(I find) PvP is boring...

[Deleted member 192138]

I'm not on Facebook, LOL. I only have to deal with it if I choose to. I shouldn't have to in order to enjoy PvP in this game. I've been gaming since forever, and I've never had to use external tools to enjoy PvP in any other game I've owned over these many years. Thus taking me back to my OP.

The galaxy is too big, the player base too small, the player base involved in PvP even smaller, and a mixture of poor balancing and an ill-conceived grind barrier means ship selection to be viable outside of 1v1s shifts to an increasingly small pool of viable ships depending on wing dynamics (generally FDL, Mamba, Corvette and Cutter with an emphasis on the mediums). If you're looking for organic 1v1s then the viability of hull tanks is greater but they get shut down too fast in wings of open organic because seekers/packhounds, scramble spectrum and emissive being all weighted heavily against hull tanks plus the over-strength power of shield mechanics in an age of engineering and prismatics.

If you're looking for open organic then the places to find it will clearly be best in peak time. Busy systems that will attract PvPers where pick up fights are viable include Shinrarta Dezhra, Wyrd and Deciat (engineer ganking systems) and LHS 3006 (German PvP hub). CGs on the weekend especially will be busier, and towards the start of the CG whichever system while it's novel and more interesting. San Tu used to be a PvP hub system and occasionally there are people that fight out there but it's not a place that's easy to grab a pick up fight. Since a player group decided to plant their faction there and flip it from Anarchist that's not likely to shift any time soon, seeing as if you're going to risk people trolling with crimes on you may as well go to where the higher population is.

Or the majority of the PvP community organise via Discord because it's a convenient, clear, consistent way to communicate including voice comms for more than four people in the same wing. That's not an advert to draw you in - nobody is going to bat an eyelid if you don't want to join them on Discord. Including the "groups with purpose" like power play supporters will be organising on Discord/Reddit/whichever external forums. Because figuring out where to go, what to do, who to wing with etc isn't easily feasible with the in game mechanics versus using external platforms outside of that. But that's just the state of the game. If you want PvP to work in this game like an MMO with dedicated servers, when instancing and netcode is as bad as it is with P2P networking thrown in - well don't hold your breath on that.

 

[Deleted member 192138]

Well I do respect your stealth ship. Still, let's agree to disagree on the notion that joining a Discord-based Squadron is the answer for ME, and instead get back to the bigger premise of the OP. Would you not like to see more in-game based PvP events like CGs that revolve around combat zones or purposeful piracy / smuggling and the counters of bounty hunting? Or perhaps a PP CG, where the Federation gives rewards for killing Empire pledged CMDRs and vice-versa. This would be a win-win for both people interested in casual PvP like myself and more diehard PvPers like you and your mates. And more importantly, it gives real in-game purpose to PvP.

It's not like I'm asking Frontier to reinvent the game, but rather to use the tools they already have to give us a reason, a location, and "rules" to engage in combat with other players. Surely even the pro-PvPers would welcome this, no?

ps - gotta go to work, so o7 for now (I'm glad this thread has remained civil).

Lack of Frontier input into what, how, why etc and little to no nurturing of a space for purposeful PvP to happen is a big part of why a lot of people end up in a couple of hub systems where idle ganking happens. tbh I think the main reason they don't do more to encourage it is because it would make more obvious how bad their netcode and instancing is, how unbalanced the game is when you start really getting into deeper levels of mechanics, and also how poorly they interact with/understand the PvP community. The attempts they've made to engaged them have been sort of half-baked, poorly implemented and just sort of fizzle out or are left as a rotting carcass monument (CQC, CGs and Initiatives, power play). Player groups put effort into filling the gap on that, whether it's power play groups or more general PvP groups declaring wars or ECCE works to develop spotlight events for bigger pitched battles or goal based activities. I won't mention where you can find out about those things happening and get involved in planning and participating though, because you won't like it.

 

[Aashenfox]

Lack of Frontier input into what, how, why etc and little to no nurturing of a space for purposeful PvP to happen is a big part of why a lot of people end up in a couple of hub systems where idle ganking happens. tbh I think the main reason they don't do more to encourage it is because it would make more obvious how bad their netcode and instancing is, how unbalanced the game is when you start really getting into deeper levels of mechanics, and also how poorly they interact with/understand the PvP community. The attempts they've made to engaged them have been sort of half-baked, poorly implemented and just sort of fizzle out or are left as a rotting carcass monument (CQC, CGs and Initiatives, power play). Player groups put effort into filling the gap on that, whether it's power play groups or more general PvP groups declaring wars or ECCE works to develop spotlight events for bigger pitched battles or goal based activities. I won't mention where you can find out about those things happening and get involved in planning and participating though, because you won't like it.

 

[jasonbarron]

Lack of Frontier input into what, how, why etc and little to no nurturing of a space for purposeful PvP to happen is a big part of why a lot of people end up in a couple of hub systems where idle ganking happens. tbh I think the main reason they don't do more to encourage it is because it would make more obvious how bad their netcode and instancing is, how unbalanced the game is when you start really getting into deeper levels of mechanics, and also how poorly they interact with/understand the PvP community. The attempts they've made to engaged them have been sort of half-baked, poorly implemented and just sort of fizzle out or are left as a rotting carcass monument (CQC, CGs and Initiatives, power play). Player groups put effort into filling the gap on that, whether it's power play groups or more general PvP groups declaring wars or ECCE works to develop spotlight events for bigger pitched battles or goal based activities. I won't mention where you can find out about those things happening and get involved in planning and participating though, because you won't like it.

Honestly, it makes you wonder why Frontier even bothered making this a multiplayer game in the first place. If they were just going to phone it in they could have saved themselves a lot of effort and simply made it solo and called it good.

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Then there's the toys which are cool as all hell...
Background check :

Live alerts:

How does it work? Is there a certain format to use for reporting?

 

[Navigare Necesse Est]

Honestly, it makes you wonder why Frontier even bothered making this a multiplayer game in the first place. If they were just going to phone it in they could have saved themselves a lot of effort and simply made it solo and called it good.

It would have been for the better. And then get serious and design a true MP game separately.

 

[LanceLord]

Not the actual combat, mind you, but rather all the time sitting around waiting for said combat to occur. For every minute of epic battle I've enjoyed during this CG, I've spent who knows how many minutes (hours) sitting in supercruise or at the station just waiting for something to happen. And without a CG, sure there's random encounters around engineering, but nothing quite of the scale I've enjoyed this week.

Maybe Combat Zone CGs are different, where we're actually given both a location and a reason to fight? If so, does that mean PvP is fun like once per year in this game?

I'm just a hair trigger away from switching to Infinity Battlescape for my spaceship PvP pew-pew fun. Don't get me wrong, ED still has a lot to offer me, but I'm beginning to really think that PvP isn't one of those things. I just don't have the patience!

I don't get it. Didn't you add all the PvPers and potential gankers to your friends list? Got on some 3rd party channel like Discord and broadcasted to everyone what system you were in? Rinse and repeat using the chat window in Open? And if doing all that still fails to work, then why not create a thread on this forum for PvP meetups based on time zones etc.

 

[Aashenfox]

How does it work? Is there a certain format to use for reporting?

People are running an EDMC addon called EDR, most serious lawful pvpers and a lot of casual neutral pvpers for that matter, are running the addon in a simple 'data provider' kind of way, the same way one would run EDMC itself as a provider of game information to a third party db. When an EDR user scans you (regular point-at-you scan), EDR adds the event and wanted status as well as some other parameters to a database. This is then used as the player record for that player, when a background check is carried out (screenshot), this data is processed, how many times they have been scanned wanted/clean etc and the metric you see in the screenshot is applied (lawful++++ or whatever). Furthermore, if the player has been scanned enough times with a wanted status, naturally his karma changes to 'outlaw' and the pluses get added the more wanted he gets. If people warrant scan a wanted commander and find he has HUGE bounties, that affects the karma rating in a larger way. There are instances of outlaws being clean as can be and neutral players being outlaws, but time and being scanned clean eventually clears any bad rep, it can take a long time though. So, when a player reaches a certain threshold that determines him as an obvious outlaw, then his name is added to a list of players who are on alert status, in other words, sightings of them are reported as they happen (based on a timed update, it's not actually live) to the discord bot. The discord bot is available by application only, and only established, active lawful groups are likely to get access to it (a VERY small number currently, and in various states of data depth, GARD has one of the best datasets). No format or data input is required, it's all fully automatic, there is even an in game overlay that will present in game the players record as soon as you scan them, as well as a lot of other useful information such as what materials should be gatherable in the system (some of these functions are available by application only).

 

[Rick6549]

People are running an EDMC addon called EDR, most serious lawful pvpers and a lot of casual neutral pvpers for that matter, are running the addon in a simple 'data provider' kind of way, the same way one would run EDMC itself as a provider of game information to a third party db. When an EDR user scans you (regular point-at-you scan), EDR adds the event and wanted status as well as some other parameters to a database. This is then used as the player record for that player, when a background check is carried out (screenshot), this data is processed, how many times they have been scanned wanted/clean etc and the metric you see in the screenshot is applied (lawful++++ or whatever). Furthermore, if the player has been scanned enough times with a wanted status, naturally his karma changes to 'outlaw' and the pluses get added the more wanted he gets. If people warrant scan a wanted commander and find he has HUGE bounties, that affects the karma rating in a larger way. There are instances of outlaws being clean as can be and neutral players being outlaws, but time and being scanned clean eventually clears any bad rep, it can take a long time though. So, when a player reaches a certain threshold that determines him as an obvious outlaw, then his name is added to a list of players who are on alert status, in other words, sightings of them are reported as they happen (based on a timed update, it's not actually live) to the discord bot. The discord bot is available by application only, and only established, active lawful groups are likely to get access to it (a VERY small number currently, and in various states of data depth, GARD has one of the best datasets). No format or data input is required, it's all fully automatic.

My profile on there is horribly outdated and also wrong, i should be quite the outlaw

 

[Aashenfox]

My profile on there is horribly outdated and also wrong, i should be quite the outlaw

You are currently Ambiguous, almost dead center, 5 points only. No recent scans. Spend time in pvp hotspots clean (or wanted lol) and that will rapidly change.

 

[Rick6549]

You are currently Ambiguous, almost dead center, 5 points only. No recent scans. Spend time in pvp hotspots clean (or wanted lol) and that will rapidly change.

I am very illegal, i am conatantly blowing up clean ships for bgs, and i am in colonia.


Someone scan me so it says beluga

 

[Aashenfox]

and i am in colonia.

... Oof

I'm sure some users will make it out there sooner or later. If not already. Good luck getting your karma down! o7

 

[znôrt]

Honestly, it makes you wonder why Frontier even bothered making this a multiplayer game in the first place.

paintjobs.

 

[Old Duck]

Lack of Frontier input into what, how, why etc and little to no nurturing of a space for purposeful PvP to happen is a big part of why a lot of people end up in a couple of hub systems where idle ganking happens. tbh I think the main reason they don't do more to encourage it is because it would make more obvious how bad their netcode and instancing is, how unbalanced the game is when you start really getting into deeper levels of mechanics, and also how poorly they interact with/understand the PvP community.

While I don't disagree with you, doesn't every CG expose how bad their netcode and balancing is? Especially after the recent updates.... As I said in another thread, CMDR Net Code is the biggest griefer I know, and the one that would force me into Solo or small PG for a CG.

 

[Mohrgan]

My guess has always been, that the limits on net-code are our computers as much as anything. I believe when a multi-Cmdr instance is initiated, one PC's environment becomes the host of all the players included. Get one guy in the mix who's running on a potato and the whole thing goes to the bumper, not to mention the distances between these players. My experience shows that a player in NA, like myself, can have trouble with ping between even another player in the EU. I'm not sure how much FD can be expected to take responsibility for, considering the decisions made as the game was released.

 

[Deleted member 192138]

Most of the bugs around multiplayer seem to relate to effects, calculations and event triggers being multiplied per CMDR in instance which seems to be something that they either are unable or unwilling to resolve. It took them how long to fix the heat bug? How long have we had the heart desync or magically renewing shields on Thargoids? That's not an issue with the host player being on a sluggish computer.

 

[Deleted member 192138]

People are running an EDMC addon called EDR, most serious lawful pvpers and a lot of casual neutral pvpers for that matter, are running the addon in a simple 'data provider' kind of way, the same way one would run EDMC itself as a provider of game information to a third party db. When an EDR user scans you (regular point-at-you scan), EDR adds the event and wanted status as well as some other parameters to a database. This is then used as the player record for that player, when a background check is carried out (screenshot), this data is processed, how many times they have been scanned wanted/clean etc and the metric you see in the screenshot is applied (lawful++++ or whatever). Furthermore, if the player has been scanned enough times with a wanted status, naturally his karma changes to 'outlaw' and the pluses get added the more wanted he gets. If people warrant scan a wanted commander and find he has HUGE bounties, that affects the karma rating in a larger way. There are instances of outlaws being clean as can be and neutral players being outlaws, but time and being scanned clean eventually clears any bad rep, it can take a long time though. So, when a player reaches a certain threshold that determines him as an obvious outlaw, then his name is added to a list of players who are on alert status, in other words, sightings of them are reported as they happen (based on a timed update, it's not actually live) to the discord bot. The discord bot is available by application only, and only established, active lawful groups are likely to get access to it (a VERY small number currently, and in various states of data depth, GARD has one of the best datasets). No format or data input is required, it's all fully automatic, there is even an in game overlay that will present in game the players record as soon as you scan them, as well as a lot of other useful information such as what materials should be gatherable in the system (some of these functions are available by application only).

Does EDR conform to GDPR?

 

[Ian Skippy]

A reasonably well outfitted and very basically engineered conda can survive most ganks for long enough for an escort to get stuck in, especially if the gankers are rubbish.

Any ship that can do that can also just jump away. There is no purpose or point to escorts in this game, at all. Either you can can kill the target in 20 seconds or you cant, and no escort will have any influence on that.

 

[askavir]

Any ship that can do that can also just jump away. There is no purpose or point to escorts in this game, at all. Either you can can kill the target in 20 seconds or you cant, and no escort will have any influence on that.

... or 10 if the escaping ship is not mass locked and low-wakes instead.

 

[Aashenfox]

Does EDR conform to GDPR?

If Elite Dangerous does, then it does. FD define what data is allowed to be used by third parties, not the coder.