To Solo Play Players: If You Could Disable PVP, Would You Play in Open Play Mode Instead?

"To Solo Play Players: If You Could Disable PVP, Would You Play in Open Play Mode Instead?"

Yes.

In fact, it's a huge shame that Elite has decided it's "spirit" has to be a carbon copy of EvE online, because the whole reason I jumped in to Elite was the ability to switch PvP off via solo mode in the first place.

In theory, the idea of a grand open sandbox where everyone can do everything, and thus actions have consequences and players can strive with or against each other for great things is a beautiful one. Wandering the stars, randomly encountering fellow players, and making new friends or enemies on grand adventures is a glorious idea. But with a free for all PvP mode rather then something that can be toggled, it simply does not work that way.

In practice, the sad reality is that the minority of people on the internet will ruin it for everyone else. By which I mean a minority will aquire the best possible equipment and then proceed to make life miserable for those who have no means of retaliating, particularly newer players like myself.

I am painfully aware that I would have no defense against the vast majority of players in open and thus make real sure to only play in solo. The developer might say it would go against " the spirit of elite", but shockingly, being constantly preyed upon by veteran players impeding my progress is not my idea of fun.

This is a system that rewards only veterans, or those with vast amounts of time to pour in to a game. For someone like me, who has to balance my game time with real life duties that mean I may have only one or two hours on a day, if even that, I need to spend my time carefully and can't be caught up in constant ambushes.

I would love to play "with" players, but there seems to be a norm in this game that those players who want cooperation go into solo, and only those who prey on others go into open. Thus, there is no playing "with". Only "against".

This is even worse then EvE online, in other words. And the whole reason I left that game was precisely because of this.
I can play that game just fine, but due to the predatory nature of it's gameplay, I cannot simply log in and do the things I want to do, I have to take huge precautions and mostly, travel with friends. That means any game activity I want to do that my alliance does not, I have to skip on, and the ultimate result of that was that I simply wasn't playing the game, because in practice, it wasn't an option to play it the way I wanted to. Not without having my fleet of pricey ships destroyed one by one.

I am not sure what "the spirit of Elite Dangerous" is supposed to be. Playing the game, it feels like a labour of love, with ultra realism pouring from every pixel in a way that draws and entices. It is a wonderous game. It does not feel like its meant to be a PvP centric game where players striving against each other at all times is the idea. It feels like a game meant to be played as a game of discovery and cooperation, with combat only a minimal part of the experience.

But the open mode doesnt seem to be able to make that spirit come to life at all.
 
I sympathise with what CMDR @Anaya has said but my (oft repeated 2 cents worth opinion) is that the "danger" of Open is vastly overblown but so is the chance for random encounters leading to co-op gameplay.

It's overblown because short of the following systems https://inara.cz/reports-security/ PvP is very rare, so "being constantly preyed upon by veteran players impeding my progress..." isn't the reality unless you are constantly visiting these systems. Deciat is perhaps the only exception where you need to visit Felicity at least once to pin the FSD upgrade blueprint (and ofc no experimentals if you do it remotely either). I don't include CGs as they are very much designed to be hotspots, meaning it's unrealistic to expect no PvP in these systems.

Co-Op play is extremely hard to organise without either using the Discord or being an active member of a Squadron already - if PvP is rare then (random) Co-Op play is even rarer.

There are plenty of Co-Op Open groups to join - if you want - but it's a faff that I would love to see improved. There's not much organic Co-Op play opportunities.

Finally, no one sensible looks down on CMDRs who choose Solo or PG to do their activities. It's more the "spirit of Elite" to be given a choice IMHO.
 
Yeah but I do wish I could just go out and do things without having to worry about PvP'ers blowing my ship apart.
You're definetely right that the "git gud" crowd seems to exaggerate the danger levels a bit. At the same time, I'd love to just fly in and help players I encounter on their adventures, but my common sense tells me something over 50% of them would just turn their guns on me if I tried, because I AM used to players being exceptionally competitive in a "PvP always on" environment.

Elite would be a wonderful game if that mechanic were to be turned off, and that would also dinstinguish it from it's older sibling, EvE online.

I remember in the heyday of sandboxes you had oodles of them you could sink the better part of a life in to without PvP being always on. Granted, Elite in particular could use more mechanics to build things for that to work (town building mechanics, ship interiors, the ability to colonize new systems, crafting things rather then buying them from npc's, ect..)
 
Co-Op play is extremely hard to organise without either using the Discord or being an active member of a Squadron already - if PvP is rare then (random) Co-Op play is even rarer.
It's not like that with me.
I go into the open and choose to wait for the ecpiege, usually 1-2 appear quickly enough.

I don't use Discord, much less Squadrons.
 
I'd agree that the 'Eve' culture isn't welcome. I decided not to get that game due to the apparent inability to act independently.
Steering clear of SC for the same reason.

Elite doesn't have that dynamic, the Bubble is easily large enough to get lost in without interference.
The advice to use Solo/PG holds for engineer systems and CGs.
Beyond that it's a vastly different atmosphere.
I've never had a hostile encounter away from a CG system, even most of the engineers are quiet these days, Deciat and Shinrarta being obvious exceptions.
Elsewhere it's usually o7 Cmdr with the occasional more in depth conversation.
 
That can have a eide variety of reasons.
e.g. they sit down and have diplomacy after they showed each other - role play. Or they move on with stuff they usually do because sitting in space waiting for enemies doesnt get the BGS work done.

Diplomacy, or "decisive" duels/wingfights... or also the latter, may happen of course (and feeds the "wall of shame" :D ).
 
I'm curious: what kind of 'non pvp' interaction do you have in mind in the case of Elite Dangerous?
Well... I'm a trader/miner/explorer, so most of my gameplay is entirely solo. However, I'm playing to relax and wind down after working in real life. I don't need to be stressed out by fleets of player gankers blowing up my tradeship (which can't defend itself... it's a TRADE ship) for jollies. Meanwhile, I'm a social person, and enjoy just chatting with people. Watching people going by in their ships, checking out their customizations, and so on.
As far as doing things WITH other players, I would LOVE to try taking on some Thargoids. Solo, there's no way I can... but in a group, I might be able to contribute.

As an explorer, it would be neat going to a world as a kind of away team, where we all spread out and search for samples or what have you.

There are things I'd love to be able to do. The social things are of most interest with me, but there are other things to do.
 
I would play in Open if PvP could be disabled.

The problem for me is that player interdictions vastly favor the interdictor so you will get pulled there’s no “competing”.

Then once you’re in real space for all intents and purposes:

- A combat ship will beat an optimized trade/exploration/mining ship

- An engineered combat ship will beat a combat ship

- A wing of ships will beat all.

It’s not rock, paper, scissors, it’s just A beats B beats C.

It could be balanced for example of interdictions were competitive and if attacking a member of the Pilot’s Federation was met with harsh galaxy wide punishment, for example becoming hostile to every member of the pilots federation and stations.

But Mobius is just a simpler solution
 
I would play in Open if PvP could be disabled.

The problem for me is that player interdictions vastly favor the interdictor so you will get pulled there’s no “competing”.

Then once you’re in real space for all intents and purposes:

- A combat ship will beat an optimized trade/exploration/mining ship

- An engineered combat ship will beat a combat ship

- A wing of ships will beat all.

It’s not rock, paper, scissors, it’s just A beats B beats C.

It could be balanced for example of interdictions were competitive and if attacking a member of the Pilot’s Federation was met with harsh galaxy wide punishment, for example becoming hostile to every member of the pilots federation and stations.

But Mobius is just a simpler solution
This has been in the game for quite some time. It's called: bad reputation.
And if any of the gankers want to remove it (according to them it does not bother them) they do not turn off the computer at night.
And how to determine the honest pirate from the ganker?

In essence, PP allows you to attack other players as part of a hostile force.
Destroying a pirate doesn't make you a criminal either. That just leaves you as a pirate.
I was suggesting that at a minimum there should be a cargo scanner check ...

Basically, an honest pirate should always have 3 things: a cargo scanner, a cargo bay, and drones.
 
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Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
Everything you do in this game is PvP...indirect...but still PvP....
... while not requiring any player to engage in in-the-same-instance PvP while engaged in game features - by design - the three modes and the single shared galaxy have meant that indirect asynchronous competition has been baked in to the game since we first heard about it, over nine years ago, whereas direct competition cannot be forced on other players - even if some can't accept it.
 
... while not requiring any player to engage in in-the-same-instance PvP while engaged in game features - by design - the three modes and the single shared galaxy have meant that indirect asynchronous competition has been baked in to the game since we first heard about it, over nine years ago, whereas direct competition cannot be forced on other players - even if some can't accept it.
That is, if I go into the open game I accept the imposition of direct competition on me ?

P.S. PG is no guarantee against this either.
 

Robert Maynard

Volunteer Moderator
That is, if I go into the open game I accept the imposition of direct competition on me ?

P.S. PG is no guarantee against this either.
That is indeed the case, if one meets those who wish to oppose. There's no PvE multi-player game mode in this game as players can shoot at anything they instance with.
 
I would play in open PvP if security systems were setup in a meaningful way.
- High security systems should be safe
- Medium security kinda dangerous
- Low security pure anarchy

The issue many regular players may forget is that those who don't combat regularly don't stand a chance. I just started playing after 6 month hiatus, I had to look up my basic keybinds just for basic functions. My exploration ship obviously doesn't stand any chance against any ganking, and I have no memory on how to fly my combat ships.

Sure after 5-10 hours of practicing against npc's in each of my various ships, checking the armaments, etc and I might be okay, but then there is the unknown ship upgrades that might have happened in my absence. So another bunch of hours required to research possible ship equipment upgrades. During all of this I don't feel like being blown apart.

I expect many commanders are in my situation following the crappy EDO launch last year, where playing ED was placed on hold.
 
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