ANNOUNCEMENT Game Balancing

[CardioTherapy]

Greetings Commanders!

Game balance has been at the heart of many discussions around Elite Dangerous, for a long time, and rightly so. At its core, Elite Dangerous is about blazing your own trail and we want all Commanders to feel fairly rewarded for whichever path they choose.

To this end, we have taken a close look at the current state of the game and where we would like it to be. Using our data combined with your feedback, we have created a plan of incremental changes we hope will bring the key gameplay mechanics more in line with each other.

What's Changing?

Elite Dangerous has seen a lot of changes since its release in 2014. Among many other aspects of the game, these changes have affected the core gameplay elements and how players earn credits. Over that time, while we have made some balancing adjustments, these elements have inevitably grown out of sync.

In response to your feedback, will bring a series of balancing adjustments to the rate at which credits are earned in each core gameplay mechanic: mining, trade, combat and exploration. Our goal is to have rewards better match the level of skill, effort, and risk each method requires. This means we'll see increased credit rates in some activities and reductions in others.

Crucially, this re-balancing will be an ongoing process where we spend time observing how the changes affect the game and how you, the community, respond both in-game and with your feedback. This may mean several adjustments are needed for each type of gameplay before settling on final values. Giving each method attention in isolation will allow us to more accurately see the results and tweak accordingly, hence the step by step approach, but ultimately they all need to work in the context of each other.

Mining and combat stand out from your feedback as needing the most attention with regards to balancing. As such, we will begin with mining, bring the top range down to a point we see as fair and look at which aspects of mining should offer the greatest rewards based on the skill required.

After this, we intend to look at increasing bounties and solo combat missions in the weeks that follow to meet expected levels. From there we can turn to the still important but less pressing elements such as other mission types and exploration.

These changes will be woven into Elite Dangerous lore and introduced through the narrative. The first can be expected early next week in the form of a GalNet article.

Mining and Trade

Mining has been the most lucrative role within Elite Dangerous for a long time. While this makes perfect sense as pilots find, extract, and transport huge quantities of precious minerals, the gap has become disproportional. This has allowed even brand new Commanders to become wealthy enough to buy the highest performing ships very quickly. For the health and longevity of Elite Dangerous, we're going to considerably reduce the payout of this activity so that it remains lucrative but players won't feel compelled to head out to the latest triple hotspot whenever they need credits.

The following changes will be implemented early next week as a starting point:

These approximate maximum prices offered by markets for the following commodities will be introduced:

• Painite - 600,000
• Low Temperature Diamonds - 700,000
• Void Opals - 1,300,000

To recognise and reward the extra effort and skill needed for core mining, the majority of minerals extracted this way will see an increase in price, barring Void Opals mentioned above. Several mining commodities which can be bought will have the range of their prices increased, resulting in a higher number of goods with strong profit margins (25,000+) when commodity markets are in suitable states.

To benefit trade, we'll also bring the following changes:

• Commodity markets will offer the average price rather than minimum price when selling in bulk. This will affect all commodities.
• The base prices of a number of general salvage items will be increased.

What's Next?

As above, these first changes will happen early next week. We'll spend time observing their effects and listening to your feedback before deciding whether further adjustments are needed.

Next, we intend to adjust combat rewards in the form of bounties and mission payouts. You can expect to hear the planned changes before the date is announced in a post similar to this one.

Thank you in advance for your patience and understanding that this isn't a fast process and it will take time for the effects to become clear.

We would also most importantly like to thank you for your continued constructive feedback on this topic, which will be invaluable during this process!

Thanks for your support,

o7

So far, no changes in the mining gameplay. Just some prices shuffling. The issue has never been the price but the rate at which you find 40%+ painite deposits. If I fill 500t cargo for 1 hour with painite there is something wrong with the game not the prices.

 

[D.D.Hariman]

The system scanner should be optional equipment. In exchange for that, make supercruise assist built-in into the ships or at least into the docking computers.

NOOOoooo . I don't want to permanently lose a module slot.

 

[CMDR Shuuichi Muraii]

You don't see any of those in the system scanner, or do you?

You can in fact see which planets have interesting geological/biological signals from the FSS. It will even tell you if there are human settlements, however to actually land and find them you have to use the DSS for a more accurate picture.

 

[CMDR Shuuichi Muraii]

NOOOoooo . I don't want to permanently lose a module slot.

You technically would gain a slot. Instead of SC+DA=2 slots, it'd be DA/SC in one. The FSS doesn't actually take up a slot so making it optional would cause you to balance out in @limpetdwarf example.

 

[Maymo]

NOOOoooo . I don't want to permanently lose a module slot.

I must say I never really got behind the choice of...

Small ship x2 1 slots
Big/medium ships x1 1 slots

The other way around would have made more sense to me. Not a big deal...at the time I was just happy to get what I got.

 

[D.D.Hariman]

and for me, the additional surface detail that was added to the land-able bodies was a very welcome addition since the additional data is now worth the time.

Are you saying that you can see anyhting in the system scanner, or are you referring to the surface scanner showing points of intersts/signals after you did a detailed surface scan?

[...]
When I say "INTERESTING THINGS", I am referring to ruins and crash sites mostly but early on the geological features.

You don't see any of those in the system scanner, or do you?

Well, you don't necessarily see specifically where the interesting things are on the body until you map it.
You do have to either wait while still in the FSS viewing the body for the information to resolve in the upper right side of the screen and it will tell you what types of "points of interest" are on the body.
Alternatively, which is why I like exploring in wing, you can hover the cursor over the body in the system map and it will "resolve" the details there IF the body has been scanned with the FSS. (This is one of the things that seems to be intermittently broken. Doesn't work if the wingmate didn't get the data from the FSS scan done by the other ship.)
This means I can do the FSS scan faster by not waiting for the "resolution" by having the wingmate do the "hover" in the system map.

BUT,,
I now understand what your real issue is with the FSS. (and a lot of other things like not having to actually fly your ship to and from locations) You want instant gratification. You want the "arcade experience".

 

[limpetdwarf]

Like yesterday, you're asking for features that are already in the game...

What are you referring to?

Explorers didn't stop scanning because it's a PITA, they stopped scanning because they simply don't need to. After a honk, the FSS chart instantly tells you the main details about the system, bodies etc. This allows you to quickly decide if it's worth hanging around or make the next jump...

View attachment 197262
Learn to 'read' this...

We already have the system map for everything in the bubble, it may be an 'unexplored' system map for your cmdr, but the actual visual system map exists. This is the same once you leave the bubble, if another cmdr has visited, scanned the system and sold the data then you will have the system map when you arrive at the system.

I recently took a mission to Nebula View which is a good 5/6k ly outside the bubble. Every system I jumped to along the path had a system map, not once did I find a virgin 'black' system. You have to go way off into space/untrod paths to find those...

Ok, I randomly picked a system within the bubble that shows as not having been visited in the galaxy map. There is not even an option to display the system map of the system.

I don't know what you mean by "a honk". When I enter a system that I haven't visited yet, I may get messages that something was discovered. If I use the FSS, it will show so many percent of the system as already discovered. When I have scanned all bodies of a particular type, the icon/dot for it shows up on the scale --- and not before that.

When I look at the navigation panel, things show as unexplored before I scanned them.

So I have to fully scan the system to get the picture you posted. I don't know how you get the full scan of a system without fully scanning it first with the FSS.

There seem to be some systems that are populated and don't need much or any scanning; I did't keep track of that. I'm not referring to those.

Maybe you're getting different results. And/or you didn't read what I suggested.

 

[limpetdwarf]

NOOOoooo . I don't want to permanently lose a module slot.

I'm not suggesting to remove the module slot. With the supercruise assist built into the ship or into the docking computer, you would gain a slot because you don't need to block one with the assist.

 

[Robert Maynard]

I'm not suggesting to remove the module slot. With the supercruise assist built into the ship or into the docking computer, you would gain a slot because you don't need to block one with the assist.

When SuperCruise Assist and the Advanced Docking Computer were added to the game small ships gained two Class 1 slots and medium and large ships gained a single Class 1 slot.

It the SCA were integrated then we'd likely lose those slots.

 

[limpetdwarf]

You can in fact see which planets have interesting geological/biological signals from the FSS. It will even tell you if there are human settlements, however to actually land and find them you have to use the DSS for a more accurate picture.

Thanks, I didn't know that. I never saw any such information in the FSS, and when I scan, I don't look at the bodies because I never had a reason to.

 

[limpetdwarf]

You technically would gain a slot. Instead of SC+DA=2 slots, it'd be DA/SC in one. The FSS doesn't actually take up a slot so making it optional would cause you to balance out in @limpetdwarf example.

Err yes, the FSS is built-in, so you don't gain a slot, grr.

 

[D.D.Hariman]

I'm not suggesting to remove the module slot. With the supercruise assist built into the ship or into the docking computer, you would gain a slot because you don't need to block one with the assist.

The PLANETARY APPROACH SUITE is automatically in the ship and it takes up a slot. If you remove it, and you can, then the ship becomes essentially unnavigable.
Here again is an example of the desire for the "arcade" experience.
In this case you don't want to have to worry about "module space allocations". You want every module that relieves you of having to actually fly your ship permanently installed on every ship so you have the module slot available for other things.
Space allocation (in the early AD&D games it was weight, something I think would make more sense in a space ship) makes a player have to do something the arcadists don't like to do.
THINK and PLAN.
Do I want this Armor or this Weapon? Do I really need to carry this extra thing I only use 1% of the time?
Do I want to be able to put everything on auto pilot using SCA and AAD, (some 1% stuff) or do I want an SRV Hanger and/or an FSD Booster and/or a DSS and/or a collector controller and/or a prospector controller. There isn't a ship that will let you have all 7 at the same time and still have room for other more necessary things.

 

[limpetdwarf]

Well, you don't necessarily see specifically where the interesting things are on the body until you map it.
You do have to either wait while still in the FSS viewing the body for the information to resolve in the upper right side of the screen and it will tell you what types of "points of interest" are on the body.

I always thought that we have to do a full surface scan to find out if there are any interesting things. I have never seen that kind of information in the FSS because after a couple times using it and not seeing any information like that, I stopped looking at the bodies and immediately zoomed out before I could even see them.

Remember what I keep saying about no information being within the game that would players allow you to learn how to play it successfully. I already suspected that things work way better for players who have been playing it since ED was first released --- because they got all the history and got all the information and have years of experience while players starting only later can't catch up. Making money fast or slow isn't the issue, and that would be a good thing if we could learn by just playing the game.

Alternatively, which is why I like exploring in wing, you can hover the cursor over the body in the system map and it will "resolve" the details there IF the body has been scanned with the FSS. (This is one of the things that seems to be intermittently broken. Doesn't work if the wingmate didn't get the data from the FSS scan done by the other ship.)
This means I can do the FSS scan faster by not waiting for the "resolution" by having the wingmate do the "hover" in the system map.

So I'm right in that I'm forced to do a full system scan of every system if I want to have the data for every single system I've visited just in case I might want to look at the system map. My suggestion would solve that problem.

BUT,,
I now understand what your real issue is with the FSS. (and a lot of other things like not having to actually fly your ship to and from locations) You want instant gratification. You want the "arcade experience".

In that case, you entirely misunderstood me.

 

[limpetdwarf]

When SuperCruise Assist and the Advanced Docking Computer were added to the game small ships gained two Class 1 slots and medium and large ships gained a single Class 1 slot.

It the SCA were integrated then we'd likely lose those slots.

Why would we loose any slots at all? I sometimes have to take out the SCA to fit something else, and it would be really bad if we had even less slots. It's not really an option to take out the refinery instead.

Why is it that some things like the FSS and the data link scanner are built in while others are not? If it was me, I'd have the docking computer built in and the SCA --- without loosing slots, of course.

And then there is a really big refinery built into our suits (or where?) that stores all the materials and enables us to refine various things like SRV fuel and ammunitions. If that is built in, why isn't the mining refinery built in?

These are arbitrary, random choices.

And if we ever get a mining fortress, it might have a refinery built in because it's a mining fortress ... Or why don't bigger ships have docking computers and SCA built in while smaller ships haven't?

It's entirely inconcievable that cruise ships like the Beluga Liner don't have at least a docking computer and SCA and DSS built in without having less slots. They are supposedly top of the line! (And the Beluga is actually difficult to dock.)

Who is docking their T9 or Defender manually? They barely fit through the docking slots, and docking them manually means damage and/or fines or destruction because they sometimes get stuck.

 

[Ozric]

Remember what I keep saying about no information being within the game that would players allow you to learn how to play it successfully.

It shows you in the Help for the FSS, which is located in the game and automatically run on the first use of the FSS, that you can view extra information about a body. Including the materials it has and if it has any locations.

Now granted this has changed a little bit to make it easier for people, after player feedback. So now it splits out locations (Thargoid, Guardian, Human) that resolve instantly, from the Biological/Geological features which you can see if there are any instantly, but take a while to resolve the scan to tell you exactly how many of each there are.

 

[Florenus]

Why would we loose any slots at all? I sometimes have to take out the SCA to fit something else, and it would be really bad if we had even less slots. It's not really an option to take out the refinery instead.

As was ponited out above, when SuperCruise Assist and AdvancedAutodock were introduced to help new players, small ships gained additional two slots, while the rest gained additional 1 slot. - players can fit those modules if they need assistance (they come fitted with new ships), without sacrificing space. The fact you can install something else there is a bonus. You can look at it this way - those are integrated modules that you can actually uninstall and gain additional slots- if they would be truly integrated - those slots would be removed.

And if we ever get a mining fortress, it might have a refinery built in because it's a mining fortress ... Or why don't bigger ships have docking computers and SCA built in while smaller ships haven't?

What's mining fortress? Why are you using some made up things as an argumentation?
Bigger ships gained one slot to fit someting like SCA or whatever.

Who is docking their T9 or Defender manually? They barely fit through the docking slots, and docking them manually means damage and/or fines or destruction because they sometimes get stuck.

You are clearly inexperienced. That's another reason why we need progression at reasonable speed, so players are able to learn how to fly, before getting big, expensive ships they will then stick into mail slots.
When you fly long enough it's not a problem to fit those big ships through the slot. Actually, at some point you start to discover that station mail slot is getting bigger.

 

[Maymo]

Ok, I randomly picked a system within the bubble that shows as not having been visited in the galaxy map. There is not even an option to display the system map of the system.

I don't know what you mean by "a honk". When I enter a system that I haven't visited yet, I may get messages that something was discovered. If I use the FSS, it will show so many percent of the system as already discovered. When I have scanned all bodies of a particular type, the icon/dot for it shows up on the scale --- and not before that.

When I look at the navigation panel, things show as unexplored before I scanned them.

So I have to fully scan the system to get the picture you posted. I don't know how you get the full scan of a system without fully scanning it first with the FSS.

There seem to be some systems that are populated and don't need much or any scanning; I did't keep track of that. I'm not referring to those.

Maybe you're getting different results. And/or you didn't read what I suggested.

Yeah you have to visit the system first. Or if you’re close enough and at a station you can pay unicart to unlock the system data.

It wouldn’t actually be a bad idea for FD to increase the purchase radius for this, it’s limited to 20ly I think...

For the most part not being able to see into a system on the other side of the bubble isn’t a problem. You can still pull up most of the important information on the galaxy map (economy/security/government/state) the only time I find it a minor problem is if i’m looking for the presence of rings to find a RES for combat.

‘Honking’ is firing off your discovery scanner as this is used to access the FSS.

So I’ll jump into an unexplored system and honk. Open the FSS while scooping and see what I’ve found. The signals depicted on the scanner tell me what specific bodies are in the system. If it’s just a bunch of rock and ice I’ll usually just move on...(no zooming in and out)

...but if there’s high metal worlds/ww’s/ELW’s then the scanning starts (and mapping if things are good enough).

I used to dislike the FSS when it was introduced, I’m a visual person and I used to enjoy opening the system map and immediately seeing the shiny with the old ADS approach. But the FSS has grown on me and it does save me a lot of time.

 

[Ashnak]

Who is docking their T9 or Defender manually? They barely fit through the docking slots, and docking them manually means damage and/or fines or destruction because they sometimes get stuck.

Couldn't find the Beluga video on short notice, so here's a Corvette drifting through the mailslot:

 

[Ryan P Bodfirst]

It seems to depend on risk and cargo value now. That was a screenshot I took earlier in Taygeta. High-risk delivery missions + valuable cargo = high payout.

I've also seen Wetwork missions paying 15+ Mil. Keep in mind this is while allied with the local factions.

That's a welcome change - but have they added any actual risk to these missions - are you finding that NPC interdictions are now risky - i.e. not really easy to evade?

 

[TheGrimCorsair]

I saw a couple posts regarding power play tweaks and have honestly had this rattling around in the back of my head for.. well a couple years tbh:

All of the reward modules should be available in all class sizes, similar to how prismatic shields can be fit to any size shield slot. Weapons should be able to fit as small, medium, large and huge hardpoints, with a similar stat distribution compared to their non power play counterpart at the same size.

(I also think that having the pack hounds having the same missile size at each weapon size and just decrease/increase the number of missiles fired and magazine size to be in line with the size/damage estimates would make sense purely from a logistical standpoint when assembling them)


As for balancing the remainder of power play, I'm honestly not sure as it's been a while since I actively participated.

They should also be moved out of Power Play and into the Tech Broker. Ship modules don't belong in Power Play.