Didn't DBOBE say something about rare and meaningful pvp?
Also, please point out where on the menu screen does it say "By clicking Open, you are consenting to PvP at any time"?
With the implementation o NEW Karma e C&P - Will the Log timer go up? 15 secs is to low!
- Thread starter CMDR GTR2014
- Start date
Didn't DBOBE say something about rare and meaningful pvp?
Also, please point out where on the menu screen does it say "By clicking Open, you are consenting to PvP at any time"?
It is rare unless you go looking for it (or go to player hotspots). It's not meaningful because it can be bypassed so easily with no impact on progress or end-result (solo, private, blocking, menu logging).
Does it have to? I'm pretty sure non-consensual PvP does not break the EULA (to qualify as harassment, it has to go much further than a single incident).
There's a quote from Sandro about it IIRC.
Currently I use a speed build at full throttle or a tanky build low-waking on it's own to leave quickly, it's a workaround but it's functional usually. Only effective against NPC's.
Please point out where on the menu screen it says "by clicking Solo, you are consenting to PvE at any time"?
If non-consensual conflict was intended to be against the rules, it would be banned in-game, there would be notes in the ToS against it, there would be mechanics to support dedicated in-game PvP, we wouldn't need different game modes (please remember even Solo is tied into the BGS and other players, meaning it's unusable as an offline mode, thus solely serving the purpose of stopping you being seen by others) and we wouldn't be developing a karma system intended to - for the most part - add a sense of risk/consequence to murder-based playstyles (and CLers).
But that's not the game we have, which instead was strictly put forward as "blaze your own trail". I've seen FD state clearly all playstyles are valid as long as it's not cheating, and the only obstacle seems to be players believing "blaze your own trail" means "I'm entitled to a risk-free game".
If risk-free is what you want, then...as above, you were given two game modes and Mobius. Open play is for those that want something different.
Last edited:
I don't post here very often but I'm amazed at the assertion that by logging in to Open I'm consenting to PvP. I'm pretty sure FD haven't asked me to agree that even in small print. All I can say is: it's not true. I know PvP might happen, but I haven't agreed to it and I usually don't want it.
It's an unrealistic selfish position and just noise, no different in it's own way to claiming any in-game attack is real world illegal. Ignore it, it's just a game there are always people who loudly demand everything their way.
High wake is always the best in-game option if you are not in the mood.
I guess that will always be the opinion of someone when commenting on something they don't like/agree with. It's the very nature of differing opinions.
See in my mind, if you are a player that enjoys risk, or causing risk, or a thoroughly natural environment with no "rules", then it's conversely selfish to demand three game modes and Mobius for "hand holdey peace times" instead of two game modes and Mobius.
So instead, take a moment to look at this objectively. All playstyles are valid; this has previously been confirmed by FD - none of what you're objecting to is against the rules (and that's not up for debate, by the way). So to remain valid, must all playstyles not have somewhere they are allowed to operate? Thusly is the beauty of "Open"; for a game to exist that not just condones, but actively hinges on, the ability to "blaze your trail" then at least one environment must exist without "rules". The moment rules are cemented in, you restrict playstyles.
If you don't like that, then as before...you weren't unthought of. This is the sole purpose of Solo/PG/Mobius. And if that's not enough still, join your brethren in promoting an "official" Mobius/Open PvE mode. But if you're going to sit at the sidelines in such hysteria that you simply insult people for an in-game playstyle and pretend it's not legit, given a game is suppose to be about escaping from rl, then you are far more guilty of infringing on other's play rights than any in-game murderer.
What's more concerning is the number of such complaints from CMDRs that have barely even looked at the Open mode, much less actually experienced it. Put aside yonder terror of gankage, and try to look at this game objectively for a moment...we can either all sit in silence trucking between two stations, or we can allow one game mode where people are free to wage war, or barricade goods, or pirate, or rob, or start a revolution. If I wanted to spend my life in simple routine tasks, I wouldn't come home from work in the evening.
You've gone down the wrong track there stitch. There's no fear for me of being blown up or getting PVP'd or whatever.
I play in and enjoy all the modes with all they offer and don't offer. My kill to death ratio in PVP is much higher and was gained almost exclusively by taking out attacking ganking wings solo. I'm not militant about any of it, each to his or her own. But I'm a realist who believes FDEV will allways go with pleasing (or trying to please) the majority. I know there are extemes on either side and that they get largely ignored, as neither represent the majority.
The only things I draw a line at are :
Cheating, they should all have been perma-banned or at minimum been reset to starter ships with a good six months in the shadow server to protect real noobs from them. But as a realist I know this isnt likely so I'll put up with FDEV's decision. I'll log out immediatly if I see a known cheat in-game though, they are not worthy.
Ganking/noob splatting because they are cowardly zero skill persuits.
Proposed punishments for combat logging that would penalise my rural intenernet connection are another thing, but FDEV seem too sensible for that.
I walked the track put in front of me, friend. Or did I misunderstand, and you were somehow disagreeing with the poster when you said this?
Because that's quite different to the sentiment you just put forward...kudos if cheating is indeed the only line you draw, but I simply saw someone agreeing that non-consensual PvP is selfish, and that's what I challenged.
Nope what I meant was the expectation that another player must remain available to be shot at or else (KOS threats abound) is one of the more extreme positions, my solution as you've quoted is to high-wake not clog.
Pirates.
Powerplayers.
Roleplayers.
PvP bounty hunters (don't forget griefers can CL too).
...want me to go on? (rhetorical)
Just because it doesn't affect you, it doesn't mean there's no effect.
Surely if and when a Karma system is put in place, it'll take care of "combat logging" anyway, even when the logoff timer stays at 15 seconds.
It'll be just as effective - if a persistent 'combat' logger keeps doing what they're doing, eventually their Karma will catch up with them.
Ergo: no need to up the logoff timer amount.
It'll be just as effective - if a persistent 'combat' logger keeps doing what they're doing, eventually their Karma will catch up with them.
Ergo: no need to up the logoff timer amount.
You got it wrong then. I personally think it's foolish for someone in a trade fit ship to stick around for slaughter and always advise submit & hi wake rather than fight.
My previous comments in this thread have been about clogging and menu logging only.
If a player logs into Open they have indeed given their consent to PvP, which simply means anything goes, including their ability to wake out.
Yes, it is. You are expressly consenting to anything that happens there. Perhaps if more people actually took the time to think this through, there would be less angst expressed on the forum from players who define PvP as "bad." Mind you, I'm not defining PvP for everybody as fighting only, as I think skillfully running away is a viable defensive tactic.
Open includes PvP. Logging into open, means you are available to all, including PvP. Asserting otherwise is willful ignorance. I don't find any interest in PvP, I know that I will have to log in to a mode, or Private Group, that excludes PvP by tule, to avoid it.
It is patently ridiculous to expect a 'request' for a fight. It happens, but it is surly not required. Be responsible for your own good time, and log-in in the environment that best suits your interests at that time.
It is patently ridiculous to expect a 'request' for a fight. It happens, but it is surly not required. Be responsible for your own good time, and log-in in the environment that best suits your interests at that time.
Last edited:
It's so weird. It's like aliens abducted Mohrgan and substituted a synth who I agree with
About this whole 'consent to PvP' thing ... really, the only things Frontier are explicit about is that whenever you log into their game, in any mode, you consent neither (1) to hack, nor (2) to combat log (i.e. force an instant disconnect when in danger).
The fact that in Open you may be subjected to 15 seconds of PvP attack is merely a functional consequence of offering those twin consents.
The fact that in Open you may be subjected to 15 seconds of PvP attack is merely a functional consequence of offering those twin consents.
