Why are they struggling to find PvP in Open powerplay? Where are all these folks that want PvP?
Sounds like not as many folks enjoy PvP as some make out.
O7
Open-Only in PP2.0?
- Thread starter August Lagrange
- Start date
Sounds like not as many folks enjoy PvP as some make out.
O7
Whatever you about say player choice it doesn't counter the argument that allowing players to work against other players from absolute safety is fair... it is not and needs to change for PP2 to be long term successful.
This debate is never going to get settled unless FDEV take a firm position on it... they opened Pandoras box when they suggested it. They should not sit on the fence forever.
If they came out and categorically said its never happening I would be like fine, I know not to engage with this anymore and can go play other games.
Its never going to be Open only, they made modes so that all can play the way they want, Elite will never be a PvP game.
O7
As they have stated "Not at launch"...
...Have used the same phrase with other features that have not materialised in the past 4 years.
It may be worth considering that "Not at launch" means "Not in the next 5 years, maybe more", then play something else with occasional forays back to the announcements page / forum, to ensure that the status quo remains?
In your opinion... FDEV need to be the one to confirm this, not forum posters with a particular bias..
Yeah but that's not taking a position... thats just stringing pvp players along like they always have done... remember the 'icarus cup' lol
I don't have a dog in the race, having zero interest in PvP and even less in PP...
I have no idea what the 'icarus cup' refers to...
All I did was mention what "Not at launch" has meant to date....
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
It's not intended to counter the argument of those who don't like the game's design - it's a statement of fact as to the design of the game, that no player was forced to buy if they don't like the game design.
No disagreement on this point whatsoever - the "never say never" position leads to corrosive friction among the player-base.
Given Arf's "parting shot" regarding Open only at the very end of one of the Frontier Unlocked streams, that was assumed to be about Powerplay 2.0 as we didn't know about Colonisation (but Arf was obviously aware that Colonisation was coming), here's hoping that Colonisation offers something for those seeking Open only gameplay.
Oh just a pvp event fdev once talked about in the early days with prize money... they went quiet on it and it never happened.
They worked on PP2 for months, maybe more, they would have done it if they had any intention.
Yes i am biased, but isn't everyone?
O7
It's more like that this game's netcode isn't designed for that kind of advesarial gameplay. I literally go looking for trouble, and only find it 10% of the time? That's mightly long odds. Doubly so, when you consider that there's little point in PvPing in PowerPlay, unless you enjoy that kind of thing.
Of course, it's telling that their reaction to being unable to find the PvP they seek via PowerPlay is go to Deciat instead.
Some people have been demanding "Open Only" since the Kickstarter page, it's nothing new and not limited to Power Play.
You also seem to have ignored the fact that the same voices were demanding the new feature be open only before Sandro said anything about it.
Feel free to go back through the SOG threads.
Any idea how many "Lead Designers" there are at FDev?
Every title they have has a different lead designer, it's a middle management role.
And either way, the Executive Producer and the CEO at the time both said no to open only content - so his opinion didn't matter, he was outranked.
And now he isn't even the lead designer on this project, so its about time you quit invoking his name like he is some sort of god.
[All hail the space loach]
"better" = subjective, just because you believe that, doesn't mean it is a fact. It's your opinion.
It does however go against the actual fact we were sold a game where we were told all the content is available for all players.
And it's bad enough how FDev has treated console players without them upsetting a load of PC players as well.
And in my opinion, after being told no to open only content for over 10 years - you are trolling now, because you know the answer is no.
You have no idea why other players are doing what they are doing, all of that is pure speculation.
As I've said before, open mode does not deserve any special privileges. You play open mode for the benefits and risks of open mode. It is its own reward.
HOWEVER, RN was onto a good idea where every mode had something special, unique to that mode.
Now that would be a fair change, if there was solo only content, PG only content and open only content.
Then I'd have no issues.
That's more to do with the size of the game area than the netcode. Exactly why players head to deciat, because the chances of pvp are much higher there than some random system.
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Can what happens in Deciat in Open really be described, with a straight face, as "PvP"?
i.e. It seems that it's very often "PK" with no "v" from the targets.
I think we all know the answer to that one.
Couple of reasons:
Firstly, because as Lateralus, a few others and myself have said a few times now, the problem is that people are playing powerplay primarily, which in a pan modal mode means using the modes systems to maximise you're effectiveness, and minimising 'risk'.
Secondly, PP2.0's game state is in its infancy, so expansions are firing off all over the place. Once battle lines are more clearly drawn and it takes more effort to make changes, we'll probably see more compressed system fights like we had on 1.0
Yeah but then you get counter-gankers coming out too which is less one-sided.
As we've made the case many times, if you limit pvp oppertunity through more legitimate means, you end up with lowest level pvp which is ganking, as its the only reliable form of it left...
If fdev were to encourage more pvp through powerplay, you would see a drop in deciat/shinrarta ganking (this was evidenced by the temporary rares gold rush on pp2 launch - everyone knew where to go for powerplay pvp for that period - deciat kills dropped substantially, now they're back up).
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Which gives the gankers and counter-gankers something to do - which is still at the expense of those (probably in many cases) uninterested in PvP who are simply attempting to access one of the first Engineers that they are invited to.
Which, in a game where PvP is entirely optional, means that some of those who want to engage in it (who no-one needs to play among) choose to engage in behaviours which don't seem to enamour them to the rest of the player-base when they don't find it.
Possibly, for a time - however those inclined to frequent Deciat would very likely revert to the behaviour whenever they get bored.
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Give me NPC wingmen who can fly my other ships in Solo and I'll give RN my wife!
Yeah we want to limit that, but if powerplay pvp is hard to find you get more of this as a consequence...
whether people approve of it or not doesnt really matter... the design of the game funnels players towards it due to lack of other gameplay avenues. What other options do players have to find pvp? (CQC doesnt count btw, its always dead and doesnt stack up to main game pvp).
This is speculation and I do not think it accurate... if there are reliable avenues to find meaningful pvp, ganking will reduce, we already saw that happen for a limited time.
I think npc wing and expanded crew features would be perfectly reasonable for solo and private groups potentially. Could be a nice trade off for open only powerplay features...
Robert Maynard
Volunteer Moderator
Which is suggestive of a "if we don't get what we want we will behave in this way" approach.
While the fact that PvP is an optional extra in this game that no player needs to much less choose to engage in, that some players choose to behave in particular ways when they don't otherwise get what they want has been obvious for a long time.
Noting the initiatives that some PvP player groups chose to promote and engage in over the years when attempting to force Frontier to change the game to suit them, it does not seem to be an inaccurate statement.