Look on the Brightside the first expedition to mars will be sorted for emergency toilet roll all thanks to the ethics manual.
General / Off-Topic We may need to rethink Colonia
- Thread starter Olivia Vespera
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Look on the Brightside the first expedition to mars will be sorted for emergency toilet roll all thanks to the ethics manual.
Olivia, I'm not a linguistic, however, while the term 'colony' may share the root of other words like 'colonialism' or 'colonization', it doesn't really need to have the same connotations. The scientific community agrees that a an ant colony is a perfect example of different organisms growing together and even sharing common interests without really having anything at all with humans. A colony of settlers perfectly fits to the current 'Colonia' as a name and doesn't necessarily means conflict or has to be related to human past history.
Similarly, in that area of space you wouldn't like to have outposts, since the term has been very heavily attached to military advance settlements.
Similarly, in that area of space you wouldn't like to have outposts, since the term has been very heavily attached to military advance settlements.
This is one of many posts that point out that there is a difference between RL and games, so we shouldn't bring RL issues into gaming world.
First of all, most games are, and most importantly ED is based on real life.
Game world is populated by characters (or numbers representing characters) that are based on real life humans, that act more or less as humans would in circumstances depicted by the game.
There is politics in the game world, based on RL politics, although realities of this are different, game world history is to a certain point identical to our RL history. All this is used to depict world that is beliveable to some degree.
Even cannibalism is real world thing, that you take into your game and use for your enjoyment. It might be fun for you, although I suppose not that much if you would meet another player whose parents were eaten by real cannibals, and who might take offense
Anyway I don't understand this kind of selective approach, because apart from everything else one could easily imagine that what OP suggests might be part of game world - and in fact it is, because she is one of players in that universe. Imagine she is playing a character that feels that using word Colonia might not be right, because of Old World colonialism (also a thing in ED universe). It might be easier for you to get into conversation about name of in game thing.
I know that this is probably not exactly what OP was about, but this kind of argument is no argument at all. it's just another way of saying: this is something i have no interest in, so I came here to tell you that.
indeed populating mars with humans, where there's no creature living that we know of, is not the same thing as robbing other's lands or ecosystems which is what homo sapiens have been doing all along, for millions of years, despite both being named colonizing. an insect plague is also, in essence, colonization. but i'm fine with calling it colonia because that's just what we biologically are: a plague
that said, and interesting and exciting as mars colonization is, it's a pipe dream unless we sort out our problems here on earth first, and fast. if we can't feed ourselves on the poles, nor on the desert, and not even quite in temperate climate ... how could we possibly do that on a rock 2 years travel away and with no atmosphere whatsoever? it's just wishful thinking (since has to continue, though).
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I think the fundamental misapprehension the OP has taken from the article is that the RL piece discusses the issues and impact of humans setting up shop on another planet.
Mars for example has an atmosphere, and as such has a potential to have indigenous life (probably microbial, and more likely had life but no more). The issue in real life is the impact of an alien species (humans) invading this totally inhuman environment.
Trying to take this item, which is written based on the modern history of humanity, and then apply it to a Science fiction game, is in my opinion disingenuous. So far many responders have highlighted that the environment of Colonia is set in the vacuum of space, or on airless worlds. The game has no indigenous life forms in this area for humans to contaminate, exterminate, exploit or enslave.
So fretting over ther origin of the word Colonia based on 20th viewpoint is as much use as a chocolate teapot.
This game allows players to participate in slavery and are rewarded for it. This game only allows players to interact with fauna and flora discovered by shooting it with weapons. This game already has a “bubble” of humanity which prior to the onset of player game time has colonised and exploited Earth like worlds, terra formed others at an unknown cost of the indigenous populations there. I believe in the game lore Achenar had a local sentient species that was made extinct due to human colonisation.
I dont see you bemoaning this construct - if your concerns over using the wrong descriptors is so key, you may want to survey the ‘occupied’ planets closer to Sol and then berate FDev for creating a game with such inequalities and wrong doings.
Piffle to you!
Mars for example has an atmosphere, and as such has a potential to have indigenous life (probably microbial, and more likely had life but no more). The issue in real life is the impact of an alien species (humans) invading this totally inhuman environment.
Trying to take this item, which is written based on the modern history of humanity, and then apply it to a Science fiction game, is in my opinion disingenuous. So far many responders have highlighted that the environment of Colonia is set in the vacuum of space, or on airless worlds. The game has no indigenous life forms in this area for humans to contaminate, exterminate, exploit or enslave.
So fretting over ther origin of the word Colonia based on 20th viewpoint is as much use as a chocolate teapot.
This game allows players to participate in slavery and are rewarded for it. This game only allows players to interact with fauna and flora discovered by shooting it with weapons. This game already has a “bubble” of humanity which prior to the onset of player game time has colonised and exploited Earth like worlds, terra formed others at an unknown cost of the indigenous populations there. I believe in the game lore Achenar had a local sentient species that was made extinct due to human colonisation.
I dont see you bemoaning this construct - if your concerns over using the wrong descriptors is so key, you may want to survey the ‘occupied’ planets closer to Sol and then berate FDev for creating a game with such inequalities and wrong doings.
Piffle to you!
You know what really helps normal people get on board with the other-ing that lets them not get so worked up about the homophobia, the racism, the sectarianism that they are able to carry on with their lives and pretend, day to day, that everything's fine really because it's not happening where they can see it?
The terminology, that's what. Terminology is part of the problem.
I grew up in a time and a place where (some people thought) it was OK to kill people because they were taigs and fenians so they weren't real people.
You can't say "we'll worry about the bad words when we've sorted out all the bad deeds" because the words help to drive the deeds.
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this is true, words are the narrative which shapes reality. i have no problem with the use of "colonization" specifically though. it's a descriptive word of appropriation of space. humanity is not "bringing the light" to colonia, it's expanding there to reap resources because it can, an it will do so violently if needed. so the name is very apt. that's what we do, op has seen too much star trek
this is true, words are the narrative which shapes reality. i have no problem with the use of "colonization" specifically though. it's a descriptive word of appropriation of space. humanity is not "bringing the light" to colonia, it's expanding there to reap resources because it can, an it will do so violently if needed. so the name is very apt. that's what we do, op has seen too much star trek
And even in Star Trek they refer to human colonies
whatever will we call the third new bubble for explorers to grow anew?
Colonia 2!
Star Wars jumped the shark well before Disney got their hands on it and no amount of "PC hand wringing" was responsible for, or could overshadow, nonsensical plots and inane characterization.
Well, except for how unoriginal "Colonia" is for a colony.
It's almost as bad as naming a big river I stumbled across the Rio Grande.
Origin
Colore (Latin - cultivate) -> Colonus (Latin - settler/farmer) -> Colonia (Latin - settlement/farm) -> Colony (late Middle English)
Late Middle English (denoting a settlement formed mainly of retired soldiers, acting as a garrison in newly conquered territory in the Roman Empire): from Latin colonia ‘settlement, farm’, from colonus ‘settler, farmer’, from colere ‘cultivate’.
Thus, technically, Colonia means settlement/farm. Seems about right to me, if rather uninspired.
Z...
Colore (Latin - cultivate) -> Colonus (Latin - settler/farmer) -> Colonia (Latin - settlement/farm) -> Colony (late Middle English)
Late Middle English (denoting a settlement formed mainly of retired soldiers, acting as a garrison in newly conquered territory in the Roman Empire): from Latin colonia ‘settlement, farm’, from colonus ‘settler, farmer’, from colere ‘cultivate’.
Thus, technically, Colonia means settlement/farm. Seems about right to me, if rather uninspired.
Z...
![[VR] Merkir](https://forums-cdn.zaonce.net/data/avatars/m/141/141091.jpg?1553527154){kind=avatar}
From the ED dictionary:
Colonoscopy (noun): The study of colonies and their effects on online gaming communities.
(shuffles slowly out of the room)
Colonoscopy (noun): The study of colonies and their effects on online gaming communities.
(shuffles slowly out of the room)
Laughed hard at this
I've had the dubious pleasure of fighting in some other idiots religious conflict and I don't agree.
People make a big deal about the terminology because its a very easy way of looking like you are doing something whilst not putting any effort whatsoever into the actual problem. Its all about appearances no actual use and driven mostly by fashion.
You just force it into hiding or even worsen resentments by trying to force newspeak on people.
You also undermine how people see the real issues (like the one you described) by making a fuss about trivialities, which this thread is.
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OP lacks a grasp on the etymology of the word "colony" (unlike Zeeman above)
This thread is a result of a lack of knowledge but not of perceived political correctness.
OP should read Zeeman's post and learn how silly this request is.
I will not stop calling Germany that name just because Hitler did too. Which is essentially what OP requests.
This thread is a result of a lack of knowledge but not of perceived political correctness.
OP should read Zeeman's post and learn how silly this request is.
I will not stop calling Germany that name just because Hitler did too. Which is essentially what OP requests.
I do wonder if people keep renaming things to distance themselves from some kind of collective guilt they feel for acts have certainly been pretty awful and in the case of colonisation, been literally devastating for indigenous peoples. It's not going to change the past though and changing the name is unlikely to make the slightest difference to any activities undertaken as part of any future colonisation. The kind of people who might think this kind of thing is a worthwhile idea and may change their behaviour because of it aren't the kind of people who are going to land on distant shores and start smashing the natives heads in with sticks or whatever they did in the first place.
Some kinds of social reprogramming through the use of different language are probably quite effective and beneficial but given that as far as we know there are no indigenous anything else anywhere apart from on Earth, it seems like a bit of a waste of time at the moment to start changing the way we refer to colonising other worlds. It's a bridge we can cross another day. Maybe.
Some kinds of social reprogramming through the use of different language are probably quite effective and beneficial but given that as far as we know there are no indigenous anything else anywhere apart from on Earth, it seems like a bit of a waste of time at the moment to start changing the way we refer to colonising other worlds. It's a bridge we can cross another day. Maybe.
If, in the unfortunate event there's a renaming, I suggest Middle Finger, referencing Joe Haldeman's "Forever Wars", and for the same reasons. Or, if we must bow to the milquetoast Bowdlerists here, Animal Farm, referencing Orwell.
I like Olivia but this is painfully stupid.
Yes, ‘colony’ and its derivitives have some nasty baggage. But abandoning any word that has had bad things done in its name will eviscerate language.
It’s also cowardly. Words aren’t malign - they can’t be, they have no intentions. People can be malign. What’s achieved by simply giving up words to people who do bad things?
But all these “it’s a game, it’s not real life” comments are also stupid. Who cares? Basic standards of decency still apply - just because it’s a video game doesn’t mean racism is fine, for example. The fact is that renaming Colonia would be equally stupid if it was a real-life scenario.
Yes, ‘colonisation’ has some baggage. But rather than feebly retreat from it and force ourselves to awkwardly use some less useful word, how about we clean it up? Let’s make ‘colonialism’ associated with good things, not bad.
Yes, ‘colony’ and its derivitives have some nasty baggage. But abandoning any word that has had bad things done in its name will eviscerate language.
It’s also cowardly. Words aren’t malign - they can’t be, they have no intentions. People can be malign. What’s achieved by simply giving up words to people who do bad things?
But all these “it’s a game, it’s not real life” comments are also stupid. Who cares? Basic standards of decency still apply - just because it’s a video game doesn’t mean racism is fine, for example. The fact is that renaming Colonia would be equally stupid if it was a real-life scenario.
Yes, ‘colonisation’ has some baggage. But rather than feebly retreat from it and force ourselves to awkwardly use some less useful word, how about we clean it up? Let’s make ‘colonialism’ associated with good things, not bad.
The name Mississippi comes from the French "Messipi" - the French rendering of the native American Anishinaabe (Ojibwe or Algonquin) name for the river, "Misi-ziibi," meaning "Great River."
For the win!
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Lucianne Walkowicz said:
In the specific context of Elite Dangerous, over the last thousand years on Tau Ceti, Achenar, Lave, Phiagre, and many more the native life on ELWs has been killed, reduced to a fraction of its original spread and kept from extinction in nature reserves, or sold as a curiosity across the galaxy. We can call it something other than "colonisation" when we do something other than "colonisation".
Colonia itself, I'm hopeful that it won't repeat those mistakes. So far ... the majority of life on inhabited ELWs, WWs and AWs is being kept away from human settlements. The vacuum fungus discovered on a moon of Colonia 3 may not have survived, though, despite efforts not to interfere "too much" with it, and there's still quite a bit of collection of "samples" for research. Maybe having a warning of what the easy route is going to lead to placed in the name of the region is no bad thing after all? Maybe it has to prove itself and earn the right to be called something better? It hasn't yet - even if it hasn't been an Achenar-level disaster yet either.
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