The new exploration system

Yes, there is a chance we could miss something in a system we are actually in, but for me personally, I like the fact that my experience and intuition is being challenged.

There are a few things that could streamline things a bit such as having body count on the main HUD after initial honk, and having body distance displayed in the FSS just by pointing at the blue blob without having to focus and zoom in.

Totally this. The more info up-front to help us decide whether a system is "interesting" or not, the better.

And "blue blob"... heh. I don't even see those, since I play in VR, and it puts the blue "haze" right in front of your eyeballs, without any blobs. So I only get the arrows, for locating things.
 
What's this talk about defeat? You should just do what you find fun to do. If it's not stopping in every system and just picking up whatever, then do that. If it's no longer exploration, then don't do that, the game has plenty of other activities to try. And if you find that you don't have fun with any of them, well, don't do them.

This is my own little personal dilemma: I'm finding the new mechanics fun. I'm really enjoying exploring the systems in the beta. My issue is that whereas before I could easily travel 3000 lys/hr and only stop if I happened to come across an interesting sys map, NOW I'm finding my best speed of travel is around 600 lys/hr! Or about 9-10 systems per hour. That's in a 70ly Asp X. I've done several one hour sessions to time myself and I've gotten fairly good at using the FSS but my rate of travel about the galaxy will be taking a huge hit come 3.3.

The conundrum is that I'm actually happy about that? Exploring in 3.3 is more fun for me, but my playstyle will be changing big time. And keeping up with expeditions might be difficult for me very soon. I can of course just forego exploring and jonk like the old times, but by doing so I'll have no idea what kind of systems I'm leaving behind, and as an explorer that just doesn't sit well with me.

So, Mengy will be slowing down come 3.3, for better or for worse. But I think I'll be for the most part okay with that.
 
This is my own little personal dilemma: I'm finding the new mechanics fun. I'm really enjoying exploring the systems in the beta. My issue is that whereas before I could easily travel 3000 lys/hr and only stop if I happened to come across an interesting sys map, NOW I'm finding my best speed of travel is around 600 lys/hr! Or about 9-10 systems per hour. That's in a 70ly Asp X. I've done several one hour sessions to time myself and I've gotten fairly good at using the FSS but my rate of travel about the galaxy will be taking a huge hit come 3.3.

The conundrum is that I'm actually happy about that? Exploring in 3.3 is more fun for me, but my playstyle will be changing big time. And keeping up with expeditions might be difficult for me very soon. I can of course just forego exploring and jonk like the old times, but by doing so I'll have no idea what kind of systems I'm leaving behind, and as an explorer that just doesn't sit well with me.

So, Mengy will be slowing down come 3.3, for better or for worse. But I think I'll be for the most part okay with that.

Three words to describe your findings: quality over quantity.

I find it particularly interesting that Genar is now on-board with the changes. It appears that the walls are crumbling now that people are actually giving it a try.
 
What I am probably going to end up doing is restricting myself to ELWs, AWs, and WWs for most stars. Then pick a star class or two that I full scan.
 
I find it particularly interesting that Genar is now on-board with the changes. It appears that the walls are crumbling now that people are actually giving it a try.

They arnt. People might put up with it for a while but as others have already pointed out, you are forced to scan an entire system to work out if the system is interesting or not. That breaks a certain playstyle, its not something that you can learn to live with, its just broken.
 
This is my own little personal dilemma: I'm finding the new mechanics fun. I'm really enjoying exploring the systems in the beta. My issue is that whereas before I could easily travel 3000 lys/hr and only stop if I happened to come across an interesting sys map, NOW I'm finding my best speed of travel is around 600 lys/hr! Or about 9-10 systems per hour. That's in a 70ly Asp X. I've done several one hour sessions to time myself and I've gotten fairly good at using the FSS but my rate of travel about the galaxy will be taking a huge hit come 3.3.

The conundrum is that I'm actually happy about that? Exploring in 3.3 is more fun for me, but my playstyle will be changing big time. And keeping up with expeditions might be difficult for me very soon. I can of course just forego exploring and jonk like the old times, but by doing so I'll have no idea what kind of systems I'm leaving behind, and as an explorer that just doesn't sit well with me.

So, Mengy will be slowing down come 3.3, for better or for worse. But I think I'll be for the most part okay with that.

Don't be afraid to admit it Mengy! Be proud! I think my biggest personal dilemma is feeling guilty about NOT feeling the same way about this that a few of the other, more prominent and visible explorers feel.

As far as the slower travel, I have felt that as well, thought I am not really travelling all that much slower, but I had to ask myself why I was bothered about just how many light years per hour I was travelling?

I can see that as a possible issue for group explorations, but presumably those expeditions will take into account a new reasonable distance per leg in their planning, and no one will be rushed or left behind.

So serious question here Mengy...what is it that is so important to you about the ly/hr metric?
 
They arnt. People might put up with it for a while but as others have already pointed out, you are forced to scan an entire system to work out if the system is interesting or not. That breaks a certain playstyle, its not something that you can learn to live with, its just broken.

Sounds like a pre-conception, Burke. Some of you guys are determined to hold onto negative views regardless of the evidence beginning to pour in from the beta where a number of esteemed explorers who were also deeply skeptical of the new system are trying it and much to their surprise actually finding that they like it and find it useful. Here's a good a good example of what I mean: Reaction from an FSS Skeptic authored by Genar-Hofoen

Everybody here can probably agree that Genar is highly respected and his views carry weight, and I'm very intrigued to read what he says on the matter.
 
Sounds like a pre-conception, Burke. Some of you guys are determined to hold onto negative views regardless of the evidence beginning to pour in from the beta where a number of esteemed explorers who were also deeply skeptical of the new system are trying it and much to their surprise actually finding that they like it and find it useful. Here's a good a good example of what I mean: Reaction from an FSS Skeptic authored by Genar-Hofoen

Everybody here can probably agree that Genar is highly respected and his views carry weight, and I'm very intrigued to read what he says on the matter.

And unless the play style is absolutely and exclusively dependent upon the whole system layout and configuration, under the old system, once the detailed surface scanner is needed to further determine if it is an interesting system, then the time gap quickly closes to the point of swing in favor of the new system in I suspect most cases.

I tested out a system last night. It had 31 bodies including an ELW with a landable moon around a secondary star at 145,000 ls from entry. Took me about two minutes to FSS the entire system, including seeing that the ELW moon had volcanism and high mountains at the north pole. The volcanism and mountains are what got me to fly out there. Two things that I would NOT have know in the old system unless I took the gamble. It took way longer than that to fly out to it than it did to determine I actually wanted to.
 
....

So serious question here Mengy...what is it that is so important to you about the ly/hr metric?

I hope you dont mind if i answer this question.
ly/hr is not that important. Systems/hr is what matters. Most of us hunt rare objects and configurations and the chance to find these increases with the number of systems visited. It is the same with the lottery: more tickets you by, the bigger is the chance to win. With the new system we will spend far more time scanning totally useless (IMO) objects, which (again IMO) dont deserve even 5sec of my time. Instead of pushing forward to the next system which might be more interesting.
 
So serious question here Mengy...what is it that is so important to you about the ly/hr metric?

Normally I’m not a “traveler explorer”, but I do fall back on the style from time to time. Particularly in two situations:


  1. When I’m trying to go explore a particular area and I just want to get there. Usually this is somewhere far into deep space.
  2. When I’m on an expedition and I fall behind. This happened to me a lot on the DWE1, as I’d putter around exploring and flying off track a lot, and then come meetup time I’d have to rush my way there. It’s also why it took me over half a year and 130,000 lys to get home!

The traveler explorer style is a handy tool in that it both allows you to cover distance but also still explore along the way too. While many players use this as their main exploration style I only used it when I needed to. The new mechanics of 3.3 improve actual exploration greatly, unfortunately they also decimate traveling exploration into the ground. Traveling is still possible if you don’t explore at all, and a moderate much slower pace of traveling exploration is possible if you only half explore, but for people who enjoy the traveling exploration style as a way of life this new update is going to hurt.

I guess I just don’t want some of my fellow explorers to hurt. Especially when I feel like a few minor changes to the mechanics could soften the blow considerably.
 
Normally I’m not a “traveler explorer”, but I do fall back on the style from time to time. Particularly in two situations:


  1. When I’m trying to go explore a particular area and I just want to get there. Usually this is somewhere far into deep space.
  2. When I’m on an expedition and I fall behind. This happened to me a lot on the DWE1, as I’d putter around exploring and flying off track a lot, and then come meetup time I’d have to rush my way there. It’s also why it took me over half a year and 130,000 lys to get home!

The traveler explorer style is a handy tool in that it both allows you to cover distance but also still explore along the way too. While many players use this as their main exploration style I only used it when I needed to. The new mechanics of 3.3 improve actual exploration greatly, unfortunately they also decimate traveling exploration into the ground. Traveling is still possible if you don’t explore at all, and a moderate much slower pace of traveling exploration is possible if you only half explore, but for people who enjoy the traveling exploration style as a way of life this new update is going to hurt.

I guess I just don’t want some of my fellow explorers to hurt. Especially when I feel like a few minor changes to the mechanics could soften the blow considerably.

I can tell you really like the new system, but are feeling guilty about your enjoyment because of all the people claiming they've been left behind and are seriously guilt tripping anybody who will listen. Speaking as a guy who enjoys blowing up other people as an in-game occupation, let me just give you some advice: worry more about your enjoyment and less about theirs. At the end of the day, all that really matters is how much fun YOU are having, and if these guys want to live in a world of negativity surrounding themselves with a cloud of made up problems, that's their deal, not yours. It's okay to like the new system without having to soft peddle it to spare their tender feelings.
 
I hope you dont mind if i answer this question.
ly/hr is not that important. Systems/hr is what matters. Most of us hunt rare objects and configurations and the chance to find these increases with the number of systems visited. It is the same with the lottery: more tickets you by, the bigger is the chance to win. With the new system we will spend far more time scanning totally useless (IMO) objects, which (again IMO) dont deserve even 5sec of my time. Instead of pushing forward to the next system which might be more interesting.

I get the systems/hour metric, but I specifically asked about ly/hour because that is what Mengy stated, still, point taken.

Aside from the obvious bugaboo that can ONLY be found visually that is GGG, What are some examples of rare objects and system configurations that you seek? I ask, only because I too tend to seek out rare objects and system configurations, scenic vistas, etc
 
You may not like it Mengy, but we all know us Rare-Object/Configuration hunters are screwed HARD come 3.3.

FDev has decided our gameplay style is not something they wish to allow anymore. So our choices are to find a new style, or stop exploring.

A rather crappy situation frankly.
 
I hope you dont mind if i answer this question.
ly/hr is not that important. Systems/hr is what matters. Most of us hunt rare objects and configurations and the chance to find these increases with the number of systems visited. It is the same with the lottery: more tickets you by, the bigger is the chance to win. With the new system we will spend far more time scanning totally useless (IMO) objects, which (again IMO) dont deserve even 5sec of my time. Instead of pushing forward to the next system which might be more interesting.


I see these posts on here that are like "omg its so great i can tell the system is full of icy bodys so i dont have to explore it"

What the posters fail to understand is that some of us went into those empty systems of icy bodys and found stuff that was interesting to us.

Yet again ill say it, compromise. Leave the system map alone, add all the new goodies but just leave the honk/map bit alone
 
I get the systems/hour metric, but I specifically asked about ly/hour because that is what Mengy stated, still, point taken.

Aside from the obvious bugaboo that can ONLY be found visually that is GGG, What are some examples of rare objects and system configurations that you seek? I ask, only because I too tend to seek out rare objects and system configurations, scenic vistas, etc

Few examples:

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--> this is an ELW moon orbiting a Lava planet in a planetary nebula
 
This is my own little personal dilemma: I'm finding the new mechanics fun. I'm really enjoying exploring the systems in the beta. My issue is that whereas before I could easily travel 3000 lys/hr and only stop if I happened to come across an interesting sys map, NOW I'm finding my best speed of travel is around 600 lys/hr! Or about 9-10 systems per hour. That's in a 70ly Asp X. I've done several one hour sessions to time myself and I've gotten fairly good at using the FSS but my rate of travel about the galaxy will be taking a huge hit come 3.3.
I'm somewhat surprised at your findings re time. My most recent modus operandi in the live game has been to scan all ELWs and the WWs, AWs and CFTs around the primary star. Like that I maybe average some 25 systems per hour (a bit hard to be precise since I also have to take into account manual plotting & waiting for jumponium so my actual figure is less and I have adjusted it upwards to try and take these factors into account). With the new system I seem to be averaging at least 20 systems per hour if I fully scan them all but don't map anything. So really not much difference time wise. Obviously it would be a lot fewer systems if I investigated the surface features but I quickly realised that one geyser etc is not different enough from the next to be worth flying out & landing. And I've still yet to see a surface feature in ED that doesn't appear to just be tacked onto the landscape which rather destroys the appeal.

I've just started a 11,000 LY run in which I will be in "travelling" mode where I'll only stop if the FSS shows at least a WW. If it does I'll likely scan the whole system. I'm not far into it, but so far whilst it is obviously slower than just Buckyballing (which wouldn't be any slower in its pure form), it's not massively slower than my usual travelling.

The real issue for me just comes right back to the whole concept of the FSS. Functionally, I just cannot see it as anything other than a list of objects which I am being asked to click on one after the other. Needing to tune in to the right frequency and move my joystick around doesn't alter that it is just a list at heart. The FSS knows exactly where every object is and it also knows the right frequency required to tune into it. So it really is just make work for the sake of it. For the last 4 years this sort of doing something for the sake of it has systematically been removed in the name of Quality of Life improvements which is the real reason why exploration is currently so trivial (if you really want engagement, why not go back having to surface prospect to find out what mats a planet has and only gather them 1 at a time...). And now people are wetting themselves over a massive QoL degradation. I can only assume that they find the improvement in finding surface features worth it but I do wonder how long even that can last - I never once found anything live but have already got bored of them in beta.

For me, clicking on a list of objects is just clicking on a list however it is presented. And, no, that's not fun in the slightest. I actively object to the need to move my joystick around a boring screen to do that clicking which means that I have to concentrate on the game and cannot enjoy doing other things at the same time. It doesn't add anything, just takes away the chance to do something else.

Right now, I can possibly see myself continuing to explore after 3.3 drops. It all depends on whether I can think of something worth doing. But it's going to be despite the changes rather than because of them. And for those out there who think it is all about tagging systems, prepare to be annoyed - if I continue exploring, every system I visit and a much greater percentage of planets will have my name on them...
 
Normally I’m not a “traveler explorer”, but I do fall back on the style from time to time. Particularly in two situations:


  1. When I’m trying to go explore a particular area and I just want to get there. Usually this is somewhere far into deep space.
  2. When I’m on an expedition and I fall behind. This happened to me a lot on the DWE1, as I’d putter around exploring and flying off track a lot, and then come meetup time I’d have to rush my way there. It’s also why it took me over half a year and 130,000 lys to get home!

The traveler explorer style is a handy tool in that it both allows you to cover distance but also still explore along the way too. While many players use this as their main exploration style I only used it when I needed to. The new mechanics of 3.3 improve actual exploration greatly, unfortunately they also decimate traveling exploration into the ground. Traveling is still possible if you don’t explore at all, and a moderate much slower pace of traveling exploration is possible if you only half explore, but for people who enjoy the traveling exploration style as a way of life this new update is going to hurt.

I guess I just don’t want some of my fellow explorers to hurt. Especially when I feel like a few minor changes to the mechanics could soften the blow considerably.
When you have spent a lot of time around the Bubble, as many explorers have, you might like to travel to the core because of it's unique composition of neutrons, black holes, planetary nebulae. I like exploring the core. But before I get there I have 16 KLY to go.

This is what bothers me. If going 16 KLY becomes such a chore it makes the trip useless, that would be a great loss to me. And this is also why the denominator "Traveler" goes off. To get there I have to travel, yeah. But once I'm there It's economic all the way.

I'm going to miss that [sad]
 
You know, all that really needs to be done is populating the system map from the Honk and just not make you able to lock onto the planet from that map.

Then FSS could remain exactly the same and we would still be able to do our survey at-a-glance we currently do.
 
When you have spent a lot of time around the Bubble, as many explorers have, you might like to travel to the core because of it's unique composition of neutrons, black holes, planetary nebulae. I like exploring the core. But before I get there I have 16 KLY to go.

This is what bothers me. If going 16 KLY becomes such a chore it makes the trip useless, that would be a great loss to me. And this is also why the denominator "Traveler" goes off. To get there I have to travel, yeah. But once I'm there It's economic all the way.

I'm going to miss that [sad]

With a properly outfitted ship, how long does it take to get to the core nowadays if someone is trying to make good time? My plan for exploration is going to be the same as it ever was: make all haste towards a destination until I feel I need a break from the monotony of the jump/honk/scoop routine, and then spend the next 30-60 minutes dragging my feet and examining each system I come to very carefully looking for interesting things, then get back to making progress towards my destination and keep repeating that cycle until I get where I'm going. I find that works well to keep my interest up, make decent progress in terms of "mileage" and keeps me awake and engaged on long trips. Utilizing that method, I've never noticed myself having a hard time finding interesting discoveries.
 
Forum mods don't work for FD and close threads due to uncivil behaviour. This forum has thousands of threads complaining about FDev and the game, does it look like FD closes them because they're upset?

If you are too critical about FD or the development, you will get hammered. I did.
 
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