the same time......albeit with some small amount of difficulty. Wouldn't it be nice, though, if we could have NPC crew that can take either helm or scanners for the player?
I like the common sense that the OP is suggesting!
We can't have a all our nav data and discover it too.
We can't have a all our nav data and discover it too.
This thing is almost exactly what I suggested in one of the gigantic threads as a middle-ground between having the full-colour system map on-honk as we do now, and having absolutely nothing until you go through with the signal scanner.
So yes, obviously thumbs-up from me.
edit: hell, make this functionality the difference between the ADS and the basic, rather than just rolling them all into a single module.
So yes, obviously thumbs-up from me.
edit: hell, make this functionality the difference between the ADS and the basic, rather than just rolling them all into a single module.
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Iv been pretty vocal about about the upcoming loss of instascan & it's new replacement. So much so that Iv spent more time on the forums & little time playing ED.
Yesterday, while out Exploring in the black, I decided to see for myself how long it ACTUALLY takes to scan a typical system that I jumped into. This was because I wondered if the last 4 years of Exploring had in effect 'numbed' my awarness of time when system scanning.
The system I jumped into contained:-
Main Star with 8 HMC's
Star B (16k LS's away) with 2 HMC's & 1 Rock Moon orbiting 1 of the Planets
I chose this system because I knew from the 'instascan' system map, that my exploration technique would involve scanning all bodies in this system.
The time taken to complete this scan was 24 minutes!
My concerns with how I percieve this new system to be is that it will slow down considerably any trip that I undertake, due to length of time taken to repeat scan the Ecliptic Plane for each planet of each type in a system.
On completion I then realised, SURELY this new method, even when I'm still getting used to it, wouldn't have taken me 24 minutes, by not having to travel to each Planet in turn.
There are some considerations here though, mainly regarding interference from multiple star systems within a system & the actual accuracy of the scanner when getting information from 100k-500k LS's away.
I feel now, until I try it out in Beta, that on average, the time taken to explore a number of systems will most likely be the same possibly even less, with the added bonus (I hope!) of being informed of interesting things to find in-system - which is currently difficult to find now.
Yesterday, while out Exploring in the black, I decided to see for myself how long it ACTUALLY takes to scan a typical system that I jumped into. This was because I wondered if the last 4 years of Exploring had in effect 'numbed' my awarness of time when system scanning.
The system I jumped into contained:-
Main Star with 8 HMC's
Star B (16k LS's away) with 2 HMC's & 1 Rock Moon orbiting 1 of the Planets
I chose this system because I knew from the 'instascan' system map, that my exploration technique would involve scanning all bodies in this system.
The time taken to complete this scan was 24 minutes!
My concerns with how I percieve this new system to be is that it will slow down considerably any trip that I undertake, due to length of time taken to repeat scan the Ecliptic Plane for each planet of each type in a system.
On completion I then realised, SURELY this new method, even when I'm still getting used to it, wouldn't have taken me 24 minutes, by not having to travel to each Planet in turn.
There are some considerations here though, mainly regarding interference from multiple star systems within a system & the actual accuracy of the scanner when getting information from 100k-500k LS's away.
I feel now, until I try it out in Beta, that on average, the time taken to explore a number of systems will most likely be the same possibly even less, with the added bonus (I hope!) of being informed of interesting things to find in-system - which is currently difficult to find now.
While I do understand the issues some explorers have with the new system I think they need to take one for the team and accept that the old days of instant exploration are gone. Yes, it might take longer to find some rare exceptions, but the process of exploring will be way more interesting and finally fun. It's going to be like it always was supposed to be. If the instant honk never existed people wouldn't complain about the lack of it and probably regard it as a pretty stupid idea.
I don't think a compromise is needed.
I don't think a compromise is needed.
Just posting to comment that I remember that 'black body' scan from beta 2.2, and I really liked it. I thought it fit the jobs of the different scanners really well - discovery scanner finds the bodies, surface scanner provides the maps.
Then again, I also miss the prospecting gameplay the original Horizons had - where you had to actually land on planets and prospect in the srv to find what materials each planet had. Then they made the surface scanner find everything at the click of a button.
Then again, I also miss the prospecting gameplay the original Horizons had - where you had to actually land on planets and prospect in the srv to find what materials each planet had. Then they made the surface scanner find everything at the click of a button.
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I suggested that the DSS act more like a telescope whereby you point and zoom in on a planet to scan it from much further away, and it could be done as a third person turret so you could do it on the way to a different location if you wanted. I think I will like the new system as it is similar in that regard.
But I am skeptical about honking a system and not getting instant gratification. How much extra time will scanning a system take? I honestly scan, fuel scoop, and charge FSD almost all at the same time. I check the system map and if I see anything interesting I cancel the FSD sequence. This new mechanic will throw an wrench into the gears for how I normally explore. Maybe. If it's quick, I'm okay with that.
But I am skeptical about honking a system and not getting instant gratification. How much extra time will scanning a system take? I honestly scan, fuel scoop, and charge FSD almost all at the same time. I check the system map and if I see anything interesting I cancel the FSD sequence. This new mechanic will throw an wrench into the gears for how I normally explore. Maybe. If it's quick, I'm okay with that.
I was sceptical too, but I look at the system map & see what's there. If it's only Ice/Rock Planets I leave....if ANYTHING else, I SC to it/them & scan.
While I'm hitting just Ice/Rock Planet systems, then I suppose I'll be losing out because it WILL be likely I'll spend more time in what I would call a 'useless' system.
If I'm hitting other Planet systems then it should be quicker than traveling to them in SC.
This is where players differ in how/what they explore for. Each player's 'time in system' will differ accordingly.
It's worth remembering that there are a number of different subsets of explorers as StuartGT pointed out.
a) Scanning for credits in the most efficient manner (i.e. Road to riches).
b) Completing each system map with detailed surface scan, before moving on.
c) Searching for interesting sights and unique locations.
This form of exploration will be seriously negatively affected. Currently, it's possible to find an interesting planet based upon the image obtained from the initial honk. This will no longer be possible.
There are likely other forms of exploration that I haven't covered.
The proposal in the original post, will help a) and c) - but it won't help with b). That said, it also won't hinder b) in anyway.
As far as I can see - there's no drawbacks to what Stuart suggests. The current exploration mechanics need to change, but it would be nice to retain certain functionality, whilst still gaining new gameplay. The ideas shown here, really do help with that!
a) Scanning for credits in the most efficient manner (i.e. Road to riches).
The new system will likely dramatically change this.
b) Completing each system map with detailed surface scan, before moving on.
The new system will likely slow this down. Flying up close to planets to use probes will still be required, and will almost certainly take more time than the current surface scan.
c) Searching for interesting sights and unique locations.
This form of exploration will be seriously negatively affected. Currently, it's possible to find an interesting planet based upon the image obtained from the initial honk. This will no longer be possible.
There are likely other forms of exploration that I haven't covered.
The proposal in the original post, will help a) and c) - but it won't help with b). That said, it also won't hinder b) in anyway.
As far as I can see - there's no drawbacks to what Stuart suggests. The current exploration mechanics need to change, but it would be nice to retain certain functionality, whilst still gaining new gameplay. The ideas shown here, really do help with that!
You're wrong. Cherry picking will become so much easier. The constant jump, honk, jump, just scanning the best options will become much easier, since you can still recognize the best planets by their electromagnetic signal, only now, you don't even have to fly towards them.
Many are confused by this, so I'll repeat: jump, honk, scoop, jump while cherry picking will become easier. Everyone get this? The kind of mundane boring exploration everyone is attributing to those who complain about losing the information in the system map, will not be a thing of the past, it will become more efficient, so it's not unlikely it will become more prevalent. It's also not the reason CMDRs are complaining.
*sounds of holier than thou explorers tumbling off their high horse*
For me this comes down to the difference between EXPLORING and TRAVELLING. I have reached Elite explorer status mainly on the back of exp/credits earned from the latter rather than the former. I travel across the bubble for other purposes than exploring but can currently scoop, honk, jump and rack up the credits even in well travelled space.
I don't think this makes much sense. To really gain from exploration you should be a skilled, knowledgeable, and invested explorer, not just a traveller. Maybe the biggest "Losers" from this new system would be the travellers like myself. Maybe this is exactly how it should always have been...… (in my humble...)