Engineers Summary: Engineers, Material requests and Time.

[VidarSnipes]

And I'm at grade 3 with Elvira Martuuk, so? The problem is, some materials are unreasonably difficult to get, while other, even high level ones, are trivial. You can get all wake scan results you want in an hour or two, while finding firmware upgrades is a pain in the ass, found either as rewards, or in rare (found one in beta, one on live in perhaps 15 hours of gameplay) satellite signal sources.

 

[Hexcaliber]

[where is it] [down] [arrrr] [hotas] [wacko]

 

[Mephane]

while finding firmware upgrades is a pain in the ass, found either as rewards, or in rare (found one in beta, one on live in perhaps 15 hours of gameplay) satellite signal sources.

And here comes another issue: engineers force you to get the specific materials. I do actually enjoy looking for USS with wreckage to scan that reveals some specialized firmware and then scoop up some materials. I like that. Yet I utterly, deeply hate looking for that one mission that gives the 1 material I need (except I don't need 1. I need between 1 and however many it takes until the results are good). I do like missions, but when I need a specific materials, I may go to the mission board and lo and behold - none offers the stuff I need, because there are so many different ones and not all missions award them anyway. It gets even worse with commodities - you need cargo racks for them and almost every upgrade from grade 2 onward needs one. If you want to upgrade a fighter with tight internal space, say a Viper, you may carry 4 tons and then have to go fetch some more.

 

[GJ51]

Yes, that's a fundamental and paradigm shift, and it makes me sad; I always saw it as a key strength of the game that credits as the universal currency bought you everything, so you really got to pick and choose your own adventure at all times.

+1 rep

Exactly right. This update represents a paradigm shift that will split the player base into multiple factions.

May will appreciate that we now have Engineers rather than passenger missions (that work). Others - not so much...

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And here comes another issue: engineers force you to get the specific materials. I do actually enjoy looking for USS with wreckage to scan that reveals some specialized firmware and then scoop up some materials. I like that. Yet I utterly, deeply hate looking for that one mission that gives the 1 material I need (except I don't need 1. I need between 1 and however many it takes until the results are good). I do like missions, but when I need a specific materials, I may go to the mission board and lo and behold - none offers the stuff I need, because there are so many different ones and not all missions award them anyway. It gets even worse with commodities - you need cargo racks for them and almost every upgrade from grade 2 onward needs one. If you want to upgrade a fighter with tight internal space, say a Viper, you may carry 4 tons and then have to go fetch some more.

The whole process is over-complicated and compounded by limited storage space and the laborious task it will be to document all your needs to reach your objectives. Once you run out of personal storage space you have to decide what to eject to collect something you need, at which point you'll probably find out down the road that you ejected something you're going to need later.

Too much work - too much uncertainty - for too little reward - with too much RNG involved.

Not really interested at this point, but I will be a patient observer...

 

[ilo]

wow, I'm not joining a post about the RNG madness again,I had enough. /me leaves

 

[NMS]

They tried to add horizontal depth to the game, but failed horrendously. The said depth is built on tedious grind and nothing more.

Elite has great graphics and engine developers, but they should hire some external devs to handle gameplay aspects, so it is more in line with 21st century standards. Elite is really pretty space simulation tech demo that you have fun with in short bursts of playing, but terrible game in a long run.

Could not agree more.

This is the best definition of ED that i saw.[yesnod]

 

[GJ51]

wow, I'm not joining a post about the RNG madness again,I had enough. /me leaves

Fair point.

I think I can hit the whole thing a little better after some more reflection...

We've now moved from Chess to Backgammon.

 

[S0k4r0]

I'm also of this opinion.

The game is supposed to have a 10 year long development plan.

I think it's sort of the intention that by the end of 10 years, the most laziest casual player, had acquired and tanked out an annaconda.

The people who put ALL their effort into trying to grind as quick as they can - are destroying the game for themselves in my simple casual player opinion.

As more and more interesting modules and expansions come-online in the future adding more layers to the game, or alternative ways of playing the game.
Different SRV's, mining planet surfaces, multi-crewed vehicles, passengers.

We got a trailer with NPC's in buildings because that stuff needed to be sorted out for when we can walk around them.
We'll be making our own avatars with the next half year....so stuff's happening.

When your ship is more than just a cockpit, and your three abilities from within that cockpit have evolved from reach a location/ shoot and/or scoop
I think a number of people will be g and blinding that they didn't get a good chance to "apreciate" their smaller ships from the previous years of play.

Suddenly an ASP is not long just an ASP, but a place you and buddy can go shoot some rocks together, and go clean up a fuel leak or go assisnate a passanger who is trying to sabotage your ship, 'cos he's actually a pirate with a homing beacon.

No disrespect , I think it's an empty common sense view , people will not be expecting to play so that after 10 years have a tank anaconda , no, people want to have fun with the game, and that the only thing cause is that we have to repeat over and over again the same situations and to modify a python with its 5 weapons , we discussed that maybe they are needed more than a thousand attempts to get what you want .... Absurd

For my part I will not wait ten years ... to enjoy ... an update ...

 

[Cmdr Esteban]

[FONT=&]Well, I tested the beta engineers and i must say several things at favor and several against.[/FONT]

[FONT=&]The first is that the AI ​​is not as difficult as some players said, if you have some time fighting already, you know perfectly how to counter fighting maneuvers[up], i do not think this is hard at all.[/FONT]

[FONT=&]The second is that the graphics have some remarkable improvements.[/FONT]

[FONT=&]And here comes the problem[where is it], time and materials requested by the part of the engineers is ABSURD[mad] let me Explain why:[/FONT]

[FONT=&]Not everyone has hours and hours throughout every day of the week to collect materials and other items to change things with the engineers[knocked out], I mean, for example, to improve an Multicanon with Overcharged 5*, need, material surface scan[down], which get in 1 day if you do not have much time, materials from scanning settlements[/FONT] [FONT=&]on planets[down]... two days... hunting materials battleships[down], another day, craft materials from conflict zones[down], another day, and destroy materials cargo birds (pirating or something), another day[sad]. (And Commondities[down])[/FONT]

[FONT=&]We can not be spending a week of our lives to try an improvement[sad]... And, not to mention that probably most likely not be getting the results of the modification that you want and even much much less likely that you get the experimental modification... and gentlemen ... this is for 1 bloody weapon[mad], imagine having to spend months in edit 1 weapon do not say to modify 4 or 5:x....[/FONT]

[FONT=&]Summary[blah], materials engineers require too many, and too time which many of us do not have:|, is an update that many of us are not going to enjoy this[sad]... because ye have overstepped the mark.[mad][/FONT]

I have been informed that the OP has the honour of winning the Frontier Award For The Most Smilies Used In Any Post Ever.

Congratulations! [up]

 

[S0k4r0]

I have been informed that the OP has the honour of winning the Frontier Award For The Most Smilies Used In Any Post Ever.

Congratulations! [up]

I have been informed that you also has ingratiated himself with the title to the post with less contribution to the whole community.

Degradations !!!

 

[shulkir]

Amen brother

 

[NeilF]

For me, the Engineers (+ crafting) area of 2.1 seems a huge development investment for what seems a tiny gain. All that design/development so I can get 15% more powerful beam lasers... to do, exactly what I've already been doing for the past 18 months?

Just imagine if with the weapons modules, when buying one, simply let you choose the side effect you wanted? Done!


Imagine then what all that saved development time could have been spent on?

1 - Piracy reputation/bases/missions.
2 - Exploration content.
3 - Convoy escort missions and the like.
4 - NPC crew. NPC wingmen for hire (see 3).
5 - Wing missions (see 3 & 4).
6 - Station blockade mechanics.
7 - Missions/tasks piloting a fighter for a Capital ship.
8 - Missions/tasks piloting a fighter for a platform/station (see 6).
9 - Improved community goal/powerplay tasks. (see 3 & 6 & 7 & 8).​

No doubt some of those are on "the list", but why are they further down the list, when stuff actually being added means we ultimately just keep doing what we've been doing for nigh on 18 months? When are things going to get "deeper" than just adding yet more simplistic mini-game RNG mechanics? Sitting there scanning wakes to get random scan materials? Really? Is this what we're happy to expect now?

 

[S0k4r0]

For me, the Engineers (+ crafting) area of 2.1 seems a huge development investment for what seems a tiny gain. All that design/development so I can get 15% more powerful beam lasers... to do, exactly what I've already been doing for the past 18 months?

Just imagine if with the weapons modules, when buying one, simply let you choose the side effect you wanted? Done!


Imagine then what all that saved development time could have been spent on?

1 - Piracy reputation/bases/missions.
2 - Exploration content.
3 - Convoy escort missions and the like.
4 - NPC crew. NPC wingmen for hire (see 3).
5 - Wing missions (see 3 & 4).
6 - Station blockade mechanics.
7 - Missions/tasks piloting a fighter for a Capital ship.
8 - Missions/tasks piloting a fighter for a platform/station (see 6).
9 - Improved community goal/powerplay tasks. (see 3 & 6 & 7 & 8).​

No doubt some of those are on "the list", but why are they further down the list, when stuff actually being added means we ultimately just keep doing what we've been doing for nigh on 18 months? When are things going to get "deeper" than just adding yet more simplistic mini-game RNG mechanics? Sitting there scanning wakes to get random scan materials? Really? Is this what we're happy to expect now?

Thats the point of me post, to much time invested for quite a small gain.

 

[Evil Flanker]

I love the update but I have to agree with the OP, materials are too difficult to find..

I imagine it is like this as the beta involed fish to get the mods which are plentiful and their location is not difficult to find, whilst I understand this was to test if the upgrades were all working properly, more time should have gone into testing how difficult/tedious/frustrating it is to get the materials needed.

Great update FD with engineers, just no-one wants that level of tedium and frustration, at least no-one I have spoken to.

 

[The ST]

I like the idea behind the engineers and the things they can do. But the materials they require are so arbitrary. I have actually had some fun ranking them up, but only by doing the upgrades for the materials I had through my natural progression of the game. Bounty hunting and surface exploration will net materials that can get you SOME upgrades. But for the rest you have to -HAVE TO- do things you may not enjoy or may even go against your personal RP.

I don't want to destroy innocent traders, but some materials can only be gathered from YOU blowing up some innocent person in a type-6 in an anarchy system. A material you "may" also be able to get from a random USS, by cannibalizing scrap left over from some OTHER poor innocent pilots trade ship. But no, just going to an anarchy system and blowing them up is significantly more lucrative if you don't also want a bounty on your head.

There are simply too many materials, exclusive to too many different types of gameplay. I thought missions offering materials would make it better, giving players another option to get them, but there are mission exclusive materials too! Mixed in with the non exclusives to make it even harder to find exactly what you want. It compounds the grind to insane levels.

I was excited about the update! I like the new AI! I like challenging gameplay! I like looting! I like the engineers! And yet, I just don't feel like playing anymore.

 

[S0k4r0]

you have to -HAVE TO- do things you may not enjo

THATS the point!, why should i bought next year the game??, im not having fun right now, did you understand? this is not to difficult, but expensive in time...

 

[Rigmor]

I would rather have an Engineer have several options to fulfil the requirements.

1. Go find this stuff, it's gonna take some grinding,
2. Go kill this dude and bring back the contents of his ship.
3. Do me a favor and take this crap 356 LY to my buddy, and bring this stuff I need (he gives you) back on the return.

Now I gave the Enginner the relics (want to upgrade my FSD range) now I shall go to Google to see where this other stuff is and how to get it.
But a simple kill mission would have been my thing really,

 

[Cmdr Rosewing]

Still haven't got the materials for first Upgrade on the fsd. Been looking the Whole day and it has till now cost me 2 mill credits......

 

[ilo]

Still haven't got the materials for first Upgrade on the fsd. Been looking the Whole day and it has till now cost me 2 mill credits......

however I do have upgarded my FSD, 4 multicannons and the powerplant. not level 5, not probably the best upgrades ever, but I have a better ship, I'm playing casually and have two kids. I wasn't looking for anything specific, but I was doing most of what the game offers I found them.

just that only doing pewpew won't get you what you want.

 

[ilo]

I would rather have an Engineer have several options to fulfil the requirements.

1. Go find this stuff, it's gonna take some grinding,
2. Go kill this dude and bring back the contents of his ship.
3. Do me a favor and take this crap 356 LY to my buddy, and bring this stuff I need (he gives you) back on the return.

Now I gave the Enginner the relics (want to upgrade my FSD range) now I shall go to Google to see where this other stuff is and how to get it.
But a simple kill mission would have been my thing really,

you know there is a description saying where to find it if you click on any material requested by an engineer??