What Would Make Most Players Happy?

Disagreed. I think it's pretty silly lore-wise that anyone with a bounty gets 95% of their ship's value handed to them, however if we completely took away insurance from pirates, it would throw so many people off of the role that it would never become widespread, and thus bounty hunters would suffer.

I think it should be revoked in cases of murder (not theft) in any of the high to medium security systems, but all is fair when it comes to anarchic space and the pilot's federation in this case should just not give a hoot as there really is nobody that cares in system to report the crimes to. What happens in anarchic space stays in anarchic space and all that jazz.......

this would vastly reduce crime (especially murder) in secure systems but have no impact on anarchies and would help relocate players with a naughty streak to the systems they should be in. With the increased profits from trade made available by desperate colonists also in these systems that would attract traders that wish to live on the dangerous side to reap the rewards of that trade at the risk of possibly running a gauntlet of the scum of society (no insult intended) to get those profits.

just my $0.02
 
I think it should be revoked in cases of murder (not theft) in any of the high to medium security systems, but all is fair when it comes to anarchic space and the pilot's federation in this case should just not give a hoot as there really is nobody that cares in system to report the crimes to. What happens in anarchic space stays in anarchic space and all that jazz.......

this would vastly reduce crime (especially murder) in secure systems but have no impact on anarchies and would help relocate players with a naughty streak to the systems they should be in. With the increased profits from trade made available by desperate colonists also in these systems that would attract traders that wish to live on the dangerous side to reap the rewards of that trade at the risk of possibly running a gauntlet of the scum of society (no insult intended) to get those profits.

just my $0.02

You know, I really like your ideas, Phoenix! That's a great solution which adds more depth to the game in creating more choices for a criminal to consider. only one thing saddens me:

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Darkphoenix again."

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Ability to buy into beta...1.3.....*kicks self*

As a beta backer ican tell you that, at least for me, it is all about bug-testing and not about playing with toys. The game is nothing in beta compared to the actual release. Back in 1.2 beta, when I bought the 100 cr Vulture (testing prices), I couldn't even tell it would one day be a 22 million credit ship. i thought it would be 800,000 or something xD.

The 1.3 beta is really for bugs, it's not enjoyable at all in comparison to release. Unless you enjoy playtesting with the intent to help the game, and thus FD and the community, don't worry about it ;)
 
On the cargo amount, percentage is a great idea, but I don't know how it would be implemented with the current A-E 1,3,5,7 Limpet Computers. Perhaps:

Works only on Small Ships:
1E 20%
1D 30%
1C 40%
1B 50%
1A 60%
Works only with Small/Medium ships:
3E 20%
3D 30%
3C 40%
3B 50%
3A 60%
Works with all ships:
5E 20%
5D 30%
5C 40%
5B 50%
5A 60%

And the Class 7's will be Class 5 Limpets with a hack-time decrease. Now, this works because a medium/large ship wouldn't stop a small ship and thus wouldn't equip the cheap computers. Also, Limpet hack-speed would need to be severely increased to compensate for the sheer amount of cargo taken from the traders. Piracy isn't (shouldn't) be a quick event!

As for stray shots being made a bounty, well, how would the game decide what was stray and what was not? We already have friendly-fire mechanics, and they will be extended to players in 1.3. If I do not target a police ship but fire at him until he is at 1%, will I receive no bounty?

You are right, piracy should take time and with my proposed changes to system response would make it even less likely that it would be probable in secure systems. Stray shots are shots that hit a target inadvertently while they are not even the ship being targeted. (i.e. poor flying npc's in RES that swerve in front of your beam lasers while targeting the pirate in front of them. The current friendly fire mechanics seem rather arbitrary and I am not sure how they work. I have seen times that they work as intended and other times where a stray shot nets you a 600 cr bounty and a lot of extremely annoyed fuzz. I have even had a murder charge once in a RES because an npc flew rather poorly and collided with me resulting in his death.

What I am proposing is that friendly fire be a fine and not a bounty and that the parameters for what constitutes friendly fire be adjusted. I would think that friendly fire would be glancing shots (less than 10% hull/shield damage) that happen on ships not actually targeted with the weapons in question.
 
You are right, piracy should take time and with my proposed changes to system response would make it even less likely that it would be probable in secure systems. Stray shots are shots that hit a target inadvertently while they are not even the ship being targeted. (i.e. poor flying npc's in RES that swerve in front of your beam lasers while targeting the pirate in front of them. The current friendly fire mechanics seem rather arbitrary and I am not sure how they work. I have seen times that they work as intended and other times where a stray shot nets you a 600 cr bounty and a lot of extremely annoyed fuzz. I have even had a murder charge once in a RES because an npc flew rather poorly and collided with me resulting in his death.

What I am proposing is that friendly fire be a fine and not a bounty and that the parameters for what constitutes friendly fire be adjusted. I would think that friendly fire would be glancing shots (less than 10% hull/shield damage) that happen on ships not actually targeted with the weapons in question.

Well, if you propose 10% hull/shield damage be the limit to friendly fire, what if the policeman flies an Eagle and you fly a python? I think I can do more than 50% shield damage in the space of half a second ;P
 
Well, if you propose 10% hull/shield damage be the limit to friendly fire, what if the policeman flies an Eagle and you fly a python? I think I can do more than 50% shield damage in the space of half a second ;P

In that case I would recommend more careful control of your firing pattern lol

Seriously though, as far as how much I really can't say what would be acceptable but I do know the current system seems kinda wonky at times. That being said it would be livable as is IF friendly fire was a fine and not a bounty.
 
In that case I would recommend more careful control of your firing pattern lol

Seriously though, as far as how much I really can't say what would be acceptable but I do know the current system seems kinda wonky at times. That being said it would be livable as is IF friendly fire was a fine and not a bounty.

Maybe aligning with a Power in 1.3 will help with that! :)
 
I have spent the past few nights thinking about the general gap in how most traders feel about the game and most pirates and the current holes in the crime and punishment that currently exists.

Yes we know the security services are Thugs. If you want to murder without penalty, join the Feds Security. Nothing has changed in thousands of years.
The Pilot's Federation look down on pilots who cry, you risk being expelled for being weak. Get a grip.

You should keep your criminals in your own systems, they are yours and not all belong to anarchies. You even have missions for your pirates to complete and gain influence for your faction. Murderers too. We don't want your problems, we are not a prison colony or a rubbish dump for you. We do not police the systems for you. You shall be punished now for calling all anarchies criminal. It is clear that normal citizens in anarchy systems are not safe from you lot.
Some of us are anarchist because we are sick and tired of your political and murderous security. Some of us just want to be free, to live normal and co-exist peacefully.

You want to impose economical sanctions on anarchies for what reason? Because they are lawless? We don't shoot and kill innocents for scratching someone's paintjob like your crazy cops do. Even you own BH will kill their own players for a mere 200cr.
Our anarchy systems are safer than your faction controlled systems. When I return to my peaceful anarchy system I get no trouble. It is bliss. I can dock with anything. Everyone is friendly. We can trade like any normal pilot. Do missions like any other pilot. BH or pirate like any other pilot and nobody is going to shoot us or fine us for reasons.

Fine, you get extra security (you already have it, you just don't use it). Ok, so while a pirate is sparring with your security, if he beats the security, he should then have the oppurtunity to pirate the trader. If the security is successful then the trader can escape. I suggest a perm tether that keeps you within 3km of the pirate until such a battle is over. This way the pirate can continue since he won the engagement and now earnt the right to pirate. ;)

If a trader can have extra security then the pirate should be able to call other pirates to come help against the security. Like for like. That way all is fair and balanced. So our security fights with your security. :p

If a trader combat logs (any method) then his cargo should be left behind to scoop and his ship destroyed. Same for the pirate if he try the same thing.

Any more crying from pilots on this forum and they should be expelled from the pilots federation and reverted back to being an npc, until that npc can learn to stop crying, learns interdiction skills and also learns that being a glass trader in open is wreckless. Then if you can do 100 push ups without a break you may be considered a human again and able to play again. You should be tested with a fake interdiction, a secret camera pointing at your face and if your bottom lip
trembles then you should not have access to the pilot's federation until you can pass such a test.

Since alot of this forum user's still believe in Darwin's Theory of Evolution, pirates, murderers and griefers are only weeding out the unfit for human evolution. We will by your own definition improve humanity and in the future we will have a humanity worthy of standing up to the Thargoids. The reason they are not here is because the humans are not a challenge anymore and it is too easy win for them so they go play another game waiting for humans to match their intellect and power. We will speed up that process for you if you want. The Thargoids are also sick and tired of your tears and combat logging. It was your salty tears that was used to disable their drives. You brought shame on the human race and now no aliens will entertain us.

Your BH's are terribad. By traders own admissions they would rather have extra AI protect them because the BH's can't do it. BH'ers should be confined to training until they learn basic combat skills and then, if they can prove they can lift, then they can get admission to the pilot's Federation and open play.
Pirates are much nicer folk than BH. Pirate do not kill on site, they take a fee, these are our laws just like you have yours. Non compliance can result in death but it's not like we do it over 200cr like your cops and BH's. When a BH interdicts a pirate they try to kill the pirate. If they were outstanding white knights of chivarly they wouldn't be weak and would give the pirate an oppurtunity to move on before getting killed. A trader is given an opportunity to live, why can't you live by the same peaceful standards.

:D
 
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Yes we know the security services are Thugs. If you want to murder without penalty, join the Feds Security. Nothing has changed in thousands of years.
The Pilot's Federation look down on pilots who cry, you risk being expelled for being weak. Get a grip.

You should keep your criminals in your own systems, they are yours and not all belong to anarchies. You even have missions for your pirates to complete and gain influence for your faction. Murderers too. We don't want your problems, we are not a prison colony or a rubbish dump for you. We do not police the systems for you. You shall be punished now for calling all anarchies criminal. It is clear that normal citizens in anarchy systems are not safe from you lot.
Some of us are anarchist because we are sick and tired of your political and murderous security. Some of us just want to be free, to live normal and co-exist peacefully.

You want to impose economical sanctions on anarchies for what reason? Because they are lawless? We don't shoot and kill innocents for scratching someone's paintjob like your crazy cops do. Even you own BH will kill their own players for a mere 200cr.
Our anarchy systems are safer than your faction controlled systems. When I return to my peaceful anarchy system I get no trouble. It is bliss. I can dock with anything. Everyone is friendly. We can trade like any normal pilot. Do missions like any other pilot. BH or pirate like any other pilot and nobody is going to shoot us or fine us for reasons.

Fine, you get extra security (you already have it, you just don't use it). Ok, so while a pirate is sparring with your security, if he beats the security, he should then have the oppurtunity to pirate the trader. If the security is successful then the trader can escape. I suggest a perm tether that keeps you within 3km of the pirate until such a battle is over. This way the pirate can continue since he won the engagement and now earnt the right to pirate. ;)

If a trader can have extra security then the pirate should be able to call other pirates to come help against the security. Like for like. That way all is fair and balanced. So our security fights with your security. :p

If a trader combat logs (any method) then his cargo should be left behind to scoop and his ship destroyed. Same for the pirate if he try the same thing.

Any more crying from pilots on this forum and they should be expelled from the pilots federation and reverted back to being an npc, until that npc can learn to stop crying, learns interdiction skills and also learns that being a glass trader in open is wreckless. Then if you can do 100 push ups without a break you may be considered a human again and able to play again. You should be tested with a fake interdiction, a secret camera pointing at your face and if your bottom lip
trembles then you should not have access to the pilot's federation until you can pass such a test.

Since alot of this forum user's still believe in Darwin's Theory of Evolution, pirates, murderers and griefers are only weeding out the unfit for human evolution. We will by your own definition improve humanity and in the future we will have a humanity worthy of standing up to the Thargoids. The reason they are not here is because the humans are not a challenge anymore and it is too easy win for them so they go play another game waiting for humans to match their intellect and power. We will speed up that process for you if you want. The Thargoids are also sick and tired of your tears and combat logging. It was your salty tears that was used to disable their drives. You brought shame on the human race and now no aliens will entertain us.

Your BH's are terribad. By traders own admissions they would rather have extra AI protect them because the BH's can't do it. BH'ers should be confined to training until they learn basic combat skills and then, if they can prove they can lift, then they can get admission to the pilot's Federation and open play.
Pirates are much nicer folk than BH. Pirate do not kill on site, they take a fee, these are our laws just like you have yours. Non compliance can result in death but it's not like we do it over 200cr like your cops and BH's. When a BH interdicts a pirate they try to kill the pirate. If they were outstanding white knights of chivarly they wouldn't be weak and would give the pirate an oppurtunity to move on before getting killed. A trader is given an opportunity to live, why can't you live by the same peaceful standards.

:D

So basically, pirates should be pushed towards higher-security systems? I would like to see that happen, I would like to battle security, but what is there to gain? I don't think anarchies are civilized, considering pirate interdictions are much more common there. :)
 
So basically, pirates should be pushed towards higher-security systems? I would like to see that happen, I would like to battle security, but what is there to gain? I don't think anarchies are civilized, considering pirate interdictions are much more common there. :)

Hi,

I think all is dandy as it is. A few things need some balance.
I can pirate for any faction I want right now. I can be a Fed pirate and only pirate the Empire if I want. If I then pirate a player in Fed territory, what gives? Do the Feds then attack their own ally? I take a hit on influence if it's a Fed only, these players then expect the Fed system to send elite wing npc's to kill the pirate when he's allied with them and the trader is not?

I pirate alone, I only get a few chances to interdict a human trader so I pirate npc's too.
I get to experience what the security is like. None of these traders get to experience it so they have no clue if it's working or not.

If npc's come to the rescue of traders while I ask for loot, I can always kill the trader 1st then FSD away from the npc's no matter what turns up. Your right, I have no interest in the npc's or a battle with them. Nothing to gain from it. If I can't kill the trader in time it's cos he's got some defence to allow him to survive the FSD re-charge which means he never needed the npc's extra security in the 1st place. If traders increase their force then I have to too.

Anarchies are civilised. They have stations and missions and trade just like any other faction. The only difference is security.
No system is more scary than another. They are all the same. If a trader trades with anarchy he can become friendly or even allied with them and get less or no pirates but then get pirated by an Empire or Fed pirate in their systems.

Plus this is open, why would anyone want more npc's?
 
pirates should be hunted down, shot in the back of the head, and their remains used as kitty litter.

at the very least, if you turn to a life of piracy, you lose your insurance. I mean, really, even today, does state farm insure mass murdering scumbag freeloading serial killers? no.

remove insurance for pirates, and I be a lot of the cowards we see today greifing would show their true colors and either leave the game or go back to trading (probably not, they probably couldn't handle real work)

Geebus that rage is on fire.

As for your concern in regard to insurance, there are easily many questionable corporations that will compensate criminals or acts of war to promote conflict in systems that they desire. Therefore think of criminals as mercenaries, there will always be supporters of any sort of act.

A more expensive insurance however, I believe may be useful to weed out the pirate-wana-be from actual pirates.
 
I can think of no rational reason why pirates should be given insurance. Romanticize the life as much as you want, its criminal. If you want to throw off the downside of society by ignoring rules and laws, you shouldn't be given the benefits of society .. like insurance. And Obamacare.

Seriously, think aobut it... the games allows psychos to kill people for sport, yet offers them insurance? give me a break. Turn to a life of crime, you lose your insurance.

Hah... there are warmongers you know...? PMC anyone? There are plenty of people that are willing to support criminal acts as long as it influence the politics within systems... oh wait, crime does do that...

Get my drift good sir?
 
Fixing the Anaconda's ridiculously squishy subsystems, primarily the paper powerplant and boosters (to some degree.)
 
On the cargo amount, percentage is a great idea, but I don't know how it would be implemented with the current A-E 1,3,5,7 Limpet Computers. Perhaps:

Works only on Small Ships:
1E 20%
1D 30%
1C 40%
1B 50%
1A 60%
Works only with Small/Medium ships:
3E 20%
3D 30%
3C 40%
3B 50%
3A 60%
Works with all ships:
5E 20%
5D 30%
5C 40%
5B 50%
5A 60%

And the Class 7's will be Class 5 Limpets with a hack-time decrease. Now, this works because a medium/large ship wouldn't stop a small ship and thus wouldn't equip the cheap computers. Also, Limpet hack-speed would need to be severely increased to compensate for the sheer amount of cargo taken from the traders. Piracy isn't (shouldn't) be a quick event!

As for stray shots being made a bounty, well, how would the game decide what was stray and what was not? We already have friendly-fire mechanics, and they will be extended to players in 1.3. If I do not target a police ship but fire at him until he is at 1%, will I receive no bounty?

I have been thinking about the percentages and I think they should be lower but we both do agree that a percentage is a good idea. I think more appropriate would be something like 5%, 10%, 15%, 20%, 25%. If we use a base Anaconda trade ship as a model figure (404 tonnes) this would work out to 20t, 40t, 61t, 81t, then 101t. 101t is a LOT of cargo and even 20t is a significant amount for most ships. If we take a Cobra Trader for example say 40t of cargo capacity this works out to be not worth it at 2t, 4t, 6t, 8t, 10t, (rough estimate). So maybe a scale like mine for the ones that work on large ships but they are slightly more efficient on smaller ships. Maybe something like 15%, 20%, 25%, 30%, 35% for something Cobra sized.

As for the comments about anarchies being all gumdrops and sunflowers by the other poster (I for an I?) I will just simply say I disagree......ask the people of Somalia if it is so......yes it may be their home but I think even they will admit that it isn't the paradise you seem to be claiming that it is.

Yes to bobbleheads as well and a big yes to Armor and hull packages giving protection to subsystems.
 
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I love the title of the thread.
I see in the forums more people share my frustrations with boring frameshift drives in a year where we should have automatic pilots, automatic massage robots and automatic window panels (to see under our feet the landing pads when we land in manual) etc....
And of course this autopilot would be smart enough to avoid annoying interdictions. If I want them Interdictions I go manual to seek for them, but if I am in busy mode I just want my ship parked on the other side. I want freedom and choices, not gambling/programmatic/boring/impositions. These last ones drive clients away.
And I am sure that is exactly what the developers do not want.
 
I've been thinking about the issue a bit, and I now think where it comes from is... the Pilots Federation.

It should be able to expel those that kill its other members in cold blood for whatever reason, be it piracy, war, etc. Insurrance should then be handled by factions.

For instance, a player might want to serve the Empire and kill other players in the process. To do so he will have to leave the Pilots Federation, and from then on insurrance, rank, etc, will all be tied to the Empire.
In the same way, to be insurred a pirate would need to seek pirate factions to join (and follow their rules), or join "official" factions and become a privateer. Those could be major or minor factions. Then, insurrance levels would also be tied to how wealthy the faction is, and working towards improving that would grant privateers better insurrances.
 
I've been thinking about the issue a bit, and I now think where it comes from is... the Pilots Federation.

It should be able to expel those that kill its other members in cold blood for whatever reason, be it piracy, war, etc. Insurrance should then be handled by factions.

For instance, a player might want to serve the Empire and kill other players in the process. To do so he will have to leave the Pilots Federation, and from then on insurrance, rank, etc, will all be tied to the Empire.
In the same way, to be insurred a pirate would need to seek pirate factions to join (and follow their rules), or join "official" factions and become a privateer. Those could be major or minor factions. Then, insurrance levels would also be tied to how wealthy the faction is, and working towards improving that would grant privateers better insurrances.

I could see this as working provided that the amount that the factions would be willing to cover would still not be near equal to what the Pilot's Federation will cover so that ticking off the Pilot's Federation would still generally be a bad idea for most.
 
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