The Exploits Have Damaged Elite

lefty1117

L
There is a deeper meaning here, which is this: people are using exploits to shortcut the game because the game makes things less enjoyable to do than they should be.

I don't mean the specific act of piloting a ship or managing the UI. I mean decisions made on things like not automatically share trade and market data across the populated systems. Decisions like, "hey let's add all of these great map features for traders, and material brokers, but we won't let people actually SEE them until they've visited the systems".

What is the point of adding quality of life features, which is what 3.0 is supposed to be about, when you are blocking them behind a crushing grind?

We had a great pass on engineering - many people quite like it now that they are guaranteed a stat increase on every pass. But god forbid you are out and about trying to find mats and you want to take a look at blueprints other than the one you happened to pin.

It's as if there is a scale that they use to balance each gameplay improvement with a grind barrier that has to be passed in order to be able to enjoy it.

And so to bring it back to the original point - I think a lot of people use exploits because they just don't want to deal with all that . The game doesn't present challenges to overcome, it presents obstacles to be circumvented.
 

PANTHER STARFORCE

PANTHER STARFORCE
Nebohtes said:
I've never done a gold rush or participated in an exploit. I know this makes me the biggest idiot in Elite: Dangerous, but until the most recent one, I haven't really cared.

I usually have fun, and if making some credits without having to risk anything makes the game fun for others, why should I care?

Seriously -- why should I care?

Well, I'm actually embarrassed to say I do, for once. FDev couldn't care less that players who have never bent the rules are hopelessly outclassed by players that spend a few hours cheating. It has always been like this, but it's too unbalanced, now. I've always been behind, but it's so laughably skewed now, playing missions feels like putting quarters in the punching machine. The worst is that it's all me -- my fun game is no longer fun because I actually wish I had cheated so I could go do the stuff I want in the ship I want without having to spend hours building up the credits to do it, which used to be fun when it was the cost of doing business, but I'm like the only player in Elite that has to do it, so it suddenly feels like... bull.
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Your frustration is genuine and shared by many. But I think blaming the exploit and the players that seize on them is misguided.

The frustration should be directed at Frontier, who has failed to balance their economy of progression. Instead of accepting the things they cannot change, like human behavior, psychology and the fact that water flows downhill, they instead resort to nerfing anything in the game that ends up progressing a players agenda. Why? Because it's easy and quick.

The real problem is they have an imbalance to progression. They have an economy that has an flat curve with a population that is earning a continuously diluted wage. What happens is that, much like in real-world economics you end up with a massive wealth disparity. Things stay expensive, but you earn less because you have to earn more. Frontier has continuously added new "currencies" to the game: credits, rares, commodities, materials, data, salvage, etc... which dilutes and devalues the resources that players have every time a new one is inserted. Everyone grinds these "monies" to satisfy their personal goals and drive toward the experiences they subjectively deem "fun". In expanding the scope of the economy and pumping more money in to the market via these continuously diversified currencies, but leaving players with no new mechanics to "keep up with inflation" (just add work) players labor harder & longer to earn more cash to buy things that remain fixed at a relative high price point.

With each new currency added, so added is a new grind. Which pushes end-goal activities farther away from the player.
We currently have:
-Credit grind
-manufactured material grind
-data grind
-raw material grind
-murder grind (kill 300 pirates)
-distance grind (take me 20KLY)
-rank grind (o7 Admiral)
-CG grind
-broken space station grind
-other grinds I'm probably forgetting about

So it's truly no shock when a "gold rush" is discovered for any of the above and the players go bananas. And then SURPRISE! get angry as sin when Frontier nerfs the exploit effectively bombing the player base bright back to poverty.

What Frontier needs to do is hire an economist. Probably a new lead designer too.
 

Logios

L
Junky Juke said:
Don't let the cheaters ruin your point of view.
Don't let them ruin your sense of accomplishment.
They play dumb, that doesn't mean you have too.
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Oh really? The 4 billion in assets I have say otherwise. Call me a "cheater", "exploiter" or whatever else lets you feel smug and morally superior. I don't care, I'm rich. :cool:
 
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jasonbarron

jasonbarron
When I read this thread, with all of the people judging me for being so filthily rich, it just makes me so so SO sad! This is me, being sad:
crying-money-woody-harrelson-zombieland.gif
 

Azirphaeli

Azirphaeli
Why exactly can't you have fun? Last time I checked missions aren't tuned to g5'd anacondas and payouts are just as high as ever outside of exploits.
 

Space Dandy

Space Dandy
Nebohtes said:
I've never done a gold rush or participated in an exploit. I know this makes me the biggest idiot in Elite: Dangerous, but until the most recent one, I haven't really cared.

I usually have fun, and if making some credits without having to risk anything makes the game fun for others, why should I care?

Seriously -- why should I care?

Well, I'm actually embarrassed to say I do, for once. FDev couldn't care less that players who have never bent the rules are hopelessly outclassed by players that spend a few hours cheating. It has always been like this, but it's too unbalanced, now. I've always been behind, but it's so laughably skewed now, playing missions feels like putting quarters in the punching machine. The worst is that it's all me -- my fun game is no longer fun because I actually wish I had cheated so I could go do the stuff I want in the ship I want without having to spend hours building up the credits to do it, which used to be fun when it was the cost of doing business, but I'm like the only player in Elite that has to do it, so it suddenly feels like... bull.
Click to expand...

I am afraid to break it to you but it has been like this since before launch. There were some people "testing stuff" right before launch and thus acquired large amounts of credits and there was no wipe cause FD told us how many credits another player has doesn't affect anyone else.

This means right since day one of the live release of the game people have been "behind" others in terms of creds.


This means just keep ignoring the gold rushes, and there have been quite a few, and keep playing how you like playing.

Seriously this game play far far more like a single player game with some shoddy limited multiplayer than anything else.. Frankly it's a little like Grim Dawn's buggy multiplayer.
 

MadDogMurdock

MadDogMurdock
Meh, these things have been around since day one.
'Seeking Weapons', etc.

What does seem to have changed is the increasingly immature response to FD deciding that these things are OP, and nerfing or removing them entirely for a while until they get rebalanced.
I guess that's the price of having a significant chunk of the player base who want an arcade game with disposable ships.

Ho hum, I'm sure the true believers are already grinding some new credit exploit.

Carry on chaps, this is business as usual.
 

Droid8Apple

Droid8Apple
Maka Gucci said:
Damn, that gave me a good laugh.

I mean I agree, it's a massive thing that many talk about all the time. I fully get venting, and while I don't wanna bash the devs any more than I have (as I don't see how it can be encouraging in any way), they must be aware of player frustration.
I can't believe it's fully intended, but they haven't listened (in regards to this point) so far, so its hard to hold out hope for future.

Just stay alert for the next thing that pops up and jump on it, then actually get to play the game. FDev wont take the credits, and the vast majority of people that will get on at you really do already have vast sums. (Just watch Rusty Dogs streams, who I like, but he has as much play time as me, vastly more credits and ships yet gets on people for using "exploits").
Well I used Upsilon, and I've made a hell of a lot more than I would have organically just playing, and my balance doesn't come close to many of those who complain about such missions.

So forget those people, and as much as I'm sure you'd rather do something you enjoy for rewarding pay, 1 day spent at one of these gold rushes is equivalent to months of your life grinding for peanuts. Your time is worth more than that, even if FD refuse to appreciate it.

Fly safe, o7.
Click to expand...

This whole thing, just, awesome. Wanted to take a minute to say that.
 

Droid8Apple

Droid8Apple
PANTHER STARFORCE said:
...Probably a new lead designer too.
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This. I have said it multiple times, multiple places in the last week or so. Sandy means well and if he were, I don't know, making anything but a video game he'd excel. But enough is enough. He doesn't even play the game. How. Why. Not once have I seen him play yet he gets to make all these judgement calls based on what? It's nothing against him- like I said it's not like he's an awful person or something but he shouldn't be given absolute say over things that people working there probably even want to happen like increasing the payouts globally so the domino effect of problems that gold rushing causes doesn't even have to happen. Or, use your brains and incorporate your own gold rush that gets people playing. Announce it, encourage it, so it's not some forbidden fruit. (IE- double affinity weekends on Warframe or double resource drops) and not ... "grind your hearts out for a ship nobody wants" and instead "lower rank requirements for Corvette/Cutter this weekend only" because the amount of people that would spend real time, real money, and real joy for those ships would make the game busier than it's ever been.
 

Y2K

Y2K
i like the exploits.. as soon as i hear about one im off in my 1.4billion combat fitted fully engineered cutter to blow cheating cmdrs outa the sky ^_^ i wrecked 40-50 cmdrs days with the last skimmer exploit :D .. you want big and fancy - put the time and effort in like most of us do.
 
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