Your problem is with crowd funding any project, the whole nature of it is to ask for funding to make something happen.
A funding model like this is not unusual, when you have an idea but lack the funds to turn that idea into reality what do you do?
Game Discussions Star Citizen Discussion Thread v12
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Your problem is with crowd funding any project, the whole nature of it is to ask for funding to make something happen.
A funding model like this is not unusual, when you have an idea but lack the funds to turn that idea into reality what do you do?
Nope you are friend. When you state that technological achievements without precedent are definitely achievable, the onus is on you to demonstrate that.
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So pick my brains, no one can address double negative blanket statements, if you think you know something i don't, and you might, we can have a conversation about that, alternatively we can go round in circles. So unless you know something i don't i'm going to keep telling you i don't see anything in the game that existing technology cannot solve, if you do? Shoot.
In the game "as it is" or in the game "as intended"? Could you actually elaborate what the game "as intended" is? Because in 2021 I am pretty lost in all the promises. I am seriously asking because after reading quite a lot on the topic, including this interview (https://venturebeat.com/2018/06/28/...with-its-ambitious-alpha-3-2-quarterly-patch/) with Erin Roberts, I still do not know.
I mean concrete scenarios that the game's networking / persistence layer should handle. Like "real time twitch gameplay with 10 capital ships with 20 characters in each, in a single battle, with a 100 smaller ships, missiles, countermeasures, torpedoes, half of all the characters are NPCs, damage based on fully physicalised materials and physics engine emulating their properties like resistance to heat, plasticity, ability to withhold kinetic damage" etc.
Or "100 000 of NPCs in ships, vehicles and on foot taking part in economic activities that shape the market as to the demand and supply for various services and goods, with possible supply chain disturbances and emergent gameplay including piracy and protection of most profitable trade routes". You know, the famous interplanetary dynamic general equilibrium model presented by Tony Zurovec in 2019. Something like that.
If we cannot be this specific, it is really hard to assume something is possible, isn't it?
Coming back to you previous two posts, please notice I have not asserted anything. In the second response I simply said that the claim you are making was strong. In the first one, I was wondering whether you were arguing that it was obvious that some of the things CIG sold as promises were, in fact, impossible. This is why I got lost in your argument. You were responding to a post pointing out that CIG was selling a particular set of promises. As a response, you offered an argument about technical limitations of modern PCs with respect to fully modelled capital ships. I just cannot connect the two.
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I'm curious about this. If Vulkan can do this wonderous thing, why can't DX? Have MS been sleeping on this for years while Vulkan overtook DX? Its not like MS to allow a competitor to gain an advantage like this without a fight.
A full persistence MMO First Person Space game with up to 100 star systems and a player driven economy, that's the macro version and the expanded revised pitch, that has not changed. This is what's achievable. Tho on a personal note i wouldn't want more than 30 Star Systems, no matter how many players are in your instance its too easy to get lost in the aether when there is too much space. 30 to me seems like a good balance.
On a more granular level its constantly evolving because they keep adding to it, some of those addons are already in to some degree.
So now the question is how do i know its possible if it keeps evolving? As it stands right now i think it is, if in the future they add something that isn't possible then i guess this feature will not be going into the end product.
ED Emulates these properties, that is not difficult, I have never seen it to this extent in ED but is it possible to gather these elements together and try it?
That’s still not how it works mate. When someone makes a claim that is at odds with demonstrable reality the onus is on them to stand up their claim.
So far you’ve muttered vague things about culling and Vulkan. Two things used by numerous games, none of which display the results you say are definitely possible. Pretty poor evidence to date.
But ok, if you’d like a challenge: Explain how CIG’s proposed 100k player single shard, allowing for twitch gameplay between enormous inhabitable vehicles and while on foot, is definitely possible.
Should be fun
However, CIG claims to have had from the start super awesome industry stars. People who have been in the industry for decades. Of course, some of us on the skeptical side of things also note that most of them haven't had any particular successes during those decades and CR himself was out of the industry for a good long while.
There is also the argument that EA or Ubisoft wouldn't have gone for it is because CR had no clearly defined scope and they knew of him. He basically did what the guys behind that recent MMO claimed. He basically said he wanted the best game ever, with bells on it. And as the funding increased the scope ran away from him. Those in charge of making such decisions at Ubisoft/EA would likely have known CR and his history.
Its perhaps not impossible. What is impossible for CIG to deliver on what they have promised to backers over the years. Even infinitely deep pockets and all the time in the world won't allow CR/CIG to deliver on that.
What is possible, although more likely if CR wasn't involved, is a damn good space game with some of the stuff CIG have promised over the years. Something like that might be possible to take to a 1.0 release within the next few years and be built upon from there.
Viajero
Volunteer Moderator
I think this exchange summarizes nicely SC. The first quote describes how a large part of the SC community thinks, and the bottom one describes the actual current state of SC.
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CIG have said multiple times that Star Citizen won't have a player-driven economy; it'll be managed by CIG via the "90% are NPCs" angle.
If i did a kickstarter claiming i was going to make the best damn game ever, and talk at length about all the things i'd like to have in it. All things that maybe, perhaps soon, or one day, be technically possible... and its really going to be the best game ever. Hell, I even get my mates at a 3D company to make a rather flashy demo to show everyone what amazing progress we've already made and will strongly imply we already have lots of work done, that we've been working on it for a year already, and i just need a 2-3 years to make it happen and a few million. I've even got some of my industry veteran friends to join me in making the game.
Would you pledge?
Pretty much yes. There was a time when Microsoft had zero interest in PC gamers, perhaps they thought their XBox Eco System was more worthwhile to them in some way, they completely neglected Direct X, there had been no real improvements made to it in more than a decade and it was holding back game development, it was also a problem for the people who make the Hardware, such as AMD, Direct X didn't keep up with the technical advances they were making with the hardware so AMD took it upon themselves to creat a competitive alternative to Direct X, tho knowing it wouldn't work unless this new Graphics API incorporated the advances all hardware designers were making, including thier own competitors, like Intel and Nvidia, they decided to make it hardware agnostic right from the start and then gave it away, for free to an independent group to manage.
It worked, it forced Microsoft to develop their own API, now DX12 and DX12 Ultimate, and they started to take PC gaming more seriously, XBox Live is now on PC, there is cross play between consoles and PC, in fact Microsofts Game Consoles are now PC's in a branded box, AMD designed and built the hardware in them, not just the XBox but also the PS5.
What you missed from that article is the question Chris was answering - "What do you expect to be saying to backers in 2045?"
(and still probably hopeful
)Chris is a ########################### but one ####################### does not make a team, i have faith CIG will get it done despite Chris.
Except I don't belong to the Star Citizen community, I never bought into it.
And the visuals of SC are stunning partially, I can admit this as an staunch Elite Dangerous fanatic
This is false.
DirectX11 launched in 2009, DirectX12 launched in 2015.
There were also iterations of DirectX11.x launched during the interim.
Pure design aestethics aren't a work/money problem, if FD wished they could build the same ship aestethics SC does.
I just think the designs from SC are better. Elite did some strange decisions, mostly cockpit size and the hardpoint visuals.
Viajero
Volunteer Moderator
Never said you were part of it. Just said your comments nicely reflected how a large part of it thinks.