Proposal Discussion Kill Warrant Scanner Feedback

[Ra'Kaan]

I have been following this thread closely, but have not posted as my views have already been copied by other commanders.

Bottom line for me:
Please just give me a reason to keep KWS equipped on my dedicated BH ships. whatever the reason. Just give me a proper reason to keep using one.

My Vulture and FDL have KWS slot permantly assigned. It's bassically the ONLY defining factor that MAKES them my go to BH ships - besides performance. My Python may get a KWS occasionally as per current situations.

As it stands, the KWS is perhaps the single piece of equippment that makes role playing a thing. Otherwise were just murder hobo riff raff.

 

[Turjan]

The new proposal is definitely a step in the right direction, so that's worth a [up]

IMO there's still way too much of a fixation on Superpowers at the expense of minor factions though. There's a nagging doubt in the back of my mind that's telling me this a recipe for future disaster somehow, but the image is fuzzy just now, so I'll have to opt for a Magic 8 Ball uncertainty and say "Cannot predict now" until I've got more of a feel for that system in action

There is however still the matter of a completely wasted golden opportunity to add some characterisation and depth to the game - I'm talking about how the KWS treats CMDRs and NPCs as the same thing.

I still stand by my suggestion that having the KWS being a Pilots' Federation only piece of kit makes the most sense from a gameplay perspective. After all, as many posters have said in this thread, the PF is supposed to be the best merc group in the galaxy...and yet there is literally nothing in game to either back that up, or even inform players of the PF's special & pivotal place in human history (unless you have access to the tourist beacons in the Shinrarta system, but you have to be either a Kickstarter backer or have earned an Elite rank in order to be able to read the text in those).

Now here's the thing - as a Pilots' Federation piece of tech, the proposed new functionality of the KWS isn't too bad now...for NPC targets.
But CMDRs are not NPCs.
We're all part of an exclusive club whose members get offered missions on our station board (missions which, presumably, non-Pilots' Federation members don't get offered...that's an assumption of course because again there's nothing in game that explicitly tells us the mission boards are CMDRs only...). In a lot of cases these missions automatically entail the acquisition of a bounty or fine because they're "a bit dodgy squire" which is why the mission givers are asking CMDRs to do them of course, rather than Joe NPC who isn't a member of the galaxy's most respected merc group like we are.

So my point is this : given that as CMDRs we're routinely taking jobs that earn fines/bounties simply because we're CMDRs, where is the logic in having our fellow CMDRs going around shooting each other for doing the jobs we're supposed to be doing as members of the Pilots' Federation?

Realistically, the Pilots' Federation doesn't give a stuff whose laws CMDRs break...so long as it isn't the Pilots' Federation's. And that's as it should be IMO.

Now, given that CMDRs are not NPCs, I don't believe it's fair to CMDRs to subject them to the same rules as NPCs when it comes to other CMDRs who are taking on the role of Bounty Hunter. Bottom line is, it's really none of a CMDR's business what another CMDR gets up to, so long as it doesn't break any Pilots' Federation rules.

However, one CMDR attacking another is something the Pilots' Federation does take a dim view of, and for obvious reasons : it's hard to maintain your prestigious position in the eyes of the galaxy's superpowers as the most trusted and respected 'go to guys' if your members are perpetually taking potshots at each other. It undermines the Pilots' Federation's reputation.

So I stand by my suggestion that the KWS could become a defining piece of in game storytelling simply by it behaving one way when used on an NPC, and another when used on a CMDR.

i.e. - used on NPC, the KWS should show all relevant bounties the NPC has on them.
Used on a CMDR, it should specifically NOT show any bounty other than that accrued from attacking another CMDR.

It's breathtakingly simple, totally logical, lore-friendly, and in one fell swoop adds characterisation depth to reinforce exactly what it means to be a member of the prestigious Pilots' Federation rather than simply Joe NPC.

To back up my assertion about just how much influence the Pilots' Federation should actually have on the subject of bounties & their associated technologies, I'll add in these quotes taken directly from game itself :
(I have highlighted espeically relevant sections in BOLD)



"The Pilots Federation’s zero tolerance policy of dishonourable behaviour amongst its members is enforced by a system of bounties automatically placed on the heads of transgressors. This built a galaxy-wide respect for the badge, which then started to be worn with pride by members." (from Newsletter #22)

"Before long this small and highly respected group of pilots with these coveted badges became known as 'The Elite'. They received all sorts of offers - both commercial and personal - (including offer of marriage!). The commercial side became valuable - whether it was transporting royalty or taking unknown items 'no questions asked'. The group was considered utterly trustworthy, with the confidentiality assured, and its members took this very seriously." (The Elite - tourist beacon 0245)

"It is rumoured they run secret bases and have their own technologies, but what is known for certain is they are highly respected, and get generous discounts throughout human space." (The Elite Federation of Pilots - tourist beacon 0246)

"It exists to support pilots, not nationalities or political factions. Over the years this has led to its acceptance (albeit grudging in some cases) in practically all human domain.
The PF represents the nearest thing to law in uncontrolled and ungoverned space. Their existence provides a safely net for human expansion in space beyond the major factions." (Pilots Federation Secrecy - tourist beacon 0247)

"As well as providing funds for bounties it also receives transaction fees for completed bounties that are processed through the PF bounty system - and in many cases retains unclaimed bounties where, for whatever reason, the pilot who has earned it doesn't claim it.
By far the most significant contribution to the PF's finances is the near monopoly it has for the embedded ship and station systems." (Pilots Federation Interests - tourist beacon 0248)

"In 3300 the Pilots Federation's GalNet system has a near monopoly on all shipboard and station embedded systems. The systems are fitted as standard on nearly all independent ships and even some militaries. It's a testament to the trusted nature of the PF that this monopoly has occurred with the little resistance bar some backroom negotiations." (Pilots Federation's Near Monopoly - tourist beacon 0249...yes, that's right : the PF actually owns GalNet...)

"The PF wields considerable power through its web of political contacts as well as the application of the bounty system and control of the ship and station embedded systems.
There are also known cliques within the PF (The Dark Wheel is probably the most famous) that have their own agendas. Officially these are discouraged, but in an organisation so large they are tolerated as long as they don't overstep the mark." (Pilots' Federation Influence - tourist beacon 0250)

 

[Jynessa Loraeyn]

Hello Commanders!

We've taken a step back and revaluated what we want the Kill Warrant Scanner to achieve, as well as look at how it fits in with the bigger picture of the update crime system. Part of the issue we run into with the KWS is how it interacts with Interstellar bounties. We've decided to more clearly delineate the roles of these to features:

• The KWS reveals bounties for all jurisdictions in the local system.
• The KWS provides a license to kill for all bounties associated with the jurisdiction’s superpower.
• The KWS removes any reputation loss from destroying wanted ships, unless the wanted ship belongs to a criminal faction.

With this suite of rules, we can see that the Kill Warrant scanner becomes a clearly defined tool. It communicates with all security channels within the system, allowing Commanders to fully exploit bounty hunting opportunities where they are.

This allows the Kill Warrant scanner to be effective in gaining reputation, tactically supporting factions and of course, increasing profits (we'd be looking at making sure the right levels of crime are linked to factions in the system). It also means that bounty hunters can continue to work in anarchies.

Whilst it does lose some power being limited to the system where it is being used, we've offset this by allowing the Kill Warrant scanner to legitimise attack when dealing with bounties associated with a superpower. We've also made it more robust in protecting the bounty hunter's reputation when working a system.

This also allows Interstellar bounties to remain relevant:

• Interstellar Bounties provide a license to kill in all associated jurisdictions.
• Interstellar bounties are packed up for the criminal, unpacked for the bounty hunter.

Interstellar bounties have a specific role - to make criminals legal targets in every associated jurisdiction. Basically, once you have an Interstellar bounty for a superpower (such as the Federation), all bounties from Federal aligned factions will be visible - and legally claimable - to anyone performing a basic scan on you whilst in a Federal aligned jurisdiction. Furthermore, the bounty hunter still retains the ability to claim or avoid individual bounties within an Interstellar bounty, allowing them to interact with the background simulation as before.

These rules also mitigate one of our bugbears: superpowers honouring each others bounties. Whilst this can happen at a local level using the Kill Warrant scanner, such bounties are local bounties connected with the faction rather than the superpower.

Once a bounty becomes Interstellar, the superpowers get involved, and they take a different approach - only accepting claims within their jurisdiction.

Overall, we're quite happy with this proposal, to the point of looking into making it happen, so feedback is greatly appreciated.

Okay, either there's something here that is going to involve a big change to how bounties are issued, or something's been missed.


Current Live system:


ALL bounties in a jurisdiction are issued by the controlling minor faction - the authority in the system. This is the bounty you see when you do a normal scan on a ship, and it shows as Wanted (and often there's a superpower bonus bounty too, even with the normal scan).


Proposed KWS change:


KWS will reveal ONLY bounties issued by FACTIONS (plural) in the system you are in.


Now, if the actual system of who issues bounties doesn't change, doesn't this mean that there aren't any other bounties for the KWS to detect?


Yes, there will be some overlap, where a controlling authority faction in a nearby system has expanded into this one, and perhaps has issued a bounty on your target as well... but the other jurisdictions can only mean around starports controlled by other local factions, or down on planets around the settlements controlled by other local factions. Just in case this hasn't been considered - there is still a bug involving pirate ships appearing down on planet surfaces which are Clean (even when then planet surface is the same jurisdiction as the system itself)... they talk like pirates, demand cargo, and attack you... but they have no bounty from a normal scan until they hit you and end up with a measly 200Cr assault bounty, which is hardly worth fighting them for. So I'm not sure the 'other' jurisdictions in the system thing is 100% working at the moment.


But to be clear - is the suggestion here that ALL factions in a system now issue bounties? This is a fairly weighty change (not saying it's bad, though). So presumably now, there's got to be some backend stuff done to check which factions in a system have issued bounties on a given ship, calculating how big the bounty should be... does this mean the normal Wanted bounty from the authority will get smaller, and the KWS is how you pick up all the extra ones from the other factions? Or is it just that in the current live system, non-authority minor factions already issue bounties for the tiny bits of space they have jurisdiction in (i.e. directly around their ports and settlements?), and these bounties are not currently revealed by a normal scan? I could well be misunderstanding something here.


I'm just hoping that this has been thought about, and we don't end up with a KWS that just scans and picks up the same single authority bounty we already see from a normal scan - the change will be sort of pointless then.

 

[killerofstars]

Whilst it does lose some power being limited to the system where it is being used, we've offset this by allowing the Kill Warrant scanner to legitimise attack when dealing with bounties associated with a superpower. We've also made it more robust in protecting the bounty hunter's reputation when working a system.

I think in general this is a good proposal, because preventing reputation loss for destroying criminals should already be in there.

I think it is frustrating to constantly watched income sources get nickle and dimed back, continually slowly dialed down. Bounty hunting already doesn't pay very well, this makes it worse.

 

[Kaocraft]

@Turjan: All fine and good, but until such time as Frontier is really going to get deep in the weeds of storytelling in the Elite universe, I think it's more useful to recognize that the PF is primarily a conceit to distinguish between players and NPCs, and to somehow try and make sense of having an in-game, in-lore "scoring" system. I would not like to see any extension of the PF's influence into the primary storylines or lorebuilding of the game until such time as: (1) there are PF NPCs in the game, and (2) I as a player have the choice of playing as a non-PF member and/or leaving the PF or even being kicked out of it. Until that point, I don't think expanded narratives or mechanics around the PF/non-PF distinctions are going to be beneficial.

 

[Shanaeri]

@Turjan: All fine and good, but until such time as Frontier is really going to get deep in the weeds of storytelling in the Elite universe, I think it's more useful to recognize that the PF is primarily a conceit to distinguish between players and NPCs, and to somehow try and make sense of having an in-game, in-lore "scoring" system. I would not like to see any extension of the PF's influence into the primary storylines or lorebuilding of the game until such time as: (1) there are PF NPCs in the game, and (2) I as a player have the choice of playing as a non-PF member and/or leaving the PF or even being kicked out of it. Until that point, I don't think expanded narratives or mechanics around the PF/non-PF distinctions are going to be beneficial.

The thing is, in 3.0 the PF is now irrelevant as NPC's and players are counted exactly the same in regards to crime.

Also since NPC's have a PF rank too, there is also an inconsistency there too..

 

[Ian Doncaster]

.. and what happens in an independent system? Do you have license to kill if the target has a controlling faction bounty?

By definition, yes - if the target has a controlling faction bounty you can open fire without any KWS at all, just a regular scan.

 

[ilo]

By definition, yes - if the target has a controlling faction bounty you can open fire without any KWS at all, just a regular scan.

You know you can still kill the target and claim the bounties even if you get a bounty yourself in the process.. right?

What I still haven't seen clear is how much does a player have to pay before leaving the detention centre with the new system.

 

[DocLooshkin]

If a CG says "help us defeat the sudden spike in pirate activity" then there better be a huge spike in local pirate activity. Quintuple all pirate spawn rates. Turn all RES into HAZRES for the duration of the CG. Make the nav beacon compromised. Spawn special "pirates vs police" conflict zones. A system with a bounty hunt CG should be the place where you want to hunt, not the place where you sell your bounties from somewhere else.

Hello, Mephane.

That sounds like a very good idea. +1 for you, sir!

 

[DocLooshkin]

Hello again, Turjan.

I've thought again about your earlier posts and I'm looking at the latest one. I've come to the conclusion that what you're asking for is really something quite ugly.

I still stand by my suggestion that having the KWS being a Pilots' Federation only piece of kit makes the most sense from a gameplay perspective.

I don't agree. Even if the PF were the original creators, there's no plausible reason why the NPCs should not have subsequently developed and distributed the same technology, in short order: however the KWS is supposed to actually work, no interpretation of it seems especially taxing, from a technological point of view.

Also, the fact that there are NPC bounty hunters seems to directly contradict your suggestion. Is FD supposed to remove them from the game or have only PF-aligned bounty hunters? The former seems a clear loss for gameplay, the latter, a clear loss for lore.

[...] given that as CMDRs we're routinely taking jobs that earn fines/bounties simply because we're CMDRs [...]

This is entirely based upon your suggestion and assertions, which don't really seem to fit what's already been in the game since forever.

[...] the best merc group in the galaxy... [...] special & pivotal place in human history [...] an exclusive club [...] the galaxy's most respected merc group [...] the most trusted and respected [...] prestigious [...]

My word. Turjan, you seem absurdly intent on the idea that the game should discriminate in favour of players and against NPCs. I honestly don't know what your intentions are, but the more you post, the more I'm thinking it sounds just like the arguments of the extreme-right, when they try to defend the ideas of white racial supremacy and entrenched privilege. This is not what Elite: Dangerous or Frontier Developments should ever be about.

Realistically, the Pilots' Federation doesn't give a stuff whose laws CMDRs break...so long as it isn't the Pilots' Federation's. And that's as it should be IMO. [...] Bottom line is, it's really none of a CMDR's business what another CMDR gets up to, so long as it doesn't break any Pilots' Federation rules.

I want NPCs to have the same rights as we do. KWS or no KWS, I am making it my business. Any problem with that, Turjan?

 

[Turjan]

I want NPCs to have the same rights as we do. KWS or no KWS, I am making it my business. Any problem with that, Turjan?

If you have a problem with NPCs having less 'rights' than CMDRs then you need to take it up with the Pilots' Federation, not me. Because what you're saying flies in face of the actual backstory and lore of the Pilots' Federation in Elite's history. Like it or not, the Pilots' Federation are an elitist minority group - by definition. The clue's in the name really : Elite.

If you read the lore, you'll also see mention that the Pilots' Federation is indeed supposed to have access to technology that the rest of the galaxy does not. This is logical and makes sense, because of the shocking scale of the power the PF is actually capable of wielding behind the scenes. Don't forget that the PF owns and runs GalNet, with all the consequences that that should imply in terms of their ability to control news stories, market data, etc.

Whatever we may think about it, Elite lore has always made a distinction between members of the Pilots' Federation, and everyone else. To deny that simple fact is to deny the entire history of the Elite games franchise.

Yes, if Frontier allowed us the ability to play as anything other than a member of the Pilots' Federation, then I might agree with you. If this was a game like WoW where all the players are just freelance adventurers, the same as all the NPC freelance adventurers in the game, then it's a valid point.

But as things stand, all players are CMDRs...and NPCs are not. David Braben himself has explicitly stated that fact on numerous occasions : only players can be CMDRs.

As for your comment about NPC bounty hunters chasing members of the PF, then of course they do - there's nothing to stop an NPC being a bounty hunter, just as there's nothing to stop them being a trader, or a miner. In fact under my suggestion for how I believe the KWS should work, it's imperative that there are NPC bounty hunters chasing CMDRs on behalf of factions & superpowers for crimes committed against them. This is because my vision for a PF KWS means CMDRs wouldn't actually be able to see bounties for crimes committed against NPCs by another CMDR anyway. Because it's none of one CMDR's business what another CMDR gets up to in the course of carrying out their Pilots' Federation contracts. Under my proposal, only NPCs would be able to chase CMDRs for crimes committed against NPCs.

So far from denying NPCs rights, my version of the KWS would actually give NPCs more rights than CMDRs have when it comes to the subject of scanning for crimes, because NPCs can also scan other NPCs to see if they're wanted by NPC factions.

 

[ilo]

If you read the lore, you'll also see mention that the Pilots' Federation is indeed supposed to have access to technology that the rest of the galaxy does not. This is logical and makes sense, because of the shocking scale of the power the PF is actually capable of wielding behind the scenes. Don't forget that the PF owns and runs GalNet, with all the consequences that that should imply in terms of their ability to control news stories, market data, etc.

Speaking of which, NPCs are not allowed to access eddb.io etc.. this is restricted to commanders only.

 

[wstephenson]

I'm just hoping that this has been thought about, and we don't end up with a KWS that just scans and picks up the same single authority bounty we already see from a normal scan - the change will be sort of pointless then.

I assume the aim is for the overall sum of discoverable bounties to remain the same. The logic that builds a list of secondary bounty-giving factions would have to change. I assume that the current system builds a list of factions in the current system and its neighbours, then rolls a #bounties dice and then rolls in the faction list for the issuing factions.

Does this now only use the local jurisdictions list, to guarantee the claimability of the bounties? Does it also include non-local factions so there's something to find if we track an NPC to another system with the Wake Scanner, or is this dropped because of the vestigial gameplay value in doing so? Will it generate NPCs where no license to kill is granted, because a local jurisdiction's bounty is detected that does not align to the current jurisdiction's superpower?

 

[Moesis]

I don't really like the KWS being local only. It reduces the risk of being detected as a criminal considerably IMO & so makes it easier to get away with crime.

At least in the current live version you have a few days where you could be detected as a criminal anywhere & in any ship. Even under these rules it's so easy to ignore bounty hunters as a criminal, in a different system, it barely registers as a risk while it's active.

In the proposed system, the KWS won't even see crimes from other jurisdictions where the issuing faction isn't present. Single system Independent's laws will be so impotent once a crime is committed they have zero recourse, once you leave the one system they happen to occupy.

This update will give Punishment a buff, but detection of Crime itself is nerfed, unless you happen to be a Fed/Imp/Alliance fanboy who attacks the opposition. We only needed the change of ships to blind the law, now we have both that and a KWS that can't see anything outside the local system.

My disappointment is my own fault, I mistakenly thought there might be some small excitement to being in a hot ship, for those of us that aren't murder-hobos & seal clubbers, and NEEDING a clean ship would be a thing, clearly being in a hot ship isn't going to be much of a big deal, for those of us that are petty crims, it will just be slightly easier now, which is a shame.

Also a shame the Independent pseudo superpower idea isn't going ahead, that would help address the huge gap between superpower aligned and Independent factions, with regard to how much thought is required before breaking laws.

It is also interesting, with this KWS change I am also extremely curious, how they are going to make the Wake Scanner relevant for more than mats gathering, now bounty hunting can't be it's primary use, I look forward to finding out how they eventually do this, assuming they actually do.

 

[Alec Turner]

I don't really like the KWS being local only.

Me neither I'm afraid. The scanned ship has been committing crimes in other jurisdictions and systems. Currently the KWS reveals all of these. That is (or was) it's purpose. End of. Simple, clean and effective. In truth I still don't really understand why this has to change. Oh well.

 

[wstephenson]

My disappointment is my own fault, I mistakenly thought there might be some small excitement to being in a hot ship, for those of us that aren't murder-hobos & seal clubbers, and NEEDING a clean ship would be a thing, clearly being in a hot ship isn't going to be much of a big deal, for those of us that are petty crims, it will just be slightly easier now, which is a shame.

Also a shame the Independent pseudo superpower idea isn't going ahead, that would help address the huge gap between superpower aligned and Independent factions, with regard to how much thought is required before breaking laws.

It is also interesting, with this KWS change I am also extremely curious, how they are going to make the Wake Scanner relevant for more than mats gathering, now bounty hunting can't be it's primary use, I look forward to finding out how they eventually do this, assuming they actually do.

A lot depends on where the bar of Interstellar Bounties is set. Otherwise, if you are a petty crim moving from Independent jurisdiction to jurisdiction to carry out your crimes, you have a good chance of staying ahead of the law, until one day you decide to backtrack and are suddenly hot again. I hope the NPC bounty hunter response in an Independent system is quick enough to make this matter.

Wake Scanners: I think generally there is a big unfulfilled gameplay potential around interstellar and multi-jump missions and pursuit. I had a great time once trying to pounce on Steve Kirby as he was trying to unlock an Engineer in Open with cigars and was ping-ponging between the Engineer and Kamitra. His Asp had a higher jump range than my CobraMk4, but by not stopping to scoop I had a good chance of getting in front of him and interdicting him on arrival at a star, and was trying to knock his drives out with railguns on departing the Engineer's base.

The difference between two ships' jump ranges, having an ability to predict a target's location, either by using a tracking device, or knowing their scheduled movements (think of CG piracy between commodity source and destination systems), and an ability to see a 'sail on the horizon' or a pursuer's dust cloud, and competing to reach a goal first have huge dramatic potential for the game.

I quite like the idea of, rather than 'tracker limpets', taking inspiration from the real life Internet and having ships become contaminated with 'cookies' - in this case, smart dust which reports a ship's location via the Nav Beacon network. Pursuers would be able to subscribe to factions' databases of tracked ships, eg criminals, or be given access to track a particular ship, and track them down wherever they are via the Galaxy Map. Ships would be able to evade pursuit by travelling via unpopulated or Compromised Nav Beacon systems, where the Wake Scanner would come back into play. Players would be able to dust other ships (including players) with 'cookies', allowing inter-system tracking for a limited time (appearing on the Galaxy Map like friends do, notification on system entry, notification on tracking loss with location) and players would be able to have their ships 'cleaned' of cookies at specialised facilities...

 

[wstephenson]

In truth I still don't really understand why this has to change.

1) The change is forced motivated by the decision to have detected destroyed criminals respawn at Detention Faciliities.

2) Detected bounties are charged to criminals whose ships were destroyed upon respawn.

3) The Detention Facility belongs to a superpower faction, ergo, it is counterintuitive that that faction collects other superpowers' claimed bounties from reformed criminals.

4) Therefore, the KWS may not allow you to claim* bounties from factions other than the controlling superpower to the local jurisdiction.

* NB the current proposal allows you to detect these bounties, but does not legitimise attack for these bounties alone. I assume these bounties would be paid to the bounty hunter when redeemed (irrespective of the legality of killing the criminal), so this raises the question, are they charged to a respawning criminal Commander, and if so, does this contradict 3) above?

EDIT: s/forced/motivated/ as agreed with raymondo.

 

[Alec Turner]

1) The change is forced by the decision to have detected destroyed criminals respawn at Detention Faciliities.

2) Detected bounties are charged to criminals whose ships were destroyed upon respawn.

3) The Detention Facility belongs to a superpower faction, ergo, it is counterintuitive that that faction collects other superpowers' claimed bounties from reformed criminals.

4) Therefore, the KWS may not allow you to claim* bounties from factions other than the controlling superpower to the local jurisdiction.

* NB the current proposal allows you to detect these bounties, but does not legitimise attack for these bounties alone. I assume these bounties would be paid to the bounty hunter when redeemed (irrespective of the legality of killing the criminal), so this raises the question, are they charged to a respawning criminal Commander, and if so, does this contradict 3) above?

Thanks.

o7

 

[nrage]

By definition, yes - if the target has a controlling faction bounty you can open fire without any KWS at all, just a regular scan.

Of course, thanks

 

[nrage]

Me neither I'm afraid. The scanned ship has been committing crimes in other jurisdictions and systems. Currently the KWS reveals all of these. That is (or was) it's purpose. End of. Simple, clean and effective. In truth I still don't really understand why this has to change. Oh well.

I think the driving force is the inconsistency with what players pay when killed with bounties.

If the KWS shows all bounties, then you kill a commander with bounties for multiple superpowers. You would be paid for all bounties, but they would only pay-off the bounties valid in the system where they were killed. Imagine you kill them in an anarchy, they pay off none of the bounties you claimed. So, you find them, scan them, kill them, and claim all those bounties again.