The Star Citizen Thread v5

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So elite 1.0 wasn't shallow in content / game mechanics? Stuff to do... [rolleyes]


You could argue that, yes.

However you couldn't make that same claim a year after that release.

And you most certainly can't say that about Elite Dangerous currently.

Star Citizen on the other hand?

Five years into development and there is barely anything to do outside of a couple of "missions", some not very well balanced PvP combat, some shopping, flying around in your ship in your "system" of 1 gas giant planet and the stations you can visit, still mostly awful FPS combat that would have looked embarrassingly bad over 15 years ago in terms of control and lag issues alone..... and that's it.

Five years.

$125 million+ dollars.

And a load of promises about how this game is going to be better than all the rest out there.
 
I always heard people like you and Roberts and co. justifying all their delays of all their modules so far released with the statement that he is perfectionist and that you would get more content waiting longer. Well... all their releases, lame estimates, etc, speaks for themselves.

I can call him many things, except, perfectionist.

Yeah I wouldn't call you reasonable either. So what? It's not me who is calling him a perfectionist, it's pretty much anyone that has worked with him.

Star Citizen is not sold as a released game, it doesn't matter if it's shallow now because it is not being sold as a finished game, anyone following it's development knows that and the ones that don't follow it's development won't see it being advertised as "Released" and ready to provide a great gaming experience.

Understand that Braben released the ED early and in the state that it was by necessity not because he wanted to. He needed those release sales to leverage the next stage of development.
 
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He didn't let the community dictate the direction of his vision, he embraced the opportunity given by the community that gave their funds to make his perfectionist vision a reality. The vision is all Chris Roberts, the funding is all backers.

Sorry, my use of rhetorical questions can be unnecessarily confusing sometimes.

I know he didn't let the community decide...as I said, he was more looking for a semblance of agreement with an uncapped growth in scope.
 
Guys, relax. Citizencon is coming and y'all be...

d22.gif
 
If you are going to pick a line from an article try to understand the context before raging.... [big grin]
(anyway just look some posts/page before it's there explained by other posters).
"You misunderstood him" defense? Really? That's your last stand? Nonsense. CR is a failure as real life producer of anything. It was wildly known before, and nothing really has changed. This article and everything what he said within it just gives full picture for many to see finally.
 
Derek...that thing is 30 min long...I'm hoping it is at the beginning.


EDIT: 3min in...not hearing it yet...ugh, I can't stand this Texas-British accent.

EDIT2: 6 min, my brain is breaking...WHYYYYY!!!????!! So much off the cuff design going on...PLEASE SAVE ME

EDIT3: 9 min...OMG HE IS STILL ANSWERING THE FIRST QUESTION...Derek, you and me, we got beef now :p

EDIT4: I died zzzZZZzzz

EDIT5: 18min...ok, now I'm thinking I missed it...this is a cruel punishment, Derek....**Golf Clap**

How dare you do this to me Derek...for those that are curious it is at 23:07

https://youtu.be/vJoHlCc4Y7E?t=23m9s

:D I kid, thanks for pointing this out, but next time put a time stamp man!
 
So elite 1.0 wasn't shallow in content / game mechanics? Stuff to do... [rolleyes]

ED at release was the original game remastered, but with a Milky Way galaxy simulation as its play area. The galaxy part is the key USP that ED has and CR conveniently omits that from his comparison. I agree that ED was light on content, but I would argue that for the 8M GBP it cost, it was value for money. Comparing a 12M USD game to one with a 120M budget is a difficult one, you would kind of expect that it would be possible to squeeze a little more content into release with 10 times the funding.
 
ED at release was the original game remastered, but with a Milky Way galaxy simulation as its play area. The galaxy part is the key USP that ED has and CR conveniently omits that from his comparison. I agree that ED was light on content, but I would argue that for the 8M GBP it cost, it was value for money. Comparing a 12M USD game to one with a 120M budget is a difficult one, you would kind of expect that it would be possible to squeeze a little more content into release with 10 times the funding.

ED 1.0 with Season 1 cost about 30M GBP, which is around 50M USD. So no 8M GBP - which was initially planned user input via crowdfunding. I suspect Season 2 cost around 20 - 25M, and Season 3 will be in same ball park.

So when Season 3 will finish - around 2018 I think - FD will have spent around 70M GBP - around 100M on ED and Seasons 1/2/3.

ED is not a cheap game. As FD doesn't sell credits or ships for real money, nor have subscription, it has considerable running costs.

So no, ED budget is not that smaller than SC. Difference is, FD wanted to roll out 1.0 early and improve on as we go. That was their way and so far it has been quite justified.
 

dsmart

Banned
Derek...that thing is 30 min long...I'm hoping it is at the beginning.


EDIT: 3min in...not hearing it yet...ugh, I can't stand this Texas-British accent.

EDIT2: 6 min, my brain is breaking...WHYYYYY!!!????!! So much off the cuff design going on...PLEASE SAVE ME

EDIT3: 9 min...OMG HE IS STILL ANSWERING THE FIRST QUESTION...Derek, you and me, we got beef now :p

EDIT4: I died zzzZZZzzz

EDIT5: 18min...ok, now I'm thinking I missed it...this is a cruel punishment, Derek....**Golf Clap**

hmmm, I guess the time stamp didn't take? It's at 23:09 time stamp
 
I really don't think it makes sense to compare E : D to SC or vice versa, or really SC to any game. I think SC should stand on it's own. As of yet, it is really a CryEngine tech demo that isn't impressive at all and requires some very questionable individuals to consistently defend it across the internet. That right there says it all.

- - - - - Additional Content Posted / Auto Merge - - - - -

hmmm, I guess the time stamp didn't take? It's at 23:09 time stamp

It doesn't seem to work on the boards here.
 
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jcrg99

Banned
Yeah I wouldn't call you reasonable either. So what? It's not me who is calling him a perfectionist, it's pretty much anyone that has worked with him.

Star Citizen is not sold as a released game, it doesn't matter if it's shallow now because it is not being sold as a finished game, anyone following it's development knows that and the ones that don't follow it's development won't see it being advertised as "Released" and ready to provide a great gaming experience.

Understand that Braben released the ED early and in the state that it was by necessity not because he wanted to. He needed those release sales to leverage the next stage of development.

I was referring to your statement that because he is "perfectionist" that means people getting more content. Like we should rest assured that would be something great and full of content. That is pretty much contradicted by everything that was released so far and before released, was claimed by CR and people like you, as great things which wait would be worthy.

I think that when some (not all) people who worked with him, call him 'perfectionist', that does not mean that he is doing something "perfect" or requiring people to do something great and perfect, but just someone that wants what you do be a perfect match with what he wants. But that does not mean, more content, something great. And this project has been showing that doing the things in the way that he wants is far from perfect... It's bad. Terrible. Crap. A shame. A game that wouldn't be worthy of 1 million dollars, guess what, 125m. A game that does not deserve the title of "game".

And again, all the time, regardless not been a game called "released", for all their earlier modules, prior to their releases, they were always told as been hold because should be great, should match his vision, his level of quality, blablabla. And then, what people got? Crap. Rushed, without content and remaining broken and without content for a long time. And that is a fact. Like you or not. This idea of "perfectionist" is just not compatible with a good end result, when the perfectionist is Chris Roberts.

Would be better to call him undecided incompetent ego-maniac. Because that is what their results with Star Citizen has been showing.

But I stay with the belief that he is not incompetent. He does that all in purpose. For money. Maximizing his personal profit from a project that he knows that will be a total flop, failure, regardless what he delivers at this point.
 
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ED 1.0 with Season 1 cost about 30M GBP, which is around 50M USD. So no 8M GBP - which was initially planned user input via crowdfunding. I suspect Season 2 cost around 20 - 25M, and Season 3 will be in same ball park.

So when Season 3 will finish - around 2018 I think - FD will have spent around 70M GBP - around 100M on ED and Seasons 1/2/3.

ED is not a cheap game. As FD doesn't sell credits or ships for real money, nor have subscription, it has considerable running costs.

So no, ED budget is not that smaller than SC. Difference is, FD wanted to roll out 1.0 early and improve on as we go. That was their way and so far it has been quite justified.

Pecsik - I am confused. On the 24th August 2014 in a thread on this forum that you created about the cost of ED you quoted, "In crowd-funding, Braben sees a brave new future for computer games. Just as Elite broke new ground in 1984, so Braben hopes Elite: Dangerous, which is costing £8 million to develop, will break the stranglehold of powerful commercial publishers and distributors who prefer guaranteed returns to risk-taking experiments." Where did your new figures magically scale from.
 
Well when I backed ED on the Kickstarter I was expecting them to make a reasonable entry into the Elite series, maybe with some modern network stuff to augment the experience with real players.

I wasn't expecting them to continuously fund a bigger and bigger Elite game that I wouldn't get to play until I was almost in my retiring years, nor was I expecting them to sell in-game ships to continuously fund it.

I'd say they delivered a reasonably good update to the Elite series and put it out in a professional manner on a small budget.

I honestly see no alternative to how Frontier could have delivered Elite. They couldn't have left it in development hell for another two years with no funding, they certainly didn't have a stash of continuous income from excited backers. What were they supposed to do?

They didn't promise the "best damn space game" or anything like that. Just Elite made by a medium sized team. The title is still going strong and they have continued to add all of the content they originally said they would roughly when they originally claimed they would.

I certainly would have preferred it if Star Citizen could have been more open about the development sooner. I can appreciate Robert's finally being a bit more open in this kotaku interview. Wish he would refrain from commenting on Elite's development, there is no way any other Kickstarter developer could reasonably follow his approach without running out of money very quickly.

The continuous funding of SC is largely out of nostalgia and hype Chris, based on your previous over-hyped branching-story shooting-range FMV CD Rom games to the wealthy American market that were previously too busy playing Mario to appreciate Elite, so just count your blessings and make the damn game.
 
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Pecsik - I am confused. On the 24th August 2014 in a thread on this forum that you created about the cost of ED you quoted, "In crowd-funding, Braben sees a brave new future for computer games. Just as Elite broke new ground in 1984, so Braben hopes Elite: Dangerous, which is costing £8 million to develop, will break the stranglehold of powerful commercial publishers and distributors who prefer guaranteed returns to risk-taking experiments." Where did your new figures magically scale from.

Because costs grow with increased feature set FD added to ED. ED 1.0 was planned very simple during KS and it was planned to cost around 12M GBP. In the end it cost way more than that.
 
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