The Planetary landing and planetside missions discussion Thread

[Patrick_68000]

The planetary landings are very very interesting. The essential thing is not to crash

 

[fluffa]

Planetary landings is a cosmetic patch job. add it maybe after FD have focused on bring Space to life, but there so far off getting the space bit correct at present. I really hope there not wasting effort on a patch job.

 

[Panzer]

I'd expect sending some of my men in fighter-bombers to provide atmospheric overwatch, while the base-ship descends to an LZ.

I'd expect to roll off the cargo ramp, clad in power armor, embarked on an APC

I'd expect to negotiate the rough terrain whilst enjoying the pristine landscape all around

And then to ravage the blue-skinned catpeople villagers with blade and bullet.

After which - to set up a basecamp protecting an automated mine and supply depot.

 

[Shark-Bait]

Just blowing up aliens would be a wasted opportunity.

And yet that's all people ever do in the movies. ;-)

My stick is bigger than your stick. lol. My boom-stick.

These things should have a real impact in the world, on trade, on politics. People could fight over them, for them, against them. Planets could be known through them, a bit like certain stations are known for selling various rares.

Haha. --Their caves are more valuable than others' caves.

Problem with many of those fractal base engines in the market today is that they are trying to simulate Earth like planets with water. We will be visiting planets with lakes of methan or molten iron. And planets that with extremly long or short rotation. Planets with volcanoes but no tectonic plates, etc. That is some major chemistry and physics issues that needs to be considered.

Actually, just as the studies into semi-chaotic structures showed and many chaos-mathematicians would prolly agree: Shortcuts. Be aware of complexity issues, but simulate that complexity using a highly refined algorithm. i.e. "Earth like", "Jupiter like" etc.

Once they are on the 'cloud', the parameters can be tweaked, which would affect every stellar body with that 'profile'. Thus, any issues or lack of realism can be stamped out in a rather time-friendly manner.

I agree with you tho.. most of the planetary bodies will not be "Earth like," and most 'lifeforms' will not be "human-like." Take us for example, as a 'race'.. we've had computers a couple decades and we're already talking (in public) about downloading our minds to them.. And you can imagine military would be 50+ years ahead of what is 'public'.

So.. it's safe to assume the 'goldilocks-zone' is a rubbish theory, useful only in terms of satisfying the human-ego towards a Universe that is open to their species migration, to 'colonize,' as they have done on this rock ball.

The reality, unfortunately for the human-ego, is that the Universe is quite a bit older than human civilization, older even than this 'ball' we call Earth. And more likely than not, a civilization a couple million years in advance, heck, --a billion years in advance, left behind the limits of their biology early on and benefited from that.

So when you look up at the Milky Way and think of 'habitable' planets out there.. expand that to include pretty much everything within a couple ls of most stellar bodies.

So yeah. It humbles a rational mind.. especially when you consider the level achieved by any civ that old. Not limited by mammalian drives for dominance, conflict. And they can say here "we stole the show" to their hearts content.. but yeah. Stole what, exactly? It's like a bacteria moving in a slightly different fashion to the other spores, and it has a bit more energy. Not quite a "steal the show" result. :-\

And then we have the whole issue of terrain and landing... If they put in mountains those regioms are off limit for actual landing, unless the ship just hovers.

I remember loading the Drop-ship from Aliens in X-Plane 7 and wow was that thing --not-- aero-dynamic! Build up any kind of speed in an Earth-dense atmosphere and wow it'd spin around like a frisby.

So yeah.. some of the aircraft may not actually be tuned for atmospheric travel. Especially since their engines are so powerful. I'm not sure how the shields would affect air-flow around the craft.

I would really like to enjoy the atmospheric entry with lots of turbulence shaking, heat, fire, fire alarms etc.. All this with an amazing scary sound.

And all the fun that goes with it.

This would happen while the scenery is loading, separating space from ground. Once stabilized in atmosphere, we initialize navigation process to wherever waypoint already marked in your GPS. Cities, mines, bases..

I like the idea.. but you're threading on 'real' flight-sim areas. Atmospheric interaction, gravity, drag. This explains a lot of the 'hostile' responses to this idea.

I think it'd be frickin' awesome tho.

What I would like:

Procedural creatures you can capture and sell.

Xeno-biological inter-stellar slavery. I see.

Plants also.

Now what did the xeno-fauna ever do to Lucy?

When walking around ships is introduced, I'd like to be able to visit captured aliens in the ships containment area.

Dishonored - The Golden Cat - Art Dealer
www.youtube.com/watch?v=rOHbk6pSUwg​

Certainly, accurate movements of skeletons are being created using software to process the most likely movements.. or less-likely movements. So even if you create a planet with more mass and create some crazy skeletons (for animation).. you could probably just group the different movement animations into classes.

You could even group certain joint-structures so you could stick em together (with magical digital glue) and create amalgamations of creatures to your heart's content.. but that isn't quite for this game.

Though.. if the devs take advantage of those generic animations, some which are released by academic institutions, perhaps they could utilize them for a discount with their own in-game skeleton / models.

Bi-pedal, quadru-pedal, hexapeds, millipeds. lol. All to be destroyed to your primitive satisfaction.

Walking With Lucy | California Academy of Sciences​

I kindly direct you to her "small brain case." er.. 'container'.


Dinosaur-Walk Study Using 3D Imaging

Ceratopsian Forelimb Carriage and Locomotion Study Using the Vagaceratops irvinensis (CMN 41357) Model

This award-winning scientific animation shows three proposed walking postures of the dinosaur Vagaceratops irvinensis.​

Dinosaur locomotion: beyond the bones
www.rvc.ac.uk/research/research-centres-and-facilities/structure-and-motion/projects/dinosaur-locomotion-beyond-the-bones


Rigging with Skeletons
courses.cs.washington.edu/courses/cse458/08au/projects/project6/rigSkel.html​

Palaeontology: Dinosaur locomotion - scientists at the wheel

Scientific theory combines with Hollywood wizardry to bring dinosaurs to life in a News and Views feature in the 16 March 2006 edition of Nature. In films, dinosaur locomotion is a result of clever software and the artistic interpretation of special effects departments.

Now scientists are using improved software tools that have a firm grounding in physical principles, rather than artistic intuition, to test their own hypotheses on how dinosaurs walked the Earth.

John Hutchinson and Stephen Gatesy present a Tyrannosaurus rex case study of how to use modern computer tools to reconstruct dinosaur movement. They focus on the problems of determining the position of the limbs - its pose - at specific instants during a stride.

By using combinations of motion-based and force-based criteria, the authors are able to filter out unlikely or impossible poses and establish a motion 'starting point'.

From : www.rvc.ac.uk/research/research-centres-and-facilities/structure-and-motion/projects/dinosaur-locomotion-beyond-the-bones#tab-press-release​

 

[M00ka]

I'd expect sending some of my men in fighter-bombers to provide atmospheric overwatch, while the base-ship descends to an LZ.

I'd expect to roll off the cargo ramp, clad in power armor, embarked on an APC

I'd expect to negotiate the rough terrain whilst enjoying the pristine landscape all around

And then to ravage the blue-skinned catpeople villagers with blade and bullet.

After which - to set up a basecamp protecting an automated mine and supply depot.

.
Wasn't that Battlefield 2142 - except for the blue skinned catpeople bit ....

 

[Panzer]

Yeah, but the point of bf2142 was to fight and win against an equal, opposing team. Here, I'd like to think the point is rolling with a bunch of like-minded maniacs, getting rich and prosperous while doing fun things in space or planetside.

 

[Udayana]

Hopefully it doesn't follow the suit of other console ports where it takes 6 months to a year to get ported! (Like Terraria and Minecraft updates, or Payday 2 updates. I mean, the last Minecraft update took like 8 months, and only added night time sensors and colored glass lmao.)

if they ever get to work on planetary landing, i'd say a year with big cuts here and there on features. 5 years later, i bet that minecraft still has a lot more content.
so don't expect that you can do anything useful on that planet.

I'm not being negative or so, just keep your expectation low, and let them surprise you for a change. Works better for me than dreaming and imagining things i could do on a planet just to find 5 types of rock scattered procedurally across the planet

 

[Herik]

My guesstimate?

Around Christmas this year.

Your right Tinman (the first phase). It's this sort of stuff in the game that has me so stoked! ...The other thing, almost as important is comprehensive Tier 2 NPC's.

All in all massive content immersion creation.

 

[kamu]

16 December 2015

 

[Herik]

To be honest I've heard rumours that it is the gamecon announcement and *may* be here in time to boost December and Christmas sales. However, I have no idea how well informed/misinformed these rumours are.
From the older Dev Diaries on youtube it sounds like flying and landing around planets can be easily done in game, the problem is putting interesting stuff in there instead of having different coloured skyboxes.

If I had to do it I'd be looking at a staggered release: Walking around your own ship -> Walking around stations -> Atmosphere flight -> Landing (docking style) on planets -> Fully functional planet landing.

That gives them time to troubleshoot the walking and stuff whilst being able to have another team creating cities, mountains, hurricanes and other content for when landing finally arrives. Not sure though, all speculation.
My personal guess is that we will see passenger missions and the Dolphin/Beluga introduced this year as well as other tweaks and the paid expansions will be introduced next year.

I can't see planet landings coming in this year, I mean imagine all the meshes and textures required to create a reasonably realistic city that the procedural generation system can deal with. If you need 50 buildings to make it feel unique and each building takes the team a day to complete that'd take the whole team 2 months to complete with a 5 day working week, then think about making it all work, bugshooting, getting it to generate in the right places at the right time clipping issues, lighting etc etc.
Would be great but to do it properly I'd say next year.

Alex Brentnall, I suspect you just did not hear of this; -several months ago (almost a year), DB mentioned in an interview, (phasing) planet landings. Specifically the first probably being landings on airless moons, rocky airless planetoids, and the like.

Evidently atmosphere, its turbulence and types will take some work...

 

[Herik]

Highly complicated to implement and more or less worthless unless we can then walk about which is even more difficult to implement. So way, way, way in the future.

Probably useless for some, and fantastic excitement and hope for others. For me, give us airless moons to begin with or cockpit walking (which ever is first). I will be so 'stoked' !

 

[Arindor]

My guesstimate?

Around Christmas this year.

I love your optimism! It's a more likely time-frame TBH. Fingers crossed!!

 

[Hell Razor5543]

Oops, I meant 31st September.

*raises hand* what year is september?

How many days has September got in it?

 

[Quineloe]

Several games and countless demos imply otherwise.

Millions of completely unique worlds in full 3D detail? Name one game.

 

[Obsidian Ant]

Millions of completely unique worlds in full 3D detail? Name one game.

No Man's Sky
Space Engine

 

[Scudmungus]

Mi wantin to post long correction to assumptions an misconception bout procedural generating content fah gamin.

But no - betta aal educate selves.

It not bein magic. Assets still gotta be made, component bein ready for callin. No man an Space Eng showin environ an world - but assets still needin baseline to tamper wid to be makin illusion of complexity an variety. An dat be limited at best - only stretch an re-color so much! Tinker here, tweakin dere! No man gonna only as varied as de asset library it bein buit upon an de quality de tool be mixin it aal up. Terrarin wi can be makin, no worries. Wi be doin dat for many years now. Yes ickle problem wid makin textures to line up an blend pretty an ickle bits ok. Aal gud. But 3d assets? Animation fah asset? Sound fah asset? Maybi yuh wantin to procedually generate rig an texture an skin de model an animate an..

HA!

Procedual generation not bein magic. Needin much more to be makin many many many worlds, populated, convincin. Uncanny valley be more dan just applicable to makin tings look human. Also apply to worlds, environments!

..an dis notin to wid wot makin a game.. game - gameplay! Gud luck wid usin procedural generation fah dat

 

[CMDR Nef]

No Man's Sky
Space Engine

Because of NDA I can't really specify, but Space Engineers is soon to be one.

 

[Senex VII]

No Man's Sky
Space Engine

Yup. OK with Space Engine there are no planetary lifeforms as yet, but this is just one guy developing it. But it's addictive and, yes, it does create countless procedurally generated worlds in full 3D detail. AND... you're not just limited to this galaxy. Flying around the universe and landing on planets is more fun than Powerplay, believe me. And it's free.

Anyway, back to the original question...

My prediction: planetary landings will appear in Elite just in time to try and head off a major haemorrhage to NMS, so it's co-dependent on NMS's release date.

BONUS: Space Engine pics I took the other day = approach to and landing on random planet, within a nebula and close to a globular cluster...

 

[Vitalii Magnov]

Shark-Bait, you are a funny living being.

http://edition.cnn.com/2015/07/13/architecture/eco-capsule-nice-architects/index.html?sr=cnnitw

 

[etien]

The planetary landings expansion is what I am looking forward to the most.
However, I feel that there could be much more to do 'in space' first to make it more interesting and more believable. Here are a few ideas.....

1. Secret asteroid bases
2. Huge cities in space ( a bit like the CQC add on but bigger)
3. Comets (I know they are there but they haven't been switched ON yet)
4. A science class ship with spectrometer and other equipment on board.
5. People inside space stations doing repairs, welding, loading etc.

I am sure that some of you have other idea's too.

fully agree

regarding planet landing, i would love some decent atmospheric entry ( warm up , runway) and exit ( shuttle like with side powder booster needed? ) done, it should not be trivial to exit an earth like planet. clouds should be modeled too.