Automation and Scripting - An investigation into further abuses of BGS and Powerplay

Ah forget about that. FD got no time for this. They´re looking into the reputation bug right now, far more important.
 
Interesting read, amazing that people would go to such lengths (spending actual money for accounts) to influence a game this way.

Just one thing to help me understand: I don't get why those bots would even fly in open, making it easier to spot them, why is that, why not just keep them in solo?
I was wondering just this. Who prepares a sophisticated bot then leave it in sunlight where everyone can see it?
 
This is highly dissapointing, but not surprising. There are always those who will seek to gain an advantage any way possible or to cause problems for others.

The periodic sale of the game has its pluses and minuses, and i don't think FD need to stop doing this. But i do think they need to find a way to come down on the owners of these accounts harder, and if possible, be able to detect them quicker.

There are a number of areas in the game where FD's approach to things is probably too soft. If you look at many online games its a case of ban first, ask questions later. Not sure that is the right apporach either, but there must be a middle ground.


EDIT: Just a thought, imagine how much worse things could be if FD allowed credit transfers between players...
 
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This is highly dissapointing, but not surprising. There are always those who will seek to gain an advantage any way possible or to cause problems for others.

The periodic sale of the game has its pluses and minuses, and i don't think FD need to stop doing this. But i do think they need to find a way to come down on the owners of these accounts harder, and if possible, be able to detect them quicker.

There are a number of areas in the game where FD's approach to things is probably too soft. If you look at many online games its a case of ban first, ask questions later. Not sure that is the right apporach either, but there must be a middle ground.


EDIT: Just a thought, imagine how much worse things could be if FD allowed credit transfers between players...

FDEV should be handing out permanent shadow bans for this kind of thing, if they don't want to go full on whack-a-cheat (which most of us would support I think).

That way the little tykes can't screech they can no longer play the game, or demand refunds or whatever, but they can't touch the BGS.
 
FDEV should be handing out permanent shadow bans for this kind of thing, if they don't want to go full on whack-a-cheat (which most of us would support I think).

That way the little tykes can't screech they can no longer play the game, or demand refunds or whatever, but they can't touch the BGS.
how would a shadow ban prevent them touching the bgs? that's as much as leaving them doing their thing on solo/pg unmolested.

actually, frontier should ban them from solo/pg, i.e. ban them to open, so cmdrs could deal with them! :D
 
FDEV should be handing out permanent shadow bans for this kind of thing, if they don't want to go full on whack-a-cheat (which most of us would support I think).

That way the little tykes can't screech they can no longer play the game, or demand refunds or whatever, but they can't touch the BGS.
Indeed. Just perma-ban them like pretty much every other company would do.

how would a shadow ban prevent them touching the bgs? that's as much as leaving them doing their thing on solo/pg unmolested.

actually, frontier should ban them from solo/pg, i.e. ban them to open, so cmdrs could deal with them! :D
I thought people in shadowban didnt contribute to the bgs?
 
You may as well ask FD to stop selling the game.

Or shut down the servers. Preferably with Mahon at #1, so you can go down undefeated.

Some powerplayers take this game too seriously to be taken seriously. One PP faction uses bots, and other PP faction reports them to FD? Let me quote the great Peter Griffin:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAA1xgTTw9w
As a non-PP, non-BGS player, I care!
I don't want bots and cheating in the game, whether it directly affects me or not.
 
Indeed. Just perma-ban them like pretty much every other company would do.



I thought people in shadowban didnt contribute to the bgs?
From what I understand, you're right. I guess it would be like the beta servers. They'd have their own BGS. They could manipulate it to their heart's content.
 
I was wondering just this. Who prepares a sophisticated bot then leave it in sunlight where everyone can see it?
Someone who who is either A) overconfident and brazen or B) wants it known that the game is "full of cheaters", to illustrate how simple the code is

Likely for some "you reneged on your promise" retribution.
 
Wouldn't it be an easy fix to just have all PP activities restricted to open play?
At least the offenders could be interdicted and destroyed unless they figure out a way to script combat bots. The only danger would be that they become self aware and murder us all.
 
i find the bots are quite a feature in itself, and i can very well understand how someone can invest time into them just for the fun of it. some people spend hours developing tools for the game that frontier should have implemented themselves, so not so strange after all.

otoh, in case it is really about gaming the bgs you could see it just as a variant of 'play it your way'. i see no fundamental difference between a bot and a cmdr behaving like a bot, doing grind loops. if gameplay is so easily automatable then that's what you get.

of course frontier needs to address this, if only for pr reasons, but that's a cat and mouse game. the only real solution is to generate gameplay that is not automatable. we face the same problem irl with job loss due to more and more sophisticated algorithms, only solution is to adapt and reinvent.
Except bots can fly all hours of all the day. We commanders can only fly when other stuff like dayjob's etc doesn't block. Oh don't forget sleep.

True for the most part that most of the bot accounts observed stuck to 8 hour stints, but log off one bot CMDR boot up another bot CMDR and continue.
 
Any chance we can move these Bots to CqC (Arena, whatever?).

A straight forward solution would be to make Open worth more in BGS, PP and UA bombing terms so people could actually defend their turf.

Spectacular research OP. Sometimes I wonder if I even play this game.
 
This is highly dissapointing, but not surprising. There are always those who will seek to gain an advantage any way possible or to cause problems for others.

The periodic sale of the game has its pluses and minuses, and i don't think FD need to stop doing this. But i do think they need to find a way to come down on the owners of these accounts harder, and if possible, be able to detect them quicker.

There are a number of areas in the game where FD's approach to things is probably too soft. If you look at many online games its a case of ban first, ask questions later. Not sure that is the right apporach either, but there must be a middle ground.


EDIT: Just a thought, imagine how much worse things could be if FD allowed credit transfers between players...
Credit transfers are basically as easy as teabagging meta alloys
 
Some powerplayers take this game too seriously to be taken seriously. One PP faction uses bots, and other PP faction reports them to FD?
uw;dw

Are we entirely sure these are even separate people? Remember there's that other group of combat-whiners that stage their own combat-logging and call it research too.

Sorry, but any player-generated "research" of this nature starts at zero credibility and goes down from there. I can't think of a single example where it's gone up.

And yes, at the very end of the day - it's ultimately meaningless. All that effort to change who is listed first on a station mission board, and for what? A change in the legal status of beer?
 
how would a shadow ban prevent them touching the bgs? that's as much as leaving them doing their thing on solo/pg unmolested.

actually, frontier should ban them from solo/pg, i.e. ban them to open, so cmdrs could deal with them! :D
As I understand it the shadow server is where they can dump cheats temporarily or permanently, once in it you can only meet up with people who are also shadowbanned and what you do doesn't effect the BGS. You can make money but you can't alter the gameworld in any way.
 
I don't actively engage powerplay and I don't actively engage BGS, but for once I'm fully on the side of these commanders. If they can do this investigation without the tools while FD blatantly ignores it I can only think how ashamed FD has to be, and they better be.
It's certainly looks that way, but please bare in mind the OPs post is more a timeline of events and shows proof and graphs of what kind of problem they are dealing with. This also serves as a way for the community to keep an eye out for such practices I the future, which will, in turn help FDev with thorough reporting. I feel like they've taken as far as they can alone and are now reaching out publically to raise awareness. NOT So much to level blame. Sadly though this has had a huge effect on the groups involved and contributed to burn out over it, so the damage is done, and their are hard feelings. :/
 
It's certainly looks that way, but please bare in mind the OPs post is more a timeline of events and shows proof and graphs of what kind of problem they are dealing with. This also serves as a way for the community to keep an eye out for such practices I the future, which will, in turn help FDev with thorough reporting. I feel like they've taken as far as they can alone and are now reaching out publically to raise awareness. NOT So much to level blame. Sadly though this has had a huge effect on the groups involved and contributed to burn out over it, so the damage is done, and their are hard feelings. :/
This is true.

We believe that this problem is far more widespread than just us.

For now, this shows BGS and powerplayers how to detect, and monitor and counter these bots.

If the problem is widespread, with the techniques we've demonstrated, this will be picked up and reported quickly.
 
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