Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11

Asp Explorer · May 28, 2020

Agony_Aunt said:
Hah!

My recent video has had loads of "you need to install it on a SSD" comments, despite it being installed on a SSD. Makes them look a bit silly. But they have to quote from the Book of Roberts, its the only litany they know.

It doesn't matter if you install SC on a RAMdrive

It still runs like frozen ketchup.

PiLhEaD · May 28, 2020

Surefoot said:
...We veterans are used to CiG shenanigans...

Based on what you described may I commend you on the use of the word 'shenanigans'. It wasn't the one that had sprung to my mind.

Tippis · May 28, 2020

Mole HD · May 28, 2020

Spectrum is aflame again...servers are all down and nobody can login...on the odd occasion they do get in after several 16k-7 errors, nothing is working due to the backend servers being down as well.

Ci¬G server room be like...

Asp Explorer · May 28, 2020

Mole HD said:
Ci¬G server room be like...

Beaker is far too competent and knowledgeable a technician to let himself get anywhere near CI-G's catastrophically dangerous infrastructure

Interestingly - I was able to log in earlier and was able to select New Babbage as the spawn point and got to admire some elevator buttons and NPC's standing on chairs. Now I can only select Stanton and the pre-alpha in the very earliest stages of development hangs as soon as it hits 4836.8Mb RAM and a call to a session manager that keeps freezing.

Code:

<17:52:41> [net] [bind culling] enabled and set to 1
<17:52:41> [EntityId] Granted 1 network ids from server [0x0, 0x0)
<17:52:41> Game rules class: SC_Default
<17:52:41> Loading GameMode='SC_Default'
<17:52:41> Couldn't find override spawn location with name
<17:52:41> [SessionIDManager] host session changed to: 379f6f6e-fd92-40c7-924a-2c9bfaf393fb
<17:52:41> CMicrophoneSelectionOptionBinding::SetChoicesAndValues() displaying 5 values. There are 6 devices
<17:52:41> Game mode created
<17:52:41> [CSessionManager::OnClientConnected] Connected!
<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS BEGIN 2
<17:57:01>   entities:     1932 allocated:     8192, reallocs:        1, deletion queue:        0 (stalled:        0)
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:      256 bytes type: CPhysicalPlaceholder
<17:57:01>   instances:     1289 size:      832 bytes type: CPhysicalEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1664 bytes type: CActorEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1088 bytes type: CParticleEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1504 bytes type: CRopeEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1216 bytes type: CSoftEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1216 bytes type: CSoftEntityEx
<17:57:01>   instances:      628 size:     1888 bytes type: CRigidEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     2432 bytes type: CArticulatedEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:    18656 bytes type: CWheeledVehicleEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:    20864 bytes type: CSpaceshipEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:       16 size:     1504 bytes type: CPhysPlanetEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:      677 size:      992 bytes type: CPhysArea
<17:57:01>   instances:    14765 size:      136 bytes type: CBoxGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:     4181 size:      152 bytes type: CSphereGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      156 size:      176 bytes type: CCapsuleGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      560 size:      176 bytes type: CCylinderGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      645 size:      480 bytes type: CEntityGrid
<17:57:01>   instances:      499 size:      632 bytes type: CTriMesh
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:      656 bytes type: COrderedMesh
<17:57:01>   instances:      256 size:   486680 bytes type: ordered_mesh_data_t
<17:57:01>   parts:      644 total size:   118496 bytes [184 per instance]
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton4
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: Stanton4c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stantont4b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: delamar_asteroid
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1d
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton4a
<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS END

The servers themselves are still responding and allowed a valid shutdown.

Code:

<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS END
<17:59:52> [net] OnChannelDisconnected - disconnection now pending for connectionId[1,1]
<17:59:52> System Fast Shutdown (ExitOnQuit enabled)
<17:59:52> BaseInput - Shutting down all force feedback
<17:59:52> ActionGame - Shutting down all force feedback
<17:59:52> [CIG] CCIGBroker::FastShutdown
<17:59:52> [CIG] CCIGBroker::StopProcessThread

ECity · May 28, 2020

Now we know why there are duplicated trains, ships and elevators:

Source: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQj2NP25TIo

Surefoot · May 29, 2020

Mole HD said:
Ci¬G server room be like...

Sums up perfectly the whole week event. That was planned perfectly by CiG. This is going well.

Cmdr Nemo · May 29, 2020

Surefoot said:
It has to be said that 3.9.1 is still a complete mess. Getting into the PU with a functional character is an achievement by itself, given the amount of obstacles thrown by this broken heap of dung... And then after hours of battle, reboots, reinstalls, redownloads just in case, and various rain dances invoked by the cultists ("it must be your computer !" "your install is broken !" "reset your character !" - note it's never ever CiG's fault) you get lucky and get in, get to the nearest spaceport, try and spawn a ship, server goes 30K, game over. Go and load the thing again and you are back to square one...
We veterans are used to CiG shenanigans, but imagine a fresh new player, naive and wide eyed coming from the video promotion of that free fly event...

But on the other hand in order to be come veterans, us noobs will have to learn how to endure the Shenanigans the same as you Veterans did. I keep thinking of all the other video games and there kick start programs and such that last for years. And during the wait by investor's, there's absolutly NOTHING to do. Learning to deal with the Shenanigans allows us to actually play what we have invested in if only for brief moments. Were as other's are not so lucky, they just wait and wait and ...

Mole HD · May 29, 2020

Cmdr Nemo LXXI said:
But on the other hand in order to be come veterans, us noobs will have to learn how to endure the Shenanigans the same as you Veterans did. I keep thinking of all the other video games and there kick start programs and such that last for years. And during the wait by investor's, there's absolutly NOTHING to do. Learning to deal with the Shenanigans allows us to actually play what we have invested in if only for brief moments. Were as other's are not so lucky, they just wait and wait and ...

Doesn't really matter if you're a veteran or not...it's broken for everybody

ECity · May 29, 2020

Cmdr Nemo LXXI said:
Learning to deal with the Shenanigans allows us to actually play what we have invested in if only for brief moments. Were as other's are not so lucky, they just wait and wait and ...

I'd say it's more like paying a large toll to get onto a highway. But the highway is currently being built and will never be finished.

Asp Explorer · May 29, 2020

ECity said:
I'd say it's more like paying a large toll to get onto a highway. But the highway is currently being built and will never be finished.

I pass the Star Citizen Roadmap every day....

Mole HD · May 29, 2020

Asp Explorer said:

Beaker is far too competent and knowledgeable a technician to let himself get anywhere near CI-G's catastrophically dangerous infrastructure

Interestingly - I was able to log in earlier and was able to select New Babbage as the spawn point and got to admire some elevator buttons and NPC's standing on chairs. Now I can only select Stanton and the pre-alpha in the very earliest stages of development hangs as soon as it hits 4836.8Mb RAM and a call to a session manager that keeps freezing.

Code:

<17:52:41> [net] [bind culling] enabled and set to 1
<17:52:41> [EntityId] Granted 1 network ids from server [0x0, 0x0)
<17:52:41> Game rules class: SC_Default
<17:52:41> Loading GameMode='SC_Default'
<17:52:41> Couldn't find override spawn location with name
<17:52:41> [SessionIDManager] host session changed to: 379f6f6e-fd92-40c7-924a-2c9bfaf393fb
<17:52:41> CMicrophoneSelectionOptionBinding::SetChoicesAndValues() displaying 5 values. There are 6 devices
<17:52:41> Game mode created
<17:52:41> [CSessionManager::OnClientConnected] Connected!
<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS BEGIN 2
<17:57:01>   entities:     1932 allocated:     8192, reallocs:        1, deletion queue:        0 (stalled:        0)
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:      256 bytes type: CPhysicalPlaceholder
<17:57:01>   instances:     1289 size:      832 bytes type: CPhysicalEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1664 bytes type: CActorEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1088 bytes type: CParticleEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1504 bytes type: CRopeEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1216 bytes type: CSoftEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     1216 bytes type: CSoftEntityEx
<17:57:01>   instances:      628 size:     1888 bytes type: CRigidEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:     2432 bytes type: CArticulatedEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:    18656 bytes type: CWheeledVehicleEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:    20864 bytes type: CSpaceshipEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:       16 size:     1504 bytes type: CPhysPlanetEntity
<17:57:01>   instances:      677 size:      992 bytes type: CPhysArea
<17:57:01>   instances:    14765 size:      136 bytes type: CBoxGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:     4181 size:      152 bytes type: CSphereGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      156 size:      176 bytes type: CCapsuleGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      560 size:      176 bytes type: CCylinderGeom
<17:57:01>   instances:      645 size:      480 bytes type: CEntityGrid
<17:57:01>   instances:      499 size:      632 bytes type: CTriMesh
<17:57:01>   instances:        0 size:      656 bytes type: COrderedMesh
<17:57:01>   instances:      256 size:   486680 bytes type: ordered_mesh_data_t
<17:57:01>   parts:      644 total size:   118496 bytes [184 per instance]
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton4
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: Stanton4c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stantont4b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: delamar_asteroid
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton3
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton2a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1c
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1d
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1b
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1a
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton1
<17:57:01>   planet cells:    0 [    0] meshes:    0 [    0] pod_fluff:        0 name: stanton4a
<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS END

The servers themselves are still responding and allowed a valid shutdown.

Code:

<17:57:01> PHYSICS INSTANCE STATS END
<17:59:52> [net] OnChannelDisconnected - disconnection now pending for connectionId[1,1]
<17:59:52> System Fast Shutdown (ExitOnQuit enabled)
<17:59:52> BaseInput - Shutting down all force feedback
<17:59:52> ActionGame - Shutting down all force feedback
<17:59:52> [CIG] CCIGBroker::FastShutdown
<17:59:52> [CIG] CCIGBroker::StopProcessThread

But what do all those nice numbers n' stuff mean to an idiot like me?...Apart from it being broken of course.

Asp Explorer · May 29, 2020

Mole HD said:
But what do all those nice numbers n' stuff mean to an idiot like me?...Apart from it being broken of course.

It means, my dear Mole, it spent nearly three minutes being broken and not detecting a fail condition - yet still responding to a manual input.

It's the software equivalent of "I've fallen over, I cannot get up, and I cannot even reach my beer"

Mole HD · May 29, 2020

Asp Explorer said:
It means, my dear Mole, it spent nearly three minutes being broken and not detecting a fail condition - yet still responding to a manual input.

It's the software equivalent of "I've fallen over, I cannot get up, and I cannot even reach my beer"

Why didn't you just say that in the first place?

Agony_Aunt · May 29, 2020

Mole HD said:
Why didn't you just say that in the first place?

He went to the CR school of making things sound more complicated than necessary.

amigacooke · May 29, 2020

Cmdr Nemo LXXI said:
But on the other hand in order to be come veterans, us noobs will have to learn how to endure the Shenanigans the same as you Veterans did. I keep thinking of all the other video games and there kick start programs and such that last for years. And during the wait by investor's, there's absolutly NOTHING to do. Learning to deal with the Shenanigans allows us to actually play what we have invested in if only for brief moments. Were as other's are not so lucky, they just wait and wait and ...

I backed Universim on KickStarter at a level that let me test the alpha and the subsequent beta. However, I decided to stop playing so I wasn't heartily sick of the game by the time it's actually released.

Surefoot · May 29, 2020

Cmdr Nemo LXXI said:
(...)play what we have invested in(...)

"invested" ? Look i can invest in shares, or BTC, or forex, or equities... but this is not "investment" if you refer to the "generous donation to CRoberts hollywood fame goal fund". I'm sorry but what i can see in 3.9.1 is not a $300M and 8 years product (*). It's a quickly slapped-together Crytek Engine demo with broken physics coded by a complete beginner, networking coded by someone who never got past the 1990's, with a complete absence of a proper vision that would hold everything together. I am now completely convinced that CR doesnt give a flying rat bottom about that product and is just there for the cameras, and his motion capture setup where he can talk face-to-face with A-list actors and play make-believe film director. I dont know if he ever intended to deliver anything, maybe in his mind it was just "code some magic and shazam, it works, after all it's just like Lego" and got completely out of his depth once reality kicked back in, maybe he intended to finance his wife career, who knows, in the end the result is the same.
And please, avoid "BuT tHeY aRe CoMmItTeD tO SQ42 !". This is at a complete stand still since about 6 years by now.

(*) the 3D assets (especially meshes) are cool, granted. Not $300M cool though.

Agony_Aunt · May 29, 2020

Surefoot said:
"invested" ? Look i can invest in shares, or BTC, or forex, or equities... but this is not "investment" if you refer to the "generous donation to CRoberts hollywood fame goal fund". I'm sorry but what i can see in 3.9.1 is not a $300M and 8 years product (*). It's a quickly slapped-together Crytek Engine demo with broken physics coded by a complete beginner, networking coded by someone who never got past the 1990's, with a complete absence of a proper vision that would hold everything together. I am now completely convinced that CR doesnt give a flying rat bottom about that product and is just there for the cameras, and his motion capture setup where he can talk face-to-face with A-list actors and play make-believe film director. I dont know if he ever intended to deliver anything, maybe in his mind it was just "code some magic and shazam, it works, after all it's just like Lego" and got completely out of his depth once reality kicked back in, maybe he intended to finance his wife career, who knows, in the end the result is the same.
And please, avoid "BuT tHeY aRe CoMmItTeD tO SQ42 !". This is at a complete stand still since about 6 years by now.

(*) the 3D assets (especially meshes) are cool, granted. Not $300M cool though.

Its the same as always. Heisenburg's Uncertainly Game. Is it a pledge or is it an investment? Is it already the BDSSE or is it ALPHA? It all depends on what the current position needs to be based on the viewpoint of the observer.

These people who call it an investment will happily flip flop to call it a pledge when they need to say that they don't expect anything out of it, that its been a "privledge" to be part of the most open development ever (LOL).

MTBFritz · May 29, 2020

The kickstarter pledge certainly was a risk investment. Not sure if you ever get your moneys worth but you help giving the project a chance. I think most people understood that back in 2012. What followed afterwards wasnt risk investment anymore tho. All the things CIG sold for real life cash in return for a promise were designed to collect more cash. At this point CIG probably doesnt even care about delivering what they sold anymore, the important thing is the next idea that they can cash in on....altho mere words dont do the trick anymore. It needs a little more effort on CIGs part to make people part with their money.

The rampant ship sales and funding boosts are not pledges and not even an investment anymore. Its simply technical debt at this point and somehow CIG doesnt seem to know how to stop but maybe they dont even want to...

hairychris · May 29, 2020

lysan said:
Not that this is an ED thread, however ED is actually a nice game from the graphic side, FPS is also pretty good.
My issue with ED is some features that simply make me annoyed after i play a few minutes, so if the New Age is going to add some of those features, it will be hard to beat for SC.

I don't think that it's the graphics, per se, but I've always been a bit bugged by the look of Star Citizen.

Don't get me wrong, there are some really nice assets in the games, and it's obvious that a lot of time has been put into modelling them.

The problem, IMO, is the overall art direction. Most games have a solid overall feel - you know that you are in their universe, and even if the graphics are not detailed the cohesive feel puts you in there. ED has this - even though the graphics are not as detailed as SC they have a consistency and a palette (colour and design) that makes those objects feel 'Elite Dangerous' to the player. Similar happens in movies where different cultures always fit within that movie's universe even if they look different (colour palette being a strong signaller here). Over-detailing stuff takes away from this.

SC just looks kinda dull. Detailed, yes, but dull. I'm getting flashbacks to the overly serious beige FPS games from mid-00s until recently where some of that stylised look has crept back in.