Contemplating covert dominance, thinking out loud. Chime in if you have any ideas:

I still think an important key is figuring out this 'covert dominance'. Assuming these parts of the myth are true and someone(s) already found Raxxla:
Raxxla also plays a role in several conspiracy theories, most of which attest that it has already been discovered by some kind of sinister cabal (or sole tyrant), which has leveraged its power to establish covert dominance over humanity.
'Because there are people on Raxxla already. This is only a guess, mind you, but from what happened to Jason I'd say it was close to being right. We've long suspected that a corps of Elites lives there, and are exploiting the gateway. They're powerful, twisted men. Powerful enough to hire an assassin to kill the threat to their dominance.'

My assumption is that these people (person) already know the 'path' to Raxxla so they can obviously guard it. I assume Jason Ryder was killed because he set foot (metaphorically) on that path directly - as in, he definitely had found something, rather than the many who are hunting and haven't found anything.

How long has this covert dominance been happening?​

Part of the issue is knowing when this group or individual started to leverage Raxxla. If we assume TDW is semi-factual (in that Jason was assassinated for getting too close), then we know this covert domination has been in place for at least 2-300-ish years? at least (could have been much, much longer).

However, until 2800 there wasn't really private ship ownership in the way we understand it now, and of course hyperdrive was more limited. So prior to that the opportunities for people to find Raxxla significantly reduce the further back in time you go, by pure function of fewer ships, costing more, travelling less.

Covert?​

Of course, "covert" is the real kicker here. If it's truly covert, how would we know at all? We know there are several candidate groups. Certainly they all leverage extreme power, but the most powerful seem fairly benign (PF, UC, The Club) and the ones that are less benign seem far less covert (Feds/Imps/Sirius/Salvation, etc.).

And consider that for anyone or any group to dominate humanity, they'd have to control all the other folks that want to do the same. So, to truly dominate humanity you'd have to influence all three superpowers, Sirius, the Kumo crew, the Utopians, the Dredger Clans, Colonia, all the independent factions and pilots (like us), all at the same time, and do it all without being found out by the masses.

What could Raxxla possibly offer that could leverage power over the diverse factions of humanity?

Maybe the myth is exaggerated?

Why dominate at all?​

I've also been wondering why? Why dominate humanity? What's the purpose of that?
  • To make money? - how much and for whom? Why covertly then? Why not start a corporation like Sirius if wealth is the goal?
  • Ideology? - believing that they can lead humanity to a better future? We don't see any specific leaning towards any particular ideology in 3310 though? Except maybe war...
  • Protection? - believing that humanity needs to be protected from something? Or something needs protecting from us?

...Raxxla is actually bad?:​

Thinking about this has made me lean much more towards the idea that Raxxla is extremely dangerous, and some other group is trying to protect us from it. Given that the Thargoids are already here, and we're very handily defeating them at every turn, it seems unlikely to me that the Thargoids are this danger.

This made me think about the idea that maybe the 'Siren of the deepest Void' is a trap (as the name suggests); Although Raxxla is an amazing treasure with massive potential, it's also incredibly dangerous and whoever found it first realised that it could entirely destroy humanity, so they have to protect it and stop others finding it. This I feel fits with the Lovecraftian themes that Brookes liked too.

I can see how "covert dominance" is necessary in order to fulfil this goal, and maybe to help guide humanity to become strong enough to defeat whatever it is (like the God-Emperor of Dune's Golden Path).

I like the idea that something is calling for us to find Raxxla, and something/someone else is trying to stop us falling into the trap. There's some delicious irony that they can't just tell us to steer clear of it either, since humanity would absolutely ignore such a warning and fall into the trap anyway.
 
I suspect almost every part of the Codex has relevance and meaning. To inject red-herring is counterproductive, especially if the text is so allegorical. The potential for such double standards only raises suspicion, and stops us focusing upon the correct path.

Much of the ‘mystery’ I suspect was altered, during the dropping of the DW missions, I suspect the Codex was brought in to tie it all together neatly.

I think the absence of whatever context the missions held, or ultimately lead to being injected, have made this puzzle ultimately muddy.

So I do suspect, that given our evidence identification so far that it likely is in the bubble, for it to be ‘lost’ for so long, there has to be some element of disguise involved.

The comment made by Drew a few posts ago - quoted by a Cmdr, may have some weight if it can be identified as true and directly linked to Raxxla or just indirect knowledge of another mystery. For to ‘hide’ something in game, the only applicable mechanism would be via Factions… but which factions, and how many are involved, and how much interaction is needed…

If it’s not factions, then it’s either just floating around…. Or on a moon… or in a belt… or really far out of the orbital line… or just dark and not registering on the scanners… we simply don’t know.

But if we can identify the ‘area’ of influence; we ought to then take into consideration ‘everything’ in that finite zone. Eg what is the lore in that area, who are the core factions etc.

So yes I feel every aspect of the Codex has direct relevance.
 
Difficult to know.

Is Raxxla physical, if so exploration ought to be enough - you assess the general location and apply brute force.

But if there is some sole tyrant or cabal, it makes it more difficult, because they would be hidden by default… unless they are not (it’s a game).

I think the Codex is giving us direct landmark clues. And I suspect every aspect is intentional, that its function is to draw our focus, and that if it’s hidden - behind a faction, that clue logically ought to be in the Codex and evident in game, or have some allegorical wider meaning?

Again, difficult to assess - personally I think it’s too wide presently - but if we can figure out certain segments then our confidence might grow about ‘where’ to look, I think whatever presents itself then ought to stick out, and possibly make sense?

Who knows…maybe it doesn’t make sense… maybe it’s simpler than all that
 
Last edited:
I think it is certainly worth considering the question of what Raxxla might be used for and might have been used for in the past. Why it was used is also a reasonable question.

This has come up before in the thread (e.g. mention of key technologies being developed, like hyperspace and AI) but despite efforts to keep Raxxla secret, I think that whenever it is used there is a risk of it being discovered.

If Raxxla is so powerful that an individual or group that controls access to it is able to exert some level of control over the development of our civilisation, then it is not being used every day. We see the daily influences in Galnet and in the faction states of our system maps. Raxxla does not need to be invoked to explain a system being flipped to a different power/superpower/government type. It does not need to be invoked to explain the results of the Federal elections, or the Ascension of Arissa Lavigny-Duval.

So what cannot be explained by any means other than Raxxla? Whenever you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.

Possible candidates:
Hyperspace technology. We've been using it for about a thousand years and still do not really understand how it works or what hyperspace is. A prime case for external influence.
AI. Some were created and then banned and the technology is now strictly controlled - but it has been done since, with Project Thunderchild and Unit 1. Raxxla could have provided an initial technological leap but if it can be done by a covert Galcop research group, then I do not think it is necessary.
I vaguely remember something in the lore about an entire fleet disappearing. That could be Raxxla and not much else - even a misjump would have only taken out one ship and its nearest neighbours.
?? Not easy to think of anything else that cannot be done without it.

Possible uses:
Fast transportation. We can get anywhere in the Milky Way within 48 hours with current technology but this is very new. (Permit locks also apply).
Summoning. Like the Shadows of Babylon 5, if you want a fleet destroyed or some nosy investigator in a big ship with an escort wiped out, it can be done. Just name a target.
Technological innovation. Want to stay ahead of your rivals, or create a whole new field for development? Accidental discoveries happen all the time. No one needs to know how they work - just shut up and let the glowing blue gizmo in the CPU do the math!

Possible traces:
Unconventional travel methods might leave unusual wakes or signal sources at the entry/exit points, possibly for more extended periods than our own hyperspace wakes.
Distortion or disruption of comms signals might lead to people hearing unusual things, or experiencing behavioural changes due to subliminal influences.
Other things, such as viruses or other dangerous micro-organisms and unknown or rare radiation signatures that disrupt navigation systems, might be present in its vicinity. It might be dangerous to jump to or from Raxxla and it has to be reached by travelling for a long period in supercruise or normal space.

So what leads does this give us:
Shamash and Nefertem (behavioural changes due to comms signals)
Halsey (found in Azaleach), Gan Romero (hearing things and being lured into deep space) (entirely plausible that Raxxla might use - or even have inspired - Guardians technology) and the Landscape Signal
If Raxxla is behind the development of hyperspace then it limits how close to Sol it can be.
Generation Ships lost to contagious diseases with a space-based origin.
Fleet disappearances
??

I agree that Raxxla is dangerous: Lovecraftian in risk of use. An 'Outside Context Problem'.
Still, there are a trillion galaxies in the Universe. I think we can afford to blow up one for the sake of a good story! ;)
 
Contemplating covert dominance, thinking out loud. Chime in if you have any ideas:

I still think an important key is figuring out this 'covert dominance'. Assuming these parts of the myth are true and someone(s) already found Raxxla:



My assumption is that these people (person) already know the 'path' to Raxxla so they can obviously guard it. I assume Jason Ryder was killed because he set foot (metaphorically) on that path directly - as in, he definitely had found something, rather than the many who are hunting and haven't found anything.

How long has this covert dominance been happening?​

Part of the issue is knowing when this group or individual started to leverage Raxxla. If we assume TDW is semi-factual (in that Jason was assassinated for getting too close), then we know this covert domination has been in place for at least 2-300-ish years? at least (could have been much, much longer).

However, until 2800 there wasn't really private ship ownership in the way we understand it now, and of course hyperdrive was more limited. So prior to that the opportunities for people to find Raxxla significantly reduce the further back in time you go, by pure function of fewer ships, costing more, travelling less.

Covert?​

Of course, "covert" is the real kicker here. If it's truly covert, how would we know at all? We know there are several candidate groups. Certainly they all leverage extreme power, but the most powerful seem fairly benign (PF, UC, The Club) and the ones that are less benign seem far less covert (Feds/Imps/Sirius/Salvation, etc.).

And consider that for anyone or any group to dominate humanity, they'd have to control all the other folks that want to do the same. So, to truly dominate humanity you'd have to influence all three superpowers, Sirius, the Kumo crew, the Utopians, the Dredger Clans, Colonia, all the independent factions and pilots (like us), all at the same time, and do it all without being found out by the masses.

What could Raxxla possibly offer that could leverage power over the diverse factions of humanity?

Maybe the myth is exaggerated?

Why dominate at all?​

I've also been wondering why? Why dominate humanity? What's the purpose of that?
  • To make money? - how much and for whom? Why covertly then? Why not start a corporation like Sirius if wealth is the goal?
  • Ideology? - believing that they can lead humanity to a better future? We don't see any specific leaning towards any particular ideology in 3310 though? Except maybe war...
  • Protection? - believing that humanity needs to be protected from something? Or something needs protecting from us?

...Raxxla is actually bad?:​

Thinking about this has made me lean much more towards the idea that Raxxla is extremely dangerous, and some other group is trying to protect us from it. Given that the Thargoids are already here, and we're very handily defeating them at every turn, it seems unlikely to me that the Thargoids are this danger.

This made me think about the idea that maybe the 'Siren of the deepest Void' is a trap (as the name suggests); Although Raxxla is an amazing treasure with massive potential, it's also incredibly dangerous and whoever found it first realised that it could entirely destroy humanity, so they have to protect it and stop others finding it. This I feel fits with the Lovecraftian themes that Brookes liked too.

I can see how "covert dominance" is necessary in order to fulfil this goal, and maybe to help guide humanity to become strong enough to defeat whatever it is (like the God-Emperor of Dune's Golden Path).

I like the idea that something is calling for us to find Raxxla, and something/someone else is trying to stop us falling into the trap. There's some delicious irony that they can't just tell us to steer clear of it either, since humanity would absolutely ignore such a warning and fall into the trap anyway.
'covert dominance' - can you name one character in game who is a ruling member of the Pilot's Federation?

What dominance do they have other than controlling bounties, where you can go, Galnet, Markets, etc? :unsure:

And even more secretive is the Elite Federation of Pilots, I would tell you more being Elite but I don't want to disappear or be hex edited! ;)

and obviously TDW being the most infamous clique... too...

Do they know where Raxxla is or what it is and stopping you from simply looking it up in the Gal map and jumping there?

just a thought... :unsure:
 
I think it is certainly worth considering the question of what Raxxla might be used for and might have been used for in the past. Why it was used is also a reasonable question.
To consider what Raxxla might be used for first you must know what Raxxla is... and we don't know according to DB ;)

As the only bonafide in-game clue/source that we know of "the Codex" (If you believe it... and please excuse me all those who consider historic lore, literature, mythology, etc as valid - just as valid an assumption in my opinion, which I also explore from time to time.....) unless I've missed something Raxxla would be:

1. A definite place that holds a mysterious secret - well good luck with that one as it could be anything!
2. Raxxla contains an alien artefact called the Omphalos Rift, which acts as a gateway to parallel universes. - Travel and probably a face to face with Thargoids, Guardian AI or just a weird version of ourselves (Starfield replay joke!) :ROFLMAO:
3. An unremarkable moon - nothing? How disappointing...
4. A state of cosmic enlightenment - you'll feel happier!
5. A place that has already been discovered by either a sinister cabal or a lone individual who has harnessed Raxxla's power to become the shadow ruler of all of humanity. - Mmm... what power and how? allowing you to jump between systems, propaganda (Galnet?), control markets, pay you to do large scale missions, etc.... Damn you PF! ;)

just a thought... :unsure:
 
Last edited:
From my FD quotes thread (see signature):

MB: DJTruthsayer [TIQ] Michael Brookes Lore interview 14May2016
player.twitch.tv/?volume=0.8&video=v66487974&time=1h40m30s
01:40:45 DJT: We put the first question in as a joke, I’m astounded you’re going to answer. MB: Well, you're assuming you’ll get a sensible answer...DJT: Where is Raxxla? MB: Where is Raxxla? ”Well, It's in the Milky Way, but I can't tell you where at this stage, it's a journey that everyone has to travel for themselves". DJT: You have always said there will be no clues. MB: "that is true, but I think you have to make some of it a tiny little bit obvious just so that people know what they are doing, there is nothing to be revealed at this stage"

He said Raxxla is in the Milky Way; I don't think he ever said anything about a gateway to Raxxla, the only source for that is the Codex mention of an Omphalos Rift:

"Several versions of the Raxxla story mention an alien artefact, the Omphalos Rift, described as a gateway or tunnel through which parallel universes can be accessed. These details, however, were later shown to bear a striking resemblance to the children's story Princess Astrophel and the Spiralling Stars, and soon lost credibility. Undaunted, some Raxxla seekers insisted that the story's author had cunningly concealed facts about the mysterious locale in his book as hints for those with eyes to see."

So the Rift is not definite, only some versions of the Raxxla story mention it, and if you assume it is true what then is Raxxla and how does it relate to the OR? So the OR may either be total obfuscation or should be interpreted as part of the children's story "clue" which we don't understand...Astrophil & Stella AFAIK doesn't mention an Omphalos, nor does Elite Legacy (either as part of the main story or as part of the children's story that was Julia's sole possession growing up).
 
If it’s not factions, then it’s either just floating around…. Or on a moon… or in a belt… or really far out of the orbital line… or just dark and not registering on the scanners… we simply don’t know.

As so much of ED touches on acquisition of money, an appropriate 'hiding spot' would be away from missions and other money-generating aspects of the game. Asteroid belt clusters are a fairly obvious guesses: there's no missions or significant money to made from those, and any 'content' needs a visit as it doesn't show up on scanners. Asteroid belts close to stars have an extra 'stay-away factor' to discourage those who are not incurable curious as heat may make it difficult to enter -- and so possibly adding piloting skills as probable requirement for entering. (I once hoped to find cluster orbital elements -- they might show if some near-star cluster moved in and out of overheating zones, and could only be entered at certain times. That's would be a neat hiding place.)

As many ED players go for ranking up, another 'hiding spot' would be 'away' from ranking. (Many Raxxla theorists seem to have come up some version of this with already: somewhere in the Pilots Federation District seems to be a favourite idea, with permission-locked systems in general also at a top place.)

As Raxxla might be unique in some sense, implementation and quality assurance would require special effort. Are there any known bugs that don't appear to make sense from normal pount of view? If there are, they may indicate galaxy locations where some degree of manual patching has been done, or where something tricky is going on. (I once found a Youtube entry about Orna 8 (landable), showing a bug that seemed to make planetary rotation larger that ship speed, making it impossible to land without crashing. It was fixed, and I think it turned out the rotation speed had been linked to the Orna 8 ring speed, or to some object in that ring. That was singular enough for me to spend a couple of weeks poking around in that neighbourhood ... but there may be other places like that.)
 
Last edited:
To consider what Raxxla might be used for first you must know what Raxxla is... and we don't know according to DB ;)

As the only bonafide in-game clue/source that we know of "the Codex" (If you believe it... and please excuse me all those who consider historic lore, literature, mythology, etc as valid - just as valid an assumption in my opinion, which I also explore from time to time.....) unless I've missed something Raxxla would be:

1. A definite place that holds a mysterious secret - well good luck with that one as it could be anything!
2. Raxxla contains an alien artefact called the Omphalos Rift, which acts as a gateway to parallel universes. - Travel and probably a face to face with Thargoids, Guardian AI or just a weird version of ourselves (Starfield replay joke!) :ROFLMAO:
3. An unremarkable moon - nothing? How disappointing...
4. A state of cosmic enlightenment - you'll feel happier!
5. A place that has already been discovered by either a sinister cabal or a lone individual who has harnessed Raxxla's power to become the shadow ruler of all of humanity. - Mmm... what power and how? allowing you to jump between systems, propaganda (Galnet?), control markets, pay you to do large scale missions, etc.... Damn you PF! ;)

just a thought... :unsure:

My current hypothesis is that Brookes based the template for Raxxla around some type of hybrid conglomerate of John Milton (JM); Robert Holdstock (RH) and possibly Lovecraft.

1. A definite place that holds a mysterious secret:

RH utilised various references that alluded to various old English/Celtic/Norse mythologies, one such ‘definite’ place alluded to, was the ‘Otherworld’, it itself was mystical secret, a land of youth, a paradise on Earth, hidden in plain sight, but existing beyond our dimension. RH attributed this as another ‘lost realm’ similar to the Christian Eden, or Greek Underworld amongst others.

2. Raxxla contains an alien artefact called the Omphalos Rift, which acts as a gateway to parallel universes:

In Paradise Lost (PL) by JM our universe was held within a Crystalline shell (a globe) which consisted of the celestial spheres (the silent song), this hung from a chain from the brow of heaven. Not far away from it, but relatively very close. It’s outer sphere was solid, and it was were Satan wandered (vagabond), until he found the apex, which was an aperture, a vast opening from which one exited (if chosen) or where celestial beings could enter, a possible omphalos?

Again this codex description might link back again to RH concept of an Otherworld, existing in a parallel dimension, containing multiple other mystical lands; it could not be entered by mistake, it had a limited number of entry points, one either had to be invited, perform some amazing deed, or hold the key, usually a silver apple or branch. Usually such locations it could said to be found close to mountains, burial mounds, over or under the sea or certain trees.

3. An unremarkable moon?

An unremarkable moon could just be the perfect place to hide something!

4. A state of cosmic enlightenment:

See above!

5. A place that has already been discovered by either a sinister cabal or a lone individual who has harnessed Raxxla's power to become the shadow ruler of all of humanity:

Possibly this might just be telling us exactly that, Raxxla was found, and is or was exploited?

Maybe it is our jump technology, maybe we are all already in Raxxla, maybe it’s a guardian simulation, maybe Raxxla was originally a precursor for the Guardian narrative, remember that FD did alter the narrative by dropping the DW missions!

Could this be pointing to the Lost Realms zone? A conglomeration of lost Edens, they obfuscate (hidden or confuse) the real Eden aka Raxxla in or around that general area, an area which is directly tied to the birth of ED society; or the journey of Jaques?

Or maybe it’s bigger than that? Maybe the Codex is telling a wider story, a hidden narrative, Brookes hidden or lost narrative, his original narrative (or side narrative) - did it get axed, is the codex a redux and his original story hidden in the game?

Or maybe the path is more important than the destination?

It’s the friends you make along the way :)

IMG_8899.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Possibly this might just be telling us exactly that, Raxxla was found, and is being exploited. Maybe it is our jump technology, maybe we are all alread in Raxxla, maybe it’s a simulation.

Maybe the path is more important than the destination.

It’s the friends you make along the way :)
To misquote Douglas Adams:

“There is a theory which states that if ever anyone discovers exactly what Raxxla is for and where it is, it will instantly disappear and be replaced by something even more bizarre and inexplicable.

There is another theory which states that this has already happened.”​

 
Similarly I thought I would try and deconstruct the codex without falling down too many rabbit holes. As you can see there was a lot to unpack 😇

Legend - specifically showing this part is not a myth. Also used in TDW codex referring to their existence.

in circulation in whispers - the imperfect transmission of information across multiple iterations. Like the game of Telephone / Broken Telephone / Chinese Whispers.

for centuries - the idea has remained strong despite its ethereal nature. TDW codex reflects this.

The quest for Raxxla - organised search mission

Location is a deadly secret - This is stated as though it is fact, and is ambiguous to what makes it dangerous. So any 'dangerous' locations could help filter a search. Is the location itself deadly? or the act of searching makes you a target? Is there a high-risk pathway to access Raxxla making it deadly to pilots who don't know the correct procedure? It is also stated distinctly separate to TDW.

Principal aim - if seeking it is their aim, then they have not yet discovered it.

Putative - word meaning a generalised assumption amongst society - this means they may not exist, or at least not in the Illuminati-esque form we might assume it to be. It is interesting to note that the original Bavarian Illuminati's stated goals were "to oppose superstition, obscurantism, religious influence over public life, and abuses of state power." Basically to prevent society from imploding by discreetly manipulating its levers. I would imagine these benevolent secret societies probably fall apart because they are trapped in the paradox of their innate goals requiring them to recruit new members, but at the same time remain secret, and also somehow hold themselves to common principles, whilst the entire time wielding immeasurable power with the temptation to brag about it.

Fraternity - group sharing a common interest - notably using the masculine latin 'frater' for "brother/brotherhood". Why masculine?

Legend-chasers - this reinforces the above 'principal aim' premise, they likely do not have possession of Raxxla. If true, this is an avenue of investigation to search for TDW station first, because it will likely contain the clue that spawned the secret society in the first place. As the DW codex states, you can allegedly "examine the record and artefacts preserved there". What's the point of examining artefacts and records if they supposedly have possession of the Omphalos Rift itself.

Early days of interstellar travel - this pins it to the 22nd Century onward - this could mean an early explorer found something that pointed them to Raxxla (but was not Raxxla itself), and thus TDW was formed to search for it. Private corporate interests dominated exploration in this era and coincidentally the hyperdrive was also invented during this time by Li Qin Jao.

Side note: Li Qingzhao was a famous 11th Century Chinese poet. (The 'zh' in mandarin is a 'juh' sound - so a potential parralel exists with 'Jao'.) Two impact craters on Mercury and Venus are named after her - worth taking a look at?
Li Yong-Rui is part of the Li dynasty (surnames are addressed first in Chinese culture). So is the dynasty derived from the success of Li Qin Jao's invention??? How Qin Jao came to that discovery is unknown - perhaps benefiting from an certain alien artifact discovered by corporate pioneer explorers?
Yong = Mandarin for 'forever', Rui = sharp/acute/keen - Forever Keen -> Fernweh? -> Future sight? Li is also quoted in the Knowledge Base codex with his thesis on behavioural predictability - "Becoming the Watchmaker". I believe there may be a big clue here.

Earliest record is in a journal of a shipboard mechanic in Tau Ceti - This puts it in common circulation early in the 23rd century. How did this "secret" become circulated? Perhaps through the disintegration of TDW? or society members leaking info?

Side Note: The location of Tau Ceti is obvious due to the early period of exploration, but the date 2296 is far beyond John Taylor's separatist actions in the colony. Aside from an obvious Pink Floyd association, John Taylor is a British inventor and horologist known for his Corpus Clock in Cambridge which he called the Chronophage or "time eater". It has an inscription "the world passeth away, and the lust thereof".
Here is John Taylor explaining its beautifully haunting mechanics. Notice the 6-armed central reinforcement structure, and the method of using vernier slits to reveal the passage of time - I'm reminded of the landscape signal segments with each shape revealed like it was emitted through an opening.
Super-duper side note: Thargoids can be broken into Thar - old version of 'there' ie. far away, and Goid - an Irish/Gaelic term for 'steal'. So one could construe "Distant/Beyond Thief", or perhaps more ominously - "Future-Stealers". Maybe this is a link to their behaviour of stealing human stasis pods.

Soused / drunk - as I understand it the first GalNet news event reports the Federation banning the proliferation of celebratory liquor. Just an innocent health and safety message by the PF? or was there a link to something in game related to alcohol?

"Map to a pirate stash" - could this be implying there is a secret stash linked to pirate/rebellious groups?? Could it contain a clue? Another avenue is to scan through instances of pirate activity for unusual cargo or 'odd' pirate activity.
Again with GalNet, the early news articles are about Eranin civil war, Eranin Defence Force, and piracy in LP98-132, as well as lots of mentions of Fish - "380 cargo canisters of Fish were detected floating in deep space. Authorities speculate that pirates ejected them to make room for more valuable cargo." It's a loose connection, but bears resemblence to Homer's Odyssey repeatedly referring to the "fishy sea".

"While we're at it" - so the same act of using the 'map to some pirate stash' is to find Raxxla, thus it could be implying the 'clue' element is needed for a successful discovery of Raxxla.

It is clear from the text that the myth was already in circulation - here the framing has changed from legend to myth. Myth involves timelessness, and has no objective proof in history or reality. Whereas Legends are stories based on historic events and can be placed within a timeline. So after the journal of Art, the parts of the codex entry referring to myth may be read as a timeless framework of ideas and meaning, not connected to the game's timeline or characters.

Extremely difficult finding consistency among fragmentary rumours - if the fragments are inconsistent, it could mean the 'signal to noise ratio' is poor, thus people take what little information they had in the wrong directions - see the above point about whispers - Telephone / Chinese Whispers. Perhaps the author is saying to find a position of clarity to reduce the interfering 'noise' - either with a literal signal source, or some other lore instances.

Ancient myths - within the same sentence, these myths are related to the interpretation of stories about Atlantis etc, so it could be telling us to avoid getting too outlandish and search for explanations constructed with the smallest possible set of elements (Occam's Razor).

Unremarkable moon, or state of cosmic enlightenment - here the writer could be giving examples of these outlandish theories.
"Unremarkable moon" saying that it is unlikely to be anti-climactic and banal.
"State of cosmic enlightenment" is trying to rule out the idea of a symbolic end point, like a message in the game with no tangible outcome.
I guess that rules out Braben's floating head in space then 😅

Points of agreement - here is the meat on the bone!
It is a definite place - it exists as a location in the game.
It holds a mystical secret - either 'holds within', or 'holds onto' a secret that has a 'spiritual or magical significance that transcends human understanding'.
This part has an auspicious relationship with Milton's pendent world fast by a golden chain.

Alien artifact - a sentient lifeform created it. Non-human. A higher form of technology?

the Omphalos Rift as a [central] tunnel or gateway resembling the fictional children's story - just like what was discussed here earlier, this seems like the author is talking about allegory. It could be telling us we need to look to a story that is an interpretation or tribute to an older version for an element in it that symbolises a passage / gateway / tunnel.

Concealed facts - here it mentions "in his book", so specifically a male author.
Edit: If we consider this book within the game's history - Li Qin Jao's real world namesake was a famous poet who wrote about her husband Zhao Mingcheng, whom she shared a love of poetry with. This was during the Song Dynasty a time of massive technological advancement. It's first standing Navy, first known formula for gunpowder, first known discernment of true north, first description of a nautical pound lock, and improved designs of astronomical clocks. So perhaps Li Qin Jao wrote the children's book?

Eyes to see - something that can reveal the secret - either a code, cypher, lens, pattern, whatever.
It could also refer to a mystical seer? Li Yong-Rui certainly claims to have this talent!
Could the children's story be connected to Li Qin Jao or the Li Dynasty?? Was this children's tale a coded message for the early Dark Wheel acolytes?

Students note the legend exerts a strangely potent fascination on the minds of seekers - Here again the author is pointing to legend, not myth. Something associated with a point in time. What instances are there of people's minds affected? We've certainly seen some instances already with visions, lights and drawing people to seek them out.

Fernweh - a tormented/pained yearning, contrasted to wanderlust which describes a more joyful yearning. It could infer a feeling of being trapped/shackled down by present needs preventing you from going.

a place one has never seen - this could mean a location, but consider the aspect of time as well. The future is unseen. It specifically uses the word "seen" not "been". Yes that is stretching the meaning, but still a specific use of the word. It could describe a place that doesn't exist at all - like Atlantis, or Heaven, but as I theorized earlier the author has ruled that out already. Or the place is invisible or heavily concealed and can only be seen when we have the correct access to it.

futile search - what made it futile? the author may be saying it's pointless to aimlessly search. Again it likely means the place must be revealed by a trigger event or accessed via a gated task - makes me think of a Turing Test. Maybe it's an alien CAPTCHA check :p

Conspiracy theories - Conspiracies can be used as a method of social engineering or manipulation. Seeding uncertainty about "this" or "that" to create mistrust of people or groups. Perhaps it is a method to slowly undermine the Federation's ubiquitous power - the earliest accounts of the legend started around the time of the Federation's emergence. The Dark Wheel codex also backs up the mistrust theme by mentioning Lyta Crane, a so-called 'people's journalist'.

Some kind of sinister cabal (or sole tyrant) - There are two GalNet articles in sequence on 23 NOV 3304 and 30 NOV 3304, which mention Li Yong-Rui's private fleet having a "cabal of junior officers" launching the incursion into Meene - which was basically a veiled attempt by Li to grab Ram Tah's research. Li tries to discredit the officers and 'arrests' them even though the mercs claim they were commissioned by the officers. Sirius has certainly leveraged power to insert itself into political and humanitarian situations and the fact that the codex calls out a "(sole tyrant)" in parentheses like that is as though the codex author is winking at us.

I refer back to Yong-Rui's codex quote:
The fortune teller rattling bones in her simple hut, the smiling insurance salesman with his snakeskin briefcase and the data analyst with his interactive holographic model are all selling the same thing: certainty. One of the paradoxes of human existence is that we crave the freedom to be spontaneous, thinking it is essential to our nature, while constantly seeking reassurance that nothing unexpected is going to happen. We flatter ourselves with the belief that we are exempt from the rules of modelling that govern the rest of the universe. — Introduction to "Becoming the Watchmaker", Li Yong-Rui's master's thesis on the innate human reluctance to accept behavioural predictability
  • Fortune teller rattling bones in her hut - a witch / seer of prophecy / future events, also a person who makes money from exploiting people's emotions.
  • Smiling insurance salesman with snakeskin briefcase - insurance is a buffer against future catastrophy, and the smiling+snakeskin symbolism implies malicious manipulation.
  • Data analyst with a holo model - Reading and modelling future events, but also someone who may be feigning technical skill with shiny gadgets with the intent to steer the decisions of people with power and influence.
  • The paradox of craving freedom, but seeking reassurance of safety - this sounds a bit like Fernweh. Yearning for freedom, but trapped in fear of uncertainty and danger.

If Raxxla existed as a legend during the early centuries of human stellar civilisation, it means someone found something to spark its existence in everyday conversation. So I'm becoming more convinced now that Raxxla has never been found and that the Dark Wheel only have/had a marginal advantage by possessing at most a few artifacts that they could study and derive advanced technology from to gain special economic advantages and power, but could never find or access Raxxla itself.

The parallels to Li Yong-Rui can probably be applied to the Federation's shady actions as well. However, the connections of 'legends' to the early period of hyperspace travel, and the long influence of the Li dynasty in association with ship technologies, seems to position Sirius as being the likely vector of discovery. This does not mean the corporation is constantly dropping hints. It's more like a starting point where we could search for hidden skeletons 💀 Additionally the keys to the door could be hidden in plain sight, like the fact we are using their drive technology to access the galaxy. Or the composition of FSD materials are somehow linked to a clue to find The Dark Wheel station - my theorized home of frame shift technology.
 
Last edited:
Today I was trying to find systems in the line between the centroids of the triangles made up of the Norse Norns and Greek Fates but found Urd was hundreds of LY away. Rochester, could you please label the systems you used to make these triangles in your most recent posts? (e.g. https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/page-1648#post-10297089)

Something else I have been thinking about is the golden chain. The fact it is golden suggests to me that we might be looking for a line or path of G-type stars that starts on the brow of heaven and descends a short way into the realm of Chaos, culminating in the system with Raxxla.
Veroandi and Skuld are both G-type stars. In a line between them are the permit-locked G-type star systems Hors and Pi Mensae. Look in the Galmap, set for G-type stars only, and there are many systems with interesting system names, often empty systems, nearby. Tiliala is another permit-locked G-type. Proteus is one name that stood out (empty).
If we can find a good starting point in this region, then I think we ought to be able to narrow down our search considerably.
 
Today I was trying to find systems in the line between the centroids of the triangles made up of the Norse Norns and Greek Fates but found Urd was hundreds of LY away. Rochester, could you please label the systems you used to make these triangles in your most recent posts? (e.g. https://forums.frontier.co.uk/threads/the-quest-to-find-raxxla.168253/page-1648#post-10297089)

Sorry false of habit, eventually mapping so many systems their locations and names just get engraved into one’s subconscious.

phonto.jpeg

There is also the ‘Thorn’ systems, runic names attributed to trees (still under construction).

phonto.jpeg
 
Last edited:
Barnard's Star .88LY out - Landscape signal.png

So I tried flying out quite a way from other things in Barnard's Star .88LY (I was trying something out) then I thought I wonder if the landscape signal was any different/clearer being so far out... and I don't think so :)

But as I was playing around with various configurations in the Spectrogram settings (as I am no expert and just play with them and see if things get clearer or completely messed up! :ROFLMAO:)...

Anyway some of the chirps seem to have definite markings/symbols and I wondered if anyone else thinks that.... and whether they are intentional or just the pictorial representation of the chirps?

....and then I also noticed something that looked a bit weird.... faint and possible letters? (the last red boxes to the right of the screen cap)...

Most likely caught a bad case of Rochester Apophenia.... but looks like something to me....

Anyone agree... and anyone understand the spectrogram settings enough to try and see if it can be made clearer or is it just random and I'm seeing things?

Here's a rubbish larger view:

Barnard's Star .88LY out - Landscape signal - letters.png


And here a colour version many times from the recording... it's consistant...
Barnard's Star .88LY out - Landscape signal - letters several samples.png

Just a thought... :unsure:

EDIT: almost forgot also saw this in the spectrogram...
1705178568030.png
 
Last edited:
I think it is certainly worth considering the question of what Raxxla might be used for and might have been used for in the past. Why it was used is also a reasonable question.

Hyperspace technology. We've been using it for about a thousand years and still do not really understand how it works or what hyperspace is. A prime case for external influence.
Loads of great ideas in your post, but this one in particular grabbed me since there's a connection I never thought of before.

1) Humans reach space (again, post WW3).
2) Humans build Generation ships and launch "thousands" in a VERY short period (for unknown reasons), starting in 2097.
3) Humans develop Hyperdrive technology within 50 years of starting to send generation ships, and within 100 years of dedicated off-earth space travel.

This is very similar to the Guardian timeline:

1) Guardians reach space to deliberately build ark ships.
2) Guardians launch many generation ships (to relieve population pressures)
3) Guardians develop Hyperspace comms technology wile the Gen ships are still travelling, and then develop FTL shortly afterwards. Timeline is unknown, but it's implied it was relatively rapidly.

It seems almost like leaving the home world and spending time in space is a trigger for the development of FTL. We've only got two examples, but in both once the homeworld is left FTL follows quickly afterwards (but it's expressly stated that it's actually an invention both times).

I can't help but think that the Landscape Signal can only be heard in space. Halsey was in space, Gan worked in space. I realise we're all biased (cos we have little choice than to mostly be in space) but I wonder if space-travellers are exposed to the siren call, whereas planet dwellers aren't - by story design not because of 'the way the game was built'.

It's almost like a filter. Once a species is developed enough to leave the protection of their homeworld's magnetosphere they'll automatically 'hear' (sense) the mystical siren song of Raxxla, and from then on they'll be 'infected' with it, portions of the population develop various forms of fernweh. Maybe that encourages the type of thinking needed to develop FTL, maybe FTL just needs enough dedicated people working on it to achieve a breakthrough and the fernweh encourages that investment of brainpower.

And that is very similar to the 2001 A Space Odyssey (and later novels) plot. The Monolith is buried deliberately in a crater on the Moon, humans detect the anomalous mass and excavate it, the first time sunlight hits it it sends out a message that triggers contact with the aliens. That sequence is deliberate and it's how the aliens monitor developing sentient life - obviously when a species is capable to the range of intelligence required to do all that, they're ready to take the next steps.
 
View attachment 380921
So I tried flying out quite a way from other things in Barnard's Star .88LY (I was trying something out) then I thought I wonder if the landscape signal was any different/clearer being so far out... and I don't think so :)

But as I was playing around with various configurations in the Spectrogram settings (as I am no expert and just play with them and see if things get clearer or completely messed up! :ROFLMAO:)...

Anyway some of the chirps seem to have definite markings/symbols and I wondered if anyone else thinks that.... and whether they are intentional or just the pictorial representation of the chirps?

....and then I also noticed something that looked a bit weird.... faint and possible letters? (the last red boxes to the right of the screen cap)...

Most likely caught a bad case of Rochester Apophenia.... but looks like something to me....

Anyone agree... and anyone understand the spectrogram settings enough to try and see if it can be made clearer or is it just random and I'm seeing things?

Here's a rubbish larger view:

View attachment 380922

And here a colour version many times from the recording... it's consistant...
View attachment 380923
Just a thought... :unsure:

EDIT: almost forgot also saw this in the spectrogram...
View attachment 380928
Can I just ask, are you doing this in freecam at max range? Because that looks like cockpit noise to me.

If you're doing this in freecam 3km from the ship, then you've found something that doesn't appear in any of my (many many many) recordings! Which is amazingly fantastic!

FYI as for:
So I tried flying out quite a way from other things in Barnard's Star .88LY (I was trying something out) then I thought I wonder if the landscape signal was any different/clearer being so far out... and I don't think so
If you're too near a star you get interference from it in the form of horizontal banding. But as long as you're in "deep space" it seems to be pretty consistently clear :)
 
Top Bottom