Pretty sure we paid back the last of the WW2 debt in 2006, we definitely paid off the last of the WW1 debt in 2014.
Why are player complaining about grinding?
- Thread starter lemny
- Start date
Pretty sure we paid back the last of the WW2 debt in 2006, we definitely paid off the last of the WW1 debt in 2014.
Frontier chose quite a poor word for crafting. Engineering isn't what our crazy friends do. They essentially void the warranty and then complain when you run out of pixie musk and lentil string and some sort of electrified milk that they've been absent mindedly pouring into highly complicated equipment.
E: Hang on, I'll just sprinkle some of this stuff on the drive.
C: I don't think that's how it works
E: <sprinkles>
C: are those sparks normal?
E: <adjusts picture of you on their bedside table, next to the 10,000 others>
C: okay that's actually starting to creep me the f--
<poof>
E: there we go
C: O.O
E: we can try again?
C: wait what just happ--
<poof>
E: whoops, sorry, you just lost 75% integrity
C: where did all my materials go?
E: about that.. you need more.
C: why is my jump range halved
E: <adjusts picture of you on their bedside table, next to the 10,000 others>
C: m8..
E: sorry I don't like you any more, you'll need more materials before I can like you again
C: ..
E: Hang on, I'll just sprinkle some of this stuff on the drive.
C: I don't think that's how it works
E: <sprinkles>
C: are those sparks normal?
E: <adjusts picture of you on their bedside table, next to the 10,000 others>
C: okay that's actually starting to creep me the f--
<poof>
E: there we go
C: O.O
E: we can try again?
C: wait what just happ--
<poof>
E: whoops, sorry, you just lost 75% integrity
C: where did all my materials go?
E: about that.. you need more.
C: why is my jump range halved
E: <adjusts picture of you on their bedside table, next to the 10,000 others>
C: m8..
E: sorry I don't like you any more, you'll need more materials before I can like you again
C: ..
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Yeah it's a total mystery. Nobody knows why people complain about grind and RNG. It's a completely unknowable, incomprehensible thing. There are no alternatives and no one has ever discussed or outlined better alternatives. The way things are is the only possible way that anything could ever be, all other alternatives are worse and furthermore impossible. The people who complain about grind and RNG are probably crazy or stupid or maybe they're just dumb babies. Either way, the one thing we can be sure of is that none of their ideas should be given even the slightest consideration, and it would be downright foolish to make a good-faith attempt at understanding where they're coming from.
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Interesting. Sounds like you are more clued in than i so can accept that. My point is, it took a while as it was a lot of cash
Edit just to be clear btw i find no grinding in ED. I dont like the rng, or more accurately i dont like the level of the RNG or that it is pushed in our faces rather than subtly hidden, but in principle getting the stuff is just playing the game and i am fine with that.
As i have said before i want to be immersed in the economy. I want to believe it when i am playing. Just like it would take time to go from trading in a 3 wheel van to going cross continents in an 18 wheeler i expect it to take time to go from a sidewinder to an anaconda
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Yup.
OT: Grinding means doing something you don't like repeatedly in the hopes of gaining some advantage to doing more grinding later on in a game.
Me? If I don't like something I don't do it. Problem solved. If it means I don't get a shiny gold star for it, so be it.
Not to take away from your larger point, but the different Engineering tiers *are* the base figure sliders. Every mod has a clearly defined range of outcomes which you can see before you run the numbers. The ranges become more favorable (and more expensive) at higher tiers. Every engineer mod, even level 1, has some stats which are guaranteed to be an improvement over the base module's stats, even if you roll the lowest possible number.
The last bit is incorrect. You can roll an outcome that is, across the board, lower than stock. I wish I was kidding. But it is possible to drop a modules stats below stock. This in part due to the lottery that is Secondaries.
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The infamous reverse-Godroll, it goes by many names, most of which are probably censored in this forum.
Personally, I hate grinding because I work a 12 hour graveyard shift at a production factory. I grind in real life. I don't want my playtime to reflect real life. I come here to ESCAPE that....not reinforce it.
People do complain about grinding all the time, in fact it's all they seem to do. Day in, day out, it's the same thing, complain, complain, complain. To be honest, it must be a bit of a grind for them.
The short answer is that most of the moaning comes from players who see Engineers as something to be 'completed' like collecting those stupid Steam trophies and who deem 'completed' to be 'having the best possible combination of every attribute for a grade 5 mod'.
The only significant grind is if players want to roll 300+ attempts at a single mod on single piece of gear to try to get that min/max roll. Picking up the mats to roll 3-5 attempts at grade 5 on pretty much any peice of kit is trivial in termms of the time spent, certainly compared to many other aspects of the game.
I would also have lost my mind if I'd been hanging around trying to get 300 datamined wake exceptions or 300 exquisite focus crystals from the mission board, in fact I think any reasonable person would. Usually when you find that kind of wall in a game though, it's a pretty reliable indicator that you're not actually accessing the content in the way the devs intended. It's like boring yourself to tears farming xp in the same base-level dungeon over and again in an RPG just to end up maxing your level before you even leave the starter areas.
It's as clear as day that the whole thinking behind engineers was to make ships unique, with strengths and weaknesses in different areas. For someone like me who isn't obsessed with having everything on my ship min/maxed to death it works well and doesn't take much time, after all a single grade 5 roll of any kind offers a huge improvement over stock on pretty much any piece of gear you care to name.
The players who are having issues with it (and who keep calling for user-controlled sliders, which would defeat the entire point of the rng and just be another metaship crapfest with the best slider settings posted on reddit) are the ones who can't reconcile the concept of not having this 'best ship evar' which is why many of them cheated their way to hundreds of rolls for grade 5 mods and why many of them are now back to banging a drum to have all the rng elements removed and just turn the game into a meta-ship builder.
Frankly I hope FDev stick to their guns and keep their vision for engineers intact. They are supposed to be variable, off-the-wall modifications, not identikit 'increase property A/reduce property B' programmable settings. If players are so limited in their outlook that they're lost without a meta template to follow and spending insane amounts of timne gringing materials to try to force that mentality on to what was never supposed to be a system that would deliver results that way to begin with, I can't pretend to have much sympathy.
There are elements of the game that could do with less rng for sure but that's never been one of them for me. Hate away people, I really don't care.
What grade was that? I'd guess grade one, since the increase in key stats from a grade two or higher should be enough to offset the worst of secondaries. I've been fortunate enough to never see a module get close to dropping below stock stats and that's on over 1,000 rolls in total (across 18 ships with multiple lots of gear) it's certainly going to take a uniquely terrible set of rolls to do it. Even so, must have sucked to lose that sulphur, I'd have been distraught
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Well, they don't void the warranty now, do they? You can get your magic items back on rebuy.
Yep. Think I saved a pic of one somewhere.
Grind is probably the worst thing in a Space Simulator, is something that reward the luck and the player that play more time when technically is suppose to reward the most skilled Pilot.
Before engeeners one of the nicest thing to do was being able to build a ship in 5 min or less, jumping in pvp and knowing that the opponent hase the same wepons, and only skill matters.
Grind has been developped to justify to land on the rockies planets.
Personally I hate grind in any game because is boring , repetitive and not fun at all.
I have been playing since day 1st with more than to 2000 hours play time, have billions and almost every ship in the game, a family and a Kid, and when i PLay I like to Pirate and pvp, I hate the fact if I want to change my setup I have to spend hours looking for stupid materials with 0 fun, and where is mandatory to use external tools to look for info regardiing materials.
Last week i spent 10 hours looking for stupid firmware, this is not the game I want to play wasnt like that that was supposed to be, this is the reason while lot of backers quit.
Why I dont quit for other games? Im 37 been dreaming for a Space Sim like this for years, and I still have lot of fun flying and fighting against people, I hate pve and grind, and I dont like to see my ideal game ruined and missthreaten in this way.
Only people that like to grind is people that like pve, where engineers are not really necessary.
This is a Wall also for new playersm where not only you need to grind a lot of money, but that is understandable, but now also have to grind their off if they want to compete in open play, and not only once but for any ship theyw ant to fly.
Blaze your own trail..... I really dont agree with this statement anymore....
Before engeeners one of the nicest thing to do was being able to build a ship in 5 min or less, jumping in pvp and knowing that the opponent hase the same wepons, and only skill matters.
Grind has been developped to justify to land on the rockies planets.
Personally I hate grind in any game because is boring , repetitive and not fun at all.
I have been playing since day 1st with more than to 2000 hours play time, have billions and almost every ship in the game, a family and a Kid, and when i PLay I like to Pirate and pvp, I hate the fact if I want to change my setup I have to spend hours looking for stupid materials with 0 fun, and where is mandatory to use external tools to look for info regardiing materials.
Last week i spent 10 hours looking for stupid firmware, this is not the game I want to play wasnt like that that was supposed to be, this is the reason while lot of backers quit.
Why I dont quit for other games? Im 37 been dreaming for a Space Sim like this for years, and I still have lot of fun flying and fighting against people, I hate pve and grind, and I dont like to see my ideal game ruined and missthreaten in this way.
Only people that like to grind is people that like pve, where engineers are not really necessary.
This is a Wall also for new playersm where not only you need to grind a lot of money, but that is understandable, but now also have to grind their off if they want to compete in open play, and not only once but for any ship theyw ant to fly.
Blaze your own trail..... I really dont agree with this statement anymore....
This is for everyone of you that love the RNG above ability and intelligence... for everyone that think that the boring, repetitive and stupid grind must be the core gameplay of every multiplayer game.
And above all, this is for everyone of you that justify this kind of lazy game developement.
And above all, this is for everyone of you that justify this kind of lazy game developement.
Because the Dev's are British, and they want everyone to queue in line for their food rationing coupons that they have been using since the end of WW 2.
In my opinion, every game is essentially a "grind". The reason why we a lot of times don't recognize it is because the game is made such that you forget that you're grinding while you're doing it. Just take car racing. What is it? You drive a car. Fast. Takes some skill, but the basic formula is that you're driving a car, driving a car, driving a car... To some people that's entertaining enough to forget that it's a repetitive task.Yep, the fuel of ED is the very good feeling of the game play itself.
It's fun to fly these ships and drive around in a SRV and so...
If that fundamentally mechanic is working out for the players, the "grind" is not a grind, it's only a nice reason to fly and drive around.
Right. It's all about ability and intelligence. Mkay, thanks for that.
wow! way to go on raising the bar on the rude ignoramus scale.
Have an opinion, share it, agree or disagree that is cool, but insulting the intellect of those who dare to disagree with you......
And as I have said I don't even like the RNG aspect personally but I consider that a separate issue from the grind.
Here is the thing tho..... its not "stupid" to want a plausible economy.... and yet for the economy to even be remotely sensible there HAS to be a certain amount of grind because......... it takes time to go from zero to billionaire!.
as for every other multiplayer game... I do not care about the other multiplayer games I care about this one, and bought into the vision sold to me back in 2013.
want to talk about grind.... where are the docking fees, the fines for causing damage when hitting the station, sensible repair costs (FD got rid of those because it slowed the game progress down too much according to some).
where are the crew that every ship bigger than a cobra MK III are meant to have to make the ship flyable - complete with salary
imo there needs to be MORE "grind" if you want to call it that in ED imo.
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Because grinding feel like your first job. Working at a Mcjob. You just want to get through the day/collect the cash and start having some well deserved fun with your homies.
But ED ain't a Mcjob. It's supposed to be a video game. Its supposed to be entertaining and when you sit 48 hours at the same spaceport logging/relogging to get that dumb reputation up it start reminding me of my Mcjob day and thats bad bruh. I'm not paid to suffer through this. There's simply wayy too many game that could occupy my time while having actual fun.
'' You don't have to grind ''.
Yeha sure if you want to stay a pleb all of your life. Some of us want to be competitive. But it should be enjoyable.
But ED ain't a Mcjob. It's supposed to be a video game. Its supposed to be entertaining and when you sit 48 hours at the same spaceport logging/relogging to get that dumb reputation up it start reminding me of my Mcjob day and thats bad bruh. I'm not paid to suffer through this. There's simply wayy too many game that could occupy my time while having actual fun.
'' You don't have to grind ''.
Yeha sure if you want to stay a pleb all of your life. Some of us want to be competitive. But it should be enjoyable.
Problem with the Engineers and "the grind" in general is that Elite tries to mimic an ordinary MMO where progress is a thing, but in fact is an illusion in ED. With the exception of PVP maybe, I don't know. Some people realize that too late, others apparently never or running from Harry Potter [where is it] [haha]. Everyone else is just enjoying the game.
Given ships are our effective identity and determination of our abilities it's a bit hard of a sell to say progresd is an illusion in ed.
You might say it's not the most important thing, but that is all the more reason not to gate it like it is the real end game.