The Planetary landing and planetside missions discussion Thread

[Araviel]

There's nothing 'un-calm' about it. My opinion is the Elite: Dangerous community isn't exactly the brightest lamp in the street, in general.

Deal with that opinion. It's also a fallacy that insulting people somehow lessens one's arguments.

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I never alluded to the fact that it is easy; but you may have noticed we're dealing with expert programmers and game designers here.

If No Man's Sky can do it like it has, then I'm pretty damn sure Frontier can better it.

Believe me i have noticed, DB has been like a god for me since i was a kid and one of the reasons i started trying to make my own games and got into game modding
and i am sure FD could do a better job. i just wanted to lift up the scope of such a project to make you appreciate it more, and possible also question the time frame needed to complete it. (no mans sky was in development for over? 5 years)

one thing in particular that you did not seem to grasp when you mentioned the old Elite games was all the artwork that is needed, today even procedural created worlds needs artists to create the building blocks which is a very time consuming task.
let me illustrate whit a qoute from the NMS wiki:

Most of the universe in No Man's Sky is procedurally-generated, including solar systems, planets, flora and fauna on these planets, and artificial structures like buildings and spacecraft. The development team developed a procedural generation system where they would first hand-create core structures and the art associated with those - such as a basic skeleton and skin for a creature - and then allow the algorithm to make randomized changes to that, as to make a wide variety of creatures, mimicking the diversity of species resulting from evolution on Earth. They made sure the elements of this generation process reflected the setting - creatures and plants inhabiting a planet that contained blue-colored minerals would be tinted blue as well. To assure that the procedural generation worked well, the development team created the in-game equivalent of automated probes to visit the various planets and take images to review, allowing for some tweaks to be made by human developers

this could possible get refined further, for example there are methods to procedurally generate textures from a simple seed. but whit todays technology there is no way to get around using handcrafted building blocks all together, and when we are also asking for realism​ we are adding another difficult level.

 

[TorTorden_VR]

that wont help you if you get eaten by a wild animal, take a rocket to you head, or have a boulder land on you however. this is why I think it is better (though i agree maybe not perfect) to have crew do it and us control them.

I like the remote controlled android option however... you could put on a VR headset in your ship to control it i guess.

(a VR headset to put on ingame on top of the vr headset i use in real life )

I figured the space helmet you are already wearing could become and opaque vr screen, since we are wearing that already
It of course wouldn't be an either or, there would be hardly any other technical ground work different from this and regular walking around, but as for gameplay mechanics it could open up a lot of new features, be another money sink.

Besides, it just makes more sense to send an android out into the wilds on a planet with toxic atmosphere, 3g and an average temp of say 600k. No matter the amount of 'magical' tech in your suit it just makes more sense to do your scouting remotely.
Especially when we add in the possibility of a random thug (possible me) coming around and just blowing up your ship for pics and giggles.

But if you happen to find an earth like, no reason we couldnt go for a personal hike, swim or whatever.

 

[AluminumAlloy]

If FD does pledge upon adding an expansion that has planetary landing, I wouldn't mind paying $80-something for it.

So...why do some people not want it to be added, anyways? It's going to be paid-for, so they should know they don't have to buy it if they don't want it.

 

[Alien]

I just had a thought, and came to a revelation, and it's bad news for Elite Dangerous players

Let me use building my PC as an analogy. I want to build a PC and there's an order to getting the parts. First I buy the case, so that all the other parts fit into it. Then the motherboard. After that, I go for the most expensive parts first and the cheapest parts last. This is my shopping method, yours may be different, there is no wrong way with what I described so far, as I won't put the PC together until I have everything.

So, how does that relate to Elite Dangerous? Think of the basic game as the case. You need that first to fit all the other parts into. Now think of the two expansions we know of, EVA and SPL (walking around and landing on planets) as the motherboard. Now think of all the little stuff from big updates like PowerPlay to stuff like being able to name your ship as all the other stuff you need to build a PC, in order of cost.

Frontier has got their case (the game), left the motherboard (expansions) until later and are getting the smaller stuff (updates) first.

We, the players, will never get the expansions. It makes no sense to make the game, then make all this fluff like PowerPlay, THEN try to make two expansions work with all that. The most sensible way would be to make the basic game, get the expansions to work with it, THEN get the smaller stuff to work like PowerPlay.

At some point, I think Frontier will announce to us players something like "We wanted to implement planetary landings, but we couldn't get it to work with everything else we've already added to the game". Think I'm exaggerating? This is exactly what they said about single-player offline.

Michael, please tell me I'm wrong.

 

[Winterwalker]

Alien .. lol .. try to get close to a planet, the area is closed off, a reserved volume ..
or you'd be able to fly right through it.

You're right though OP .. planet landings .. yes please, but "done well" as DBOBE has stated.

And with a fair wind, mark my words, it will be.

 

[Karakhian]

For those who are wondering what was said three years ago during the Kickstarter about planetary landings, etc, and when to expect them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EM0Gcl7iUM8

I'm happy to wait. It was made clear from day one that this would be a later expansion. I'm expecting about a year after first release for the first paid expansion - that seems to be about normal for paid expansions in most games.

 

[[VR] Mad Mike]

now the weak current gen console will be getting there slice i doubt we will see that happen....there will be some excuse because there sheep boxes have restricted parts inside.

.

come off it!. Yes I was as dissapointed as the next gamer when I saw the "weak sauce" specs of the "next gen" consoles but they are more than capable of producing ANY game you can do on even the highest end pc, albeit with reduced graphical fidelity....... and the proof, if you have not seen it already in games already out on the consoles is below.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fkg5UVTsKCE
http://www.hourences.com/thesolusproject/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQM8yWoiy5s

 

[TorTorden_VR]

At some point, I think Frontier will announce to us players something like "We wanted to implement planetary landings, but we couldn't get it to work with everything else we've already added to the game". Think I'm exaggerating? This is exactly what they said about single-player offline.

Michael, please tell me I'm wrong.

Your are probably wrong about the result, but spot on with the point.
If they where going to say this, then they should have said it a long time ago, preferably before power play..

But since so much of ED at this time feel like a core gamplay with extra mini games tacked on it I doubt they will.
FD could probably spend the next three years simply bug hunting and tweaking game play to make it feel less disjointed but as it stands, there is a great core system, engine, graphics, and the flight system and the rest feel almost like mini-game features that has crept in, given a primary coat of paint and shoved out the door.
And thus needing a lot of attention post launch.

Granted I can see how FD might feel a little rushed to flesh it out as they are trying to expand player base, particularly with the xbone launch etc, and postponing PP as it ideally should have been would probably but a crimper on the xbone launch, something that would probably have large financial ramifications due to missing deadlines etc.

I wouldn't mind seeing paid expansions, but I hope they don't forget to fix and adjust the core gameplay as well, but so far I'm feeling somewhat optimistic.
It's just taking a while, if I disregard most new features in PP, it's largely taken the core game to a better place, although when it launched it almost broke the game completely so i didn't bother playing for a week the last few patches has helped a lot.

 

[Han_Zen]

Alien .. lol .. try to get close to a planet, the area is closed off, a reserved volume ..
or you'd be able to fly right through it.

You're right though OP .. planet landings .. yes please, but "done well" as DBOBE has stated.

And with a fair wind, mark my words, it will be.

There is a video on YouTube of a guy flying to the surface of a planet. Takes a long time, since you can not Super Cruise. The surface looked quite good.

 

[Alien]

Your are probably wrong about the result, but spot on with the point.
If they where going to say this, then they should have said it a long time ago, preferably before power play..

I hope I am the most wrong I've ever been about the result. Time will tell.

 

[FuzzySpider]

For those who are wondering what was said three years ago during the Kickstarter about planetary landings, etc, and when to expect them:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EM0Gcl7iUM8

I'm happy to wait. It was made clear from day one that this would be a later expansion. I'm expecting about a year after first release for the first paid expansion - that seems to be about normal for paid expansions in most games.

The problem is this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7trmEmI5Js

Or this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efeq_9XwU7s

Or even this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiT6EAehctY

NEVER believe game development blurbs. Even if the person in front of you is being sincere there is a tendancy for other events to kick in and prevent the finished product from matching the promises made.

 

[Karakhian]

The problem is this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B7trmEmI5Js

Or this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=efeq_9XwU7s

Or even this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZiT6EAehctY

NEVER believe game development blurbs. Even if the person in front of you is being sincere there is a tendancy for other events to kick in and prevent the finished product from matching the promises made.

Are you trying to imply that Elite is going down the same road? (though Skyrim is an odd example to use - a lot of people consider that now, once the early bugs have been fixed, it is a great game).

All right, so you are speculating. On the basis of what?

My point was that there are people actually categorically stating that planetary landing will never happen - adopting poses of jaded cynicism and declaring that features of the game have been 'cut'.

This is ridiculous. The game hasn't even had its first paid expansion released yet. Despite them stating clearly three years ago that these features would not be in at release, that they would be paid expansions and it would take time to implement them after release, people have started throwing their arms in the air that it hasn't been released yet, and taking this as evidence that it will never be released.

We're six months in. I'm expecting the first paid expansion to be about a year afterwards. That's about normal for games nowadays.

What is actually meant is, "I'm tired of waiting. I'm impatient. I want it now. Don't work on anything else. Work on what I want. If you don't, I'll claim you lied and that you've cut those features from the game."

I doubt that's going to improve Frontier's desire to deliver. I think I'll just wait and see.

 

[HoshiQaVam]

Planetary landings would/will kill this game.

This is the typically development-ignorant post that always gets made to any new addition to any game, and its one of my pet peeves.

"Fix bugs, don't make more content".

Stupid attitude, and pretty irrelevant given that the group of developers that are building expansions for Elite are not the same group of developers that are working on/fixing the core game.

Believe it or not even a company as small as Frontier can do more than one thing at a time.

 

[Lycon]

I wonder is SC will be released first or planetary landing in E

 

[FuzzySpider]

Are you trying to imply that Elite is going down the same road? (though Skyrim is an odd example to use - a lot of people consider that now, once the early bugs have been fixed, it is a great game).

I'm trying to imply that you DON'T pay much attention to what has been said about a game so early in development.

 

[Alien]

This is ridiculous. The game hasn't even had its first paid expansion released yet. Despite them stating clearly three years ago that these features would not be in at release, that they would be paid expansions and it would take time to implement them after release, people have started throwing their arms in the air that it hasn't been released yet, and taking this as evidence that it will never be released.

We're six months in. I'm expecting the first paid expansion to be about a year afterwards. That's about normal for games nowadays.

What is actually meant is, "I'm tired of waiting. I'm impatient. I want it now. Don't work on anything else. Work on what I want. If you don't, I'll claim you lied and that you've cut those features from the game."

I doubt that's going to improve Frontier's desire to deliver. I think I'll just wait and see.

It was January 2013 the kickstarter ended, so that's two and a half years to develop the expansions. In all that time they've said nothing about the expansions, it's us lot on here that keep going on about them. I'd love nothing more than for Michael to post anywhere on this forum, that the expansions will happen. I want to be proven wrong.

And I'm sorry but Frontier have lied to us. It's not a baseless accusation, it's a fact. They have also cut features from the game, see the DDF archive, those were Frontier's own proposals, and where are those features now?

 

[FuzzySpider]

And I'm sorry but Frontier have lied to us. It's not a baseless accusation, it's a fact. They have also cut features from the game, see the DDF archive, those were Frontier's own proposals, and where are those features now?

Lying implies intent. I love you Alien, but I must humbly disagree with you here. I think they sincerely intended, when they started out, to deliver on the things in the DDF archive and build this living, breathing universe.

But something went wrong somewhere. Maybe they just couldn't? Maybe they need a bigger team? More experienced developers? Or maybe the engine they are using just can't manage it?

For whatever reason, those plans do seem to have been abandoned. I agree with you there. We need them to be honest about it if that's the case, and to be forthcoming and tell us. I'm REALLY tempted to ask a moderator to move this thread over here.

 

[Philip Coutts]

It is interesting to note that Frontier have been silent on the paid for expansions, i.e. walking around and planetary landings. Now given these were part of the kickstarter I would have expected them to be giving some form of updates. Hey, maybe they could have added something to the newsletters now and then because to be honest they have been getting more devoid of actual news as the weeks have gone by. But we have heard nothing. Now that's maybe not so surprising because we know Frontier's PR and communication is next to non-existent but it is worrying. I still expect to see the paid expansions in time but I am now very very cautious about anything Frontier say. For me (and I'm sorry to say this) the trust has completely gone.

 

[stevesideas]

Not to mention most people asking for this feature have no concept of what it will take to implement let alone what exactly are you going to do once you land on said planet? Look around? A pointless feature in and of itself and to expand upon the idea and actually have the feature give some sort of value would basically entail creating a whole new game. This isnt SC, elite isnt a module based game in structure.

I think 100% of FD would disagree...probably a fair amount of the ED community also.

 

[CMDRKNac]

What we need is for them to finish the game. Stop asking for more fluff and unfinished features please. We didn't need more new mini-games and they go and add a complete new parallel game on top of ED. awesome (/sarc).

Flesh out the freaking game and add features and content to the current existing frameworks. Connect the dots and make the universe alive. I can think in 1 minute about 10 features that could be added to PP to make it better.


I don't want/need planetary landing, walking in stations/ships, fluff, parallel WarThudner wannabe, etc. I want a complete and coherent/consistent game universe where I can immerse myself and with others while trying to achieve something (beyond grinding credits) while having good mechanics (certainly not hauling contracts from A to B).