The Star Citizen Thread V2.0

[Fivebyfive]

the details, the love

That's a pretty vague remark though.

What parts of the gameplay elements do you think are deep specifically? I'm not trying to attack you, I'm very interested to hear what you think.

Personally, at the game's current state the only deep element is the damage modeling on the ships that looks fantastic. It's very satisfying to see a ship you're shooting at break apart piece by piece. The rest of the game doesn't really have anything "deep" in my opinion. Combat, gunnery and any form of metagame in AC is very shallow.

 

[Andrew Sayers]

**If the group of like-minded people who have gravitated toward this thread talking to each other, occasionally off-topic, is too distracting to the discussion of Star Citizen, perhaps Frontier could set up another Off-Topic category called "UEE Refugees" or something. Then we could all leave this thread and discuss things to our heart's content where it won't bother this very important topic. Might get lonely in here though.**

I actually think that sounds like a great idea, although it might be easier for you just to create a "UEE Refugees" thread in the general off-topic forum - I doubt they'd get merged so long as the OP makes it clear that thread is for chatter and the news thread is over here.

 

[psyron]

In the latest 10FTC Chris says they are running into problems once they get over 12 players in AC - but they do have a lot of optimisation to do.

But they are still aiming for 50-100?

I think i know the secret of CIG ... Simply wait 5-10 years with the development and their promises will become true due to better hardware and internet connections!

This is one of those examples that show clearly how naive many of the SC backers are. They are telling us all the way that SC will be better than ED because CIG are promising much more! But promises cost nothing and impress the average folks quite easily.
FD only promises what they know is feasable with the current hardware.
Their 'numbers' may look less impressive, but you will get it NOW!

And since the development of ED will continue afterwards you can expect them to deliver better results even in 5-10 years!

Edit:
I have nothing against NEWS on SC in this thread as longs it's not advertising yet another ship sale!!!

 

[Toumal]

the details, the love

but in case you just wanted an attack vector on my position. drop it. if you cant love the game dont hate on it.. think +...

That was a genuine question. I found AC to be severely disappointing so far. The gameplay is not fun at all, the multiplayer was unplayable last time I tried it. Sound design did improve a bit but does not hold up to today's standards. The only thing that I really liked is the level of detail of the models and the damage modeling. Those two are kickass. Unfortunately nothing that doesn't help to make me want to play that game again.

I'm not a "hater". I'm just not blindly believing everything CR says anymore. I've been disappointed too many times. A million for a stretch goal and you get a plant? Seriously?

No. Now it's up to them to release something more substantial. Like travel and trading. I was never interested in just the dogfighting, mind you. I don't play deathmatch and capture the flag games anymore, been doing that for almost 30 years.

Think positive? How about they deliver positive for a change?

 

[Mr.Nowak]

Had an issue with duplicate posters in the Hangar. Here is how the conversation with the Customer support went down. :smilie:

Spoiler

--

That was a genuine question. I found AC to be severely disappointing so far. The gameplay is not fun at all, the multiplayer was unplayable last time I tried it. Sound design did improve a bit but does not hold up to today's standards. The only thing that I really liked is the level of detail of the models and the damage modeling. Those two are kickass. Unfortunately nothing that doesn't help to make me want to play that game again.

I'm not a "hater". I'm just not blindly believing everything CR says anymore. I've been disappointed too many times. A million for a stretch goal and you get a plant? Seriously?

No. Now it's up to them to release something more substantial. Like travel and trading. I was never interested in just the dogfighting, mind you. I don't play deathmatch and capture the flag games anymore, been doing that for almost 30 years.

Think positive? How about they deliver positive for a change?

Interesting a lot of my friends play weekly and none of them are huge SC followers or backers.The sound design is pretty good now and for sure holds to today's standards imo. The small million dollar stretch goals are to balance feature creep. Most of the money from stretch goals goes to the development costs anyway. CR said this many many many times. Little gifts for a million are just to make sure the feature set is balanced with easy stuff to make sure they don't stretch out the development too far.

No. Now it's up to them to release something more substantial. Like travel and trading.

This stuff will be released late this year or early next year. So you have some waiting to do. The point with modules is to make the waiting easier and a more enjoyable experience while testing and giving feedback on the game. One of things that improved vastly is Multiplayer the other one is stability and the one that had a modest pass is audio. More of these improvements are on the way. 13.0 should be pretty close after Gamescom. Maybe 2-4 weeks after? We will see.

I wasn't aware there was one. What time is it? I'll see if I can catch it, but I plan on being out for dinner on Friday.

It is from 7 PM GMT+1 to 12 PM GMT+1.

 

[psyron]

Personally, at the game's current state the only deep element is the damage modeling on the ships that looks fantastic. It's very satisfying to see a ship you're shooting at break apart piece by piece. The rest of the game doesn't really have anything "deep" in my opinion. Combat, gunnery and any form of metagame in AC is very shallow.

I have to admit that i don't even like that part of the game because
- it's neither realistic that a ship which is half broken apart is still somehow playable
- nor does it makes sense to design ships that are so fragile in the first place!

So however you turn it - the ship design in SC is completely wrong. Having fragile wings for space ships make no sense at all!

But this shows once more the wrong way to design a game done by CIG:
- They first had this idea: "Hey, would be cool to have a good looking damage system in SC!"
- Then they try to model ships the ways that makes a cool damage system visually attractive: "We have to create ships fragile to make our damage system plausible!"
-> The result is fragile ships that makes the game unplayable!

The same for the thrusters and flight mechanics:
- They first had this idea: "Hey, would be cool to have ship react exactly based on thrusters movement/output!"
- Then they try to model ships the ways that makes a cool thruster system visually attactive: "We have to create ships with moving/rotating thrusters to make our thruster system visually plausible!"
-> The result is a very bad flight mechanic in sacrifice to a "beautiful" looking thruster system!

Bottom line:
They put so much effort in systems that are not only completely irrelevant, very time consuming for development but also affect the gameplay negatively. Headache again ...

 

[psyron]

... The point with modules is to make the waiting easier and a more enjoyable experience while testing and giving feedback on the game.

Really? But why are they putting so much effort in things that are only "placeholders"?

FD is realeasing Alphas/Beta purely to get feedback and get things tested - not to give little children something to play with in the meantime, he he

So the argument of saying that you can't judge SC by playing AC is
- either wrong because AC is a fundamental piece of SC
- or means that CIG is wasting time and money!

However you look at it - is doesn't throw a good light on CIG.

 

[Mr.Nowak]

Really? But why are they putting so much effort in things that are only "placeholders"?

FD is realeasing Alphas/Beta purely to get feedback and get things tested - not to give little children something to play with in the meantime, he he

So the argument of saying that you can't judge SC by playing AC is
- either wrong because AC is a fundamental piece of SC
- or means that CIG is wasting time and money!

However you look at it - is doesn't throw a good light on CIG.

Placeholders? This is the public build of SC most stuff if not placeholder. Only a few things are and the rest will just be revamped because they were produced in 2013 according to the SC Standards back then.

Oh so FD releasing Combat Scenarios was something to give little children something to play with in the meantime? AC is a feedback and testing platform while also an entertainment one.

AC is first piece of SC but it's a mini game within the universe. How come CIG is wating time and money by releasing modules of which the assets they will use in the game and of which they are balancing and testing?

What logic is this? By that standard the combat scenarios of ED were a waste of time and money. No they were not they are the beginning of it. But while the CS scenarios in ED have no purpose other than being a little tutorial in the full game Arena Commander will be a mini game within the SC universe where you can lose a ship without paying the price and you can do MOBA style matches.

It's called ARENA Commander. Here is the stretch goal for it.

16 Mil

Arena mode: The next generation of Wing Commander’s TrainSim allows pilots to test out their combat skills against friends or strangers in a simulation. Gain valuable combat experience without the downside of losing your ship in the game universe! Place bets on competitions across the galaxy.

Source: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/funding-goals

 

[Voivod]

Had an issue with duplicate posters in the Hangar. Here is how the conversation with the Customer support went down.

I'm still waiting for you to post a single negative comment about SC.
Because you know... you're not advertising

 

[Mr.Nowak]

I'm still waiting for you to post a single negative comment about SC.
Because you know... you're not advertising

Because you know you haven't read all my comments?

http://forums.frontier.co.uk/showthread.php?p=479021#post479021 that is just one there are several.

 

[Voivod]

Because you know you haven't read all my comments?

Well yeah I haven't investigated every post of yours, but I do read daily and I don't remember you saying a single criticism about anything to do with SC/RSI... but I'm sure like the post you mentioned, if you do, you'll have a "but I bet they fix it soon.com" excuse attached to it.

Your positive opinion on pretty much EVERYTHING, from random concept screens to important gameplay elements, is kind of overwhelming compared to your criticism of the game (and some of your posts are borderline advertising even though you deny it)

Then again I suspect you're trying to balance all the negative opinions some people have over here. It's like watching pong sometimes.

 

[Thargon]

Omg! Is that the new capture the core gameplay! Looks amazingly deep

 

[Bains]

lol at the SC hate..

Rule one from the Fanboy Manifesto

#1 Critics are haters...

the details, the love

but in case you just wanted an attack vector on my position. drop it. if you cant love the game dont hate on it.. think +...

I get the impression if you took the boulders and obstacles away it would be like an typical FPS shooter with no cover, two guys facing each other and shooting, and straffing defensively - and the guy with the bigger gun almost certainly wins - Revealing the game can not deliver dogfighting. I'm so sure about this I predict there will always be 'space crates' of one kind or another to provide cover on every single map. Where as you don't need cover to make an engagement in elite interesting because the, dogfighting it delivers is intrinsically interesting. The same is true for a flight sim - its about angles, maneuvers, turning arcs, you dont need floating cover in the sky to hide behind and without which the experience is empty. Even the notion of capture the flag and return to your side puts me off still further because it is so obviously a FPS game mode. How can anyone not see this? For me its obvious AC combat is being revealed as COD like FPS combat with you running around in spaceship-shaped avatars. No doubt many mainstream FPS players will and are finding this comfortingly unchallenged and familiar - just the way they love it.

Anyway since you've been playing it recently. Can you tell me whats the situation with the wide angle gimbiled weapons? Is it still point vaguely in the direction of a ship and click on them with your mouse? What about the big red arrow telling you where to look next? How this design choice can be associated with a deep game leaves me baffled. In any case is it still there? What about the strength of the yaw? Is it the same as it was? i.e. the strongest force in the SC universe. Has true 6dof arrived yet? Or in its absence are we still hiding behind juvenile attempts at military sounding flight modes - conflab, couples, g-string or whatever.

I'm very interested.

But they are still aiming for 50-100?

I think i know the secret of CIG ... Simply wait 5-10 years with the development and their promises will become true due to better hardware and internet connections!

I don't think you full understand the mind of the Roberts. 'The game will never be finished' will be said and resaid like a mantra (much as 'its a pre alpha' is continually said now). On the surface the suggest will be that the game will always be a work in progress - which is no bad thing - but in reality it will be become the universal excuse.

 

[Mr.Nowak]

Well yeah I haven't investigated every post of yours, but I do read daily and I don't remember you saying a single criticism about anything to do with SC/RSI... but I'm sure like the post you mentioned, if you do, you'll have a "but I bet they fix it soon.com" excuse attached to it.

Your positive opinion on pretty much EVERYTHING, from random concept screens to important gameplay elements, is kind of overwhelming compared to your criticism of the game (and some of your posts are borderline advertising even though you deny it)

Then again I suspect you're trying to balance all the negative opinions some people have over here. It's like watching pong sometimes.

So posting stuff related to the SC project and CIG is advertising? And why can't I have a positive opinion on this Project? Is the only way to talk about SC to thrash and criticise every bit of it? I have no advertisement posts I just post stuff that is interesting from the SC project.

If that is advertisement to you then everything regarding Star Citizen is. Then the starcitizen reddit is advertisement too. It's just weird that you guys can't accept that there are many people who enjoy AC and have a positive outlook on the project.

At the end of the day I criticised the game and the project in several ways and said what they could do better in my opinion. I also know what the people's frustrations here are but regardless I want to keep this thread well informed.

--

New SC Lore released talking of the era of Messer X. If you are interested in the Lore of SC and mainly politics It's a good read. I mainly enjoy the Congress Now series though. Those remind me of the Roman Senate.

A culture of subversion was growing within the UEE. Though the death of Anthony Tanaka had occurred almost twenty-five years earlier, the seeds of dissent were only now beginning to grow. The people, subjugated for so long, were slowly building the confidence to speak out. The tenth Imperator, Ulysses Messer, was oblivious to all of this as he continued the massive architectural venture he had undertaken while serving as High Secretary during his uncle’s reign.

https://robertsspaceindustries.com/...-This-Day-In-History-The-Beginning-Of-The-End

 

[metatheurgist]

What feels "deep" in SC?

the love

The length of Mr Roberts stretch goals deep inside your wallet?

 

[Bains]

At first glance I thought this was a reference to the so called flight model.

 

[Mr.Nowak]

One of the guys from the SC Community made this huge gallery that includes collection of a lot of imagery from the whole project. Fan and official stuff included. That's a huge collection

http://www.space-champion.com/gallery/

 

[Bains]

One of the guys from the SC Community made this huge gallery that includes collection of a lot of imagery from the whole project. Fan and official stuff included. That's a huge collection

http://www.space-champion.com/gallery/

Wow. Someones put the same old material all in one place. I hope this wont stop you continuing to re post bits of it again and again and again.

 

[Voivod]

So posting stuff related to the SC project and CIG is advertising?

No, posting that conversation you had with customer services was, in my opinion, borderline advertising.

And why can't I have a positive opinion on this Project?

Noone said you shouldn't or can't. Where did you read that?

Is the only way to talk about SC to thrash and criticise every bit of it?

No, you should criticize the parts of the game that need improvement.
You barely criticize the project you adore at all.

It's just weird that you guys can't accept that there are many people who enjoy AC and have a positive outlook on the project.

Who is "you guys"? You're responding to my post and I don't represent anyone.

I have no problem accepting that people have a positive outlook, I have problem with people having an overwhelming positive comment for *everything* that CIG does.

"Flight model is great! Space plants are great! Development is great! Selling ships 24/7 is great!"

That's not a way to improve the game I want to play.
These "fans" are the ones who are going to ruin MY gameplay experience.

At the end of the day I criticised the game and the project in several ways

Please.... I disagree.

 

[Voivod]

At first glance I thought this was a reference to the so called flight model.

It was actually a reference to the problematic netcode of the previous patch
However it's much better now.