Gunner = Arcade Action Cam for the 12 yr olds?

[Bobbydylan]

TBH, The gunner cam looks lame to me, but since I'll never be a crew-member for anyone, or have anyone on my ship, I don't think it's an issue for me.

I personally think that FD should try keep to the game lore, it seems that the further along they get in the Development of the game, the more "that'll do" their attitude becomes.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Nobody asked for Power Play and nobody wanted it.
Nobody asked for CQC and nobody wanted it.
Nobody asked for the stupid Engineering Meta and nobody wanted it.

Those are the things that nobody asked for.

Instant transfers would do nothing to the game unless you choose to let it offend your fine senses. That is your problem and nobody elses.

Your strawman argument attempts are sad.

You want a strawman argument to counter yours. Well seeing as how you want so much realism and consistency, How about you fly back to Sol system start at earth turn off your FSD and then fly and meet me at Sirius. If you started that journey at launch then you should be close enough to Jupiter to see it. I will see you in several thousand years.
Goodbye and take your realism with you.

Well you just proved your lack of knowledge of the game with this post. Instant transfers would do nothing to the game....

 

[Magic Man]

Talking someone onto a target which is moving in 6 degrees of freedom while the firing platform is moving in 6 degrees of freedom wouldnt work.

It would work exactly as well as targetting it from an astral 3d projection outside of the ship.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I like new gunner cam. Looks promising. It will be fun from time to time. If somebody doesnt like it then just dont play it, simple. Its not mandatory part of gameplay.

This statement is so wrong in so many ways. I want to use the gunnery role, but it looks so bad, that it makes me not want to use it. That is the issue.

 

[Mystixx Foxx]

Look, a dead horse.
Immersion crowd needs to accept that this is just how its going to be if developers want to attempt to target a wider audience

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Look, a dead horse.
Immersion crowd needs to accept that this is just how its going to be if developers want to attempt to target a wider audience

What does immersion crowd mean? Please explain.

Last I checked to actually enjoy any game, book or movie, you need to be immersed in the story or lore, otherwise it gets boring real quick.

 

[Jex =TE=]

Well... there are plenty of FPS games that allows you to see your characters feet when walking (if you look down). I see no difference between that and being in SRV turret mode and drive the SRV, being able to see parts of the SRV when driving.

The Gunner role in The Commanders is the first gameplay mechanic when a 3rd person camera is used. Up until now, the only 3rd person mode in this game has been the debug camera.

Sorry, but I just fail to see how people even regard the Turret mode in an SRV as third person... that is just... weird.

How can you not know the difference between 3rd person and 1st person? So in the turret view your sat outside the SRV and above it are you? How are you magically floating there?

 

[Xargo]

Look, a dead horse.
Immersion crowd needs to accept that this is just how its going to be if developers want to attempt to target a wider audience

True. The thing is that immersion crowd is now trying to tell the devs that short term profit from that wider audience is bad for the game long term. That "if" you put there really is significant and I hope FD doesn't go that route.

Just look at what happened to Evolve. Really cool game with a lot of potential but devs got greedy with marketing model looking for a quick profit and trying to please everyone and in the end no-one would play it. After that they tried to simplify the game (this is pretty much what FD is doing now) which only lead to even less players when those original fans that liked the original mechanics of the game left and now the game is dead. I don't want that to happen to ED.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

True. The thing is that immersion crowd is now trying to tell the devs that short term profit from that wider audience is bad for the game long term. That "if" you put there really is significant and I hope FD doesn't go that route.

Just look at what happened to Evolve. Really cool game with a lot of potential but devs got greedy with marketing model looking for a quick profit and trying to please everyone and in the end no-one would play it. After that they tried to simplify the game (this is pretty much what FD is doing now) which only lead to even less players when those original fans that liked the original mechanics of the game left and now the game is dead. I don't want that to happen to ED.

What does immersion crowd mean? Please explain.

Last I checked to actually enjoy any game, book or movie, you need to be immersed in the story or lore, otherwise it gets boring real quick.

 

[Xargo]

What does immersion crowd mean? Please explain.

Last I checked to actually enjoy any game, book or movie, you need to be immersed in the story or lore, otherwise it gets boring real quick.

I'm not sure if those who support this gunner cam share my view but for me this is a definition of immersion crowd:

People who value consistent game mechanics that are seamlessly woven together to form a game world that feels, looks and sounds consistent without breakups or parts that are clearly of inferior quality compared to the rest of the game.

Or something like that. English isn't my native language so couldn't quite describe it exactly the way I wanted but I'm sure you got the point.

 

[lysan]

VR support has been in the game for a year.

And it works fine, as far as I know (not using VR, but a mate of mine do)

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I'm not sure if those who support this gunner cam share my view but for me this is a definition of immersion crowd:

People who value consistent game mechanics that are seamlessly woven together to form a game world that feels, looks and sounds consistent without breakups or parts that are clearly of inferior quality compared to the rest of the game.

Or something like that. English isn't my native language so couldn't quite describe it exactly the way I wanted but I'm sure you got the point.

Pretty close, but what people get immersed into is always different. But yep, game mechanics should be interwoven within the games lore, otherwise it becomes a load of mini games without context which won't help the long term health of any game.

It would be like playing Tome Raider but without the story to tie all the mini game mechanics together. I am not a big fan of how the gunnery role looks and have thought many ways how it could look, be great fun and in keeping with the games premise.

Basically we all want to be immersed in the games we play, so I never understand why people hate on the "Immersion crowd" because we are all a part of the immersion crowd in some shape or form.

 

[CylonSurfer]

Well... there are plenty of FPS games that allows you to see your characters feet when walking (if you look down). I see no difference between that and being in SRV turret mode and drive the SRV, being able to see parts of the SRV when driving.

The Gunner role in The Commanders is the first gameplay mechanic when a 3rd person camera is used. Up until now, the only 3rd person mode in this game has been the debug camera.

Sorry, but I just fail to see how people even regard the Turret mode in an SRV as third person... that is just... weird.

While using the SRV turret, your character is sat in the cockpit, the game (as in the above diagram) then transfers you from the 1st person camera to a 3rd person camera. Nothing wierd about it.

 

[Tarman]

Pretty close, but what people get immersed into is always different. But yep, game mechanics should be interwoven within the games lore, otherwise it becomes a load of mini games without context which won't help the long term health of any game.

It would be like playing Tome Raider but without the story to tie all the mini game mechanics together. I am not a big fan of how the gunnery role looks and have thought many ways how it could look, be great fun and in keeping with the games premise.

Basically we all want to be immersed in the games we play, so I never understand why people hate on the "Immersion crowd" because we are all a part of the immersion crowd in some shape or form.

Immersion in this game community at least, is no longer used as a valid descriptor of game concepts but is instead used as an attack buzzword by people who don't value experiential gameplay or interior consistency of the game world as much as they value straight up game mechanics, but also don't value the thoughts and opinions of other players with different playstyles. Immersion, conceptually, they believe will somehow ruin or restrict their mechanics-based gameplay. They do not appreciate a change that is caused by an aesthetic as to them the mechanics are the primary game and everything else is trappings. This is fine if it's not accompanied by outright dismissal of other valid playstyles, but it ofttimes is, and this dismissal of others is the problem, not the fact that they don't care much for a certain way to play the game.

It's the same concept thoughtwise as the "omg pewpewers get outten my game" vibe that we have from some other extremist groups, who also believe that other people are playing the game "wrong" and that their very existence can cause massive development shifts "away" from their preferred game. If every extremist group didn't loudly and combatively cry doom at every topic from all sides then there might even be some validity there but the primary vibe to me shows as just selfishness. Some players play so insularly and in such relatively absolute terms that they can't even relate to other ways to intake the game or reasons for change that aren't part of their bubble, and see any of those outside ideas as a threat to their "way of life" instead of a concession in a multiplayer game.

Come to think of it, they're like Hudson, except about a video game instead of a galactic incursion by unknown aliens. But with the same level of dedication. >____>

 

[Zambrick]

View attachment 114872

While using the SRV turret, your character is sat in the cockpit, the game (as in the above diagram) then transfers you from the 1st person camera to a 3rd person camera. Nothing wierd about it.

Or anyother way to think of it is they switch your first person view in the ship to the first person view of the targeting drones camera system with ship enhanced sensor data on the overlay.


Either way you wish to spin it it means nothing.

 

[Zambrick]

Or the version of Elite Dangerous we were sold and bought. The one without shoddy third person cameras.

And nowhere in any of the data provided by FDEV did they ever say that other camera angles were shunned from existence. Your very limited views, experience, credibility, and influence can't convince anyone to your cause.

Just because you thought you bought something and then attached your own set of trivial rules to it, doesnt mean that the item that never promised those rules has to abide. Show any single piece of evidence stating that this was to be a first person view only game. Everyone especially the backers knows you can't produce said data. However all you can provide is what you expected out of the product. I dont care what you expected.

Did you expect Santa Clause to bring you a shiny new bike this year? I believe in Santa Clause just as much as I believe that FDEV ever said this game was First Person exclusive title.

Also Space Engine isnt a game any more than Google Earth is a game. But you go ahead and try and make the comparison.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

Immersion in this game community at least, is no longer used as a valid descriptor of game concepts but is instead used as an attack buzzword by people who don't value experiential gameplay or interior consistency of the game world as much as they value straight up game mechanics, but also don't value the thoughts and opinions of other players with different playstyles. Immersion, conceptually, they believe will somehow ruin or restrict their mechanics-based gameplay. They do not appreciate a change that is caused by an aesthetic as to them the mechanics are the primary game and everything else is trappings. This is fine if it's not accompanied by outright dismissal of other valid playstyles, but it ofttimes is, and this dismissal of others is the problem, not the fact that they don't care much for a certain way to play the game.

It's the same concept thoughtwise as the "omg pewpewers get outten my game" vibe that we have from some other extremist groups, who also believe that other people are playing the game "wrong" and that their very existence can cause massive development shifts "away" from their preferred game. If every extremist group didn't loudly and combatively cry doom at every topic from all sides then there might even be some validity there but the primary vibe to me shows as just selfishness. Some players play so insularly and in such relatively absolute terms that they can't even relate to other ways to intake the game or reasons for change that aren't part of their bubble, and see any of those outside ideas as a threat to their "way of life" instead of a concession in a multiplayer game.

Come to think of it, they're like Hudson, except about a video game instead of a galactic incursion by unknown aliens. But with the same level of dedication. >____>

I agree, and the issue with most of the people who don't care about the ingame lore, is that once they have had enough of the mechanic and it gets boring they will start hunting for other mechanics to use until they get bored again.

Mechanics with a context are important for longevity. No context, you might as well make a serperate game (like CQC, and look how that has turned out).

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And nowhere in any of the data provided by FDEV did they ever say that other camera angles were shunned from existence. Your very limited views, experience, credibility, and influence can't convince anyone to your cause.

Just because you thought you bought something and then attached your own set of trivial rules to it, doesnt mean that the item that never promised those rules has to abide. Show any single piece of evidence stating that this was to be a first person view only game. Everyone especially the backers knows you can't produce said data. However all you can provide is what you expected out of the product. I dont care what you expected.

Did you expect Santa Clause to bring you a shiny new bike this year? I believe in Santa Clause just as much as I believe that FDEV ever said this game was First Person exclusive title.

Also Space Engine isnt a game any more than Google Earth is a game. But you go ahead and try and make the comparison.

Except Michael Brookes said that the game is meant to be a Cockpit experience from a 1st person perspective, that is the reason there was no 3rd person view.

And now that is all thrown away for an easy solution. It could have been a lot better, still fun and still be a cockpit 1st person perspective experience.

 

[Ian Skippy]

What does immersion crowd mean? Please explain.

Last I checked to actually enjoy any game, book or movie, you need to be immersed in the story or lore, otherwise it gets boring real quick.

Immersion crowd: people with little imagination or interest in scu-fi, so they need world-war-2 mechanics to feel immersed in the distant future.

 

[Goose4291]

Immersion in this game community at least, is no longer used as a valid descriptor of game concepts but is instead used as an attack buzzword by people who don't value experiential gameplay or interior consistency of the game world as much as they value straight up game mechanics, but also don't value the thoughts and opinions of other players with different playstyles.

It saddens me that we're at the stage now I think that if 'tea drinking' could be an insult, people here would happily use it to attack each other.

Particuarly when we remember what the average age of the playerbase is.

 

[Zambrick]

I agree, and the issue with most of the people who don't care about the ingame lore, is that once they have had enough of the mechanic and it gets boring they will start hunting for other mechanics to use until they get bored again.

Mechanics with a context are important for longevity. No context, you might as well make a serperate game (like CQC, and look how that has turned out).

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Except Michael Brookes said that the game is meant to be a Cockpit experience from a 1st person perspective, that is the reason there was no 3rd person view.

And now that is all thrown away for an easy solution. It could have been a lot better, still fun and still be a cockpit 1st person perspective experience.

Where did Michael Brookes say that? Written down or sold that way? Lets say I might just might believe you (not until I see evidence). Where does a "Cockpit experience from a 1st person perspective" mean that all other camera views are forbidden. Did it say exclusive? If so, then do not expect space legs. Dont use an SRV because its not in a ship. Do not use ship launched fighters, because that is not your cockpit, its telepresence.

If they just add a little drone to the camera system outside of the ship, then this whole argument is over. It is a first person view provided by a Drone whose camera has been slaved to the gunner telepresence pilot.