Any word on fixing grenade spam and near impossible to kill NPC's in FPS missions, regardless of level?
- Thread starter Malakie
- Start date
@ op , are you using ingame sound?
There are audio queues and directional indicators as to where nades are.
Personally having zero issues with any of the ground combat.
Use a Thermal to take down shields, use kinetic to nuke flesh
Nade lands at my feet I jump boost away.
Not sure it can be any simpler than that?
There are audio queues and directional indicators as to where nades are.
Personally having zero issues with any of the ground combat.
Use a Thermal to take down shields, use kinetic to nuke flesh
Nade lands at my feet I jump boost away.
Not sure it can be any simpler than that?
The NPC's do seem to have infinite grenades.
I -think- this is because the AI doesn't know how to handle rooftops - and so, instead of actually doing the job properly, and letting them use jetpacks, or just stairs effectively, they just gave them infinite grenades and told the AI to throw grenades if it can't immediately work out how to get to the enemy.
It's pretty poor, yes.
However, the other part about it being impossible isn't true, I've completed a whole bunch of missions where I needed to fight the AI.
I -think- this is because the AI doesn't know how to handle rooftops - and so, instead of actually doing the job properly, and letting them use jetpacks, or just stairs effectively, they just gave them infinite grenades and told the AI to throw grenades if it can't immediately work out how to get to the enemy.
It's pretty poor, yes.
However, the other part about it being impossible isn't true, I've completed a whole bunch of missions where I needed to fight the AI.
The pathfinding changes required for the AI to use the Jetpacks is probably less trivial than simply rewriting the entire Cobra Engine from whole cloth in Vulkan.
Warframe has perhaps the best Pathfinding solution in modern gaming for AI, and even that relies heavily on machine learning that analyzes how players move over the terrain and attempts to emulate it and took over 2 years make functional. Just the pathfinding, and the levels in Warframe are much more constrained than even EDO.
I know it would be damned hard to do it to that level.
However.
Enemy on roof.
Move to edge of building closest to enemy.
Use jet pack to move upward.
Land on roof.
Go back to normal ground AI.
That would fail, because the edge of many buildings has an overhang, which also has a simple solution, which would have the side effect of enemies not walking under covered spaces. It would also fail on non- building rises.
Of course, these all do have solutions, but they continue to increase complexity which requires an ever increasing set of considerations to be pre calculated and therefore, adverse effect on performance which, if i understand the community complaints right, is already "not good".
tl;dr you don't just "detect the edge of the building"
Its not hard, its DAAAaaAAAAAAAaaaaAAAAaangerous.
In 2017, when target ships for massacre missions wouldnt spawn, or would spawn at rates far too slow to finish missions? Frontier claimed "they didnt see it on their end" despite 100s of posts and 1000s of comments over time. Forum comments: edit oops I didnt realize >< were operands
--The game is DANGEROUS. Do you want it to be too easy? Maybe you just arent good at the game.
--2 years later, the ship spawning issue was resolved. Oops, I guess that wasn't the 'dangerous' thing after all, but if you read the forums you might have gotten the idea that the only people complaining about it at the time were... not good at playing the game.
But in 2021, where all games have to have an uber-nightmare-hell-permadeath difficulty setting for the Real Gamers, who shame gamers who say "wow this is really too hard" on social media and forums, this isnt daaaaangerous enough, am I right?? We dont get enough stress in the outside world today, so we should make games MORE stressful and challenging, and then mock anyone who says "this is stress." Yes, lets.
In 2017, when target ships for massacre missions wouldnt spawn, or would spawn at rates far too slow to finish missions? Frontier claimed "they didnt see it on their end" despite 100s of posts and 1000s of comments over time. Forum comments: edit oops I didnt realize >< were operands
--The game is DANGEROUS. Do you want it to be too easy? Maybe you just arent good at the game.
--2 years later, the ship spawning issue was resolved. Oops, I guess that wasn't the 'dangerous' thing after all, but if you read the forums you might have gotten the idea that the only people complaining about it at the time were... not good at playing the game.
But in 2021, where all games have to have an uber-nightmare-hell-permadeath difficulty setting for the Real Gamers, who shame gamers who say "wow this is really too hard" on social media and forums, this isnt daaaaangerous enough, am I right?? We dont get enough stress in the outside world today, so we should make games MORE stressful and challenging, and then mock anyone who says "this is stress." Yes, lets.
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Well yeah, it's obviously not as simple as I made out, I'm just suggesting there is probably a way somewhere between deep learning algorithms, and something from the 80s
Wow that sounds so simple, and so easy.
Maybe you should try Animal Crossing?
Look, the shooter mechanism is pretty basic but it does, it seems, require a different approach to what most people expect.
Mostly all I see is people offering advice as to how they’ve adapted to it, not mocking. If someone refuses to listen, insisting that they know it’s just broken because they’ve played XYZ game and still struggle without G5, then they deserve to be mocked. Although most members still just offer advice.
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This one.Maybe you should try Animal Crossing?
Look, the shooter mechanism is pretty basic but it does, it seems, require a different approach.
Mostly all I see is people offering advice as to how they’ve adapted to it, not mocking. If someone refuses to listen, insisting that they know it’s just broken because they’ve played XYZ game and still struggle without G5, then they deserve to be mocked. Although most members still just offer advice.
Do typical FPS tactics work? In my opinion, no. Are there some basic things that keep you safe in pretty much all circumstances? Absolutely. Are there also situations where, if you well and truly screw the pooch, you're going to be dead with barely any recourse? Also definitely true. These have all been discussed in the thread so far.
But last night I walked into a high-security base with all the bells and whistles; goliaths, turrets and minimum-sergeant-rank(? silver with three chevrons and 2-3 bars of shield) with a G2 Maverick, G1 Plasma Rifle and G3 Plasma Pistol, stole Level 3 credentials, closed in to and shot my way through the last 20m to disable settlement alarms... then working my way out was just a point and click adventure where the only action is "kill guard with gun".
That's not because I'm good at FPS, rather, I've died enough to learn what works and what doesn't in Odyssey. And mentioned, the mechanics here don't work like a regular FPS. Once you work them out, the only thing you'll die to is recklessness.
Ok, i haven't read all of it, but it is actually proven they have unlimited stuff?
I mean, I found meself being cornered on a roof too far by a squad of grunts.
They did used a lot of grenades, but after all: they were 4, i assume they wore Dominators, which means they had like 12 frags and 12 emps
I definitely did not see 24 grenades thrown at me, but after like the fifth grenade i was like Oh! Come on, i'm trying to make a living here
I mean, I found meself being cornered on a roof too far by a squad of grunts.
They did used a lot of grenades, but after all: they were 4, i assume they wore Dominators, which means they had like 12 frags and 12 emps
I definitely did not see 24 grenades thrown at me, but after like the fifth grenade i was like Oh! Come on, i'm trying to make a living here
Odyssey is about as much a first person shooter as Fallout3 ... it's not. You need a tactic, and if you set off the alarm, you did something wrong. Retreat and try again (fly to orbit and land again)
I’m not much of an FPS player either, but every time I die I try a different tactic until I find something that works for me.
Did FDev promote Odyssey as an FPS?
I didn’t pay much attention before the Alpha started - they pretty much sold me the pre-order by playing Bowie
- but I always thought of it as a natural extension of existing gameplay rather than a particular focus on foot combat.Did FDev promote Odyssey as an FPS?
I didn’t pay much attention before the Alpha started - they pretty much sold me the pre-order by playing Bowie
Shame it doesn't extend the gameplay, just bolts on some entirely decoupled game loops
OT, but...
I'm surprised people thought that existing gameplay would be extended in the first place.
A common counter to my cynicism about them pushing odyssey before fixing the base game was that Odyssey would actuslly fix the base game.
Well, it's here... Odyssey has done nothing for space activities, all the old bugs (and some ones which were previously fixed, and are now back) still exist, and activities in Odyssey couldn't be any more segregated.
Basically, it's everything i expected from a standalone, optional DLC in this context, and why I was opposed to it. It's activities are segregated, it doesn't touch the original game content and just places more pressure on an already- fragile foundations.
A common counter to my cynicism about them pushing odyssey before fixing the base game was that Odyssey would actuslly fix the base game.
- on foot would enrich space missions
- code refresh would fix all the bugs
- it would introduce more choice
Well, it's here... Odyssey has done nothing for space activities, all the old bugs (and some ones which were previously fixed, and are now back) still exist, and activities in Odyssey couldn't be any more segregated.
Basically, it's everything i expected from a standalone, optional DLC in this context, and why I was opposed to it. It's activities are segregated, it doesn't touch the original game content and just places more pressure on an already- fragile foundations.
Some people think so, and if you look at CZ gameplay you could almost mean it.
Some Thargoids are, but I am too.
Another thing too is that you're alone, perhaps on a roof top, while that squad might be running around and picking up ammo and grenades from the boxes around the base while you're busy hammering a part of the squad. So even if they might see to have some unlimited resource, that could be explained by them having better access to refills.
With that said, you're right, even when there's been a lot of grenades thrown at me, it was probably less than 10 in total, even when they're gangs of 10.
It also seems like not all the commandos throw grenades, for instance the "sharp shooters" use different techniques, blast you with a plasma (Executioner) from distance and if they lose shield they hide. Don't think I've seen them throw grenades. shrugs