ED Engineering Grind + Colonia/Bubble Dependency

[kakes]

Hi there,

If this is a duplicate please refer me to the original thread below and close this one.

I would strongly suggest allowing commanders purchasing materials for in-game money, because the grind is awful. The grind is worse than in Diablo Immortal. And you have no advantage in that, because your game is not a service, whilst Diablo Immortal is an awful service/SCAM designed to steal money (and time) from people.

You must spend about 300-500 hours in-game to be able to purchase Anaconda (if you don't utilize the exploits or tips). Then, you must be able to spend a 1000 more to grind the materials needed for engineering. Not even mentioning the time needed to unlock the engineers and so on. And I'm only talking about the ships here, because upgrading suits is far more absurd and requires an infinite amount of grind.

I honestly don't understand why it's not possible to purchase those freaking materials from material traders for money, just as we are able to buy commodities. You still need to spend a load of time in the game to get somewhere, to even start. You still have a motivation to get those materials organically, because for money it would obviously be far more expensive. But still, I really prefer exploring new systems over searching for destroyed ships. I don't like combat and I don't want to destroy those ships myself.

There's far more things I don't understand, like your choices to abandon console players or DLCs that would bring thousands of players, especially as this game is basically good and has a lot of potential for improvements even today, but let me only focus on one more thing here, that is related to the topic. Why the hell do the engineers in Colonia depend on the ones in the Bubble? This is the most absurd. I have not unlocked even ONE engineer back in the Bubble. I'm now in Colonia. And I can't even attempt to engineer my modules, because I would need to go back to the Bubble and then back to Colonia. Are you kidding me?

Guys, again, you are not a predatory service. You are a proper game. There is no need for that.

Don't make me spend 1500 hours to engineer one module, so that I can spend 3000 hours just flying around. Otherwise I'll just get mad and uninstall that game and never purchase any DLC for it, out of frustration.

If there is anyone that disagrees with me, please provide me with some arguments, because perhaps I'm missing something here.

I am unable to progress any further in the game at the moment, which kills my motivation for it.

 

[metatheurgist]

Infinity you say? How many infinities have I used here?

Spoiler

You do know people are talking about 200M CR/hr gameloops atm. You should be able to get a fully kitted 'conda in 5 hours unless there are liars everywhere. You get more just by killing 'goids and you don't even have to be good at it or do it alone. Just join one of the many groups slaughtering them.

And you're right. ED is not a predatory game, what's the rush to get anything? Every aspect of gameplay in ED can be enjoyed with a Sidewinder. Will you enjoy it more with a 'conda? Possibly, but there's plenty of time to get there, unless the Doomsayer finally get their wish.

 

[Galactic Fork]

Why do you want an Anaconda? If you're not into all the other gameplay the game has to offer, why bother? Just use a DBX. Still will need to engineer it, and get an fsd boost. But it seems to me that to you so much of just playing the game is grind, so what would you be able to do with an Anaconda that you can't do without it. Otherwise, when you get it, you'll just be grinding, but with an Anaconda. Keep in mind I am mainly an explorer as well, who hates ship combat and also does not have an Anaconda.

 

[WILLIAM BILL ADAMA]

Yeah, grinding is terrible and exploits like relogging is strange. I agreed.

But, But, 300~500 hours to Anaconda? 1000 hours for Mat? Did you stop playing ED since 2016? You can buy all-A-Class Anaconda in 100 hours from starting by repeating only data/cargo delivery missions... even with trial errors... with no tips, no third party services, no exploits. And if you use some tips, time will be dramatically shorten.

And, why shouldn't we use 'users tips'? ED is not old platformer game trying with naked. ED is designed at begining for community users who assist or attack each others. Many user tips(and third party services) are parts of this game. We can find those in 5s by googling.

 

[BackToTheMud]

Well, they dropped consoles because they're to weak to run the game.
For the rest...you seem to have very little understanding of how to things done in the game, and I'm not talking about exploits here.

 

[Darth Ender]

this is basically feedback that "your activities in the game aren't fun to repeat hundreds of times while repeating these activities hundreds of times is your only option (all that changes is how much time you put between them and if you mix in other simple repeat loop activities)"

unfortunately, buying your way out isn't going to solve anything because you can only do the same stuff with these other ships or resources that you currently do. this is the game. if you are miserable now, you will be when you have your goal ship too.

that reality is why we have this game that started with so much potential and excitement, stagnating with a studio that continues to shoot themselves in the foot, where they develop something they think will make sales improve, but it's totally not what players are telling them they want so it doesn't do that well so they don't bother continuing to refine it after release, so player's drop off and the next idea has even less money and scope and so even less of a chance to turn things around and the cycle just repeats every time.

tldr: the grindy game loops are the only game loops. that's the entire game. there's zero content limited to 'end game' assets unless you consider setting prices on buying or selling commodities in a table ui ... gameplay. there's effectively no community content in game anymore (fdev never felt that content was a priority). so, it doesn't make sense to circumvent the game loops any more than it makes sense to warp to the end game screen in mario from the first level.

 

[kakes]

I only play solo, so talking about any kind of multiplayer exploit is irrelevant for my experience. I can now scan plants near Colonia and get 50M an hour but it took time to get there. I want to play my own way. That first response was somewhat arrogant. I'm talking about my experience and I highlighted that I meant normal pace, not exploits.

 

[metatheurgist]

Wow, how arrogant to assume I used exploits!

 

[kakes]

this is basically feedback that "your activities in the game aren't fun to repeat hundreds of times while repeating these activities hundreds of times is your only option (all that changes is how much time you put between them and if you mix in other simple repeat loop activities)"

unfortunately, buying your way out isn't going to solve anything because you can only do the same stuff with these other ships or resources that you currently do. this is the game. if you are miserable now, you will be when you have your goal ship too.

that reality is why we have this game that started with so much potential and excitement, stagnating with a studio that continues to shoot themselves in the foot, where they develop something they think will make sales improve, but it's totally not what players are telling them they want so it doesn't do that well so they don't bother continuing to refine it after release, so player's drop off and the next idea has even less money and scope and so even less of a chance to turn things around and the cycle just repeats every time.

tldr: the grindy game loops are the only game loops. that's the entire game. there's zero content limited to 'end game' assets unless you consider setting prices on buying or selling commodities in a table ui ... gameplay. there's effectively no community content in game anymore (fdev never felt that content was a priority). so, it doesn't make sense to circumvent the game loops any more than it makes sense to warp to the end game screen in mario from the first level.

Speaking of the end-game content. At the moment I'm exploring and scanning plants and planets near Colonia. Eventually, I want to go back to the Bubble, continue with the story, unlock all fractions, maybe fight some Thargoids for instance, but in order to do so, I went to Colonia to get a nice ship first. And first up I can't, because for some reason I can't unlock the Colonia engineers before I unlock the Bubble engineers, which I have not. Secondary, I was around Colonia for over 100 hours now and I couldn't even get 10% of the materials I would need for any engineering. Forget Anaconda. At the moment I couldn't even engineer the ASPX nor DBX. I can't afford a freaking V1 FSD that doesn't even require engineers. There's simply nowhere to get the materials needed. It's an awful grind loop that's imo unnecessary.

And those ships require engineering in order to jump sensible ranges and to produce enough power to have modules I want in my ship. Otherwise they're extremely underpowered and unbalanced. Which makes me even less engaged into the game.

I'm not even talking about engineering the Odyssey space suits or weapons, because that's simply close to impossible. Try and see.

The game is unbalanced and engineering is awful. I don't mind not being able to purchase materials with credits, okay, but at least make it freaking possible to progress in-game. Otherwise it doesn't make any sense to continue playing it.

 

[kakes]

Wow, how arrogant to assume I used exploits!

Sorry

 

[Markov Chaney]

I'll tell ya what's a grind. Reading a new post about this once a week!

 

[zimms]

I'll tell ya what's a grind. Reading a new post about this once a week!

But you don't have to. You're simply choosing to be a forum completionist!

 

[Factabulous]

If this is a duplicate please refer me to the original thread below and close this one.

General - Overhauling Engineering: A Family's Request for a Streamlined Upgrade System

I don’t know if this will make any difference, but I’ll leave it here, hoping someone from Frontier Dev. would read it. I picked up four copies of ED for my family, and we were excited about the game. I worked my way up to a Vulture, loved the little ship, and decided to plan the upgrade route...

forums.frontier.co.uk

C'mon mods - do it!

 

[Markov Chaney]

At least I'm only aiming to read them all... not duplicate them all.

 

[Ian Doncaster]

I went to Colonia to get a nice ship first

Why?

I mean, I like Colonia, and you can buy most of the same ships and equipment here, but there's nothing advantageous about buying them out here, and there are quite a few things which it's either easier or only possible to get in the bubble.

I can't afford a freaking V1 FSD that doesn't even require engineers.

That one costs about twice as much in materials as it would to engineer one. If you're hating material collection now, don't go for that one.
(It also doesn't work well with an Anaconda - it's a size too small)

 

[kakes]

Thank you everyone for your answers, it's more than appreciated. Even when we disagree with something it's very nice to learn someone else's point of view and new stuff in general.

Since this is indeed a duplicate of a thread that has been linked above, feel free to close this one (in case I can't).

Thanks again, I think I'm starting to agree with you guys. The engineering system indeed has flaws, but not the ones I thought of.

 

[SteveWW57]

I had a thought, so pulled up Road to Riches, Sol to Colonia. 20ly jump range, 20 LY radius, 100 systems, max 1000 LS from sun. Minimum scan value 100,000.
The results obtained were interesting. 102 systems scanned, about 75 million from honking, 275 million if worthwhile bodies were scanned. Given that Colonia is 22,0000 LY from Sol, the ability to make stacks of money en route is available. double the number of systems and that is 150/550 million.

A path to getting money and then mats might be to head back to the bubble using R2R, gather explo data on the way to sell and then gather materials and unlock some of the bubble engineers. Then return to Colonia.

Steve

 

[Shadowsnog]

Hi there

hello

If this is a duplicate please refer me to the original thread below and close this one.

search bar is your friend. look up things before you post them, dont expect others to sweep your mess. it looks disrespectful.

I would strongly suggest allowing commanders purchasing materials for in-game money, because the grind is awful. The grind is worse than in Diablo Immortal. And you have no advantage in that, because your game is not a service, whilst Diablo Immortal is an awful service/SCAM designed to steal money (and time) from people.

making long story short: mats are the real currency of the game. credits lose their value fairly quickly in the life of a cmdr. buying mats for money would be skipping all the ingame content the game has, and that the devs would like you to play. im sure many people would like to dip in the game and just jump on the Big Funny Gun and embody the "if look could kill" powercreep. unfortunately you will have to earn it first...

You must spend about 300-500 hours in-game to be able to purchase Anaconda (if you don't utilize the exploits or tips). Then, you must be able to spend a 1000 more to grind the materials needed for engineering. Not even mentioning the time needed to unlock the engineers and so on. And I'm only talking about the ships here, because upgrading suits is far more absurd and requires an infinite amount of grind.

i think i got my conda after about 2k hours and im totally fine with that. im not saying all the proceses and systems in place are working well, but endgame ship should be endgame...
however as someone with 2k+ hours im currently doing a fleet of fully engineered corvettes (im currently sitting at 5, 2 more currently planned out), while already having a fleet of engineered ships. full engineering of large ships is arguably one of the hardest things to do. at least in regards to mat collecting (and engineer unlocks). currently i can ship out a fully engineered vette in about of month of almost not playing at all and i have to say i dont feel the grind anywhere. i just play the game.

There's far more things I don't understand, like your choices to abandon console players or DLCs that would bring thousands of players, especially as this game is basically good and has a lot of potential for improvements even today

a topic also discussed in no small matter in here. afaik one of the reasons was some driver issue that would require manufacturer to update the console, which wouldnt happen.

but let me only focus on one more thing here, that is related to the topic. Why the hell do the engineers in Colonia depend on the ones in the Bubble? This is the most absurd. I have not unlocked even ONE engineer back in the Bubble. I'm now in Colonia. And I can't even attempt to engineer my modules, because I would need to go back to the Bubble and then back to Colonia. Are you kidding me?

so... you went to colonia without checking what engineers you need to unlock first? and didnt even pin the bubble blueprints?

Guys, again, you are not a predatory service. You are a proper game. There is no need for that.

i too think that game that expects you to play the game instead of paying money is a proper, not predatory game. lets keep it that way.

Don't make me spend 1500 hours to engineer one module, so that I can spend 3000 hours just flying around. Otherwise I'll just get mad and uninstall that game and never purchase any DLC for it, out of frustration.

you can perfectly spend 3k hours just flying around even without engineering. engineering has its costs for which you are given additional benefits. i see no issue there (as a principle. not that engineering doesnt have issues). however i can say that absurdly (and comically) inflating numbers just so you can slam your fists on the table a little harder hurts only you.

I am unable to progress any further in the game at the moment, which kills my motivation for it.

this i 100% understand. and while for a lot of different reasons i am at somewhat similar place... elite is game full of issues and wonders. it is what it is

 

[Darth Ender]

Thank you everyone for your answers, it's more than appreciated. Even when we disagree with something it's very nice to learn someone else's point of view and new stuff in general.

Since this is indeed a duplicate of a thread that has been linked above, feel free to close this one (in case I can't).

Thanks again, I think I'm starting to agree with you guys. The engineering system indeed has flaws, but not the ones I thought of.

this game has had this kind of thread created repeatedly since engineers was released. i know it's shocking but people have not liked the idea of mat grind loops and requirements since day one. it's not a topic that will go away until fdev creates some more complicated ways to get rewards vs the current grindy repeat identical basic activity method.

 

[Darth Ender]

Why?

I mean, I like Colonia, and you can buy most of the same ships and equipment here, but there's nothing advantageous about buying them out here, and there are quite a few things which it's either easier or only possible to get in the bubble.

Indeed, and this illustrates the lack of game design portrayed by fdev in elite that is seen over and over. why would you purposely respond to players wanting new content (a new bubble created by them) by making it irrelevant and identical in content to what already existed? why wouldn't you make it unique in various ways?

blazing your own trail shouldn't restrain the game from imposing meaningful roles and opportunities limited to specific choices the player makes or risks participating in.

That one costs about twice as much in materials as it would to engineer one. If you're hating material collection now, don't go for that one.
(It also doesn't work well with an Anaconda - it's a size too small)

back in my day, we had conda's with 24ly jump ranges and we explored the rift.

these engineered things are indeed optional. but again, why? why don't they have an actual purpose that really matters? a thing only they can do that actually makes a difference in some specific activity or role? why shoot yourself in the foot with all your content by making it all redundant or repetitive or just unnecessary?

stupid decisions that just lead to players being bored doing the game loops created where these are your rewards.

this game needed community content created by players to feed back to players. that's a game where grindy mechanics can still succeed, because players fill in the complex game play. but fdev actively makes choices that kill the opportunity or handicap it.