Would like a new, different exploration ship from FD:

[V'larr]

What's so wrong with that? Why does it bother you so much?

A couple reasons.

First, the Anaconda is broken.

It's not supposed to have such light mass. It's not even really supposed to have the hardpoint loadout it has, made evident by the way it *still* has major visual clipping issues caused by the large/huge hardpoint/SRV/fighter bay arrangement.

The issue there is that Fdev has sunk themselves into a hole where they *could* fix it, but then upset a bunch of players in a game where it's one of the most popular ships, whether they bring it down to other ship's levels or bring other ships up to its level. So what they've done thus far is to just...ignore it and keep it on the furthest back burner, meanwhile perpetually leaving it as the superior ship for quick travel around the galaxy.

Engineers, synthesis, and neutrons have only exacerbated the issue.

Second, it's a personal pet peeve of mine that so many players focus on skipping and ignoring the galaxy as much as possible. The galaxy feels far cheaper and smaller to me now than it did when I was first introduced to Elite, pre-Engineers, pre-synthesis, pre-neutron boost. For better or for worse, it is what it is now, but it remains my personal pet peeve - particularly because I earnestly believe if players would simply sit, relax, and *look* a bit closer at the galaxy...they would find it more enjoyable than they might think. Instead of, say, rushing the 5,000 ly Engineer requirement, not looking at anything on the way, getting bored as a direct result of that, then returning straightaway to the bubble and writing a thread about how Fdev should make more ways to get more jump range.

Thirdly is how painting the distinction between fast travel and exploring the billions of available star systems in the galaxy seems to always tip over a mountainous salt pile erected by certain vocal members of the forums here who sit themselves atop this mountain of salt and (falsely) declare themselves leaders and spokespersons of the entire community. I simply can't help myself, in this case, I admit.

 

[sb413197]

Me too. I want a big expensive ship (maybe 250 million or so) that can outjump an anaconda, has a bunch of little internal slots, turns exceptionally fast in supercruise, runs ICE cold and has a giant gas tank. Basically a deep space science vessel. It can have a terrible top speed, weak hardpoints (maybe three size2 or something), weak armor and a small but powerful shield generator (maybe just a size5 internal) for handling planetary collisions and safe re entry to the bubble.

Basically I want a seriously buffed Beluga.

 

[NMS]

Give me the Panther Clipper, in 3 versions, trade, exploration and a mixed between the two, with focus on its defense and not for attack.

 

[Mengy]

SRV is only truely important if you are committed to synthesis boosting, which implies you're more interested in fast travel instead of wandering as an explorer.

Same goes for AFMU. Without committing to neutron boosting - the worst case in the game of enabling players to just *skip* the galaxy a few hundred LY at a time - the AMFU is wholly not needed if you don't crash into stars.

No one uses synthesis boosting for fast travel, and crashing into stars is unavoidable if you jump into a close binary system, which is going to happen if you explore enough. I've lost many module points to heat damage during dangerous jump ins.

Sorry V'larr, but you do not understand how many explorers play the game. You might think you do but your statements say otherwise.

Seeing from the current livestream, new Chieftain got a 5A FSD around 20ish LY with it.
Will that suffice for the ravenous explorers?

The jump range might be slightly better than average but the five internals are limiting for explorers. The Chieftain's a straight up pure combat ship. Like any ship it CAN explore, just not ideally.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Do you only reply to my posts to try and bust my balls, anymore?

Nope, otherwise I wouldn't have spent 10 minutes writing my reply, either way, I really want to know your experience because you really talk as if you have not done much exploration beyond going to Colonia.

I know of a certain vocal individual explorer who enjoys fringe exploration. That's a few huge leaps from being a 'good portion of the community'...see my prior reply for my point that these 'fringe systems' existed just the same before any jump range improvements and were simply a different set of systems, which makes it a rather silly point to try and justify faster-travel improvements with.

1st thing: Only because you know of a single fringe explorer doesn't mean its the only one. DWE, DSE and DECE are expeditions which were made to go to the fringes of the galaxy, do you dare to say that's a minuscule part of the exploration community?

2nd thing: As technology avances, so do achievements. The highest and lowest systems ever visited have been constantly changing as new features began appearing, guess which ones are the most challenging to reach? You guessed right, the newest records OFC and those are the ones that matter.

And? Even the Type 9, the slowest-supercruise-turning ship in the game, can keep up enough that there's no time wasted in quick-jumping from star to star. Ergo, supercruise agility is a convenience and not a requirement for space travel, let alone exploration.

Sure, I didn't say it was a necesity but don't act as if explorers didn't care about that ship characteristic, after all, the vast majority of time of an explorer is spent in SC.

Pretty difficult to explore if you can't see what you're looking at (that's what the ADS enables) and don't have the gas to get there (which in Allitnil's case was either subbed for more fuel tanks or intensive fuel-ratting). But I forget, we all live in a world where it's either one extreme or the other....

Well, I'm just pointing out the fact that we don't need anything but a ship to explore which has been a concurrent argument of yours. In short, when we say need it just means that it is a very nice convinience.

If you don't care about being absurd, then you don't need to be absurd, either.

Calm down.

Which 99.9999% of the time will not happen/matter, unless you are strictly attempting to place your name on fringe systems, a.k.a. you are Mengy.

Hahaha. Not really, if you don't have a very good jump range it is very possible to misjudge a jump and remain stuck in a T-Tauri system, I mean, why do you think we have the Fuel Rats for us?

Way to contradict yourself and simultaneously fill in between the lines that literally everyone else has been able to read between. You really are simply picking at straws just to annoy me, sometimes, I swear....

If you call an assumption a contradiction then you might want to learn some logic.

A. Neutrons are for faster travel, not exploring.

Back in 2.2 beta when NS stopped being sterile and useless, some explorers noticed the 300% jump boost provided by neutron stars. It turns out it was a bug and FD definetly were planning to patch it but it wasn't thanks to the efford of Dr. Kaii & Erimus which proved how the neutron stars could allow you to reach new systems and thus the bug remained to this day. Actually, they had another bug which allows two supercharges which was in fact used to discover the lowest systems ever but since 2.4 it seems to have been patched

B. Whatever odds of crashing into stars in binary+ systems were astronomically low *before* Fdev implemented fixes and adjustments to help prevent those situations. Obviously it's even lower chances now. I made it to Colonia and back without *one incident* of crashing into a star, whether induced by me or any binary+ system, and that was before some of those fixes and adjustments. No heat sinks, no AFMU required, plenty of exploring along the way. So no, it is absolutely not a requirement; it's a safety blanket for if you make regular, distracted astral navigation errors...like in your case.

That's literally wrong. The binary bug that gets you inside a star is virtually unavoidable, the only way you can prevent it is just to check out if your next system has more than one star which is incredibly tedious and limits the systems you can visit.

 

[Lightspeed]

If the Chieftain can be engineered with a fast straight line speed, it might be useful for planetary exploration, but whether it will surpass existing ships for that purpose will have to await Beta, I suspect.

Personally, the emphasis of this ship on its combat credentials confirms my belief that the T-10 is my correct personal choice as a "bring everything in case you might need it" ship for exploration

 

[Kaltern]

I just think we need an exploration ship, with good longevity, room for plenty of cargo, a larger footprint because everyone feels safer in a large ship. I'd like to see an efficient engine design, perhaps like the Cutter's duel naecell design. I would also like to see a new radical design, where the front part of the ship can detatch from the main engine, and be used as a 'shuttle' type craft to land on planet surfaces. A round design would be aerodynamically efficient, like a frisbee flies through the air...


And, befitting it's specific role, I think it should be called the Galaxy.

 

[Oopsie Daisy]

snip...

Second, it's a personal pet peeve of mine that so many players focus on skipping and ignoring the galaxy as much as possible. The galaxy feels far cheaper and smaller to me now than it did when I was first introduced to Elite, pre-Engineers, pre-synthesis, pre-neutron boost. For better or for worse, it is what it is now, but it remains my personal pet peeve - particularly because I earnestly believe if players would simply sit, relax, and *look* a bit closer at the galaxy...they would find it more enjoyable than they might think. Instead of, say, rushing the 5,000 ly Engineer requirement, not looking at anything on the way, getting bored as a direct result of that, then returning straightaway to the bubble and writing a thread about how Fdev should make more ways to get more jump range.

...snip

I agree with this SO much. It would have been so much better for exploration if we could only jump as far as the next closest star.

 

[RealPuPpEt]

They could add something like a "layout for every profession" for every ship, like a tuning mod.
E.g. Sidewinder mod standard layout with his internals and mods, combat layout with his different internals and mods, etc..

 

[Shinji Ikari]

I agree with this SO much. It would have been so much better for exploration if we could only jump as far as the next closest star.

That'd be an incredibly disfunctional idea, You could easily enter into a closed loop of stars from which you could not get out if we were to do that.

 

[Oopsie Daisy]

That'd be an incredibly disfunctional idea, You could easily enter into a closed loop of stars from which you could not get out if we were to do that.

You would have to be careful about how you plot your routes. And would make doing things like going to Sag* actually impressive rather than the roll-your-eyes-and-lol thing that it is.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

You would have to be careful about how you plot your routes. And would make doing things like going to Sag* actually impressive rather than the roll-your-eyes-and-lol thing that it is.

Considering the tools we have it'd be just a matter of luck, close to the core the stars are so close to each other that it's impossible to dicern loops and either way, navigation would be non existant as only one system is reachable, ergo, you can't choose were to go at all.

 

[crushdepth]

A couple reasons.

First, the Anaconda is broken.

It's not supposed to have such light mass. It's not even really supposed to have the hardpoint loadout it has, made evident by the way it *still* has major visual clipping issues caused by the large/huge hardpoint/SRV/fighter bay arrangement.

The issue there is that Fdev has sunk themselves into a hole where they *could* fix it, but then upset a bunch of players in a game where it's one of the most popular ships, whether they bring it down to other ship's levels or bring other ships up to its level. So what they've done thus far is to just...ignore it and keep it on the furthest back burner, meanwhile perpetually leaving it as the superior ship for quick travel around the galaxy.

Engineers, synthesis, and neutrons have only exacerbated the issue.

Second, it's a personal pet peeve of mine that so many players focus on skipping and ignoring the galaxy as much as possible. The galaxy feels far cheaper and smaller to me now than it did when I was first introduced to Elite, pre-Engineers, pre-synthesis, pre-neutron boost. For better or for worse, it is what it is now, but it remains my personal pet peeve - particularly because I earnestly believe if players would simply sit, relax, and *look* a bit closer at the galaxy...they would find it more enjoyable than they might think. Instead of, say, rushing the 5,000 ly Engineer requirement, not looking at anything on the way, getting bored as a direct result of that, then returning straightaway to the bubble and writing a thread about how Fdev should make more ways to get more jump range.

Thirdly is how painting the distinction between fast travel and exploring the billions of available star systems in the galaxy seems to always tip over a mountainous salt pile erected by certain vocal members of the forums here who sit themselves atop this mountain of salt and (falsely) declare themselves leaders and spokespersons of the entire community. I simply can't help myself, in this case, I admit.

The clipping is due to the subsequent addition of the fighter bay, not because of the hard point placement which has been there since day 1.

I don't see the problem with having a 'quick' ship (it's quick if you strip it to the bone). After tens of thousands of systems 'skipping' the ones in between jumps is not an issue for me. The odds of finding something I haven't seen before in open, featureless space are small. I want to be able to reach an Actual Area of Interest quickly so that I can start exploring that. People that want to scan every last rock can noodle around near the bubble.

I'm on my way to the Zurara at the moment. It's taken 4 days of leisure time so far (I will reach it tonight) and all I've done is jump in a 60LY conda. I'm not sure how much longer you think it should take but that's plenty as far as I'm concerned. I went to Sag A in 37 LY conda. The trip there was interesting, being the first time, but the trip back to turn in my data...urgh.

 

[popuptoaster]

and crashing into stars is unavoidable if you jump into a close binary system, which is going to happen if you explore enough. I've lost many module points to heat damage during dangerous jump ins.

Hah! Rubbish! Many of us had already travelled thousands of LY round the galaxy without taking serious damage from binary systems (or anything much else) before AFM's, ship reboots or mats for repairs were even a thing in game. Just because many players seem unable to cope with exiting FSD without taking of half their HP doesn't mean it's unavoidable, it just means that players don't care enough to avoid it because they know they can fix the damage now.

 

[popuptoaster]

The clipping is due to the subsequent addition of the fighter bay, not because of the hard point placement which has been there since day 1.

I don't see the problem with having a 'quick' ship (it's quick if you strip it to the bone). After tens of thousands of systems 'skipping' the ones in between jumps is not an issue for me. The odds of finding something I haven't seen before in open, featureless space are small. I want to be able to reach an Actual Area of Interest quickly so that I can start exploring that. People that want to scan every last rock can noodle around near the bubble.

I'm on my way to the Zurara at the moment. It's taken 4 days of leisure time so far (I will reach it tonight) and all I've done is jump in a 60LY conda. I'm not sure how much longer you think it should take but that's plenty as far as I'm concerned. I went to Sag A in 37 LY conda. The trip there was interesting, being the first time, but the trip back to turn in my data...urgh.

Fighter bay has been part of the Anacaondas design since day one if you believe FDs claim to have ship internals mapped out, its Shipyard blurb used to say it could carry a sidewinder before FD added SLFs and then changed the 'Condas write up.

 

[V'larr]

No one uses synthesis boosting for fast travel,

That's false, even during my hiatus I've heard of players who make use of it while riding the colonia neutron highway.

and crashing into stars is unavoidable if you jump into a close binary system, which is going to happen if you explore enough. I've lost many module points to heat damage during dangerous jump ins.

That's your personal problem, because as I've previously stated, I've had no issues avoiding crashing into stars during my two trips to Colonia and back, and on my first exploration voyage (to Sag. A, took my time over the span of 2-3 months as I recall) I crashed into stars a grand total of 3 times. Crashing *inside* stars is no longer an issue, and Fdev's made changes regarding close binary systems, so those exceptions are out too.

Sorry V'larr, but you do not understand how many explorers play the game. You might think you do but your statements say otherwise.

Funny statement to make after demonstrating how you yourself don't fully understand how others play the game....

__

Nope, otherwise I wouldn't have spent 10 minutes writing my reply, either way, I really want to know your experience because you really talk as if you have not done much exploration beyond going to Colonia.

Well, aside from my aforementioned journeys to Sag. A and Colonia (keeping in mind even in trips to Colonia I made a point of stopping in each of the systems I passed through), I've embarked on several shorter exploration trips within around 10,000 ly of Sol to various locations that for whatever reasons while playing Elite, I became curious about and jotted down in my notes to go visit. I also made a project out of revisiting my discovered earthlikes and visiting each of the systems that are visible from the navigation panel, to create a sort of known-space-bubble as though preparing for future habitation, if you will. That's how I managed to reach my Elite exploration rank.

So no, I'm not just some "I took a trip to Colonia and I'm the game's best explorer" idiot, thanks very much.

1st thing: Only because you know of a single fringe explorer doesn't mean its the only one. DWE, DSE and DECE are expeditions which were made to go to the fringes of the galaxy, do you dare to say that's a minuscule part of the exploration community?

I'm certain there are others besides Mengy. There's been other expeditions that didn't focus on the fringes of the galaxy. And even that still doesn't make a large portion of the community or a majority of explorers in the face of the fact that at *least* 99% of the unexplored galaxy will not involve fringe-jumping.

And as I've repeated now, the fringe existed long before there were any changes to maximum possible jump range. The only thing that has changed is where the fringe exists.

2nd thing: As technology avances, so do achievements. The highest and lowest systems ever visited have been constantly changing as new features began appearing, guess which ones are the most challenging to reach? You guessed right, the newest records OFC and those are the ones that matter.

And who's to say that's necessarily a good thing? What would have been wrong with the original highest/lowest systems visited retaining their records? All the challenge of those old systems is now gone, and for what? Because impatient people asked for more jump range and greedy fringe explorers wanted to set some more records for themselves?

The additions of synthesis, Engineers, and neutron boosts is expansion of space magic as much as it is 'advancement of technology'.

Sure, I didn't say it was a necesity but don't act as if explorers didn't care about that ship characteristic, after all, the vast majority of time of an explorer is spent in SC.

Yes, it is mostly spent in SC - but not *turning* in SC, merely pointing yourself at your destination and then continuing to point at it once in range of a scan. Issues which I directly discuss in the time thread in my signature. Nowhere did I say people don't care about that convenience, either.

Well, I'm just pointing out the fact that we don't need anything but a ship to explore which has been a concurrent argument of yours. In short, when we say need it just means that it is a very nice convinience.

*sigh* No, that's *not* been my concurrent argument. You're being silly and going from one extreme to the other.

Calm down.

Don't be absurd, then?

Hahaha. Not really, if you don't have a very good jump range it is very possible to misjudge a jump and remain stuck in a T-Tauri system, I mean, why do you think we have the Fuel Rats for us?

Number of times I've gotten stuck in a T-tauri system and required assistance: 0

If you took any time at all to plan or simply look at where you are going before you went, you could avoid those situations each and every time you go jumping around.

Now, it's easier than ever before with the current navigation map & filters that we have to ensure that you don't miss fuel stars, so I'm afraid that I fail to see how it's a *necessity* to have that SRV-landing capability in anything but fringe exploring.

Back in 2.2 beta when NS stopped being sterile and useless, some explorers noticed the 300% jump boost provided by neutron stars. It turns out it was a bug and FD definetly were planning to patch it but it wasn't thanks to the efford of Dr. Kaii & Erimus which proved how the neutron stars could allow you to reach new systems and thus the bug remained to this day. Actually, they had another bug which allows two supercharges which was in fact used to discover the lowest systems ever but since 2.4 it seems to have been patched

And much louder than the efforts of Dr. Kaii & Erimus at the time were the voices of everyone wanting faster travel to Colonia and other reaches of the galaxy. I would know, I was there for all of it and experienced firsthand just how many members of the Elite community place value on being able to skip as much of the galaxy as possible.

That's literally wrong. The binary bug that gets you inside a star is virtually unavoidable, the only way you can prevent it is just to check out if your next system has more than one star which is incredibly tedious and limits the systems you can visit.

Wrong? You're are completely off your rocker, mate. Fdev has patched it out and fixed it, partly in thanks to bug reports of my own. Go and browse the patch note history if you don't believe me.

Your claim could have been correct over 2 years ago. It's since been addressed in multiple fashions. And even over 2 years ago, it was astronomically unlikely (pun intended) so whatever chance might exist of it now is exponentially even lower.

In no way is it an actual hazard to the point of requiring AFMUs/heatsinks/etc. (And anybody with a lick of common sense would instantly close down the game if it happened, like I did, which causes the game to then place you at a safe distance away from said star upon re-entry to the game - so again, in no way is it an actual hazard.)

__

The clipping is due to the subsequent addition of the fighter bay, not because of the hard point placement which has been there since day 1.

Really? Then explain to me why it is that the huge hardpoint still clips through the rear large hardpoint door?

Fact is that the Anaconda's layout hasn't changed since introduction. Part of the reason why Fdev went with making new SLFs was to avoid having to rework the model on it to fit Sidewinders inside.

I don't see the problem with having a 'quick' ship (it's quick if you strip it to the bone). After tens of thousands of systems 'skipping' the ones in between jumps is not an issue for me. The odds of finding something I haven't seen before in open, featureless space are small. I want to be able to reach an Actual Area of Interest quickly so that I can start exploring that. People that want to scan every last rock can noodle around near the bubble.

Okay, but how much of that would be fixed if supercruise over long distances went faster? Or if scanning took less time? Or if there was simply more to do with the things you can find (e.g. atmospherics, base building, and so on)?

Is it *actually* a problem of insufficient jump range?

I'm on my way to the Zurara at the moment. It's taken 4 days of leisure time so far (I will reach it tonight) and all I've done is jump in a 60LY conda. I'm not sure how much longer you think it should take but that's plenty as far as I'm concerned. I went to Sag A in 37 LY conda. The trip there was interesting, being the first time, but the trip back to turn in my data...urgh.

Yup, even if you used a 37ly ship, it used to be quite the journey, didn't it...? It's as though our Milky Way galaxy is a big, vast sea full of innumerable things, rather than an easily traversable road network like what Mass Effect might lead you to believe.

 

[Shinji Ikari]

Well, aside from my aforementioned journeys to Sag. A and Colonia (keeping in mind even in trips to Colonia I made a point of stopping in each of the systems I passed through), I've embarked on several shorter exploration trips within around 10,000 ly of Sol to various locations that for whatever reasons while playing Elite, I became curious about and jotted down in my notes to go visit. I also made a project out of revisiting my discovered earthlikes and visiting each of the systems that are visible from the navigation panel, to create a sort of known-space-bubble as though preparing for future habitation, if you will. That's how I managed to reach my Elite exploration rank.

So no, I'm not just some "I took a trip to Colonia and I'm the game's best explorer" idiot, thanks very much.

So you travel instead of explore? Ok.

I'm certain there are others besides Mengy. There's been other expeditions that didn't focus on the fringes of the galaxy.

I know, they all have been much less popular and known than DWE and DSE. The second one was actually possible thanks to the introduction of neutron star boosts.

And even that still doesn't make a large portion of the community or a majority of explorers in the face of the fact that at *least* 99% of the unexplored galaxy will not involve fringe-jumping.

Ummm, what? You say that the fraccion of explorers in the most popular expedition ever held is not significant just because there were are more stars in the core? Talk about some weird logic right there.

And as I've repeated now, the fringe existed long before there were any changes to maximum possible jump range. The only thing that has changed is where the fringe exists.

Fun fact, its necessary to use jumponium and manual plotting for 3000 Ly to reach either Star One or Arms End. For what I know. nothing like that existed before. At most you'd do 1000 Ly of manual plotting to reach the (now old) fringes of pre 2.0 and you would not need to take care of jumponium reserves.

Difficulty did shift and so did risk.

And who's to say that's necessarily a good thing? What would have been wrong with the original highest/lowest systems visited retaining their records?

Lets figure this impossible question, I believe its siply because they were beaten? A record is always bounded to be broken or show me otherwise.

All the challenge of those old systems is now gone, and for what? Because impatient people asked for more jump range and greedy fringe explorers wanted to set some more records for themselves?

The additions of synthesis, Engineers, and neutron boosts is expansion of space magic as much as it is 'advancement of technology'.

So you say those who want to establish a new record are selfish?

Yes, it is mostly spent in SC - but not *turning* in SC, merely pointing yourself at your destination and then continuing to point at it once in range of a scan. Issues which I directly discuss in the time thread in my signature. Nowhere did I say people don't care about that convenience, either.

Sure but you implied it was completely irrelevant for explorers but you go and ask why people don't like to use the Anaconda to explore and most of the times it's just for its manuerability.

*sigh* No, that's *not* been my concurrent argument. You're being silly and going from one extreme to the other.

Well if not that shows you don't convey too well your arguments as I probably have been the one who reads and answers the most of your replies.

Don't be absurd, then?

You are welcome to teach me.

Number of times I've gotten stuck in a T-tauri system and required assistance: 0

If you took any time at all to plan or simply look at where you are going before you went, you could avoid those situations each and every time you go jumping around.

Now, it's easier than ever before with the current navigation map & filters that we have to ensure that you don't miss fuel stars, so I'm afraid that I fail to see how it's a *necessity* to have that SRV-landing capability in anything but fringe exploring.

Necesities emerge from situations, simple as that. Its not my fault that you dismiss two scenarios I've come up in which it is a necessity.

And much louder than the efforts of Dr. Kaii & Erimus at the time were the voices of everyone wanting faster travel to Colonia and other reaches of the galaxy. I would know, I was there for all of it and experienced firsthand just how many members of the Elite community place value on being able to skip as much of the galaxy as possible.

Well, I also got to experience the 2.2 update and I never saw such thing but you don't have to trust me.

Wrong? You're are completely off your rocker, mate. Fdev has patched it out and fixed it, partly in thanks to bug reports of my own. Go and browse the patch note history if you don't believe me.

Your claim could have been correct over 2 years ago. It's since been addressed in multiple fashions. And even over 2 years ago, it was astronomically unlikely (pun intended) so whatever chance might exist of it now is exponentially even lower.

In no way is it an actual hazard to the point of requiring AFMUs/heatsinks/etc. (And anybody with a lick of common sense would instantly close down the game if it happened, like I did, which causes the game to then place you at a safe distance away from said star upon re-entry to the game - so again, in no way is it an actual hazard.)

Nope, there are still reports of this situation happening in 2.4 as rare as they might be.

 

[crushdepth]

You see this handbag?

*WHACK*

Something something social skills...

 

[V'larr]

So you travel instead of explore? Ok.

Yes, I totally reached Elite exploration by traveling past all the stars I most certainly didn't stop and scan and check the systems at. Definitely.

I'm afraid this is the point where I've lost my patience with you.

 

[V'larr]

You see this handbag?

*WHACK*

Something something social skills...

I'm puzzled, is the handbag meant to be retalitory allegory for bluntness?

(yes I should have done multiquote and I didn't, m'bad)