The Star Citizen Thread v5

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CMDR_Orlando

Banned
CMDR_Orlando
VidarSnipes said:
Sorry, but that's just a promise. Star Marine was promised to be released one and a half years ago. Until there are tangible results accessible to anyone, the MVP doesn't exist.
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It's what I think it will be a MVP, it doesn't exist and it's not supposed to exist, yet. Nobody wants them to rush things and just release a bare-bones system just to say "hey it's released", they don't need to do that and wont do it. Thankfully

FuriousMeow said:
It is not an excuse, it is an accusation of poor management. It still is an accusation as they are STILL having to modify the engine because it still doesn't do things they need it to do.

And you can't say no other engine in the world does what theirs sort of does, you don't know all of the engines. CR only chose the ready to go engines, but there are dozens more that aren't for sale that you don't know about.
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News flash, every company have to change their engine in some ways to fit their needs. You think Frontier didn't changed their engine while they were developing the game? PBR didn't magically rendered itself lol. The more specific needs you have the more you have to change. Were talking about top of the line engines and that were accessible at the time. No, no other engine can do what they do because no other game is trying to go that extra mile like they are going.
 

ianw

I
GordFreeman said:
You do realize that this thread is the biggest 'katamari' ever, right?..... [uhh]
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But it's always been in off topic. Because that's what it is in these forums.

Which is completely different to threads about SC that start in general on the SC forum and then get shunted off out of sight because they don't suit the narrative.
 
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CMDR_Orlando

Banned
CMDR_Orlando

Roybe

Roybe
CMDR_Orlando said:
All mechanics in place with 1 full system (Stanton) with all the features: planetary landings, dogfighting, FPS, EVA, Multicrew, Racing, multiple planets to land, moons, derelict ships, comarrays, satelites etc, multiple ships, economy, basic professions and respective ships and server infrastructure up and running.

http://i.imgur.com/Ia2irlg.jpg

Again its easy to look back and say "he should do this or he should do that", but its not only useless like crying over spilled milk (because that time is gone) but also conjecture, even with proven teams and engines made from scratch projects fail.

To Neo - See the Blizzard fiasco with Titan, completely scratched work of 10+ years and +50 millions of dollars! It happens, it's not a safe bet that Star Citizen would be in any better shape now, no one could know that. Stop blaming the engine, it's a poor excuse and useless one, they have the main engineers that made the engine, they own it, it's theirs and there's no other engine in the world that does what their do now. Simple.

To Furious - But they did reassess and revaluated, that's why they changed the way they were working.
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There's plenty of blame to go around for the situation...all of it falling squarely on CR shoulders. He let the scope of the game (the defining parts of the game that make the game what it is) get out of control. To add to this, he never fully re-evaluated the amount of restructuring his engine of choice would need to create a game of this scope. For the original scope of the game...CryEngine was a decent match...that would have been able to be re-arranged in less time than 2 years to put them ahead of the game. Unfortunately, that failure to re-evaluate the engine choice HAS bitten this dev team in the butt. It WOULD have taken much less time to create an engine that would have been designed specifically for this game...and in that design, actually be able to do more. All this being said...it is now water under the bridge. Hindsight is 20-20. Unfortunately, these are now sunk costs, in time and money, that cannot be recouped and will limit the possible features of the game, because both are in 'short supply' (relatively speaking).

The longer the game goes without release, the worse the press is going to get, which will slow the income to the store drastically, until no one buys anything....with the consumer demanding value for their payment. Ultimately, no game could live up to the dream world that the devs sold to everyone...so there is going to be some bloodletting once the game does release....but, as long as it is solid....that will subside.
 

GordFreeman

G
ianw said:
But it's always been in off topic. Because that's what it is in these forums.

Which is completely different to threads about SC that start in general on the SC forum and then get shunted off out of sight because they don't suit the narrative.
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Hahahaha! Of course I know it's completely different. It's the exact opposite. You can't reasonably talk about SC on these forums because everything gets dumped in this hell hole. [squeeeee]
 

ianw

I
CMDR_Orlando said:
Happens in every gaming forum:

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php/282184-Gamescom-Day-4-was-a-waste-of-time

https://forums.frontier.co.uk/showt...-between-SC-and-normal-more-like-Star-Citizen

[rolleyes]
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You've shown me two threads that are in general - they haven't been moved or merged into this thread.

Was there a point you were trying to make in comparison to threads being moved from general to somewhere else at SC?

I know all forums have their problems but SC official forums and the Reddit SC stuff seem to be the finest examples of censorship currently available on the internet.

Are you going to Gamescom btw?

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

GordFreeman said:
Hahahaha! Of course I know it's completely different. It's the exact opposite. You can't reasonably talk about SC on these forums because everything gets dumped in this hell hole. [squeeeee]
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This has always been the designated hole.

Have you had a chance to peruse the Kotaku article yet?
 
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Roybe

Roybe
GordFreeman said:
Hahahaha! Of course I know it's completely different. It's the exact opposite. You can't reasonably talk about SC on these forums because everything gets dumped in this hell hole. [squeeeee]
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As a denizen of the Hotel California thread...I would have it no other way! LOL! Seriously, though...it makes sense. There is no reason for a long winded SC thread to be in General Elite: Dangerous forum space...as there are plenty of complaints and issues there about THAT game, soaking up the words of the interwebz!
 

Neo-ST

Neo-ST
CMDR_Orlando said:
No, no other engine can do what they do because no other game is trying to go that extra mile like they are going.
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Wrong. Proprietary engines do that, and do it far better, because they're built for purpose.
In case of CIG, CR needed something shiny to show off quickly and build a base of backers. He used what was ready and available at the time, and at all costs - so he purchased the Cryengine.

It did look shiny and attracted a horde of backers with 2012 pitch video, but afterwards he was stuck with engine not built for space sim purpose, so he was stuck with refactoring it and losing (our) money & time doing it. That process lengthened to such extent that even sources from CIG say that, at this point, it was easier, cheaper and more suitable if they went with the proprietary engine.
Mismanagement and greed again.
 

Zyll Goliat

Zyll Goliat
GordFreeman said:
You do realize that this thread is the biggest 'katamari' ever, right?..... [uhh]
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Not exactly,most katamari thread are left to rotten in dark corners there only 1 it´s still kind of hanging on but except for few dozen of regular ppl. that post in there almost no one have interested in them anymore,I bet that you or Orlando are not visiting or making any post there to protect your awesome game...right?From other side this thread is IMPORTANT for all of us that want to find out objectively (from other view point) what is new in SC world,all bad news or some good news....we had conversation in here from both sides....you may notice that...you actually participate in one right now.....from other side open debate died long time ago on SC official forum......
 
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FuriousMeow

F
CMDR_Orlando said:
News flash, every company have to change their engine in some ways to fit their needs. You think Frontier didn't changed their engine while they were developing the game? PBR didn't magically rendered itself lol. The more specific needs you have the more you have to change. Were talking about top of the line engines and that were accessible at the time. No, no other engine can do what they do because no other game is trying to go that extra mile like they are going.
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News flash? Really? Because I know game companies that own and operate their own in-house engines modify them. They do it all the time. It doesn't take 2 years to do it either, they comfortably do it in a span of maybe 3 months. Pretty impressive, since they know their engine. Even with the Crytek employees it still took 2 years, and the netcode still isn't "refactored."

We're not talking about "top of the line" engines - CR could only get engines that could be licensed. There are PLENTY of very top of the line engines that are in-house only and can NOT be licensed. That statement from you shows exactly how ignorant you are on the whole situation.
 

SkUnimatrix

S
Marak said:
I missed that bit of controversy - thanks.

I do find it astonishing that a company with so many backers (and free beta testers) ignore the massive amount of feedback they get and censor any posts that don't agree with their vision. The enormous 'controller balance' and 'flight model' threads come to mind.

And whatever happened to the SC HOTAS, with its 'trackball gimball weapon control' (which only the brave admitted that they hated)?
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Likely DOA. The deal with MadCatz was for a range of peripherals to work with the HOTAS including keyboards, custom controllers, headsets, and mice. With Saitek now being bought by logitech that deal is effectively dead as MadCatz no longer has the joystick division and their current designs were based around MadCatz products. Now that doesn't mean a new deal won't be reached with Logitech replacing the MadCatz keyboards et. al. with Logitech stuff, but that likely means having to rework much of the HOTAS designs, especially the "low end" HOTAS model to now integrate with Logitech products. MadCatz actually was about the same size as CIG based on yearly revenue and market cap. So CIG had some power there. Logitech is a $1.8B company. CIG doesn't have any power there really. Logitech will very much go the: "You will take what we want to give you or no deal" mentality.

Problem for everything now is with the Thrustmaster FCS HOTAS coming out in a couple weeks, got mine on pre-order and will be reviewing and doing a 2016 buyers guide video next month, that there is actually competition now at the lower end (<$150) for the first time in a decade. That was a market position that pretty much was Saitek or nothing. And one in the hand is worth two in the bush as they say so I have a feeling if the new TM HOTAS is decent quality it's going to clean up at that price point not leaving much left in terms of a market. At this point most of the people who want to go HOTAS have because they are playing other games such as Flight Sims and Elite. Sure people will be replacing crap Saitek stuff in the next couple years as their stuff is designed to last about 300 hours and you can burn through that in no time if you are serious about flight games. Hell I've got nearly 3000 hours on my CH gear in the past 2.5 years. 1400 hours of that is in Elite the rest in flight sims. (and it's starting to have to be recalibrate on the rudder pedals now and then. But 3000 hours is going to be years for most people).
 

GordFreeman

G
Zyll Goliath said:
It´s Kind of ironic but you just proved that it is........
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HAHAHAHA WHAT?!?!?!

I am one of a handful of people here who isn't completely biased against SC. So all of your posts are basically preaching to the choir. The epitome of 'unimportant'.

Your standard for 'proof' seems to be incredibly low!
 
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CMDR_Orlando

Banned
CMDR_Orlando
Roybe said:
There's plenty of blame to go around for the situation...all of it falling squarely on CR shoulders. He let the scope of the game (the defining parts of the game that make the game what it is) get out of control. To add to this, he never fully re-evaluated the amount of restructuring his engine of choice would need to create a game of this scope. For the original scope of the game...CryEngine was a decent match...that would have been able to be re-arranged in less time than 2 years to put them ahead of the game. Unfortunately, that failure to re-evaluate the engine choice HAS bitten this dev team in the butt. It WOULD have taken much less time to create an engine that would have been designed specifically for this game...and in that design, actually be able to do more. All this being said...it is now water under the bridge. Hindsight is 20-20. Unfortunately, these are now sunk costs, in time and money, that cannot be recouped and will limit the possible features of the game, because both are in 'short supply' (relatively speaking).

The longer the game goes without release, the worse the press is going to get, which will slow the income to the store drastically, until no one buys anything....with the consumer demanding value for their payment. Ultimately, no game could live up to the dream world that the devs sold to everyone...so there is going to be some bloodletting once the game does release....but, as long as it is solid....that will subside.
Click to expand...

That's your (wrong) assumption. Besides you can't possible know that, just look at all the MAJOR engines available now and how long it took for them to be developed.

The gaming funding will only go higher, don't forget that have yet to release two of their biggest cards, Star Marine and Planetary Landings.

Expectations are in check because you can play right now and see for yourself while the game is in ongoing development.

After Citizencon expect at least +5 millions pledge and thousands of new backers as usual.
 

Hi-Ban

Hi-Ban
SkUnimatrix said:
I take you've never seen the CvC Katamari, you know the single largest thread on the RSI Forums, have you?
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Well, this thread is now on its version 5 because when it reaches certain point, it collapses the forum. That's quite an achievement. [big grin]
And this v5 is close to reach twice its critical mass without exploding as a supernova.
 
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