New upgrade System - "Your time is valueable"- is a pure grind and waste of everyones time

[JonathanBurnage]

If it takes 3 minutes to go from 1 to 5, what's the problem? Especially if all of those rolls are better than the last one was. Sounds like you haven't used the current system very much.

A quick glance at Coriolis reveals that an Anaconda has 35 slots for modifiable modules (I'm guessing there's still nothing for fuel tanks...). So 3 minutes apiece gives 1 hour 45 minutes of nothing but clicking. To say nothing of the time to gather all the materials. And that's just one ship.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

You seriously think it takes 3 minutes to collect the materials to go from g1 to g5? What are you talking about?

No. But shock horror, you have to play the game to get those materials. What a dreadful system, forcing you to play the game.

 

[Funny]

The materials trader will make it simpler to gather materials. Simply get together the "top range" materials for the mod you are looking for, and trade them down to get materials for the lower grades. You can then work your way through mods from 1 to 5 at a sitting.

But it will mean obtaining a lot more of those top range materials. I will be searching for more Arsenic and Cadmium for the FSD at Farseer and for Thrusters at Pailin.

If you have a big ship with many weapons, that is going to take a lot of material to get through each weapon, but maybe not as many as the hundreds some players have undertaken in the old system.

I just wish we only had to press a button once. Cost isn’t an issue, but to me it seems like managing how to use those mats, and actual engineering process itself, will take up a ton of time right now for everyone, not just those trying to max their modules. Of course a slightly reduced cost to get a decent g5 from the currently proposed system would be nice as well.

No. But shock horror, you have to play the game to get those materials. What a dreadful system, forcing you to play the game.

*cough* wake scans *cough*

 

[ALGOMATIC]

God modes are guaranteed after x amount of rolls since each new roll is better than the prev.

What will happen now, in order to compete you would need to roll x times because everyone else rolled that amount for their god rolls.

Today, we can roll 10 times and get a god roll or roll 1000 times and not get anything.

The new system forces alot of extra grind in order to compete. Not good.

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

A quick glance at Coriolis reveals that an Anaconda has 35 slots for modifiable modules (I'm guessing there's still nothing for fuel tanks...). So 3 minutes apiece gives 1 hour 45 minutes of nothing but clicking. To say nothing of the time to gather all the materials. And that's just one ship.

What's wrong with that. Think of it as a long term goal and not something you do in one day.

 

[JonathanBurnage]

If you are going to sit there for an hour rolling hundreds of times, you may as well go for an overspec. And if you are smart and work with multiple copies of the module, you never loose a good roll either way.

If the new system can do all that in obtaining the max ceiling in a fraction of the time, without the need to buy and ship in multiple modules what is the problem? It will certainly take less game time to accomplish.

It may or may not be capable of an overspec upgrade, but that isn't 100% confirmed yet. You will at least get say a +50% OM upgrade on your FSD Drive, which is more than most players have.

Plenty of people didn't want the max ceiling, they just wanted something quite good. The point that's being made here is that whilst this is better for you, it's not for others.

 

[Dbrn47]

Engineering will always be a grind. Sandro said in the feed '...Engineering was always meant to be a long progress which was intended to be done over time, while playing..' or similar wording.

Still can't believe that players want to just collect 1 material, take it to 1 Engineer, do 1 roll & have every module on every ship. Or take a short cut by buying the improvements. Because they can't they shout 'Grind, grind, grind!'

I knew what I was getting into when Engineers first came along.

Yes Iv used Engineers, Yes Iv spent hours collecting mats for each module RNG roll.

But Iv picked my modules & chosen the ones that suit me, on which ships I want & left the rest.

The changes to me look reasonable, but until I try it out on beta, then I'll decide whether or not to go back to Engineering to improve my ships further.

If you think it's a grind then don't do it, you don't need every one of the best grade 5 modules on every ship you own....do you?

\

Depending on the upgrades you want, it's not just 'while playing' (normally). I have to take a lot of detours from how I like to play to get many of the upgrades I'm looking for. Not to mention the unlock requirements in general. I still don't have Broo because of 50 Bromelite. It took a while for me to consider Palin because of his requirements. You have to play a certain way to get upgrades, it's not as simple as just 'play and upgrade as you go'.

 

[Red Anders]

If it takes 3 minutes to go from 1 to 5, what's the problem? Especially if all of those rolls are better than the last one was. Sounds like you haven't used the current system very much.

I have grade 5 access unlocked at Farseer and Martuuk. If I want to go there and roll a G5 FSD range enhancement now, here's a list of the materials I need to use before doing my grade 5 roll:



If I have to do 5 rolls for each of grade 1 to 4 before I can do a grade 5 roll, here's a list of the materials I need to use:

10 x atypical disrupted wake echoes
10 x chemical processors
5 x phosphorus
5 x strange wake solutions
5 x chemical distillery
5 x eccentric hyperspace trajectory
5 x manganese

Yeah, if you can pick those up in three minutes you're definitely better at this than most people.

 

[Cmdr Eagleboy]

Plenty of people didn't want the max ceiling, they just wanted something quite good. The point that's being made here is that whilst this is better for you, it's not for others.

What is "quite good"? Does "good enough" not cut it considering you are guaranteed upgrade with fixed negative effects?

 

[Roybe]

If you watched the stream of today you saw that they showed off the new system.To make things short.
Forcing us to roll a module 5 times to "complete" rank 1 to progess further to rank 2 is just a waste of time and material as it is waste of time finding all those material.
The materials required to go through 2,3 and 4 to finally roll 5 is such a huge new time sink that you will probably have to spend all your time on RNG jesus in order to aquire the tidious bits for the grades noone wants and uses.
They even adressed it quickly and said thats not a new grind. LIES, Do you even play your own game?.

Solutions to this is

1.) Remove the barrier and let us roll staight to G5 from 0
2.) Remove the utter clutter of different Materials. Create a CLEAR and CONSISTENT way of aquiring Materials.

There is no RNG to level...just mine the items you need and bring them to the material broker...

 

[JonathanBurnage]

What's wrong with that. Think of it as a long term goal and not something you do in one day.

I'm not asking for everything on a silver platter the moment you start. I've logged plenty of hours and worked for my upgrades, as I'm sure have you and many others. What I am asking for is engaging gameplay. I'll restate - 1 hour and 45 minutes of nothing but clicking. There's no fun in that at all.

 

[Roybe]

I have grade 5 access unlocked at Farseer and Martuuk. If I want to go there and roll a G5 FSD range enhancement now, here's a list of the materials I need to use before doing my grade 5 roll:



If I have to do 5 rolls for each of grade 1 to 4 before I can do a grade 5 roll, here's a list of the materials I need to use:

10 x atypical disrupted wake echoes
10 x chemical processors
5 x phosphorus
5 x strange wake solutions
5 x chemical distillery
5 x eccentric hyperspace trajectory
5 x manganese

Yeah, if you can pick those up in three minutes you're definitely better at this than most people.

You will be able to consistently find the materials to manufacture these....and take them to exchange to a material broker...until we know how much what it takes to make what...no telling what it will entail...the only good part is that there won't be any RNG to deal with getting those materials....

 

[lokvette]

Well that went well.

Ive hardley touched the enginers, so I dont know if the changes are good or bad but nothing ive read thus far has made me want to do rush out and do anymore than I have.

 

[Red Anders]

You will be able to consistently find the materials to manufacture these....and take them to exchange to a material broker...until we know how much what it takes to make what...no telling what it will entail...the only good part is that there won't be any RNG to deal with getting those materials....

I can consistently find all of those now, along with pretty much anything else for engineering. The point is that I don't need to.

 

[Zynniah]

I get it what Sandro was trying to say at the stream. Some PvP players probably did more rolls to get that god roll on that weapon than if they had with this new system. Now, they will get a great weapon using less rolls in a more progressive system.
But for those players, including myself, who unlocked lvl 5 engineering and were happy with a couple of G5 rolls, this is going to be a huge grind to upgrade a new ship. Even with the materials broker.

I should stay out of this but I'm not going to be smart right now.

I joined ED only recently. I unlocked Farseer in a few days. I didn't even know what engineers were at the time. I just got the Farseer message when I hit Scout rank. I figured I would see what it was about. Read forums and other resources. I thought increased jump range was a great idea for me only recently purchased Viper Mk IV.

By the time I found where to get the meta-alloy she wanted to unlock her (which took more time reading on forums to figure out what I was after than to actually go get it), I had enough scan data to sell to Universal Cartographers to unlock all the way to level 4. Then I had to sort out the whole materials thing and find enough materials.

That didn't actually take too long since all the information on finding materials was explained in the same places I had figured out Meta-Alloys. So, off to the material grinding for a couple of game sessions. Once I had 3 of the tough to find materials for a G5 FSD upgrade, I went back to Farseer and started engineering rolls to get to level 5 (using the other materials I had collected on the way). It didn't take too long to unlock 5.

I may have gotten lucky. My first G5 long-range FSD roll sucked. My second roll got the range bumped to about half of it's max. So, I took it. The third roll got it mostly to the top but with a big hit to power draw. I took the third and have been using it ever since. Down side is I have to power down the FSD when I deploy weapons (and an extra 0.6 of a second in FSD charge time).

Did I get lucky? I have no idea. But, my question is this ... As a total novice I got 1 Engineer unlocked and enough materials (and other pre-reqs) to have 3 attempts at G5 on a single component. I have between 2 and 4 hours a day to play. It took me about 5 days (say 20 hours), after hitting Scout rank, to get G5 FSD at say 80% of max (with some big down sides). How long will the new system take for a novice who needs to figure out where to get everything?

 

[stormyuk]

Now instead of just gathering grade 5 mats for new modules, I'll have to gather all the mats to get that module to grade 5, but not just that, it has to be enough mats to get through each grade first... for each module... Much improve, many hype, grind is definitely in my mind. Well, at least it'll be guaranteed perfect rolls by the end of each upgrade path. [money] I'll give it a test before ultimate judgement, but I'm going to stock up on Prep H just in case.

Yeh I must admit it does seem pretty excessive to force all that RNG. Some of the rolls on the stream barely moved the progression on too.

Has anyone roughly calculated what it takes compared to people like me who just did a couple of G5 rolls per module. It seems like a lot more grind to be honest.

 

[GG7]

You seriously think it takes 3 minutes to collect the materials to go from g1 to g5? What are you talking about?

Since when is mat collection part of the engineering upgrade session time?

As far as the G1 to G5 time frame... YES! I do. Based on watching Ed on the stream.

If you know what you are doing, you would have already collected all the materials in advance of heading to the engineer in question. With the new 100 quantity per material and data, just the business of flying around doing missions and whatnot is eventually going to fill up your inventory with TONS of materials.

We have NEVER had the luxury of 100 of each of the mats/data required for a specific upgrade before. Unless you dumped a bunch of other useful and hard to find stuff to make room for it.

We have also never had the luxury of actually stocking every single material and data type in the game to a 100 unit quantity. That is currently impossible with the 1000 inventory max.

<sigh> [blah] Such closed minded thinking in this thread.

I strongly suggest you wait and try out the whole package before losing your S about it! Its becoming very apparent that some here are incapable of envisioning how this upgrade will work based on ALL the info provided.

At least when you considering how dopey and off base so many of these complaints are.

 

[Zieman]

Wow, didn't take long for the first whining threads to pop up!
Sheesh...

 

[-VR- Max Factor]

I just wish we only had to press a button once. Cost isn’t an issue, but to me it seems like managing how to use those mats, and actual engineering process itself, will take up a ton of time right now for everyone, not just those trying to max their modules. Of course a slightly reduced cost to get a decent g5 from the currently proposed system would be nice as well.

*cough* wake scans *cough*

Wake scan are a gameplay element. That is still.play the game. Just scan a couple when ever you leave or enter a station, it won't take long to get some rare data and a load of none rare which you can trade up. It isn't difficult.

 

[xondk]

But Xon.... That's exactly what they did... Click 20 times to get a god roll.

They didn't show us how it behaves upon last final roll where you then can't get anymore? from my understanding it rolls and fills up the 'bar', and those rolls are like now, random, so if your final roll ends up good, you might end up with a god weapon but if it doesn't you might just end up with a top g5 weapon? easier and steadier progression?