To keep playing Elite Dangerous

[Frank]

right... I don't know how to use the SCO correctly... I just got it, and it appears I'm a dumb incompetent player...

I did manage to win the mini-game during the interdiction attempt, breaking my joystick in the process, like literally, but lucky me, this time the NPC pirate wasn't an elite combat pilot in an Anaconda, as such I successfully got away, this time...

Games are meant to be fun. I can well understand stopping a game if it isn't scratching a particular itch. I've been itching since the game's beta a decade ago. I'm not scratching as much as I used to

But you've bought the game, and it looks like you are listening to advice to see if you can get a wee bit of your money's worth back...

The SCO allows you to boost in supercruise. The way it helps in interdictions is that it gives you the opportunity to avoid getting interdicted in the first place. Whenever an NPC pirate is chasing you they'll announce it in the text messages. Look for something like "at last I've found you" or "come here little fishy" or words to that effect. Note the name of the NPC who's threatening you, and then target their ship. Once it's targeted you can see when they are sneaking up behind you. If they can't get behind you they can't interdict you. You can use the SCO to boost away from them, and/or make some headway to your destination while you are performing this cat-and-mouse trick

 

[aRJay]

you have good points...
I barely have Tycoon rank in trading, I'm good at nothing else apparently... I don't even know how to properly use the SCO, since it wasn't a thing when I was playing actively...

The SCO is pretty new for all of us, only introduced a few months ago.
By default it uses the same binding as boost does in normal space, you have to press again to switch it off.
As it uses large amounts of fuel and generates a lot of heat it isn’t a good idea to use it continuously rather run it until you get heat warnings then shut it down for 10-15 seconds then boost again this gives you a much higher speed in cruise so reduces the time you are vulnerable.
It is particularly useful when departing stars or planets for getting you out of the gravity well where your ship is really slow.

since I've started this conversation, I logged in and got a 6A SCO for my T9 and it's not working during the interdiction... so it helps me how? run away before they attempt to interdict, if they send me the taunting message, and if I see it in time to react fast and jump away...

Yes if you manage to spot them or especially if they taunt you you could use the SCO but as you have found it can’t be used to break an interdiction that has started.

I'm slow, I keep saying, I'm a casual player, not a competitive one, and I have a disability (ulnar palsy) on my left hand that prevents me from having fast reflexes and dexterity, but I enjoy ED, or I used to love it, before I started to lose ships and cargo to NPCs...

so, is ED not the right game for me and I should leave..??.. that was my message about, letting Fdevs know why am I leaving ED and why am I not eager to spend real money on ED...

In an earlier post you linked your T9’s build, here are some of my comments.

• The weapons have a short effective range which might not be the best, but they aren’t ones I use so might well be wrong, turret mounts are a good thing in my view especially in a less agile ship. The missiles are a weapon I would love if they were more effective against shielded targets, the time to get a lock can be an issue.
• The size 3 fuel scoop is painfully slow I would swap it for a size 4 which is at least twice as fast, if you got rid of the docking computer and super cruise assist it would only cost you 2t of cargo.
• Supercruise assist when used runs your ship at a lower throttle setting so you are vulnerable longer and I don’t think it can be used with the SCO boost.
• The build shows you have 7D thrusters changing those for 7A would improve handling and agility which would help against interdictions. The increase in mass would reduce jump range by around half a light year.
• The T9 is a very big ship chaff which only affects gimballed and turreted weapons isn’t going to be a lot of help as if they get close enough it can’t throw the aim off enough for them to miss and NPC pirates often have fixed weapons, a shield booster might be more useful.
• Upping the shield generator to A class would help buy you more time.

It isn’t the way I would build it but then I am usually not so focused on trading as yourself.

 

[Michael Ryan]

I will gladly join you in your trips... how can we find each other in-game...

I am glad you are interested. I startet a Thread for an event:

Community Event / Creation - Arcadia Unveiled: Beyond to Beagle Point

Announcement: Arcadia Unveiled: Beyond to Beagle Point Attention all explorers and aspiring commanders! The Extrasolar Xenobiology Organisation (EXO) is thrilled to announce our upcoming major expedition, "Arcadia Unveiled: Beyond to Beagle Point." This is a unique opportunity to delve into the...

forums.frontier.co.uk

 

[Felix DiCestria]

good point,

I would post my ship's config, but I don't know how - maybe this will help

EDSY

EDSY is a ship outfitting tool for Elite Dangerous

edsy.org

I just got, literally around 12 hrs ago, a SCO class 6A, only to be interdicted again and realize I cannot use it during the interdiction mini-game to escape... I did manage to escape the mini-game, breaking my joystick in the process, but the NPC pirate was not elite level this time with an Anaconda, lucky me...

and yes, everything else is basic, just A-rated modules, no Guardian FSD booster (I don't know how to get one), and nothing engineered, because I don't have the materials for the engineering, nor the time to find them

my old T9 is an old basic ship, but I've managed to fit in 744 tons of cargo and it works for me if NPC pirates at elite combat levels won't attack me

I don't do transportation missions, or stack those up because I'm well aware those will attract pirates

I am just a simple dull space trucker, buying low at the shipper and selling high at the destination, nothing more, because I don't have time for more, and as such I'm a novice in anything else...

I did manage to rank up to Tycoon (yey) in trading, and I assume the NPCs are scaling up to match or exceed my rank, as so I won't be "bored" with boring easy fights...altho' I avoid any fights, easy and boring, or not... I'm not elite rank in anything, I'm not that good, I'm just a casual player, enjoying flying ships in our simulated galaxy and in fact, I love landing on planets and exploring around...


that's why I'm sad about leaving ED, because in fact, I love this game at the core... I just can't make it, it became too frustrating for me and that's not fun anymore

T9 752 tonnes

 

[Rat Catcher]

That's 80% of the people here ...

I started playing games, on mainframes, in the mid 1970's... Seen it all...

 

[Darkfyre99]

right... I don't know how to use the SCO correctly... I just got it, and it appears I'm a dumb incompetent player...

I did manage to win the mini-game during the interdiction attempt, breaking my joystick in the process, like literally, but lucky me, this time the NPC pirate wasn't an elite combat pilot in an Anaconda, as such I successfully got away, this time...

The thing that really annoys me about this game is the sheer volume of bad advice out there, and how it drowns out the good advice. This has been true since the first iteration of Supercruise, and it didn't take long before bad advice on how to use SCO was quickly adopted as gospel.

Any Supercruise journey can be broken down to three phases:

1. Escaping From a Gravity Well - Speeding up this phase is tthe best use case for an SCO boost, especially if you're escaping from the surface of a world.
2. Traversing a System's Ecliptic Plane - You really don't want to travel through a system's ecliptic plane. That's where all the mass of the system is which will slow you down. Travel above or below it. Distances longer than about 200 light seconds make a second SCO boost (after your FSD cools down from the first) worth your while.
3. Entering a Gravity Well - This phase is where you're most vulnerable to being interdicted, and also the phase that takes the longest if you're using Supercruise Assist or the mind meltingly bad advice of the "Six Second Rule." This is a very bad combination, because it can easily lead to a series of interdiction attempts.

The nature of how Supercruise works means you'll really can't escape doing some hands-on flying during Phase Three. It's a question of what kind of hands-on flying you want to do: a gravity braking maneuver at your destination, or evading (an) interdiciton attempt(s). The closest compromise available to you is simply not throttling down until you're about two seconds out, throttle down and fly past the planet, and then loop around to approach your destination. It may not be as fast as gravity braking, but it's still much faster than the six second rule, doesn't require nearly as much skill, and you're still much less likely to be interdicted by NPCs.

Especially if you complete phase one and two quickly as well.

good point,

I would post my ship's config, but I don't know how - maybe this will help

EDSY

EDSY is a ship outfitting tool for Elite Dangerous

edsy.org

I just got, literally around 12 hrs ago, a SCO class 6A, only to be interdicted again and realize I cannot use it during the interdiction mini-game to escape... I did manage to escape the mini-game, breaking my joystick in the process, but the NPC pirate was not elite level this time with an Anaconda, lucky me...

and yes, everything else is basic, just A-rated modules, no Guardian FSD booster (I don't know how to get one), and nothing engineered, because I don't have the materials for the engineering, nor the time to find them

my old T9 is an old basic ship, but I've managed to fit in 744 tons of cargo and it works for me if NPC pirates at elite combat levels won't attack me

I don't do transportation missions, or stack those up because I'm well aware those will attract pirates

I am just a simple dull space trucker, buying low at the shipper and selling high at the destination, nothing more, because I don't have time for more, and as such I'm a novice in anything else...

I did manage to rank up to Tycoon (yey) in trading, and I assume the NPCs are scaling up to match or exceed my rank, as so I won't be "bored" with boring easy fights...altho' I avoid any fights, easy and boring, or not... I'm not elite rank in anything, I'm not that good, I'm just a casual player, enjoying flying ships in our simulated galaxy and in fact, I love landing on planets and exploring around...


that's why I'm sad about leaving ED, because in fact, I love this game at the core... I just can't make it, it became too frustrating for me and that's not fun anymore

You know, if you simply want to restore that kind of low-stakes gameplay, there's one simple fix: either reset your account, or get a second account whenever ED is on sale. Once you do, find a small ship you like to fly, and don't worry about flying anything larger to maximize your income. It's the exact same gameplay, only with a cheaper ship and no need to worry about a high trade rank attracting high-level NPC pirates to you.

But if you'd rather still fly that Type-9, may I humbly recommend this build:

edit: I missed that the original didn't have an SCO already installed...

EDSY

EDSY is a ship outfitting tool for Elite Dangerous

edsy.org

You gain 12 tons of cargo, lose a light year of jump range, but it almost doubles your shield power and armor. Chaff isn't really useful for large ships like the Type-9 Heavy, and you really have no need for a heat sink unless you're planning on using Silent Running. I'm not sure why you would even want to carry weapons. Supercruise Assist really should be labeled the "How to waste your time and get interdicted repeatedly" module. I'm not sure what good such a small fuel scoop is, given that it would be almost as fast to refuel at a station mid-trip even with a docking computer. And for the love of all that's holy, A-Rate your engines and shield generator!

Also, you should consider doing some light (Grade-3) engineering. It takes about a percentage of the materials required for complete a G5 mod, provides 90% of the full benefits of a completed G5 mod, and has half the penalties.

 

[Ghiby]

I'm not offended at all, so no apology required.

And obviously what 'fun' is, is relative.

My point was that having a credit restricted game actually (for me, anyway) was great, because then choices really matter, something that does not really feature in 2024 ED.

my friend, I'm not very good at ED, I consider myself still a beginner because I'm still learning every day, and I didn't reach elite rank in any area, I'm barely tycoon in trading and that just because I do a lot of trading...

my point is that my choices really matter, a lot, especially because I can't afford to risk my little cash reserves... if I load my hauler with 8 Mil cargo, and an NPC elite in combat blows me to pieces, because I'm just novice at combat, and he has a nimble Anaconda, while I have a basic T9 unengineered, and as such I lose the 8 Mil I had as far as cargo, for me counts a lot, it's a big, big blow to me... so my choices really count...

When was the last time you worried about money, or had to choose between a weapon or a new PD? In this context (if FD kept a lid on credit inflation) engineering would have then had a place - you'd be modifying inferior equipment to a higher standard rather than simply going G5 on A rated gear simply because you can't easily get or afford top end stuff.

every day I play... due to this discussion here, I logged back in and just purchased a 6A SCO, because everyone here said it's a game changer and it's a great help, an awesome module to have... so, I spent 19 Mil. (hard earned cash) on this module for my hauler boat, the T9, SCO that I admit, I don't know yet how to properly use, since I just got it, and what do you know? not long after, I got interdicted again and during the mini-game, the SCO wouldn't work, and wouldn't activate... luckily for me, this time the NPC pirate wasn't a elite with an Anaconda, so I managed to win the minigame, at the expense of destroying my joystick, but anyway, I managed to escape and save the cargo I was hauling...

so my friend, every day I play I am worried about money... how do you think I got this old T9 that I put in over 100 Mil as far as investment?? by worrying about money, and grinding like a slave for virtual cash so I can afford it... and when I finally have it, I am blown to pieces by overpowered NPC pirates...

What I find off-putting in ED is that the game heavily revolves around getting the best stuff as a starting point, rather than it being a long term thing. Flowing from that we can buy the best ships instantly, and never have to really make serious choices because we always have the cushion of money.

the answer to that is simple my friend, and here is why:

• people players, don't enjoy grinding for long periods of time, they want instant gratification
• if they don't get it, they move on to other games where they can get that, and as such abandon the current game, as I'm about to do
• abandoning a game, and not playing it, is not what the developers, publishers, and the actual owners of the game want, because this way chances of players spending real money on the game are diminishing with each player that leaves the game - that's business 101, nothing more
• the more successful developers, publishers, and owners, are successful because they offer the cardinal sin here, aka "pay-to-play", or "pay-to-win"
• every major, and financially successful developer-publisher does it, EA, Microsoft, Activision - aka Microsoft again, Ubisoft, Paradox, R* - with their GTA series - Bethesda, aka Microsoft again, and I could go on and on, the list is too long to post it here, so everyone does it, and as such players, users are used to it, not to mention, it's normal, it's the entertaining business, you pay to be entertained, I have no problem with that, I go to movies, I pay, I get a DVD, I pay, I rent a DVD I pay, so it comes natural to me if I play a game to be entertained, I pay too, not just for the game itself, once the game becomes an online entity, with its own life and community then an online ongoing set of expenses are in place (maintenance, servers hosting, etc. etc. etc) so the company needs revenue to cover those expenses, hence pay-to-play and pay-to-win...

but, no here in ED that's the capital sin...

my final consideration of this comment of mine, is that this "capital sin" will be allowed here also, because Frontier needs to survive and produce good financial results for its shareholders, and there is no other way than pay-to-play or pay-to-win, or a combination of both...

from a business point of view, for Frontier, each project, in this case ED, needs to bring in its own share of the revenue... hence is expected ED to make revenue, and this revenue in ED is not there, not where it's supposed to be by financial predictions and expectations, based on the investments to bring ED to fruition and to maintain it...

so that's why they've introduced early access to ships for arx, aka real money, or fancy liveries for tons of arx, that no one can even see while flying, because there is no decent third-person bird's eye view, so you can see your own ship while flying ot fighting, or mining, or whatever it is we do in ED... and please, please, don't bring up the camera-view, I'm well aware of that, and that's for screenshots and content creation, as you well know, it's not for while flying, or fighting or whatever... just look at any flight sim, or Eve, or car racing games, or GTA, and see what a third-person view is and how it feels when you are fighting for example... and please, don't tell me it breaks the immersion, because it's not true... it breaks the immersion to enter the camera-view, so I can see my livery on my ship... that's what break the immersion, not switching views from cockpit to third person view and eventually back to the cockpit if I wanna be glued to the cockpit...

that's why I was letting them (fdevs) know I am leaving, and with me, my money is leaving, and going someplace else, to another developer-owner, and not to them...that's why I was letting them know, I may come back when I can buy a carrier with arx, so I can pay with my credit card for a carrier, not ground endlessly to buy a carrier... I know, many may not agree with me, and that's OK... I reserve the right to express freely my opinions, and this is what I was doing with my post here, I was talking to the fdevs...

I'm honestly amazed, impressed, and overwhelmed by the reactions from you guys to my insignificant post, when in fact I was addressing fdevs...

 

[Nowski]

may I humbly recommend this build:

EDSY

EDSY is a ship outfitting tool for Elite Dangerous

edsy.org

You gain 12 tons of cargo, lose a light year of jump range

Wouldn't SCO get back some of that range, or did I miss something?

 

[Darkfyre99]

Wouldn't SCO get back some of that range, or did I miss something?

No... that would be me missing something. I assumed it would've already had SCO. I'll edit the build accordingly.

 

[Ghiby]

The thing that really annoys me about this game is the sheer volume of bad advice out there, and how it drowns out the good advice. This has been true since the first iteration of Supercruise, and it didn't take long before bad advice on how to use SCO was quickly adopted as gospel.

Any Supercruise journey can be broken down to three phases:

1. Escaping From a Gravity Well - Speeding up this phase is tthe best use case for an SCO boost, especially if you're escaping from the surface of a world.
2. Traversing a System's Ecliptic Plane - You really don't want to travel through a system's ecliptic plane. That's where all the mass of the system is which will slow you down. Travel above or below it. Distances longer than about 200 light seconds make a second SCO boost (after your FSD cools down from the first) worth your while.
3. Entering a Gravity Well - This phase is where you're most vulnerable to being interdicted, and also the phase that takes the longest if you're using Supercruise Assist or the mind meltingly bad advice of the "Six Second Rule." This is a very bad combination, because it can easily lead to a series of interdiction attempts.

The nature of how Supercruise works means you'll really can't escape doing some hands-on flying during Phase Three. It's a question of what kind of hands-on flying you want to do: a gravity braking maneuver at your destination, or evading (an) interdiciton attempt(s). The closest compromise available to you is simply not throttling down until you're about two seconds out, throttle down and fly past the planet, and then loop around to approach your destination. It may not be as fast as gravity braking, but it's still much faster than the six second rule, doesn't require nearly as much skill, and you're still much less likely to be interdicted by NPCs.

Especially if you complete phase one and two quickly as well.

this sounds like good advice, so I'll definitely try to see how it works using this procedure

You know, if you simply want to restore that kind of low-stakes gameplay, there's one simple fix: either reset your account, or get a second account whenever ED is on sale. Once you do, find a small ship you like to fly, and don't worry about flying anything larger to maximize your income. It's the exact same gameplay, only with a cheaper ship and no need to worry about a high trade rank attracting high-level NPC pirates to you.

no my friend, I can't stand the round based games, I don't play round based games by default, and if one game manages to fool me into joining and I realize it's in fact a round based game, I leave as soon as I see it...

by round base I mean "Game Over" start again... that was for me acceptable way back in the Commodore era, and even then with reluctance, but at that time was no other option... now, however, we're in the 2024, 2025 soon to be era, so this is not acceptable to me anymore, like a Game Over, reset, and start all over again... this is again, in my book, it's painful, it's tedious, it's just working in vain... why would I work all this time, years in real life, to reach the meager level that I've reached, to own a T9, and a Phyton, and an Anaconda, and a bit more, only to reset my account and start all over again, all the work again..??.. I would never do that, and if the game forced me to do that, I would leave the next day...

start a new account, fresh from the ground up and build it up again, it's the same idea, I would never do that, it's pointless work again and again... I did mention I don't enjoy grinding... so this option is not a good one for me...

But if you'd rather still fly that Type-9, may I humbly recommend this build:

EDSY

EDSY is a ship outfitting tool for Elite Dangerous

edsy.org

You gain 12 tons of cargo, lose a light year of jump range, but it almost doubles your shield power and armor. Chaff isn't really useful for large ships like the Type-9 Heavy, and you really have no need for a heat sink unless you're planning on using Silent Running. I'm not sure why you would even want to carry weapons. Supercruise Assist really should be labeled the "How to waste your time and get interdicted repeatedly" module. I'm not sure what good such a small fuel scoop is, given that it would be almost as fast to refuel at a station mid-trip even with a docking computer. And for the love of all that's holy, A-Rate your engines and shield generator!

I will try this configuration as it seems feasible... but at a first glance, I am losing the heatsinks and fuel scoop, which I may need for longer trips, tho' I admit I'm doing fewer and fewer longer trips with the T9... but no supercruise assist... I was considering that and I think I've experimented with it, but it's like not having autopilot, when needed, flying manually in supercruise, which requires a lot of focus... however I didn't try it in combination with using the SCO, so maybe that SCO may compensate for not having supercruise assist, I'll definitely try it and see how it goes...


looks like I should downgrade to a 5A power plant..??.. or I am not reading it right? now I have a 6A power plant

Also, you should consider doing some light (Grade-3) engineering. It takes about a percentage of the materials required for complete a G5 mod, provides 90% of the full benefits of a completed G5 mod, and has half the penalties.

yes, I agree engineering would be great, clearly any and all upgrades available via engineering would be great...

but, the process itself - aka grinding for the materials - is tedious, time-consuming, and not fun to me... I don't have the time, to log in, and when I do, I don't have the drive to look for the materials...

for example, to increase my jump range, I found for the FSD I need the so-called chemical processors, which I don't have... a squadron mate told me I can farm for imperial shields, and trade down to those chemical processors, once I have enough of those shields... so I went out, scanned for signals, found only 3 - yes, just three - imperial shields, in over one hour of roaming around an imperial system... I just don't have the time to spend endless hours in ED... so, I ask fdevs: like "Are you kidding me?? just 3 (three) pcs after one hour of roaming..??.." this must be a joke, or was made special to make it look like we work hard for it.. and whoever told you that working long and hard for something is fun..??..

sure, one may argue, I wasn't in the right system, I wasn't doing it right, I might be too slow, and so and so... and it may be right, but in the end, for me is still frustrating, not fun, and I don't have the time for it...

why I don't have the time?

• first, because I have a real life too, a family, friends, a job, a life in real life...
• second because I also play other games, that are more fun - to me at least - where I don't have to grind for hours to get some little materials, for the so-called engineering, where I can easily clear PvE content, get great rewards in the process, have fun with friends, and like a fool, open my credit card to make in-game purchases, because I'm having fun... not because I'm frustrated because I can't find the materials needed for engineering, not because I'm attacked by overpowered NPCs, not because I'm losing my ship and cargo being ganked by NPCs... not sure how better to explain it, but I hope you guys get my point...

it's one thing to keep grinding, hoping to find the materials you need, to make the money you need, and if you don't to be frustrated... and it's another thing to play a fun and relaxing game, to clear content relatively easy in PvE, to get nice sweet rewards in the process, and chat and joke around with friends doing the same thing as you do...

in the end, what I'm trying to say to the fdevs, is that you can make ED be that fun and relaxing game too, where players come, have fun, and open their credit cards to make purchases... grinding endlessly for hours, for cash, or materials, and/or being ganked by NPCs is not fun, I'm not sure how can I be more clear than that...

 

[Felix DiCestria]

Supercruise Assist really should be labeled the "How to waste your time and get interdicted repeatedly" module.

The "SCA trick" where you can drop at a starports at upto 1C. Aim off the the port so SCA tells you Align with destination and pull in at the last moment. Saves quite a lot of time.

 

[Michael Ryan]

(...)

1. Entering a Gravity Well - This phase is where you're most vulnerable to being interdicted, and also the phase that takes the longest if you're using Supercruise Assist or the mind meltingly bad advice of the "Six Second Rule." This is a very bad combination, because it can easily lead to a series of interdiction attempts.

The nature of how Supercruise works means you'll really can't escape doing some hands-on flying during Phase Three. It's a question of what kind of hands-on flying you want to do: a gravity braking maneuver at your destination, or evading (an) interdiciton attempt(s). The closest compromise available to you is simply not throttling down until you're about two seconds out, throttle down and fly past the planet, and then loop around to approach your destination. It may not be as fast as gravity braking, but it's still much faster than the six second rule, doesn't require nearly as much skill, and you're still much less likely to be interdicted by NPCs.

You can turn on supercruise assists just 2 seconds before the target and if your speed is circa less than 1c you do a super fast drop out. Needs practise but totally worth it.

 

[Ghiby]

Games are meant to be fun. I can well understand stopping a game if it isn't scratching a particular itch. I've been itching since the game's beta a decade ago. I'm not scratching as much as I used to

But you've bought the game, and it looks like you are listening to advice to see if you can get a wee bit of your money's worth back...

The SCO allows you to boost in supercruise. The way it helps in interdictions is that it gives you the opportunity to avoid getting interdicted in the first place. Whenever an NPC pirate is chasing you they'll announce it in the text messages. Look for something like "at last I've found you" or "come here little fishy" or words to that effect. Note the name of the NPC who's threatening you, and then target their ship. Once it's targeted you can see when they are sneaking up behind you. If they can't get behind you they can't interdict you. You can use the SCO to boost away from them, and/or make some headway to your destination while you are performing this cat-and-mouse trick

this is maybe the best advice I got about avoiding NPC pirates... I'll do that from now on...

the NPCs that blew my T9 into pieces - twice, in a two-hour gameplay session - were elite in combat, both flying Anacondas... an elite combat NPC (or human) pilot vs a novice combat pilot, in an Anaconda vs a heavy bulky T9 is a no brainer... I had like less than 1% chance to escape a nimble Anaconda and to win against an elite pilot in the actual fight...

I had no SCO at that time... now, I do, and if I see in time the taunting message they send, I will use the SCO hoping to get away...

others gave me some ideas on how to improve the T9 build, so I'll try that too and see how it goes...

but, just as a concept, being ganked by NPCs is not my idea of fun... at least not to me... so it defeats the purpose of playing a game for fun...

someone said that being challenged, that escaping successfully the pirates is the actual reward for transporting goods from point A to point B... I disagree with that... it may apply to some, that like to be challenged... I don't... and if I'm looking for a challenge, I play a game that I know is challenging and works my brain usually, not my eye-hand coordination skills...

in real life, if I buy merchandise low at the shipper and sell high at the delivery destination, that's the ultimate reward of making money, on top of not having an accident on the road and not being grounded by the cops for speeding or whatever else... not escaping pirates like in the age of sails on the seas...

here in ED, ok it's a wilderness sometimes, but I was in a medium security system, and vs an Anaconda the battle was swift, in a few seconds i was obliterated, so not enough time for the security vessels to appear on-site...

in the past, I was able to win the mini-game, or if not, to hold on in battle until the security vessels were arriving to save my butt... but the pirates then were not elite combat in Anacondas... were at a fair level aligned to my own level in combat...

I guess among other things, what I'm trying to say to fdevs, is that is not fair, not fun, to scale up the COMBAT level of NPCs pirates attacking a player, with the highest level of the player in any section... keep it combat to combat in scaling up... if I'm tycoon in trading, but a novice in combat, don't send an elite combat NPC pirate to gank me... it's counterintuitive and if it matters it's unfair...

 

[Darkfyre99]

I will try this configuration as it seems feasible... but at a first glance, I am losing the heatsinks and fuel scoop, which I may need for longer trips, tho' I admit I'm doing fewer and fewer longer trips with the T9...

Here's the deal with the fuel scoop: the 3A fuel scoop you'd originally installed would take about six minutes to fill your tanks. As a general rule when I'm considering how much time something takes, when dealing with slow heavy transports, it would add about about 4-5 minutes to my trip to detour to a station midway and refuel, six minutes for a slightly more casual Supercruise technique and less aggressive docking approach, or eight minutes if you're using SuperCruise Assist and a Docking Computer.

Since time is money, this is one area where you need to consider all opportunity costs in module choices, including time. Sometimes it might be worth it to sacrifice a little cargo space to complete a longer journey without refueling. Especially if your ship isn't engineered to run cool so you can save a little time by running a "hot jump": initiating a jump while you're still scooping at the star.

but no supercruise assist... I was considering that and I think I've experimented with it, but it's like not having autopilot, when needed, flying manually in supercruise, which requires a lot of focus... however I didn't try it in combination with using the SCO, so maybe that SCO may compensate for not having supercruise assist, I'll definitely try it and see how it goes...

Supercruise is one of those things that sounds nice IMO, but it will take the slowest, most interdiction-prone route to your destination, and doesn't take advantage of SCO. Supercruise Overdrive can hasten your journey, but it requires a hands on approach.

looks like I should downgrade to a 5A power plant..??.. or I am not reading it right? now I have a 6A power plant

You don't need the extra Power, and it'll allow you to save your credits for what's more important. A little light Engineering (G3) would allow you to run your ship with a 4A power plant.

yes, I agree engineering would be great, clearly any and all upgrades available via engineering would be great...

but, the process itself - aka grinding for the materials - is tedious, time-consuming, and not fun to me... I don't have the time, to log in, and when I do, I don't have the drive to look for the materials...

for example, to increase my jump range, I found for the FSD I need the so-called chemical processors, which I don't have... a squadron mate told me I can farm for imperial shields, and trade down to those chemical processors, once I have enough of those shields... so I went out, scanned for signals, found only 3 - yes, just three - imperial shields, in over one hour of roaming around an imperial system... I just don't have the time to spend endless hours in ED... so, I ask fdevs: like "Are you kidding me?? just 3 (three) pcs after one hour of roaming..??.." this must be a joke, or was made special to make it look like we work hard for it.. and whoever told you that working long and hard for something is fun..??..

This is why I recommend light (G3) enginnering, rather than heavy (complete G5) engineering. By trading down the components for a single G5 FSD roll, you get enough materials for nine G3 rolls. And given the recent massive increase in manufactured materials in high-grade emmissions, you'll only need to visit one to have hundreds of G1-G3 manufactured available to you after visiting a material trader.

The difficult part (which isn't all that difficult) is obtaining natural resources and data, neither of which can be obtained via trade. But aqain, you only to need to trade down few G5 minerals and data of the right type to give you plenty of G1-G3 mats.

Compare the stats of my build with G3 engineering only in the most important modules improved, vs the G5 build... and then compare the material costs of the two from stock.

Type-9 Heavy, G3 Engineering

Type-9 Heavy, G5 Engineering

Spoiler: Mats Item Type Lvl Qty Conductive Polymers Mfc G4 1 Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories Enc G4 1 Polymer Capacitors Mfc G4 1 Security Firmware Patch Enc G4 1 Mechanical Components Mfc G3 6 Electrochemical Arrays Mfc G3 3 Strange Wake Solutions Enc G3 3 Chromium Raw G2 6 Conductive Components Mfc G2 6 Chemical Processors Mfc G2 5 Flawed Focus Crystals Mfc G2 3 Galvanising Alloys Mfc G2 3 Hybrid Capacitors Mfc G2 3 Vanadium Raw G2 3 Mechanical Equipment Mfc G2 2 Phosphorus Raw G1 9 Atypical Disrupted Wake Echoes Enc G1 8 Iron Raw G1 6 Specialised Legacy Firmware Enc G1 6 Grid Resistors Mfc G1 5 Worn Shield Emitters Mfc G1 5 Anomalous Bulk Scan Data Enc G1 3 Sulphur Raw G1 3

Spoiler: Mats Item Type Lvl Qty Datamined Wake Exceptions Enc G5 5 Improvised Components Mfc G5 5 Military Supercapacitors Mfc G5 5 Pharmaceutical Isolators Mfc G5 5 Conductive Polymers Mfc G4 6 Configurable Components Mfc G4 6 Selenium Raw G4 6 Chemical Manipulators Mfc G4 5 Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories Enc G4 4 Polymer Capacitors Mfc G4 4 Security Firmware Patch Enc G4 1 Cadmium Raw G3 10 Classified Scan Databanks Enc G3 5 Cracked Industrial Firmware Enc G3 5 Mechanical Components Mfc G3 5 Chemical Distillery Mfc G3 3 Conductive Ceramics Mfc G3 3 Electrochemical Arrays Mfc G3 3 Strange Wake Solutions Enc G3 3 Arsenic Raw G2 10 Conductive Components Mfc G2 6 Manganese Raw G2 6 Chromium Raw G2 5 Chemical Processors Mfc G2 4 Flawed Focus Crystals Mfc G2 3 Galvanising Alloys Mfc G2 3 Hybrid Capacitors Mfc G2 3 Modified Consumer Firmware Enc G2 3 Unidentified Scan Archives Enc G2 3 Vanadium Raw G2 3 Mechanical Equipment Mfc G2 2 Atypical Disrupted Wake Echoes Enc G1 8 Phosphorus Raw G1 8 Iron Raw G1 6 Grid Resistors Mfc G1 5 Specialised Legacy Firmware Enc G1 5 Worn Shield Emitters Mfc G1 5 Anomalous Bulk Scan Data Enc G1 3 Sulphur Raw G1 3

Note that (nearly) every G5 material (raw materials are a bit different) can be traded downward for 3 G4's, 9 G3's, 27 G2's, or 81 G1's of the same type. You really don't need all that much to do G3 engineering, and you generally operate at 90% of its fully G5 engineered counterpart.

Hope this helps.

 

[Rubbernuke]

my friend, I'm not very good at ED, I consider myself still a beginner because I'm still learning every day, and I didn't reach elite rank in any area, I'm barely tycoon in trading and that just because I do a lot of trading...

my point is that my choices really matter, a lot, especially because I can't afford to risk my little cash reserves... if I load my hauler with 8 Mil cargo, and an NPC elite in combat blows me to pieces, because I'm just novice at combat, and he has a nimble Anaconda, while I have a basic T9 unengineered, and as such I lose the 8 Mil I had as far as cargo, for me counts a lot, it's a big, big blow to me... so my choices really count...



every day I play... due to this discussion here, I logged back in and just purchased a 6A SCO, because everyone here said it's a game changer and it's a great help, an awesome module to have... so, I spent 19 Mil. (hard earned cash) on this module for my hauler boat, the T9, SCO that I admit, I don't know yet how to properly use, since I just got it, and what do you know? not long after, I got interdicted again and during the mini-game, the SCO wouldn't work, and wouldn't activate... luckily for me, this time the NPC pirate wasn't a elite with an Anaconda, so I managed to win the minigame, at the expense of destroying my joystick, but anyway, I managed to escape and save the cargo I was hauling...

so my friend, every day I play I am worried about money... how do you think I got this old T9 that I put in over 100 Mil as far as investment?? by worrying about money, and grinding like a slave for virtual cash so I can afford it... and when I finally have it, I am blown to pieces by overpowered NPC pirates...



the answer to that is simple my friend, and here is why:

• people players, don't enjoy grinding for long periods of time, they want instant gratification
• if they don't get it, they move on to other games where they can get that, and as such abandon the current game, as I'm about to do
• abandoning a game, and not playing it, is not what the developers, publishers, and the actual owners of the game want, because this way chances of players spending real money on the game are diminishing with each player that leaves the game - that's business 101, nothing more
• the more successful developers, publishers, and owners, are successful because they offer the cardinal sin here, aka "pay-to-play", or "pay-to-win"
• every major, and financially successful developer-publisher does it, EA, Microsoft, Activision - aka Microsoft again, Ubisoft, Paradox, R* - with their GTA series - Bethesda, aka Microsoft again, and I could go on and on, the list is too long to post it here, so everyone does it, and as such players, users are used to it, not to mention, it's normal, it's the entertaining business, you pay to be entertained, I have no problem with that, I go to movies, I pay, I get a DVD, I pay, I rent a DVD I pay, so it comes natural to me if I play a game to be entertained, I pay too, not just for the game itself, once the game becomes an online entity, with its own life and community then an online ongoing set of expenses are in place (maintenance, servers hosting, etc. etc. etc) so the company needs revenue to cover those expenses, hence pay-to-play and pay-to-win...

but, no here in ED that's the capital sin...

my final consideration of this comment of mine, is that this "capital sin" will be allowed here also, because Frontier needs to survive and produce good financial results for its shareholders, and there is no other way than pay-to-play or pay-to-win, or a combination of both...

from a business point of view, for Frontier, each project, in this case ED, needs to bring in its own share of the revenue... hence is expected ED to make revenue, and this revenue in ED is not there, not where it's supposed to be by financial predictions and expectations, based on the investments to bring ED to fruition and to maintain it...

so that's why they've introduced early access to ships for arx, aka real money, or fancy liveries for tons of arx, that no one can even see while flying, because there is no decent third-person bird's eye view, so you can see your own ship while flying ot fighting, or mining, or whatever it is we do in ED... and please, please, don't bring up the camera-view, I'm well aware of that, and that's for screenshots and content creation, as you well know, it's not for while flying, or fighting or whatever... just look at any flight sim, or Eve, or car racing games, or GTA, and see what a third-person view is and how it feels when you are fighting for example... and please, don't tell me it breaks the immersion, because it's not true... it breaks the immersion to enter the camera-view, so I can see my livery on my ship... that's what break the immersion, not switching views from cockpit to third person view and eventually back to the cockpit if I wanna be glued to the cockpit...

that's why I was letting them (fdevs) know I am leaving, and with me, my money is leaving, and going someplace else, to another developer-owner, and not to them...that's why I was letting them know, I may come back when I can buy a carrier with arx, so I can pay with my credit card for a carrier, not ground endlessly to buy a carrier... I know, many may not agree with me, and that's OK... I reserve the right to express freely my opinions, and this is what I was doing with my post here, I was talking to the fdevs...

I'm honestly amazed, impressed, and overwhelmed by the reactions from you guys to my insignificant post, when in fact I was addressing fdevs...

While making the game too punishing is wrong making it too simple also leads to boredom, because you've got everything you wanted. I don't envy the devs but at the same time they made life for themselves far more difficult via power creep (ruined C+P balance), credit inflation (ruined engineering for the reason I suggested) and made consequences less impactful. They went from one extreme to the other, a one way process thats hard to come back from. EDs biggest problem early on was that money scarcity was not backed up with PvE gameplay to make use of that tension. If ED had launched as it is today it would be different because then owning ships like Lakons made sense (low repair costs, ubiquitous etc).

And as far as money is concerned, I have 400 million when I have bounties over one billion, and for a while I was doing BGS murder in an unengineered Clipper running away from ATR.

You can play as you like, but my advice is that you downsize ships and do missions that are easy- these days everything pays well. Not everything revolves around a T-9 and that if you are finding NPCs hard don't fly in a ship that is a flying brick. The joy of ED for me is you finding ways to do what you want, rather than sticking to one set path and failing.

 

[Ghiby]

While making the game too punishing is wrong making it too simple also leads to boredom, because you've got everything you wanted. I don't envy the devs but at the same time they made life for themselves far more difficult via power creep (ruined C+P balance), credit inflation (ruined engineering for the reason I suggested) and made consequences less impactful. They went from one extreme to the other, a one way process thats hard to come back from. EDs biggest problem early on was that money scarcity was not backed up with PvE gameplay to make use of that tension. If ED had launched as it is today it would be different because then owning ships like Lakons made sense (low repair costs, ubiquitous etc).

And as far as money is concerned, I have 400 million when I have bounties over one billion, and for a while I was doing BGS murder in an unengineered Clipper running away from ATR.

You can play as you like, but my advice is that you downsize ships and do missions that are easy- these days everything pays well. Not everything revolves around a T-9 and that if you are finding NPCs hard don't fly in a ship that is a flying brick. The joy of ED for me is you finding ways to do what you want, rather than sticking to one set path and failing.

you have good valid points, it's not easy to find the right balance between rewards and efforts, which is why this balancing ratio - rewards vs efforts ratio - is critical in the success or failure of a game, any game, and ED is no exception...

so yes, it's not easy for the fdevs & publisher/s teams to find the right touch, to please everyone, and either way it's not possible to please everyone... if you enjoy a more challenging - hard, difficult approach, more work for fewer rewards - others, like me, don't enjoy that...

about game style and doing missions

I did that long, long time ago way back when I started just when the Oddysey was released... once I got my first cargo boat, the T6 ('cause the hauler is just for fun), I never did missions anymore... they paid so little, it's not even worth the time to talk to the NPC mission giver, or to check the board on the screen... no offense, but a simple transport job, with 0 threat, pays around what?? 50-80k... in that range.... and you have to travel, do 2-3 jumps one way, then 2-3 jumps back... another type of mission, more risky, with threat higher and higher, pays maybe the maximum 300k, with a bonus, if it's there maybe up to 500k and you get drawn into PvE regardless if you want - and enjoy - or not... I don't enjoy fighting in ED, I don't like it, so I avoid it...

some missions with higher threat levels pay up to 1.5 maybe 2 Mil, but are difficult and hard - to a dumb player as myself - and so I don't even dare to do it...

while, doing cargo hauling, if done right, you can make 2 Mil minimum per jump... with my T9, if it's under 15 Mil per jump, I just don't waste my time...

not to mention, one can find a really good situation - that won't last long, based on market/price fluctuation, but still, on a temporary basis, a few weeks still works - so a decent situation for intersystem trading, like I just did, getting minerals from an extraction settlement on a planet, and selling those minerals to a refinery settlement on another planet, same system, not even 200 Ls away from each other, and making 12 Mil minimum (based on the cargo capacity, hence my 744 tons T9 is precious...

now, to own this T9 took me months, to fit it with the best modules (in my opinion) A rated and to find the right balance between operation, functionality, defense, speed, agility, and cargo-hauling capability, took me months once again... so, it's not like you clap your hands, and voila, you can make 12-20 Mil in like 10 Min of gameplay, or per jump

I'm not an expert at ED, far from it, I'm still learning and getting stuck in roadblocks that I encounter, but for me, for my game style doing missions, is just not feasible, not for my available time to spend online in ED, since on the other hand, I don't have much time to spend, just maybe 1-2 hrs of game-time, when I can find the time for ED...

I play other games too, FSX (which is not a game per see, it's a flight simulator) and Eve Online where I have an extensive network of assets built up since 2006 that needs to be maintained, otherwise I may lose it, and I also have some other games that I find fun, and as I've said in my first post, are even convincing me to spend real money on them, because it's fun, and I have no problems to spend some little money on a game that I find fun, like ESO... there, I'm not good either, I'm not advanced level, not the elite equivalent like here, but there I can clear PvE relatively easy, I can get some awsome rewards, without frustration, without being attacked by overpowered NPCs, without being ganked by NPCs, and I could go on and on, but the point is I also play other games that I enjoy, on top of having a life outside ED, in real life, so I can't spend more than 1-2 hrs per game session, whenever I find some time to log in...

that's where my frustration comes with ED... I spend around 1-2 hrs when I have the time in ED, I managed to build a decent (in my opinion) cargo ship my T9, took me months and months of grinding for cash and modules, and trial and error in fitting the ship to make it efficient (by ny own standards) and what do you know, when I have some time to do some cargo hauling as a dumb space trucker, I get ganked by NPCs and lose my ship and my cargo, not once, but twice...

and that after I tried to do passenger transport - in the bubble, not out in the dark - between systems not invaded and not controlled by Thargoids, and once again, I got ganked by Thargoids, that appeared out of nowhere and blew me and my passengers into pieces... why?? so I won't find ED "boring"... (I'll say it for a hundred times, in the core of the bubble, in a system not invaded or controlled by the Thargoids, apparently the Thargoids can teleport in the middle of the bubble, to target passenger transport ships, piloted by novice combat pilots, as myself)

'cause by some, just moving cargo or passengers from point A to point B, without being attacked, that's just "boring"...

well, for me, for my little 1-2 hrs of time available, that's not boring, but who am I to say what I like and what I dislike in a game...

they - fdevs - know it better, it's like:
"don't tell us what to do and how to do it, we know better, after all it's our game, we made it, we know better what's fun or not, what's boring or not"

@fdevs, are you reading that..??.. up there --^^^^^--

 

[Ghiby]

Here's the deal with the fuel scoop: the 3A fuel scoop you'd originally installed would take about six minutes to fill your tanks. As a general rule when I'm considering how much time something takes, when dealing with slow heavy transports, it would add about about 4-5 minutes to my trip to detour to a station midway and refuel, six minutes for a slightly more casual Supercruise technique and less aggressive docking approach, or eight minutes if you're using SuperCruise Assist and a Docking Computer.

Since time is money, this is one area where you need to consider all opportunity costs in module choices, including time. Sometimes it might be worth it to sacrifice a little cargo space to complete a longer journey without refueling. Especially if your ship isn't engineered to run cool so you can save a little time by running a "hot jump": initiating a jump while you're still scooping at the star.



Supercruise is one of those things that sounds nice IMO, but it will take the slowest, most interdiction-prone route to your destination, and doesn't take advantage of SCO. Supercruise Overdrive can hasten your journey, but it requires a hands on approach.



You don't need the extra Power, and it'll allow you to save your credits for what's more important. A little light Engineering (G3) would allow you to run your ship with a 4A power plant.



This is why I recommend light (G3) enginnering, rather than heavy (complete G5) engineering. By trading down the components for a single G5 FSD roll, you get enough materials for nine G3 rolls. And given the recent massive increase in manufactured materials in high-grade emmissions, you'll only need to visit one to have hundreds of G1-G3 manufactured available to you after visiting a material trader.

The difficult part (which isn't all that difficult) is obtaining natural resources and data, neither of which can be obtained via trade. But aqain, you only to need to trade down few G5 minerals and data of the right type to give you plenty of G1-G3 mats.

Compare the stats of my build with G3 engineering only in the most important modules improved, vs the G5 build... and then compare the material costs of the two from stock.

Type-9 Heavy, G3 Engineering

Type-9 Heavy, G5 Engineering

Spoiler: Mats Item Type Lvl Qty Conductive Polymers Mfc G4 1 Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories Enc G4 1 Polymer Capacitors Mfc G4 1 Security Firmware Patch Enc G4 1 Mechanical Components Mfc G3 6 Electrochemical Arrays Mfc G3 3 Strange Wake Solutions Enc G3 3 Chromium Raw G2 6 Conductive Components Mfc G2 6 Chemical Processors Mfc G2 5 Flawed Focus Crystals Mfc G2 3 Galvanising Alloys Mfc G2 3 Hybrid Capacitors Mfc G2 3 Vanadium Raw G2 3 Mechanical Equipment Mfc G2 2 Phosphorus Raw G1 9 Atypical Disrupted Wake Echoes Enc G1 8 Iron Raw G1 6 Specialised Legacy Firmware Enc G1 6 Grid Resistors Mfc G1 5 Worn Shield Emitters Mfc G1 5 Anomalous Bulk Scan Data Enc G1 3 Sulphur Raw G1 3

Spoiler: Mats Item Type Lvl Qty Datamined Wake Exceptions Enc G5 5 Improvised Components Mfc G5 5 Military Supercapacitors Mfc G5 5 Pharmaceutical Isolators Mfc G5 5 Conductive Polymers Mfc G4 6 Configurable Components Mfc G4 6 Selenium Raw G4 6 Chemical Manipulators Mfc G4 5 Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories Enc G4 4 Polymer Capacitors Mfc G4 4 Security Firmware Patch Enc G4 1 Cadmium Raw G3 10 Classified Scan Databanks Enc G3 5 Cracked Industrial Firmware Enc G3 5 Mechanical Components Mfc G3 5 Chemical Distillery Mfc G3 3 Conductive Ceramics Mfc G3 3 Electrochemical Arrays Mfc G3 3 Strange Wake Solutions Enc G3 3 Arsenic Raw G2 10 Conductive Components Mfc G2 6 Manganese Raw G2 6 Chromium Raw G2 5 Chemical Processors Mfc G2 4 Flawed Focus Crystals Mfc G2 3 Galvanising Alloys Mfc G2 3 Hybrid Capacitors Mfc G2 3 Modified Consumer Firmware Enc G2 3 Unidentified Scan Archives Enc G2 3 Vanadium Raw G2 3 Mechanical Equipment Mfc G2 2 Atypical Disrupted Wake Echoes Enc G1 8 Phosphorus Raw G1 8 Iron Raw G1 6 Grid Resistors Mfc G1 5 Specialised Legacy Firmware Enc G1 5 Worn Shield Emitters Mfc G1 5 Anomalous Bulk Scan Data Enc G1 3 Sulphur Raw G1 3

Note that (nearly) every G5 material (raw materials are a bit different) can be traded downward for 3 G4's, 9 G3's, 27 G2's, or 81 G1's of the same type. You really don't need all that much to do G3 engineering, and you generally operate at 90% of its fully G5 engineered counterpart.

Hope this helps.

well, I'm sure you are right, especially about the engineering, since you're not the only one advising me to upgrade my ships, and modules, with some engineering... so I am not questioning the advice itself, I am aware that I could significantly improve my ship/s and modules with some good engineering

the thing is too grindy, this activity of finding the right materials and whatever else is needed, farming for them, chasing them around the galaxy, is tedious, time-consuming, is repetitive, to me is also boring, it's like having a second job, in a game, and working for some rewards that should be easier to get in my opinion as a simple player...

@ fdevs:
I already have a job in real life, grinding for real cash, so I don't need a 2nd job in a game grinding for virtual cash or rewards... I don't log into a game to "work" again, I just came home from my real life work, and I want to have fun, to relax, to enjoy playing a game, not to work again, even more hours, now in a virtual game...

@fdes, are you reading this..??.. up there --^^--

as I've mentioned before, I don't have much time to play ED, I am just a casual player, I barely have 1-2 hrs of game-time whenever I find the time to play

@Darkfyre99 - back to our conversation,
maybe I should join you on a trip to gather materials for engineering and learn even more about it, from you, if it can be done in 1-2 hrs of game-time

for example, I just did a farming trip for HGE - high-grade emissions - to find imperial shields in an imperial system, based on the advice of squadmates, because I need chemical processors, for FSD to engineer it, to increase the range... so, I did just that, worked, took me more than 1 hrs, but I got it... went to the trader, and traded it down to the chem-processors I needed it, all good right..??..

well, what do you know...??.. now I need Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories and such things...

again, I don't have the time, the drive to do it again and again, this is boring to me, this is like working, not like having fun... it's fun the first time, maybe the second time, but to do it again and again, that's working, that's grinding, and that's not fun to me...

I've mentioned in a previous message why I don't have the time, and why I don't find it fun...

and I know well what "fun" means to me, it may not be the same for you, or any other player...

which is why my post and comments here are not to argue with you guys, but for fdevs to see, and asses what players like me think, and feel, and why players like me are leaving the game, abandoning the game, and maybe more importantly why we are not spending real money for arx to support the game... if nothing else, I hope they care why players are not spending real money to buy arx to support the game... or maybe they don't care, and in that case, it's really time for me to go and move on...

I'll say it again - for fdevs - I just spent a bunch of money, real cash, on another game, because it's fun and relaxing and rewarding to me... I could spend the same cash on ED, I have disposable income, and I could spend it on what I find fun, but how can I spend on a game that I find frustrating, not fun..??..

@ fdevs again
for example, here is another roadblock, or bug, or glitch, or whatever we want to call it, that makes the game frustrating for me, and not fun, and as such it doesn't convince me to open my wallet and use my credit card to buy arx

after my HGE farming trip in a T6, I had some limpets left in the cargo, and I forgot I should sell before leaving the ship and the station...

so, I left the station using an Apex shuttle, moving to another system to use another ship I had nearby...

I come back to the T6 via an Apex shuttle, and what do you know, now I cannot access my hangar, and my ship, because "a ship cannot be stored with cargo", and like a dumb player, I forgot I have some limpets left in the cargo when I left...

so now what?? how can I access my ship, that clearly is there, on the galaxy map, and the system map clearly shows that I have a ship waiting for me, yet, I cannot access the ship...

I've tried to transfer another ship, an empty one, from another system in the vicinity, and the other empty ship arrived, and the same thing, I cannot make the empty ship my active ship, because my active ship has cargo, and I can't switch ships...

so, I'm stuck on foot, in the concourse, and I cannot access the hangar to jump into my ship, simply because I forgot some limpets in the cargo when I left... that's frustrating to me, not fun at all... I'm wasting time, just trying to get back into my ship, not even playing the game, because I can't get back to the ship... how fun is that..??..

 

[Rat Catcher]

because I can't get back to the ship... how fun is that..??..

Apex is your friend - take a taxi to wherever you left it.
I think there are a lot of us who have made that same error at some point in our play!

 

[aRJay]

well, I'm sure you are right, especially about the engineering, since you're not the only one advising me to upgrade my ships, and modules, with some engineering... so I am not questioning the advice itself, I am aware that I could significantly improve my ship/s and modules with some good engineering

the thing is too grindy, this activity of finding the right materials and whatever else is needed, farming for them, chasing them around the galaxy, is tedious, time-consuming, is repetitive, to me is also boring, it's like having a second job, in a game, and working for some rewards that should be easier to get in my opinion as a simple player...

@ fdevs:
I already have a job in real life, grinding for real cash, so I don't need a 2nd job in a game grinding for virtual cash or rewards... I don't log into a game to "work" again, I just came home from my real life work, and I want to have fun, to relax, to enjoy playing a game, not to work again, even more hours, now in a virtual game...

@fdes, are you reading this..??.. up there --^^--

as I've mentioned before, I don't have much time to play ED, I am just a casual player, I barely have 1-2 hrs of game-time whenever I find the time to play

@Darkfyre99 - back to our conversation,
maybe I should join you on a trip to gather materials for engineering and learn even more about it, from you, if it can be done in 1-2 hrs of game-time

for example, I just did a farming trip for HGE - high-grade emissions - to find imperial shields in an imperial system, based on the advice of squadmates, because I need chemical processors, for FSD to engineer it, to increase the range... so, I did just that, worked, took me more than 1 hrs, but I got it... went to the trader, and traded it down to the chem-processors I needed it, all good right..??..

well, what do you know...??.. now I need Eccentric Hyperspace Trajectories and such things...

again, I don't have the time, the drive to do it again and again, this is boring to me, this is like working, not like having fun... it's fun the first time, maybe the second time, but to do it again and again, that's working, that's grinding, and that's not fun to me...

I've mentioned in a previous message why I don't have the time, and why I don't find it fun...

and I know well what "fun" means to me, it may not be the same for you, or any other player...

which is why my post and comments here are not to argue with you guys, but for fdevs to see, and asses what players like me think, and feel, and why players like me are leaving the game, abandoning the game, and maybe more importantly why we are not spending real money for arx to support the game... if nothing else, I hope they care why players are not spending real money to buy arx to support the game... or maybe they don't care, and in that case, it's really time for me to go and move on...

I'll say it again - for fdevs - I just spent a bunch of money, real cash, on another game, because it's fun and relaxing and rewarding to me... I could spend the same cash on ED, I have disposable income, and I could spend it on what I find fun, but how can I spend on a game that I find frustrating, not fun..??..

@ fdevs again
for example, here is another roadblock, or bug, or glitch, or whatever we want to call it, that makes the game frustrating for me, and not fun, and as such it doesn't convince me to open my wallet and use my credit card to buy arx

after my HGE farming trip in a T6, I had some limpets left in the cargo, and I forgot I should sell before leaving the ship and the station...

so, I left the station using an Apex shuttle, moving to another system to use another ship I had nearby...

I come back to the T6 via an Apex shuttle, and what do you know, now I cannot access my hangar, and my ship, because "a ship cannot be stored with cargo", and like a dumb player, I forgot I have some limpets left in the cargo when I left...

so now what?? how can I access my ship, that clearly is there, on the galaxy map, and the system map clearly shows that I have a ship waiting for me, yet, I cannot access the ship...

I've tried to transfer another ship, an empty one, from another system in the vicinity, and the other empty ship arrived, and the same thing, I cannot make the empty ship my active ship, because my active ship has cargo, and I can't switch ships...

so, I'm stuck on foot, in the concourse, and I cannot access the hangar to jump into my ship, simply because I forgot some limpets in the cargo when I left... that's frustrating to me, not fun at all... I'm wasting time, just trying to get back into my ship, not even playing the game, because I can't get back to the ship... how fun is that..??..

I thought if you tried to transfer you active ship with cargo to your location it gave you the option to do it buy selling/disposing of the cargo.
But I could be wrong about that.

As for engineering the recent changes have removed the randomness from the process so G1 is always 1 roll, going from that to G2 is another 2 rolls etc.
However you still need some materials and unlocks which might not fit in with how you want to play.
But while G3 is the sweet spot regarding effort and performance G1 is a useful improvement and would require one of each mat needed.

 

[Ghiby]

Apex is your friend - take a taxi to wherever you left it.
I think there are a lot of us who have made that same error at some point in our play!

yes, I did took an Apex taxi shuttle back to my location and my ship, I'm there now in-game, where my ship is at, but it won't let me use the elevator to get to my hangar telling me "No accessible ships docked"

so, I'm on foot inside the concourse loitering... I went to the Inter Astra ships dealer, to access or transfer my ship and:
- the "use this ship" button is grayed out, I cannot use it, because I have an error message in red letters telling me "Your current ship contains cargo"... so OK, but how can I switch to another ship that's empty, with no cargo, at the same location, it doesn't give me the option, when I choose to use that ship, that's empty with no cargo

the only option I have is to sell the stored ship - but I don't want to sell the stored ship, took me months to put it together, so I don't want to sell it