Was that actually confirmed? I only heard that the Scarab weighs 4t and requires a special internal component, not necessarily that it also takes up room in your cargo bay.
The Planetary landing and planetside missions discussion Thread
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Was that actually confirmed? I only heard that the Scarab weighs 4t and requires a special internal component, not necessarily that it also takes up room in your cargo bay.
Okay, but what exactly are you being locked out from? If you have two hours, you can do a bunch of missions. If you have one hour, you can do half the amount. If you have no time, you can't do anything. Trader/smugling missions take 15 minutes, assassinations take 30 min tops. I dont see the problem, I really don't.
My understanding (which may be wrong) is that the scarab requires its own internal module (a vehicle bay, for example). I also thought the 4-6 tons mentioned was the scarab's internal storage capacity, not its own mass/weight.
Why do you even need evolution to terraform a planet? you would find one similar enough to an existing planet with life, and use existing life from that. Plant Earth like plants on Earth Like Planets, no evolution required
Horizons, Planetary Landings and Mining
Back in the Frontier days, you could take a mining module and land it in a planet. With the advent of planetary landings, will this facility be brought into ED?
I have some ideas how this could be done:
Find a High Metal Content planet - beyond the rim would be best and land your module, go off exploring for a bit and come back to your module which is now full of ore/metal
This also brings into play capacity and ship outfitting, all of which could add various questions.
1. First off, do you need a refinery on board your ship?
1a) A larger, more expensive and heavier mining module could have a built-in refinery, but ofc needs a larger ship slot to carry.
1b) A smaller one without means you need a refinery in your ship, but maybe it could fit into a size 2 slot instaed of size 4
2. Various sizes with differing capacity could be sold, and then you have to trade-off capacity with the other gubbins you would want to carry - ADS, DSS & fuel scoop at minimum, maybe an AFMU
2a) A larger capacity mining module without a refinery vs a smaller capacity one with a refinery - both requiring the same size slot.
3. Again there will have to be a trade-off wrt jump range, an Asp could maybe carry 2 of these whereas a DBE could only carry 1, but no space for an AFMU. A Python could carry 4, but you have a lower jump range etc
4. Is the module reusable, when it lands it looks like an Apollo lander with a drill. When you collect it, do you take the whole thing, or does the launch module part (which contained the 2 who landing on the moon's surface) just get collected, leaving the base and the drill on the surface
5. While your galaxy map shows you where you left your auto-miner, another commander could come along and stumble across it - perhaps a radio beacon detectable at a suitably close range to guide you to its location on the surface. Then the other commander could collect it and steal your ore - since you are probably not in an inhabited system, this would not be marked as a criminal offence, but you would get a very annoyed miner
So, some proposals to make Horizons more fun and add mining for those of us not wanting to use up a hardpoint carrying a mining laser and trying to earn a living in pirate infested RESs in inhabited space. I will leave it to the design team at Frontier Dev to sort out what becomes available......
Thanks,
Jon Jaymes
Back in the Frontier days, you could take a mining module and land it in a planet. With the advent of planetary landings, will this facility be brought into ED?
I have some ideas how this could be done:
Find a High Metal Content planet - beyond the rim would be best and land your module, go off exploring for a bit and come back to your module which is now full of ore/metal
This also brings into play capacity and ship outfitting, all of which could add various questions.
1. First off, do you need a refinery on board your ship?
1a) A larger, more expensive and heavier mining module could have a built-in refinery, but ofc needs a larger ship slot to carry.
1b) A smaller one without means you need a refinery in your ship, but maybe it could fit into a size 2 slot instaed of size 4
2. Various sizes with differing capacity could be sold, and then you have to trade-off capacity with the other gubbins you would want to carry - ADS, DSS & fuel scoop at minimum, maybe an AFMU
2a) A larger capacity mining module without a refinery vs a smaller capacity one with a refinery - both requiring the same size slot.
3. Again there will have to be a trade-off wrt jump range, an Asp could maybe carry 2 of these whereas a DBE could only carry 1, but no space for an AFMU. A Python could carry 4, but you have a lower jump range etc
4. Is the module reusable, when it lands it looks like an Apollo lander with a drill. When you collect it, do you take the whole thing, or does the launch module part (which contained the 2 who landing on the moon's surface) just get collected, leaving the base and the drill on the surface
5. While your galaxy map shows you where you left your auto-miner, another commander could come along and stumble across it - perhaps a radio beacon detectable at a suitably close range to guide you to its location on the surface. Then the other commander could collect it and steal your ore - since you are probably not in an inhabited system, this would not be marked as a criminal offence, but you would get a very annoyed miner
So, some proposals to make Horizons more fun and add mining for those of us not wanting to use up a hardpoint carrying a mining laser and trying to earn a living in pirate infested RESs in inhabited space. I will leave it to the design team at Frontier Dev to sort out what becomes available......
Thanks,
Jon Jaymes
Having some kind of super ultra fast evolution in ED wasn't my proposal.
I am against it, because I don't think it is sensible from a gaming perspective and because that is not how evolution can work.
What you propose might be what humans will do.
It will have unexpected side effects and cause ecological disasters I'm sure.
The Australians know all about that.
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It really depends on if alien flora & fauna have proteins we can digest, I suppose it could happen but the odds are stacked against it.
So you have three options, firstly good old slash and burn, kill everything and start again. Unlikely to work as airborne spores or whatever would soon reclaim the land, if done on a massive scale it might fare better but that would certainly muck up the climate for a little while. That's without considering the ethical issues if there is indigenous life.
The second option is to genetically engineer gut fauna to digest the alien protein or break it down into smaller constituents our existing fauna can cope with, probably the easier method in the long run but all immigrants and newly born would need to be inoculated with a faecal "donation" which would be fun I'm sure.
Finally I suppose you could have industrial re-processing of the native proteins into human-compatible proteins, this would require reliable infrastructure but that's far too much of an all the eggs in one basket situation to be considered, on a small scale this could work along side the GM gut fauna.
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Gut Flora are mainly used to help break down carbohydrates rather than proteins, however I'd agree that GM bacteria might help break down alien or newly developed carbohydrates.
That said, what I'd expect would be planets terraformed with the intention of turning them into agricultural worlds. Whole continents dedicated to the production of a few standard grains for export throughout human space. Humans are already pretty good at that, we've done it with our own planet already.
Monoculture on a continental scale, ohh that's going to work really well. Clearing the land and planting stuff is but a tiny fraction of the overall task, with any luck there will already be some native organism to fix nitrogen, if not it shouldn't be too hard to get something into the soil. The really big problem is pollinators, the probability of a native species volunteering to do the job is pretty slight so you'd have to introduce zillions of bees, birds, bats and assorted other insects. Just planting stuff won't work, you need to build up a complete food chain, even if you are planting the crops every year you still need the food chain to sustain the pollinators when the crops are not feeding them. I'm sure it all can be done but it wouldn't be easy and definitely would not be quick, I'd expect rather than clearing a continent they'd clear a dozen or so test plantations to see what could be made to work for a few years, then they'd take the ones that worked and expand them for a few more years.
Well it doesn't have to be a complete monoculture... I'm sure there's place for hedgerows and drainage ditches or similar every few kilometers
Terraforming is a colossal task which is designed to pay off over decades if not centuries, it's also something which has been done in the Elite Universe on tens if not hundreds of worlds already so there's bound to be an entire field of expertise behind it. I'd expect each planet undergoing or being considered for terraforming has a team of experts constantly updating and refining a plan based off a series of tools and lessons developed over the last thousand years. However, given the scale and cost of Terraforming the goal of those teams will be the same: Develop this planet as quickly as possible to one with an environment and ecosystem which can maximise food production for export. There will be profit and loss forecasts along with ecosystem planning, and maps of likely fertile soil before the first atmospheric processor is even bought.
Taking this back to the OP: From the above speculation I'd expect terraformed agricultural worlds to have a similar make up when we get up close, with large fields of similar crops, tailored to the locale from a group of standard tools found throughout human space. In other words: The kind of landscape which procedural generation can handle pretty well
I think that the planet surface game-play should in no way mimic the space missions and tasks; what could be more dull than after mining asteroids for three hours for a few thousand credits, landing on the surface to mine some more - even if the rewards are slightly higher. No, the missions need to be new and fresh. As mentioned in other threads, finding a rare artifact or simple life (plant / microbe) for large rewards is fine, but perhaps with a variation in the game-play; some kind of homing beacon that beeps more rapidly when you're getting "warmer" (which you have to save for, or complete a mission to earn....), but otherwise no clues as to whether you're going the right way... in fact, Elite: Dangerous' game-play would become vastly more exciting if equipment was earned on a pre-requisite basis. How much more fun if you had to acquire special landing gear before you could land on certain surfaces to complete new missions, special shields before you could enter certain atmospheres..... Special shields, or cloaking devices to ensure your ship is not found or destroyed whilst you go off exploring in your buggy (or otherwise.....). What about a special view mode to see heat signatures or movement before you can scan/collect? Converting water/lava into fuel for those that have run dry in a system with planets, but no yellow sun.... But you have to find it first whilst your ship is dying....
Perhaps start with caves, canyons, and possibly the ability to land on or go UNDER water (nod to Star Trek: Into Darkness!). It has to be graphically pleasing, yes, but this soon gets boring if the player loses interest in the game-play choices. We've all seen a movie that was all special effects and absolutely no story <cough cough Skyline / Battleship>. Do you watch them twice....? The immersive feel of the game is short-lived if the game-play is all: go down to the surface, scan the air for human habitation prospects and be paid for your scanning...ooooh exciting (sarcasm).
So, there is obviously going to be a surface rover (if you've seen the Horizons trailer), and Frontier are going to allow you to send it out and do....something. Get lost probably! I really hope they make the journey worthwhile. If mining is to become a feature of going planetside, then I really hope the technique is entirely new. Perhaps you can leave your collector and return hours or days later to refine the "ore". Maybe scan the surface with a new device that allows you to find the highest quality "seam" and then your rewards will be proportionate.
On a separate note, inter-system travel can be very time-consuming as you sit there watching the minutes count down, waiting for the little dot to become a planet. I've always hoped you could save up for a <say> 50,000,000+credits drive that halves the super-cruise journey time. You could then only be interdicted by pilots (human or otherwise) that have invested in the same equipment. Well I hope the journey to the surface, whilst undoubtedly fun the first 20 times, is not equally as time consuming. I can imagine you dropping out of supercruise at a certain distance and then it taking 10-15 minutes to land. I guess we'll have to see.
All said, I can't wait to see those horizons flatten-out for the first time!
Perhaps start with caves, canyons, and possibly the ability to land on or go UNDER water (nod to Star Trek: Into Darkness!). It has to be graphically pleasing, yes, but this soon gets boring if the player loses interest in the game-play choices. We've all seen a movie that was all special effects and absolutely no story <cough cough Skyline / Battleship>. Do you watch them twice....? The immersive feel of the game is short-lived if the game-play is all: go down to the surface, scan the air for human habitation prospects and be paid for your scanning...ooooh exciting (sarcasm).
So, there is obviously going to be a surface rover (if you've seen the Horizons trailer), and Frontier are going to allow you to send it out and do....something. Get lost probably! I really hope they make the journey worthwhile. If mining is to become a feature of going planetside, then I really hope the technique is entirely new. Perhaps you can leave your collector and return hours or days later to refine the "ore". Maybe scan the surface with a new device that allows you to find the highest quality "seam" and then your rewards will be proportionate.
On a separate note, inter-system travel can be very time-consuming as you sit there watching the minutes count down, waiting for the little dot to become a planet. I've always hoped you could save up for a <say> 50,000,000+credits drive that halves the super-cruise journey time. You could then only be interdicted by pilots (human or otherwise) that have invested in the same equipment. Well I hope the journey to the surface, whilst undoubtedly fun the first 20 times, is not equally as time consuming. I can imagine you dropping out of supercruise at a certain distance and then it taking 10-15 minutes to land. I guess we'll have to see.
All said, I can't wait to see those horizons flatten-out for the first time!
This isn't a criticism (so White Knights can put their ponies back in the stable) but moving from where we are straight to celestial bodies seems to be leaving out those massive things in orbit we are already using- stations. It just seems logical to me that we would start experiencing new environments incrementally ? Anyway, whatever, move on Peebs.
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For the record, FD has been "downgrading" some of the graphics in Elite since Alpha. So cranking it up is not going to happen in a long, long time.
If they really did that, and I've heard the same thing, FD should stop it and return to the high fidelity and even give it a notch or two in the upper direction.
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That sure looks nice, but it's a completely different concept. It's bascially just a live rendered video, in which you can look around.
The ship is flying on rails, and the area isn't bigger than what you see. There is no planet around this place.
I really dig the atmosphere, but land there 3 times and it's bound to get old fast.
Well, what I'm trying to say is: It's easy to create awesome looking places, when you're not procedurally generating them and don't have to make them interactive.
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Yes there is, all planets are in-game, you can fly around them (CR said so, also it would take a lot of time), but only the landing zones are detailed, because you can only land on them and not somewhere else on the planet.
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Just a ball with a texture. Like we have trillions of them in Elite.
And I highly doubt it's actually there when you're seeing that landing scene. Wouldn't make much sense to actually render it.
Did you ever play Freelancer? That's how planets in SC are going to be. Well, bigger, probably. But pretty much the same gameplay.
You'll be able to look at the planet from a distance, fly around it if you like but for no real purpose, and dock at specific places.
Where you'll probably see a loading screen, then the landing scene. After which you'll be able to walk around in a limited area of the dock or city you landed at.
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Yes, but the planet is really, physically there. They need it because in a few decades, they will use it to fill it with procedurally generated content.
Also, some guy once got into a glitch in Arena Commander and flew all the way to the planet - it's not just a picture, it has surface but it looked really, REALLY bad.
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