The game is not worth fixing

[Ydiss]

I think it's a reasonable comparison. Personally I think part of the problem is FD keep trying to bite off more than they could chew, which has always been my claim about Odyssey and it bringing space legs to the game. Space legs won't fix smuggling. Space legs won't fix tissue sampling. Space legs won't fix outbreak missions. Space legs won't fix the under-utilisation of in-game assets.

Some of those, granted, are hard problems. But how hard could it be to fix a basic logic and/or maths problem like smuggling? It worked for ages, and then suddenly it didn't. I even reported it during the beta it came up in. I can convince myself maybe there's some complex networking or wireframe-interaction issue preventing Tissue sampling.... but failing to correctly calculate the cost of a smuggled good? That's basic.

It doesn't matter how big or small your project is, if it's broken, it's broken. Nobody cares how complex it is behind the scenes when it simply doesn't do what it's meant to on the tin.

(Funnily enough, I didn't agree with the Op. Op says they shouldn't bother... I think they should)

Valheim is just so far away from Elite in so many different ways I just don't play it and think "Elite could do it this way" for very much at all, except maybe the fact that Elite has a horrendous "crafting" system, holistically.

And I'm playing it right now. Just don't see any benefit drawing comparisons between the two games. It doesn't solve the issues with EDO.

 

[Jmanis]

Valheim is just so far away from Elite in so many different ways I just don't play it and think "Elite could do it this way" for very much at all, except maybe the fact that Elite has a horrendous "crafting" system, holistically.

And I'm playing it right now. Just don't see any benefit drawing comparisons between the two games. It doesn't solve the issues with EDO.

I added an edit at the bottom, just fyi. Sorry, i always do that...

 

[[Cancelled Consoleer] boppa_]

Some of those, granted, are hard problems. But how hard could it be to fix a basic logic and/or maths problem like smuggling? It worked for ages, and then suddenly it didn't. I even reported it during the beta it came up in. I can convince myself maybe there's some complex networking or wireframe-interaction issue preventing Tissue sampling.... but failing to correctly calculate the cost of a smuggled good? That's basic.

It doesn't matter how big or small your project is, if it's broken, it's broken. Nobody cares how complex it is behind the scenes when it simply doesn't do what it's meant to on the tin.

If simple fixes are going on the backlog, then the reason has to be prioritisation and planning constraints, and we can reasonably assume those constraints are primarily lack of available resource. Likely for the same reason that console development has been shelved.

A good indicator of behind-the-curtain-fire-fighting is the way the issue tracker is handled: whoever shouts loudest gets prioritised, regardless of impact.

 

[Phoenix_Dfire]

But when I play EDO, I get frustrated by the same tech, visual & performance issues, and the very gameplay I feel like I'm missing out on when playing in Horizons. At this stage I'm not sure whether it's even worth it for me to wait until patch 8 (supposedly addressing performance to a larger degree than the previous 7... whether that's what's actually going to happen is anyone's guess though) as the gameplay and visuals will likely stay with us for the foreseeable future.

If it's the visual and performance issues that spoil the gameplay, then I would say hold on. I think it was update 5 when the performance became good enough for me to walk around the bases with a smooth frame rate and get involved in conflict zones. That opened up a lot of the game for me and I've been enjoying it since (I was enjoying the exploration and plant scanning up till that point).

If its the actual gameplay that you're having trouble with (i.e. the fps doesn't feel right) then its best to cut your losses and try either Star Citizen or NMS. The one issue I would add to the list I said earlier is, the cockpit part and the on-foot part of the game need to feel a little bit more joined up. E.g., you raid a pirate stash at a POI on a planet, then the pirates come after you in their ships at a later point. Fdev have said in their developer letter that's on their to to-do list but there's no timescale.

 

[Deleted member 182079]

If it's the visual and performance issues that spoil the gameplay, then I would say hold on. I think it was update 5 when the performance became good enough for me to walk around the bases with a smooth frame rate and get involved in conflict zones. That opened up a lot of the game for me and I've been enjoying it since (I was enjoying the exploration and plant scanning up till that point).

If its the actual gameplay that you're having trouble with (i.e. the fps doesn't feel right) then its best to cut your losses and try either Star Citizen or NMS. The one issue I would add to the list I said earlier is, the cockpit part and the on-foot part of the game need to feel a little bit more joined up. E.g., you raid a pirate stash at a POI on a planet, then the pirates come after you in their ships at a later point. Fdev have said in their developer letter that's on their to to-do list but there's no timescale.

It's a bit of both to be honest. And that's why I'm a bit undecided about what to do. Part of that is because during an uncharacteristic bout of YOLO I decided to wipe my main account, and have lost everything I 'worked' towards over the past 7 or so years. The idea was to re-ignite the fire and try a more balanced, early game of Odyssey (where I'm noob rank everywhere, not just on foot) and I thought that 'having it all' was a reason I was bored with the game, despite EDO's launch bringing new stuff to it.

Didn't work out unfortunately, and now I'm having a massive grind/progression wall ahead of me if I want to get anywhere near where I was (FC, engineered fleet) in a reasonable timeframe. So I'm currently thinking, it is effort, but do I want to put it into the game again, to what purpose? To get back to my FC/ship situation I have to engage in the exact same activities that I did before EDO landed, given that is so separate, and apart from High CZs the payout is really poor as well so mixing it up with Horizons stuff is actually slowing me down.

Suppose I'm slowly moving towards the 'cutting my losses' stage. And normally I would just move on to another game, but Elite's been part of my life for so long now, that it's hard to knock the habit heh (and that includes my forum activity!). Maybe taking a break until next year might be the most sensible thing to do, even though I never really had the urge to take one previously, there was always another goal I could come up with. I'll see what #7 looks like later this week, and take it from there. At this stage I'm really running out of patience to wait more, it's been 4 months and (soon) 7 updates which didn't really change the game fundamentally for me at all (you mention #5, that for me introduced the awful performance in settlements, it was actually alright for me before that, not great but at least somewhat consistent and playable).

As for other games, while I own NMS, and X4 is taking more of my time and surprises me with all the stuff it allows me to do, I still have the urge to boot up Elite - but it's not the same anymore, in part because the organic PvP/MP encounters I had are no longer a thing in my experience (not that my ships would currently survive any hostile players due to lack of engineers/mats).

Star Citizen probably works best for me to watch on Youtube now and then, not going to touch that as I dislike the general concept of how it's managed.

 

[Crank Larson]

But when I play EDO, I get frustrated by the same tech, visual & performance issues, and the very gameplay I feel like I'm missing out on when playing in Horizons.

That's my issue too. I try EDO after each update, but so far every session has ended in frustration due to issues (mainly related to SRV driving and planets). Whereas an EDH session is still enjoyable.

 

[Rat Catcher]

Edit: i mean, i could compare to games like Starsector or Star Traders: Frontiers, other games with functional "background sims" which generate more interesting scenarios and dynamism, granted , on a smaller scale

Both of those are single player games, though, which is a pretty commpn comparison here - "single player game XXX does thing better than multiplayer ED: H/O" where a single player game has only, unsurprisingly, the actions of a single player to account for.

Not that I arguing totally in favour of that which Frontier chose to include in ED - much of what others have mentioned viable in other multiplayer games could make our own one a little more 'alaive', I'm sure!

 

[Deleted member 182079]

That's my issue too. I try EDO after each update, but so far every session has ended in frustration due to issues (mainly related to SRV driving and planets). Whereas an EDH session is still enjoyable.

There's one thing I noticed before, but it happens every time and I'm not sure if my mind is playing tricks me with - it feels that even the flight model is slightly different. It feels engaging, smooth and fun in Horizons, making me want to fly the ship (this happened in my unengineered Sidey so not exactly exciting to begin with) but switching to EDO it feels like effort, a bit like driving a car is fun in general, but driving a car in heavy traffic along a route you know inside out, not so much. It's really weird.... maybe it's the less than stellar framerate even though it's usually 70+ in normal space for me.

 

[Rat Catcher]

There's one thing I noticed before, but it happens every time and I'm not sure if my mind is playing tricks me with - it feels that even the flight model is slightly different. It feels engaging, smooth and fun in Horizons, making me want to fly the ship (this happened in my unengineered Sidey so not exactly exciting to begin with) but switching to EDO it feels like effort, a bit like driving a car is fun in general, but driving a car in heavy traffic along a route you know inside out, not so much. It's really weird.... maybe it's the less than stellar framerate even though it's usually 70+ in normal space for me.

I've noticed it is 'different' in Odyssey - ship handling on most ships 'feels' less responsive than Horizons (apart from the Corvette, which feels even more like a medium ship) - similar comments were made not long ago by one of the PvP players (who would notice differences better than I might!) whose name I forget. (no disrespect intended)

 

[Deleted member 182079]

I've noticed it is 'different' in Odyssey - ship handling on most ships 'feels' less responsive than Horizons (apart from the Corvette, which feels even more like a medium ship) - similar comments were made not long ago by one of the PvP players (who would notice differences better than I might!) whose name I forget. (no disrespect intended)

Thanks for confirming, I thought I was losing my mind... as it happened each time I switched between the two. The less visceral appearance of many of the effects of course only adds to that sense of 'meh' when experiencing this (subdued engine trails, bloom, thrusters, windscreen effects, and so on).

 

[dewelcodex1]

There's one thing I noticed before, but it happens every time and I'm not sure if my mind is playing tricks me with - it feels that even the flight model is slightly different. It feels engaging, smooth and fun in Horizons, making me want to fly the ship (this happened in my unengineered Sidey so not exactly exciting to begin with) but switching to EDO it feels like effort, a bit like driving a car is fun in general, but driving a car in heavy traffic along a route you know inside out, not so much. It's really weird.... maybe it's the less than stellar framerate even though it's usually 70+ in normal space for me.

I felt like there was an actual lag in the controller response.

 

[GJ51]

This thread is not worth fixing...

 

[Jukelo]

Should I stop enjoying this unsalvageable game?

 

[dewelcodex1]

I think it's a reasonable comparison. Personally I think part of the problem is FD keep trying to bite off more than they could chew, which has always been my claim about Odyssey and it bringing space legs to the game. Space legs won't fix smuggling. Space legs won't fix tissue sampling. Space legs won't fix outbreak missions. Space legs won't fix the under-utilisation of in-game assets.

Some of those, granted, are hard problems. But how hard could it be to fix a basic logic and/or maths problem like smuggling? It worked for ages, and then suddenly it didn't. I even reported it during the beta it came up in. I can convince myself maybe there's some complex networking or wireframe-interaction issue preventing Tissue sampling.... but failing to correctly calculate the cost of a smuggled good? That's basic.

It doesn't matter how big or small your project is, if it's broken, it's broken. Nobody cares how complex it is behind the scenes when it simply doesn't do what it's meant to on the tin.

(Funnily enough, I didn't agree with the Op. Op says they shouldn't bother... I think they should)

Edit: i mean, i could compare to games like Starsector or Star Traders: Frontiers, other games with functional "background sims" which generate more interesting scenarios and dynamism, granted , on a smaller scale. Elite may boast a bigger galaxy, but that alone doesn't make it better.

Well said Jmanis. This is how you disagree with me. I think 'fixing' is owed to everyone who bought it.
But I feel like they are focused on the wrong things, ie turrets for instance.
My point is the stuff that will keep people playing is adding more theme park type encounters, or creating a system where implementing them is easier. Creating more unique things to find or explore.

 

[dewelcodex1]

Should I stop enjoying this unsalvageable game?

You may continue. You should probably stop taking orders from rando's on the internet though.

 

[Ian Phillips]

@Robert Maynard why would you shut down MY thread because it gets swarmed by a bunch of internet bullies that don't like me?

Ban them before you shut down my thread.

Well thanks for your advice on how moderators should give your thread and wishes preferential treatment.
Just so you don't make the same mistake again here are a couple of things you should know:

1) Moderators that take part in a thread discussion may not perform any moderation actions on the thread, to avoid exactly the accusations you are making.
2) We don't need your advice on who to ban.
3) You would do yourself a great service by changing the tone of your posts. Treat this as a notification of intent.

 

[Bottom Hat]

You'd make a great lawyer as well Ian!

 

[[Cancelled Consoleer] boppa_]

Guys, you can have your own opinion of the game! On the flip side, so can I! If you want to disagree with me you can do it respectfully, or cordially, or in a similar tone that I take if you want.
Don't try to be funny though, none of you are funny, and it's embarrassing.
Take this in consideration when posting on anyone's thread going forward.

That goes as well to the muted guys that keep posting on here for some reason? I can't hear you, I don't want to hear you, not cause I don't like you.... I'm sure you're all awesome people and really good at life, I just don't like you on the forums. you also bump my thread to the top?
also
@Robert Maynard why would you shut down MY thread because it gets swarmed by a bunch of internet bullies that don't like me?

Ban them before you shut down my thread.

All of which detracts from the subject of the OP. Which I suspect is the motive.

I think what you're asking is a valid question. Where are the feature and content updates? The story being rolled out currently is all well and good but adds nothing (yet) to the game that doesn't already exist as a tried-tested-and-got-bored-of-it existing feature. Development are hamstrung to focussing on fixing Odyssey so that more people buy it. But at what point does it become 'fixed'?

Wishful thinking: maybe the update this week, seeing as it's coming to Horizons too, lays the groundwork for something new. A new weapon, ship, SRV, ** something...**

 

[Rat Catcher]

Wishful thinking: maybe the update this week, seeing as it's coming to Horizons too, lays the groundwork for something new. A new weapon, ship, SRV, ** something...**

Not this week... If it is ever likely I'd bet 'new' content will coincide with the launch of console versions - or when Frontier announce that consoles will not be receiving the DLC, either are possible.

 

[[Cancelled Consoleer] boppa_]

Not this week... If it is ever likely I'd bet 'new' content will coincide with the launch of console versions - or when Frontier announce that consoles will not be receiving the DLC, either are possible.

I'm speculating that

• some new content and story progression was originally intended to drop after console launch
• with console development being effectively shelved for the foreseeable future, the plan has changed
• the update for Horizons - billed as QoL - actually contains groundwork that allows said content to be deployed 'to all' (including the oft-ignored consoleers)

We can still hope, right!?