Several times a week.
Star Citizen Discussion Thread v11
- Thread starter Sir.Tj
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Several times a week.
I used to hop on far more often, and would actually drive my rig over to my friends place for a LAN party of SC. We even put our rigs together to see just how much horsepower SC needed to run at what we’d call a acceptable rate.
We got nowhere.
These days I only really have a look after an update, or I read about some outlandish claim, or I’m a bit bored and fancy some lulz
We got nowhere.
These days I only really have a look after an update, or I read about some outlandish claim, or I’m a bit bored and fancy some lulz
Are you having fun? All I read is negative stuff, but when I watch videos I think, "Well that looks cool!"
Despite my dislike of SC and it's direction, I'll say this..
You can have fun with ANYTHING. Add friends into the mix, and you can have even more fun, which is why you'll hear most gushing tales of fun in SC as involving the phrase "met up with some friends/people and then..." Sitting in a discord and laughing as everyone fails to meet up is, in a way, pretty fun. Sure it's at the expense of SC, but it's still fun.
The core concept of SC, as well, isn't inherently unfun. We're all here cause we like space games right? One in particular maybe, but SC's BDSSE goal is ideally going to be fun. The problem is that you are fighting against a buggy mess of errors and glitches and disconnects and time wasting nonsense and poor design decisions but, I'll admit, when it all works for that brief moment there's probably fun to be had.
How does Star Citizen compare to Red Dead Redemption 2 on PC? I know they are polar-opposite genres, but I'm thinking that RDR2 gets a lot of hate because it's a buggy mess on PC (from what I've read), but as for the actual gameplay itself, well some people don't like it, I on the other hand very much enjoyed it on PS4. Point being, is it because Star Citizen is a buggy mess that people don't like it, or is it just an empty shell of a game that hasn't had any real gameplay added to it?
RDR2 and SC are polar opposites in terms of gameplay and content; SC is is sorely lacking in both. It does have about a dozen hours of pretty landscapes to see - including lengthy travel time.
In fact, if SC was more stable, players would run out of content and become bored of the little gameplay there is much quicker.
In fact, if SC was more stable, players would run out of content and become bored of the little gameplay there is much quicker.
Same here.
Deliver boxes... since there's not much else to do with it...and assuming the live patch is as stable as the PTU...a bit of cargo shuffling and dodging torpedos from the folks who don't have one
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Sovapid... mdsilva... me. That's about everyone who posts on here that play regularly and actually enjoy it
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I try sometimes... but these server 30K errors bring me back to reality. I can do 10-15 minutes tops which includes barely getting out of a planet and starting a dogfight somewhere, then getting disconnected while warping around.. and back to desktop and actually finished games.
Also you can buy the complete RDR2 game for like $40. SC becomes quickly a bit more expensive than that if you want to do some mining, for example.
Easy. One is a complete game, the other is still a pre-pre-alpha demo full of dreams of what it might be in several decades if CiG stay constant in their delivery rate. There's barely anything to do but fool around and "have fun" in the chat with other poor souls who try and circle around the many crippling bugs...
Also you can buy the complete RDR2 game for like $40. SC becomes quickly a bit more expensive than that if you want to do some mining, for example.
That was me lol, I was like 'wow yeah I still remember playing Wing Commander on the Amiga and being blown away by it. Oh hang on though, by the time he was making Freelancer the only way Microsoft could get the game released was to buy his company and sack him' and noped out.
I was immediately rewarded for that by reading him explaining how he could take as long as he needed with SC because he didn't have an EVIL PUBLISHER breathing down his neck, seemingly oblivious to the fact that the reason he didn't have an EVIL PUBLISHER was that thousands of gamers had thrown money in. I mean me, I'd probably feel more of a sense of responsibility to deliver on time in that case but we've already established that I just don't understand game development.
No, your statement is what was not being discussed, my argumentation is about the lack of diversity of the games from 2010 era, hence what I called as the bad era in pc gaming.
On what basis can you deny the the conclusion about the lack of games on the genres that I mentioned before in that era compared to now or the last 5 years? Pages before I posted in this thread about other recent space sim games in the market, it is factually not the same situation with around the year 2010.
Microtransactions and other craps only happen in big budget games and annual game series under the biggest gaming companies, and also mobile games.
The AA and indie games are relatively free from that kind of blight, not to mention that big game companies now face backlash on their business model too, resulting in some of the companies to take it into account.
Oh but it's there and you just admitted that you didn't know about them, meaning people who said the same are the ones with ignorance, this prove my points regarding the better diversity of the games in todays market not yours which claimed that today is still the same with the 2010 era.
Years ago it was harder to find such games but today not so much, valve algorithm and tools they give you to find the kind of games that you want to search are much better now.
All in all I find it hilarious that some of you said that SC backers don't know about other games and yet you also suffers from the same ignorance.
Very nice...but who really cares?
I played RDR2 through on PC, and I have not encountered single game stopping bug. Some small issues like some doors not opening unless tried again in different angle, or some scripted npc behauviour glitching, those usually can be corrected by bumping to npc. Mostly it just works. I don't know about online mode though.
The question isnt why there is so much negativity surrounding Star Citizen. The question is if all the negativity is warranted. If you read the thread "fun" isnt questioned. Many of the videos about Star Citizen are designed to sell its strong points (no surprise there) and tho there are enough pieces available who try to address this topic neutrally they are immediately called "hit pieces" or the people releasing them "haters"... everything to discredit legit concerns and insufficiencies under the guise of "alpha" or similar excuses.
Either thousands of people who claim CIG to be a predatory greedy company with shady business practices and a lacking foundation are outright lying or you dont care about being taken for a ride. Personally I question the value of "fun" to be equal to the money, time and nerves being spent on Star Citizen. Thank god I m only in for 2 of the 3.
People are not required to stay respectful or positive when discussing Star Citizen but of course the general rules for discussions apply. If you check various YT comment sections you might even understand why so many people (on either side of the fence) are a tad tender when it comes to this topic and are prone to get personal. Often enough the point of argument isnt Star Citizen but the individual who raises an argument. So you gotta do what most in this thread do for years. Look past the individual and evaluate the point being raised. My default stance on SC fans is that most will do anything to promote their beloved project. Even lie and grossly exaggerate while vehemently denying even the most simple facts if those sound negative and that bias is based on years of experience, not a random choice of the day.
Do you think its a surprise why so many people debate even the starting point of Star Citizen even tho its perfectly documented? If you laugh about that notion I invite you to pick a random SC video and just post that you are surprised that its still being developed even tho it started in 2012, see what kind of replies you get. Are you being overly negative with that post?
Most of the time criticism or concerns are directed against the company and the people responsible but too often outside people who have no more information, influence or money in SC then you do, feel personally attacked and jump to its defense. Is assumed cult-like behavior (toxcicity) in SC circles outright "negativity" or is it an ugly truth?
Star Citizen can look and be fun, no doubt about it. Most people notice this first when they come across Star Citizen footage. They dont know anything else about the project. Not its past, not its milestones, not even its vision. It looks cool and the people playing it act like its fun. And they wonder about all the negativity that can be observed. I can even understand why most people new to the topic dont feel like going through thousands of pages of posts in order to "get the picture", what I sometimes dont understand is the willingness to jump to either side (and at this point in time people probably feel "for the underdog" in this debate) uninformed and engage on a personal level without any kind of knowledge base or personal experience.
Yes, theres a lot of negativity and criticism surrounding Star Citizen and CIG. And most of those things doesnt even touch "fun" so if you want to know if its fun then you simply went to the wrong place. This thread is beyond fun, this thread mostly doesnt concern itself with the fun aspect anymore. Or most people came to the realization that even tho SC can be fun it doesnt automatically negate all the other points in any capacity.
We are discussing management decisions or financial questions. We discuss development of singular technical aspects and often with the input from experience people. We evaluate business practices by CIG and comparing them with other publishers who are getting ripped apart publicly for comparable minor infractions. We generally compare Star Citizen with other games simply because other games are a success story from a development point of view.
Fun really isnt the question in the majority of this discussion. Even tho its often used as a carrot to justify all the shortcomings and hardship.
I m pretty glad that the moderators in this thread are on point and weed out overly hostile or personal contributions but this is a "war" going on for YEARS by now and everybody has learned a few things. What not do do (or get banned) and what is borderline accepted or "okayed". I received a few warnings myself, others have gotten bans and not because we are spiteful people but mostly because we got lured into personal discussions breaking any number of forum rules. Oh and the people who started those things are mostly gone for good.
I can understand that the constant flow of negativity through criticism directed at SC can be tiresome but again, its not because people LOVE negativity (wait....) but because there simply is hardly anything else to do besides wait. Fun and the discussion of fun is a distraction or simply trivia in all this. Its basically on par with Mole's cows and his isle
And the same goes for all the other things we discuss in this place. Distractions mostly because the ONE question that really matters (is Star Citizen going to release as expected or is it going to be good) is years in the future and we all are just passing time.Personally I didnt find a better place to discuss SC then this thread yet. And thats not because "my side" has the upper hand here. Its pretty much one of the only places where I can engage with adults and seriously talk about things of interest without having to bear open ridicule or personal attacks. By participating in this ongoing discussion I have learned a whole lot about game development in general, established industry standards, how to properly evaluate certain qualities in people and development and written english. I find that the lessons I received in this place nicely translate into RL affairs as well because face it, in todays world most battles are fought with words, not with fists.
Mole and Sovapid (and many more, but those two were specifially mentioned) draw on the "fun" aspect of Star Citizen. I focus on these other things because fun isnt something I can see. Oh I can see its lure but I know myself and I know that if I had to put up with all the crap (mostly) Mole describes from his play sessions it would be impossible for me to have fun. Because Star Citizen is NOT working reliably most of the time. And its usually very appearant that its an (very) early version of what its supposed to be.
So how important is "fun" in all this and your decision to get involved? How much are you willing to "pay" for that fun?
These are very personal questions that nobody can answer for you. I agree that live streams are the way to go in order to determine the answer. There you will see the unrefined experience without disguise or tampering (you think its a surprise why CIG pretty much gave up to show life footage anymore?). You will see the actual distribution between fun, coolness and tedious timesink that combines Star Citizen into what it is. Its how I approach games I m unsure about. I usually jump to twich and try to initiate a dialogue with the streamer. And too often I receive the "you should buy it, I think its fun" line and frankly...that advice isnt helping me at all to come to a conclusion.
But please, regardless if you think SC is for you or not, share your decision and also your exeriences in case you get involved. This thread could do with some fresh blood hehehe.
This is a phenomenon I observe in recent months/years. The absolute hyperbole of impression without any kind of experience or insight. I dont play RDR2 but can draw from other games I was a part of (as you say, RDR2 has no connection to Star Citizen in game terms so I guess its the same?). Namely Borderlands 3 and Wolcen recently. Both titles had respectable releases, not good but also not bad. They were working and the issues encountered were mostly minor. Connection and performance issues mostly. Both titles but Wolcen especially were ripped apart for minor issues disregarding the titles qualities completely because people seem to want to crap on them just looking for a reson. It actually was reversed roles for both these games. Borderlands 3 had a ton of fanboys who blindly defended the company and openly attacked anybody who had a complaint (basically like SC). I participated heavily in the discussions because I had a ton of "fun" but didnt deny the issues at hand (most of which were valid concerns). Wolcen on the other hand is working, does what its promising and yet still receives open hate and even review bombing over non-issues, mostly because it "dares" to compete with PoE (I think). You can take any kind of minor issue (bugs, connectivity etc) and you ll find people who openly spew profanity, shout at the top of their lungs and even make death threats directed against the developers. The points of arguments found in reviews is so laughable and ridiculous that only the steam no-commentary feature saves them from triggering more arguments. I actually would label the behavior I see in Wolcens community "hate" but of course thats just the tip of the iceberg. Because even "hate" has a reason and I refuse to believe that having untargetable enemies or a crash deserves that kind of hostility or IS the reason for that type of behavior.
Entitlement isnt even starting to describe the problem here. People were entitled for decades already. This shows an underlying layer of pent up frustration or subdued aggressivity unrelated to the game which is being released at any opportunity, regardless if its valid or not. You hear about people who have a bad day, relationship trouble or health problems lashing out against innocent bystanders because they didnt like their laughs or something similar?
This is equal to that. You might understand the reason for the grossly exaggerated reaction to harmless stuff if you actually learned about those reasons. But that doesnt make the action okay. Yet the internets annonymity creates this opportunity where people think they can say and do whatever they want without repercussions. And of course you hardly ever learn about the true reason for somebodies behavior. If anybody "touched" you improperly or if you are so deep in that blind defense or hate is your only line of action.
So most games these days face this problem. Open hostilty and trolling where they are not the topic but merely a tool for people to release their frustration. And weeding through valid concerns/criticism and bullying/hate can be a real piece of work for a bystander who tries to make up his mind. The question is how much you value your money. Do you care aboput 50 bucks (or 5000 in SCs case....) or not? Is a 35 dollar price tag worth your time to come up with an educated decision?
Only you can say. Leaning on people you trust is something I do as well but its always going to be MY decision in the end. If a friend tells me he has tons of fun with a game and I purchase the game based on that alone I cannot blame my friend for my lack of fun. So we get back full circle to Star Citizen. Is SC a good fit for you?
Frankly, you dont need to check this thread for the answer to that question. But you noticed the amount of negativity and thats probably what stumps most people who stumble across Star Citizen and primarily notice how "cool" it looks and the videos mostly show a working alpha build with tons to do and of course the tubers who seem to have so much fun. The question is if you are the type of person who can put up with bugs and insufficient foundations in order to have fun. Other people having fun isnt helping me most of the time to determine if the game in question is a good fit or not. Because I realize that people are different. Negativity/criticism tho is helpful. Because it points out and addresses concerns I might have. Maybe you like to just watch the vistas or walk around observing all the details? No doubt you ll have fun in that case. If I value solid gameplay, ingame depth and complexity tho I m out of luck.....right? So how is somebody who says "I m having fun" helping me in coming to a conclusion here? Synonymously negative reviews like "I hate it, yoh" are equally worthless. But the posts who delve into details and explain someones view.....those are valuable and usually the first things I look for.
So Wolcen receives a lot of negativity. My job is to determine if these concerns are applying to myself or how credible they actually are to be taken into consideration. And if I only look at one side of the argument my result will be ultimately flawed.
Sorry, I wish there was an easy answer man
![[VR] Mad Mike](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/27/27910.jpg?1553527108){kind=avatar}
I am perfectly aware of the games industry. You are not entirely wrong esp about the indie titles which I think are generally in a good place but at the same time i used to enjoy the big AAA titles knowing everything was earnable in game and knowing that if I bought a game for the most part I got a whole game .
Yes there has been some backlash on loot boxes and micro (macro) transactions but that is only because some gamers - similar to the ones in this thread i suppose - pushed back and said enough.!. Had people just accepted it there is no way the likes of EA would have started to back out of them.
Btw worse than all of that imo is the likes of EA who hoover up all the promising smaller Devs, ruin their novel IP (usually by infesting with the above) before closing the studio down.... But that rot started more than 10 years ago
Similarily I never made the claim to "know other games" but I do know some. And in case someone brings up a game I dont know I usually make the effort to learn about it in order to take it into consideration. The Star Citizen discussion tho is riddled with examples where people simply refuse to take other games into consideration. Dont know about them and simply dont want to learn about them. And even folks who claim to know those games come up with posts that make me question their actual knowledge.
Is that "not wanting to waste precious time" or "not wanting to face the truth"? Mostly the time argument is pushed forth but then...Star Citizen is a game DESIGNED to waste time already so this is another discrepancy showing up. Or the fact that games are judged with a clear bias. Things that ED gets bashed and critized for are actually "okay" in SC and getting defended. It does raise questions about the poster and if you are not getting any truthful answers things like "SC backers dont know about other games" is the most likely answer you are going to get. Of course I apply that only selectively but a whole lot of (self-proclaimed) SC backers seem to have absolutely no clue what the current industry standard is or what other games can already do making SC look like a worn shoe.
Is that "not wanting to waste precious time" or "not wanting to face the truth"? Mostly the time argument is pushed forth but then...Star Citizen is a game DESIGNED to waste time already so this is another discrepancy showing up. Or the fact that games are judged with a clear bias. Things that ED gets bashed and critized for are actually "okay" in SC and getting defended. It does raise questions about the poster and if you are not getting any truthful answers things like "SC backers dont know about other games" is the most likely answer you are going to get. Of course I apply that only selectively but a whole lot of (self-proclaimed) SC backers seem to have absolutely no clue what the current industry standard is or what other games can already do making SC look like a worn shoe.
Very nice...but who really cares?
How do you get away with this when other people posting similar things to your cow contributions would instantly be labled petty or seen as overly sensitive? I m asking because I was thinking of doing that and instantly told myself "you ll just look like a sore <BLEEP> if you do". Is it the emoticon? Is it because you are a teddybear?
....teach me
Yeah but Zombie cows are something to care about.
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