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Modes The Solo vs Open vs Groups Thread - Part the Second [Now With Added Platforms].
- Thread starter Robert Maynard
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I still need to get used to this UI, need some time
But thanks ya'll for the responses
Another question: Why can you influence the public gameplay without actually being part of it? I mean, wouldn't it be better to devide up single- and multiplayer? If not, why?
Greetings.
OK mate, let me try to make this simple for you. "6 hundred thousand copies". or if you like, (600,000), or 6/10's of a million. An awfully lot of people have purchased this game. Why? Because we can truly play it our chosen way, and yes we effect the very same background world, "as you there in open", and that's good. Now I'll bet you a hundred dollars the modes, and mode switching isn't going to change. Why? This is what we in the business world refer to as a successful business model. There is no way FD will ever change this, as it has proven it works, and are hanging there hat on this! Six Hundred Thousand Copies Sold, and still selling, even though you and players like you don't like it, I believe it will continue.
I repeat this one more time. FD cares much more about everyone having the ability to enjoy themselves in this game, than they do about supporting the Pew Pew crowd, the player based org. crowd, or any of that old wore out crap.
There top priority isn't creating structures for player dynasty's. It's people having fun, and if your fun comes at other players expense, your kinda on the out here mate.
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From Sandro's interview here:
Also of note: you can defect. But if you do so, you may become wanted by your former friends. Tied to this, Powerplay means you now have license to attack anyone from a rival power in your own territory without incurring a bounty. "We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions, and a chance to feel like part of a team even if you prefer to play alone," Sammarco added.
Pretty clear no?
Addendum: I'm not particularly PvP, but PvP with ingame motivation is something that attracted me. Particularly something as obvious as ingame lore-backed factional warring. So I gave it a try last night. My first ever PvP (which I initiated).
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from what he say is: We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions, and a chance to feel like part of a team even if you prefer to play alone
and that doesnt make the PP pvp based
from what he say is: We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions, and a chance to feel like part of a team even if you prefer to play alone
and that doesnt make the PP pvp based
Especially if you prefer to play alone.
Especially if you prefer to play alone.
from what he say is: We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions, and a chance to feel like part of a team even if you prefer to play alone
and that doesnt make the PP pvp based
As you yourself quote from this: We're giving players a reason to engage in PvP against supporters of other factions.
So apparently there was an idea to encourage PvP, not explicitly be a PvP expansion (which I never claimed).
However in its current iteration the ONLY encouragement of PvP is being able to kill players of other factions inside your own territory without getting a bounty.
But to be honest if you're going to enemy territory it makes far more sense to do in a group or solo without the risk of being accosted by Player Wings, whom you'll probably have little chance of defeating and if you do manage to defeat them zero reward.
Basically zero encouragement of PvP.
My main point being, where did anyone say it should encourage PvP? I gave you the quote from the lead designer. I think I do have at least one leg to stand on
Pretty clear that it wasn't designed to "pit player against player", yes. From this bit:
Not possible to pit player against player if you play alone.
If PP is equally valid for those playing alone, how can you see it as being "supposed" to be for PvP? They are giving you a context for meaningful PvP within the Elite universe. Something that was always David's vision (PvP would be "rare and meaningful"). The CQC could be seen to further that - adding another "lore-friendly" context for PvP.
That quote mentioned PvP, yes but it also mentioned playing alone. Why did you take it as encouraging one and not the other? They don't even give you merits for shooting other players. Isn't that enough of a clue that they aren't in fact encouraging PvP?
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The "elephant" would be that some people acquired the game without any prior information and made a ton of assumptions about what it would be.
And instead of just chalking it up to experience and moving on, they've come here to pass the blame onto FD.
The reason no one talks about it is, calling someone a [insert insult referring to lack of intelligence or reading skills] and telling them [insert instructions on putting something in/up an orifice forcefully] is not really a good idea and breaches several forum rules. Not to mention we have our own resident Mod here, so the post and the poster would not last long
So all we can do, is dance around the faulty premise that the game is broken and counter with the design documents showing it isn't until those with the faulty premise leave. Then wait for the next one to turn up saying exactly the same things for the same reasons and go around again, and again, and again.
*sigh* I'm not saying you shouldn't play alone. What I'm saying is the lead designer explicitly stated that one of the interesting things about Power Play was that it would encourage PvP.
At no point did I say one was better than the other or cast judgement on solo players (I play all three modes depending on my mood).
He says (again).... "We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions..."
That's pretty clear. 'We're giving players a reason to engage in PvP
'We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP'.
'We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP'.
'We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP'.
All I'm saying is that isn't the case. In no way am I saying that PP excludes solo players. In no way am I saying that PP is PVP only content. In no way amd I casting judgement on those who make that valid playchoice.
I was asked to provide evidence that encouraging PvP was mentioned and I've provided as clear a quote as you can get.
Yet still people seem to pick and choose what they like.
Addendum: Yes he does say there's stuff in PP for solo players too. No-one is denying that.
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<grins> Indeed!
No. He didn't.
They gave you a reason but no reward, how is that encouragement? I'd see it more as humouring the notion of PvP than encouraging it. Acknowledging at best. If they gave you extra points for killing players, that would be encouragement. That isn't what they did. They gave you a context, nothing more.
PvP was already happening but it was out of context in the game, out of place. They gave it a place, albeit a very limited, unrewarded place.
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As you yourself quote from this: We're giving players a reason to engage in PvP against supporters of other factions.
So apparently there was an idea to encourage PvP, not explicitly be a PvP expansion (which I never claimed).
However in its current iteration the ONLY encouragement of PvP is being able to kill players of other factions inside your own territory without getting a bounty.
But to be honest if you're going to enemy territory it makes far more sense to do in a group or solo without the risk of being accosted by Player Wings, whom you'll probably have little chance of defeating and if you do manage to defeat them zero reward.
Basically zero encouragement of PvP.
My main point being, where did anyone say it should encourage PvP? I gave you the quote from the lead designer. I think I do have at least one leg to stand on
You implied PP was about forced PvP with the comments underlined below;
And the second underline, your own quote shows there is a "justification" for optional PvP within PP;
"Tied to this, Powerplay means you now have license to attack anyone from a rival power in your own territory without incurring a bounty."
Have a license to - not are made to.
Just like all other content so far, Solo / Group and Open were all taken into mind while it was being made. PP features can be done and countered in each mode, that is why every action lists a counter action in the PP system. It all comes back to player choice over who they want to play with - a core feature of the game design since day one (1).
Remember, you picked Open, because you want to deal with all the stuff that comes with an Open PvP area. I picked a private group because I'm not wasting my time with people I do not know, nor want to know. Some folks picked Solo because they had to due to hardware or because they simply want to be alone. The game was made for everyone (except those who just want to grief others, then tough luck on them the game design counters them beautifully).
Not quite what I said, now was it.
You implied PvP was mandatory in PP, my response was;
I quoted your implied sentiment and asked for "any information where by PP is to directly force any player, to directly interact with another player."
So, I asked for proof where PP forced PvP
You know, the CQC mode could be essentially perfect if its matchmaking joins up players from Open Play and has a mode for Private Groups to do their thing.
Competitive nature, of course, stays on Open Play. If that's the case, hell yeah, rip this thread and for good.
Competitive nature, of course, stays on Open Play. If that's the case, hell yeah, rip this thread and for good.
i smell cqc will be at open ;p
Unless you understand that PvP in this game means teams running PvE content that directly opposes the outcome of those running said content, then you are missing what PvP in this game is designed to do. PP encourages PvP...by creating a PvE based PvP. The pew pew crowd can still PvP, and there are more reasons to kill other commanders...certainly. However, pew pew is not the focus of the game...if it was, then there would be better rewards for killing other PC's. I would love to see this occur...along with many other changes....however, it will not. Accept the game design...or move on. Yes, it is sad to realize this is the way the devs want it...you and I definitely agree that it should change...constantly demanding these issues change...is a futile exercise.
You decide on your play time and how you spend it.
Continue on the fight if you feel you must..and here's free ticket to ride:
I disagree that it was even encouraged. In one sentence - "We're giving players a reason to engage in PVP against supporters of other factions, and a chance to feel like part of a team even if you prefer to play alone" - Sandro mentioned PvP and playing alone. Why do you take one as being encouraged over the other?
Yes he also mentioned "license to attack anyone from a rival power" but that could easily have meant NPCs as well as players. "Anyone" not "players", "attack anyone" not "PvP" (a term which he used later).
You have interpreted the quote to mean something that it did not actually say. That happens an awful lot with developer-speak. It's meant to be vague. I remember saying in this thread that that interpretation (PP was designed for PvP) would prove to be disappointing to those who interpreted it that way. And we are seeing that now. You imagine it to be meant for PvP and therefore you see the things that are missing (rewards for killing other players like you get with NPCs, preventing Solo players Undermining, etc.). Those things aren't missing in the version that wasn't meant for one style of play over another. That's the version that was designed.
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