Question for Open players who don't like PVP/ganking... help me understand

Riverside

Riverside
Danquememe said:
We haven't done that for a bit.
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You have had 169 pages of discussion, a large portion of which turned out to be unreliable 'roleplay'.

And even though you pretty clearly did understand, you still want to discuss it again?

Just play how you like & accept that people will judge you on your actions, and there may well be consequences beyond the bounty & notoriety you would get for killing an NPC.
 

Just Paul

Just Paul
Riverside said:
You have had 169 pages of discussion, a large portion of which turned out to be unreliable 'roleplay'.

And even though you pretty clearly did understand, you still want to discuss it again?

Just play how you like & accept that people will judge you on your actions, and there may well be consequences beyond the bounty & notoriety you would get for killing an NPC.
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We want to go for the mother of all threats. I like this one it's sometimes goes off a little, but it always comes back to the road. It would be a shame to let it die.
 

Riverside

Riverside
Paul Smith the 3rd said:
We want to go for the mother of all threats. I like this one it's sometimes goes off a little, but it always comes back to the road. It would be a shame to let it die.
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The OP asked a question, which has been answered to their stated satisfaction. It won't die, it will remain as a permanent record on the forum. It will come to a conclusion, which is that some people will say anything to try to justify how they play rather than simply accepting that they want to act on others rather than interact with them, which the game allows anyway.

TL;DR: Play your own way, let them play theirs.
 

TiberiusDuval

T
Danquememe said:
This is the heart of the matter, indeed. Is it time to talk about the "what did you agree to when you clicked Open" thing again? We haven't done that for a bit.

Interestingly, there was a recent Reddit post on exactly that subject, and the majority opinion was that playing in Open meant you were willing to accept being attacked anywhere, for any reason, or no reason.

Opinions on that, of course, vary!
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Well you yourself said this:
Pushing PVE co-op -seeking players into the same game mode as PVP -seeking players will inevitably lead to conflict, with the PVE players wanting to be left alone to do their co-op or at least "parallel play" mostly-solo stuff, and the PVP players wanting to PVP. With no easy or reliable means of identification, no PVP or PVE -only zones, etc., the bitter acrimony we see throughout this thread, forum and elsewhere around Open mode is the result.
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Meat in bones of this discussion is that some people seemly need hard limits to controll their behauviour. Yes PVP is allowed in Open. No there is no unlimited population co-PVE mode, so if you want co-PVE without arbitrary player limits you need to choose Open. Regardless of if you want PVP. Some people doing so and getting attention of forcefull "emergent content" providers certainly don't like that. Likewise emergent content providers do not like idea of Open PVE mode, as it would make their juicy targets go away and make traditional Open chosen mode for ONLY those who would want PVP.

And another truth is: "If you do not want to be considered as jerk, do not behave like one." Of course that leads to arguments of what is considered as jerk behauviour. Someones consider say menu logging a jerk move, while it is as much within rules as shooting anybody you meet. Someones consider those shooters as jerks.
 

Danquememe

Danquememe
I do think this thread has been thought provoking, for me at least, probably not others who are more used to the "merry go round" of the subject.

There does seem to be, at this stage, pretty broad consensus on a few things:
  1. Open mode allows people to act with and upon one another (I like that phrasing @Riverside ), it's all within the rules. Meaning, for example, that both ganking and menu logging are "acceptable," if unpalatable, actions within the confines of the game's rules.

  2. Playing within the rules (i.e. not hacking, cheating, or otherwise breaking EULA and TOS) is not the same thing as "being nice" or "honorable" or whatever. Just because you're doing something that's allowed and/or possible within the rules, doesn't mean that some players won't consider you an absolute jerk while doing so.

  3. For any and every conceivable reason, some people don't mind playing as jerks, though they sometimes get sensitive if the jerkiness of their behavior is pointed out. They will refer back to #1, to which their accuser respond by pointing out #2. Controversy and hurt feelings ensue on both sides.

  4. Remedies exist to contain the impact of behaviors you dislike for whatever reason. They include playing in Solo or PG as well as adding users to your block list. You can also try using Local and/or System chat to air your grievances, but the only guaranteed results come from using the provided remedies (and excessively salty messages in chat may provoke derision from the jerks).
I think that's pretty much a common ground around the topic, or at least, that's which direction the wind seems to be blowing at the moment.
 

Borko

Borko
Really? To this particular casual contributor it's sounded like this:

dc7b34bb-4dfthcv9n6e41.jpg


That's not a complaint, to be clear. Watching you guys fight over this stuff is funny as hell.
 

Mohrgan

Mohrgan
Danquememe said:
I do think this thread has been thought provoking, for me at least, probably not others who are more used to the "merry go round" of the subject.

There does seem to be, at this stage, pretty broad consensus on a few things:
  1. Open mode allows people to act with and upon one another (I like that phrasing @Riverside ), it's all within the rules. Meaning, for example, that both ganking and menu logging are "acceptable," if unpalatable, actions within the confines of the game's rules.

  2. Playing within the rules (i.e. not hacking, cheating, or otherwise breaking EULA and TOS) is not the same thing as "being nice" or "honorable" or whatever. Just because you're doing something that's allowed and/or possible within the rules, doesn't mean that some players won't consider you an absolute jerk while doing so.

  3. For any and every conceivable reason, some people don't mind playing as jerks, though they sometimes get sensitive if the jerkiness of their behavior is pointed out. They will refer back to #1, to which their accuser respond by pointing out #2. Controversy and hurt feelings ensue on both sides.

  4. Remedies exist to contain the impact of behaviors you dislike for whatever reason. They include playing in Solo or PG as well as adding users to your block list. You can also try using Local and/or System chat to air your grievances, but the only guaranteed results come from using the provided remedies (and excessively salty messages in chat may provoke derision from the jerks).
I think that's pretty much a common ground around the topic, or at least, that's which direction the wind seems to be blowing at the moment.
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I think that the undercurrent of this whole thing is players placing expectations on other players. We should all simply stop worrying about what the other guy is doing. The next time a player comes on to complain about being destroyed, we should all just yawn, and get on with the squabble over Space-Legs and VR. Similarly, the next Open is Good thread that pops up should get a couple of memes and emoji or two then pass on into the abyss of the back pages. I know we can never loose the CL-ing threads....
 

ACowForAllSeasons

ACowForAllSeasons
Mohrgan said:
I think that the undercurrent of this whole thing is players placing expectations on other players. We should all simply stop worrying about what the other guy is doing. The next time a player comes on to complain about being destroyed, we should all just yawn, and get on with the squabble over Space-Legs and VR. Similarly, the next Open is Good thread that pops up should get a couple of memes and emoji or two then pass on into the abyss of the back pages. I know we can never loose the CL-ing threads....
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Memes for the meme god. Emoji for the emoji god.
 

[PS4] Lorenzo Waringos

[PS4] Lorenzo Waringos
Danquememe said:
I'd uninstall. Not even joking.
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Pardon me digging this up, I have been on an 'enforced forum holiday'. I read this, It's a response to this:

BelieveIcanFly said:
Imagine if everytime you wanted to do PVP a random Miner or cargo hauler could interdict and force you to do mining/hauling instead for x amount of time.
maybe that explains why some ppl frustrated with gankers.
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This was a really good point and your answer highlighted the problem. I appreciate you personally have changed your style, you now comms people but there is a risk that someone might just straight uninstall.

Another issue I considered was groups, as far as I know, I can only search for groups, from the game menu, by name. I would have to know the group name in that case, it might still give me no idea what the group activity was. I wonder if they could do it by searching on something like genre. You would have to label your group, PvP, Exploring, PvE, Mining.

Riverside said:
You have had 169 pages of discussion, a large portion of which turned out to be unreliable 'roleplay'.
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169 pages indeed, I dispute the 'large portion' estimate. At best I reckon it was around 5-10 pages and not all those pages were entirely filled with it, if I am correct in what I think you're talking about.
 
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